Guild Wars 2

Why would people invest over 1000g for something that only increases 2-3% in the stats? Juste because people don’t have it doesn’t mean they suck and shouldn’t raid, I cleared the 1st wing with ascended trinkets only and there was no timer issue at all, so please stop saying it’s required or anything even for a dumb Vale Guardian, maybe for tank or healer but certainly not for DPS and condis…

This seems so misplaced and random. People have made videos, and proven that you don’t need asc armor, full 10 man proper comp’s etc etc. If you are trying to PUG it and that’s where this rage is coming from, well sorry to break it to you but it’s their group so it’s rules are dictated by them. In a PUG scenario it’s to be expected, they don’t owe you anything, and having full asc kinda does show you have some history, experience with your class (in most cases, or at least have some commitment into that class). As for the “1000g” claim that’s completely false, a crafted set is like 500-600g. The last point is 2-3% per person, adds up with 10 people combined. More DPS = faster kill times, meaning less time to make a mistake and wipe

Some suggestions i would lay down would be start doing daily champ fractals, I see an average of 1-2 boxes a week. Trinkets are simple, and for weapons first have a look at the class specialization collections for some cheap asc weapons.

Amineo.8951:

Why would people invest over 1000g for something that only increases 2-3% in the stats? Juste because people don’t have it doesn’t mean they suck and shouldn’t raid, I cleared the 1st wing with ascended trinkets only and there was no timer issue at all, so please stop saying it’s required or anything even for a dumb Vale Guardian, maybe for tank or healer but certainly not for DPS and condis…

Unless you’re soloing the raids, 2-3% x10 more damage is a pretty big difference.

What is it with people who play gw2 who refuse to be as efficient as they possibly can. Ascended gear isn’t hard to come by either, you get them from fracs, world bosses, pvp and now raids. You could spend 10 weeks wiping in raids and spend your shards on gear.

1000g? Holy smokes dude. I spend about 90g per piece. 100 × 6 = 540g. You can farm this in a couple weeks. Everything shouldn’t come instantly. This isn’t even including the ascended armor boxes you’ll eventually acquire.

Groups are entitled to require whatever they want.

Dragon Masher.5749:

You could spend 10 weeks.

Silly goose.

https://youtu.be/hFDcoX7s6rE?t=11s

This occurs because people accept the idea that they need optimal builds to succeed in GW2. They buy right into it for traits and stats so of course they are going to buy into it for Ascended as well.

Amineo.8951:

Why would people invest over 1000g for something that only increases 2-3% in the stats? Juste because people don’t have it doesn’t mean they suck and shouldn’t raid, I cleared the 1st wing with ascended trinkets only and there was no timer issue at all, so please stop saying it’s required or anything even for a dumb Vale Guardian, maybe for tank or healer but certainly not for DPS and condis…

Your math is off by a fair bit in both regards to who gets the most effectiveness and the cost.

I’d guess a fair number of people crafted Asc. Armor specifically for raids, or converted existing stuff to Viper’s. Having that kind of commitment to optimization might in fact mean that the player took the time to learn the fights and has made some effort to improve his play.

People like control. They can’t control whether someone really knows the fights, or whether the player’s twitch reflexes are up to the fights, so they try to control the things they can. Think of it as playing the odds.

The solution to this issue, as well as any other accessibility issues, is not to PuG.

Aktium.9506:

Unless you’re soloing the raids, 2-3% x10 more damage is a pretty big difference.

Yeah, almost up to 20% more damage, right… right?
Getting ascended armor for the stats has barely any use, but you could argue it shows the dedication of the majority to how serious they want to play that class.

Aktium.9506:

Amineo.8951:

Why would people invest over 1000g for something that only increases 2-3% in the stats? Juste because people don’t have it doesn’t mean they suck and shouldn’t raid, I cleared the 1st wing with ascended trinkets only and there was no timer issue at all, so please stop saying it’s required or anything even for a dumb Vale Guardian, maybe for tank or healer but certainly not for DPS and condis…

Unless you’re soloing the raids, 2-3% x10 more damage is a pretty big difference.

Still just a 2-3% DPS Increase at best. Not really worth it to Craft Asc. Armor.

Aktium.9506:

Amineo.8951:

Why would people invest over 1000g for something that only increases 2-3% in the stats? Juste because people don’t have it doesn’t mean they suck and shouldn’t raid, I cleared the 1st wing with ascended trinkets only and there was no timer issue at all, so please stop saying it’s required or anything even for a dumb Vale Guardian, maybe for tank or healer but certainly not for DPS and condis…

Unless you’re soloing the raids, 2-3% x10 more damage is a pretty big difference.

That’s not how math works.

yeah for real
what is it with people saying “5% times 10 people is a big difference!” as if increasing 10 people’s damage by 10% each would double the group’s dps. I see this all the time.

2% on each person is 2% for the group
2% on one person out of ten is 0.2% for the group (assuming equal distribution of dps)

the main thing ascended armor gets you is… armor. the stat that makes you take less damage. For doing damage it doesn’t make a big difference. It mostly just looks good. “Yeah, I have full ascended.” However! several times I’ve seen the party wipe with the boss at 1% hp. So it isn’t worthless. Every bit can help.

lets say a full group has 100.000 dmg per second with full exotic
thats would be 102000 dps when all have asc armor. seems less right?

lets say you take the full enrage timer…8 mins.
thats 48 million dmg….vs 48.960.000. so 960k more…isn’t that big, right?

okayokay, its just 9,5 seconds more dps, its less, you are right. but then you have to count in all the 1% or 5% fails. mostly due to groupsetup and people failing their skillrota.
but as you see…it helps.

no big difference if all people are like super exp. you are right.
the rest is already said by others.

Ascended armor only seems like it really gets good when you’re running Versatile Power Infusions.

Part of me hopes that Versatile Power Infusions go the way of the dodo, just because of this off-chance that people are gonna say “you don’t have Versatile Power Infusions in all your 8-9 defensive slots? KICKED”. But idk that seems extreme and I hope people are more sensible than that.

Amineo.8951:

Why would people invest over 1000g for something that only increases 2-3% in the stats? Juste because people don’t have it doesn’t mean they suck and shouldn’t raid, I cleared the 1st wing with ascended trinkets only and there was no timer issue at all, so please stop saying it’s required or anything even for a dumb Vale Guardian, maybe for tank or healer but certainly not for DPS and condis…

https://m.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/31wbip/ascended_vs_exotic_gear_comparison_spreedsheet

Swagger.1459:

Amineo.8951:

Why would people invest over 1000g for something that only increases 2-3% in the stats? Juste because people don’t have it doesn’t mean they suck and shouldn’t raid, I cleared the 1st wing with ascended trinkets only and there was no timer issue at all, so please stop saying it’s required or anything even for a dumb Vale Guardian, maybe for tank or healer but certainly not for DPS and condis…

https://m.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/31wbip/ascended_vs_exotic_gear_comparison_spreedsheet

Which shows that Asc. Armor is even less important. So, before even looking at Asc. Armor it is better to make a second or Third Charactar Raid Ready with Weapons and Trinkets ( which are Accountbound so you don’t need a Set per Character )

Aktium.9506:

Unless you’re soloing the raids, 2-3% x10 more damage is a pretty big difference.

No, it still will be 2-3% raidwide damage.

Definitely not 1,000g. (Link)

This is a non issue, and it even has a simple fix: start your own group with only exotic gear requirement.

I’ll do what I want with my money and with my pug requirements, thank you very much.

I agree that a 3% is almost nothing. But remember : you’re not alone and you are in a team with 9 others players.

3% from 1 player is nothing, but 3% from 10 players is definitely not negligible, in theory.

But in practice, the raidwide damage is only ~3% more efficient, only because the math is from all the members dps. These flat 3% raidwide damage can save you from the enrage, for example.

Edit : it seems that 2% is more accurate (3% is certainly with infusions), but even 2% can save you from a wipe.

But keep in mind that foods/etc gives %stats, more stats you get the better.

There is also a slightly higher armor rating too.

Besides the bonus in stats it’s also a noob check imho. Goes both ways but this could generally be said.

Also shows you are prepared to get ‘geared up’ ready for raiding.
Who would you rather take out of the following two pugs:
(A) exotics with right gear/sigils
Or
(B) Ascended with right gear/sigils

It’s like would you rather take for a job:
(A) Person highly qualified – no experience
Or
(B) no qualifications – no experience

It’s you presenting your best foot forward for the raid group.

randomguy.1283:

That’s not how math works.

Rednik.3809:

No, it still will be 2-3% raidwide damage.

Well regardless of silly maths, anyone who doesn’t have at least 3 different sets of ascended gear is a filthy peasant.

Actually how the math works is important. If a specific gear load increase is 2-3% in damage for the whole group, but a group is able to beat the enrage timer by much larger percentage than 2-3% of the actual time before enrage … well, that’s a really good case for not needing an unnecessary specific gear load. The reward is only for beating the timer, no extra for how much you beat it by.

@Obtena

That is the obvious. In most cases, specifically with pugs the group will be working on progression which means they are not meeting the kill timer by any amounts of percentage. A three percent increase in stats simply means you will have an advantage when progressing.

Obviously, if a group is currently meeting the kill timer with a lot of DPS to spare then you could say even the 10th person does not matter. There have been groups 7-manning the content. Why bring the last three people to a random group? Well, the odds of success will greatly rise…

What you said above only applies to groups who are bringing more than what is required to the table. Another way to phrase that sentence is that you, or whoever is not seeking their maximum potential, is being carried.

being carried is a rather nebulous concept
strictly speaking, each person on the team is being carried by the other 9 people on the team, as they wouldn’t be able to come anywhere near clearing it by themselves, regardless of how well they do

reikken.4961:

being carried is a rather nebulous concept
strictly speaking, each person on the team is being carried by the other 9 people on the team, as they wouldn’t be able to come anywhere near clearing it by themselves, regardless of how well they do

Sure, but each player is required to put forth a certain amount of effort divided by the amount of players/roles to succeed. If some player drops below this unknown amount that varies from group to group, then other players are forced to pick up the slack.

This could get complicated (One role’s effort versus another), but I’m sure you can understand what I’m saying.

That is simply how min-maxing works. The last bit of stats or damage (let’s say 2-5%) usually costs you as much as the previous 95-98%. It is a matter of how dedicated to and maybe “crazy” about the game you are.

Having the best gear possible is certainly not required but it is safer than running in suboptimal gear. You can not blame anyone who has yet to finish a raid for going with the safest and easiest approach possible.

Let’s clear up some missconceptions.

ascended armor is worth it
No it’s not. I have multiple full sets. If at all the ascended sets make me less flexible since I’m more reluctant to switch to different builds. Back when I had 4 different exotic sets on my main I would try a new build every 2 weeks. The math has been done. Ascended armor (only talking armor) is aproximately a 2-3% increase in stats. Definately not worth the gold investment unless absolutely min/maxing and certainly not required for raiding from a stat perspective. Talking from a raid perspective not high rank fractals which require the agony resist.

ascended trinkets are worth it
Yes, they are. Biggest upgrade and easiest to aquire. Most are thrown your way by just repeatedly loging into the game, though there are more efficient ways of aquiring the different slots.

ascended weapons are worth it
Yes, less than trinkets but still on the “to get” list and the increase versus exotic is noticable enough. This should be your main investment gold wise. At 100-150g per weapon not cheap, but also attainable.

no armor vs armor
A full group of 10 people with ascended trinkets and weapons versus a group with full ascended everything will be at a disadvantage of 2-3%, not 20-30%. Math, read up on how it works.

ascended armor makes you a better player
Right, this also just in: Santa Claus is real, Trump would make a great president and if you stare right at the sun you do not go blind. Ascended armor though will show a certain type of commitment to the game (good and bad). If a raid leader feels he wants people showing this type of commitment it’s their call. You can’t force other people into smart decisions.

Summery
Get your ascended weapons and trinkets at your own pace. More importantly, make friends or join a guild if you are serious about raiding. Stop worrying about what others think or demand. If ascended armor was/is not worth the investment to you, stop trying to join groups that require it. Chances are high you would not enjoy playing with these people anyway.

Amineo.8951:

Why would people invest over 1000g for something that only increases 2-3% in the stats?

Over 1k g???
How do you get your ascended to pay that much?

You don’t need ascended for raids.

If you choose to get some it is quite easy and cheap to get it.

You can buy ascended trinkets with Laurels, Badges of Honor and Pristine Fractal Relics.
You can get an ascended back by doing PvP or with some easy tasks and 90g (Mawdrey).
You can get ascended weapons with specialization collections.
You can buy ascended armor and weapons with raid tokens.
The drop rate of ascended armor and weapons is quite good (11,4%) in high level fractals (50+).

Cyninja.2954:

Let’s clear up some missconceptions.

ascended armor is worth it
No it’s not. I have multiple full sets. If at all the ascended sets make me less flexible since I’m more reluctant to switch to different builds. Back when I had 4 different exotic sets on my main I would try a new build every 2 weeks. The math has been done. Ascended armor (only talking armor) is aproximately a 2-3% increase in stats. Definately not worth the gold investment unless absolutely min/maxing and certainly not required for raiding from a stat perspective. Talking from a raid perspective not high rank fractals which require the agony resist.

ascended trinkets are worth it
Yes, they are. Biggest upgrade and easiest to aquire. Most are thrown your way by just repeatedly loging into the game, though there are more efficient ways of aquiring the different slots.

ascended weapons are worth it
Yes, less than trinkets but still on the “to get” list and the increase versus exotic is noticable enough. This should be your main investment gold wise. At 100-150g per weapon not cheap, but also attainable.

no armor vs armor
A full group of 10 people with ascended trinkets and weapons versus a group with full ascended everything will be at a disadvantage of 2-3%, not 20-30%. Math, read up on how it works.

ascended armor makes you a better player
Right, this also just in: Santa Claus is real, Trump would make a great president and if you stare right at the sun you do not go blind. Ascended armor though will show a certain type of commitment to the game (good and bad). If a raid leader feels he wants people showing this type of commitment it’s their call. You can’t force other people into smart decisions.

Summery
Get your ascended weapons and trinkets at your own pace. More importantly, make friends or join a guild if you are serious about raiding. Stop worrying about what others think or demand. If ascended armor was/is not worth the investment to you, stop trying to join groups that require it. Chances are high you would not enjoy playing with these people anyway.

So it looks like we need to upgrade ascended armors to make them more in line with other ascended gear.

Cyninja – I mean ascended armor does provide a stat boost however small. Saying it isn’t worth it is a matter of perspective, but mathematically wrong…

Avarice.2791:

Cyninja – I mean ascended armor does provide a stat boost however small. Saying it isn’t worth it is a matter of perspective, but mathematically wrong…

Saying it isn’t worth it is indeed a matter of perspective, which means it’s not a mathematics statement at all. A math statement would be, “It is the same as Exotic.” which would of course be wrong.

Swagger.1459:

So it looks like we need to upgrade ascended armors to make them more in line with other ascended gear.

ANet talked about making the stat differential between Asc. and Exotic greater before HoT launched. There was a lot of backlash, and they decided not to do so. Just say no to more power creep.

Indigo, what I am saying is it is a matter of perspective depending on what gold is worth to you, and how much time you have.

He is saying ascended armor is not worth it due to the fact that it inconveniences him gold wise. This is his perspective, and mathematically wrong, yet he states it like a fact. “Let’s clear up some misconceptions.”

That’s all I’m saying. This may be obvious to you, but I believe my point is sound where an advantage is an advantage, and those working on progression love advantages.

You have two people asking about the last spot in your raid. Both the same roles. One states he is all ascended with exotic gear. One states he is full ascended. You have no idea who is better, they each have the same experience. Who are you most likely to bring?

Two people show up for a job interview. Both have the same qualifications. One is dressed appropriately, one is dressed inappropriately. Who do you hire?

Avarice.2791:

Indigo, what I am saying is it is a matter of perspective depending on what gold is worth to you, and how much time you have.

He is saying ascended armor is not worth it due to the fact that it inconveniences him gold wise. This is his perspective, and mathematically wrong, yet he states it like a fact. “Let’s clear up some misconceptions.”

That’s all I’m saying. This may be obvious to you, but I believe my point is sound where an advantage is an advantage, and those working on progression love advantages.

You have two people asking about the last spot in your raid. Both the same roles. One states he is all ascended with exotic gear. One states he is full ascended. You have no idea who is better, they each have the same experience. Who are you most likely to bring?

Two people show up for a job interview. Both have the same qualifications. One is dressed appropriately, one is dressed inappropriately. Who do you hire?

Cyninja may have worded his statement in a generic fashion (It isn’t worth it.). However, all such statements should be viewed as having the added phrase “to me.” Value judgments are rarely if ever anything other than opinions.

That said, someone who’s made the commitment to get Asc. Armor is more likely to have an optimizing mentality. While having it doesn’t equate to competence, PuG players cannot know the skill of some random person who joins their LFG. They can see if he has Asc. armor, which at least speaks to the possibility that someone has the mindset they’re wanting.

I can agree…somewhat… but with that mentality is exotic gear even worth it to the player who believes 10g is too much? It’s only a 2-3% gain. (Idunno maybe more or less)

What I’m confused about here, is how much stats are too much? Why would you not make it your goal to get the best possible gear? Is common gear even worth it to the group who can 7 man content?

In relation to the OP’s question, what I mainly have to say is why would anyone invest in a suit for a job interview when I can sag my jeans and wear chains? I once knew this guy who got a job with sagged jeans and chains.

Avarice.2791:

Indigo, what I am saying is it is a matter of perspective depending on what gold is worth to you, and how much time you have.

He is saying ascended armor is not worth it due to the fact that it inconveniences him gold wise. This is his perspective, and mathematically wrong, yet he states it like a fact. “Let’s clear up some misconceptions.”

That’s all I’m saying. This may be obvious to you, but I believe my point is sound where an advantage is an advantage, and those working on progression love advantages.

You have two people asking about the last spot in your raid. Both the same roles. One states he is all ascended with exotic gear. One states he is full ascended. You have no idea who is better, they each have the same experience. Who are you most likely to bring?

Two people show up for a job interview. Both have the same qualifications. One is dressed appropriately, one is dressed inappropriately. Who do you hire?

You are correct, I could have written 3 paragraphs explaining why I believe ascended armor is not worth it. For that I would have drawn uppon logical and established given facts like:

- the statistical increase between the different color tiers
- the statistical increase between the different ascended slots
- the utility function of the gold spent on the ascended armor

and so on.

“Worth” (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/worth) can be a subjective expression unlike mathematical facts. That’s why I incorporated into my reasoning why I do not think ascended armor is not worth it (the stat difference at current cost). I never said it’s mathematically not worth using. I said the math comes out to an insignificant 2-3% difference.

Avarice.2791:

You have two people asking about the last spot in your raid. Both the same roles. One states he is all ascended with exotic gear. One states he is full ascended. You have no idea who is better, they each have the same experience. Who are you most likely to bring?

Two people show up for a job interview. Both have the same qualifications. One is dressed appropriately, one is dressed inappropriately. Who do you hire?

I would argue that a 2-3% difference in stats comes more closer to one of the applicants having an A- compared to where the other has an A in one college course. Both show up to the same interview (aka they both got picked) and get to demonstrate on a limited basis why they believe they should get the job. TC is complaining about not even getting to the point where he can demonstrate he is desirable.

On whom I would pick? That decision would be based more on my conversation with said person or any fellow players impression than one having ascended armor or not. Honestly, worst case it would probably be first come first serve here if no other factors are available.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Cyninja may have worded his statement in a generic fashion (It isn’t worth it.). However, all such statements should be viewed as having the added phrase “to me.” Value judgments are rarely if ever anything other than opinions.

That said, someone who’s made the commitment to get Asc. Armor is more likely to have an optimizing mentality. While having it doesn’t equate to competence, PuG players cannot know the skill of some random person who joins their LFG. They can see if he has Asc. armor, which at least speaks to the possibility that someone has the mindset they’re wanting.

Yes, maybe I should have added “to me”. I did try to keep it light and show via sarcasm that I think the debate or issues some people have over such a small increase is laughable.

I could have fleshed out the the part more about how min/maxing can show your more familiar or devoted to your character (or some form of OCD ^^) which I agree to (again something where you could write paragraphs to). But then again, this thread or topic isn’t new and all of this has been covered bevor. If peopel still need convincing that 2-3% stat difference will not make or break their game or group, that would have happened long ago.

Cyninja, I do agree this debate is extremely small (A .2-.3% increase in group damage is laughable, yes.) I’m simply saying that there is no reason to not optimize your character. Stating “it’s not worth it” is just something I disagree with. Obviously both opinions, but the way you stated it warranted at least a response in my eyes. No disrespect.

In regards to the OP, I’m simply giving a few scenarios as to why Ascended Loot may be preferred, not to mention most guilds you apply for require you to be in full ascended armor.

Avarice.2791:

I can agree…somewhat… but with that mentality is exotic gear even worth it to the player who believes 10g is too much? It’s only a 2-3% gain. (Idunno maybe more or less)

That is just the point. The stat increase accross all tiers is different. As far as I remember (and before the ascended stat change) it was aproximately:

10% increase in stat between white, blue, green and rare
20% between rare and exotic (meaning you get 20% more stats with exotic)
5-8% between exotic and ascended

This is looking at a full set. In case of ascended this stat increase is unevenly divided between all the slots with armor being a lot more expensive than the other parts of the equipment. While at the same time having single slots be more expensive than an entire full set of exotic gear.

Finally, as mentioned, this is a value statement. If you have the gold, the desire and the possibility to get full ascended armor, sure it might be of no consequence. But if you are limited in your purchasing power ingame, you have a lot of things which would bring more value to your character than a full ascended armor set.

Avarice.2791:

Cyninja, I do agree this debate is extremely small (A .2-.3% increase in group damage is laughable, yes.) I’m simply saying that there is no reason to not optimize your character. Stating “it’s not worth it” is just something I disagree with. Obviously both opinions, but the way you stated it warranted at least a response in my eyes. No disrespect.

In regards to the OP, I’m simply giving a few scenarios as to why Ascended Loot may be preferred, not to mention most guilds you apply for require you to be in full ascended armor.

True, and I agree that if you want to optimise your character you should get ascended armor, after you’ve optimised just about everything else (which could also mean getting multiple exotic sets to try different playstyles and familiarise yourself with the character). Lucky enough, there are multiple ways to get a cheaper first ascended armor set via achievements.

I do indeed understand that the gain on ascended gear was nerfed into the ground due to an outcry by the “casuals.” I agree with you that perhaps in every value except for simple math, ascended gear really holds no advantage over exotic gear… or to say the difference is almost unnoticed.

Sarcastically speaking, Karma is going to come at you fast with a 1% wipe :P

I have a 600 second timer on my posts so I’ll reply to your second one below which I don’t have much to say because we’re at an agreement :P

Ascended Armor is definitely the last thing to do when it comes to optimizing your character. Trinkets take a matter of weeks. Ascended Armor takes either RNG, Gold, or time which is pretty much gold. Although difficult to get, most players have either a partial or complete set of ascended armor. The other good news as for raiding is that you will usually only need 1, maybe 2 sets of ascended gear since others have done the optimization work for us on metabattle meaning that there is no reason to get 3-4 sets of armor specifically for raiding.

I think people disagree on the value of ascended based on first principles, and that’s ok. We all agree that it’s a 2-3% stat increase for a disproportionate amount of gold. Some people want to spend their gold on ascended armor, others on cool looking skins. That’s ok. Heck, not all my alts are in full ascended armor, mainly because I consider the 400 magnatite shard cost for a chest piece not worth it.

I think we can also all agree that you can beat all the raid bosses without ascended armor. That said, I fully support raid leaders requiring full ascended for their pugs. Given the choice between two players I don’t know, where I don’t know their skill level, I would choose the full ascended every time. They’ll do more damage, and they’ve shown a commitment to stat maximization. The full ascended player has a higher probability of being better for the group.

Personally, I use legendary insight checks for my pugs. But I draw the insight threshold equally arbitrarily. There may not be much difference in skill between a 10- and 15-insight player. But, if I don’t know either, I choose the 15-insight player every time.

The good thing is that if you disagree with these metrics you can start your own pug group or join a guild raiding group. You can be your own solution.

Avarice.2791:

Cyninja – I mean ascended armor does provide a stat boost however small. Saying it isn’t worth it is a matter of perspective, but mathematically wrong…

Actually if you look at the cost to stats ratio of Exotic and Ascended gear, I think it’s not mathematically wrong at all. In fact, it’s even more evident that Ascended gear is not really worth the cost. It’s a luxury and luxuries are only ‘worth it’ if the cost doesn’t mean much to you.

Obtena.7952:

Avarice.2791:

Cyninja – I mean ascended armor does provide a stat boost however small. Saying it isn’t worth it is a matter of perspective, but mathematically wrong…

Actually if you look at the cost to stats ratio of Exotic and Ascended gear, I think it’s not mathematically wrong at all. In fact, it’s even more evident that Ascended gear is not really worth the cost. It’s a luxury and luxuries are only ‘worth it’ if the cost doesn’t mean much to you.

Sure, but I view 600g +- chests as worth it for the gain in stats as many players do. It’s all perspective and really not up to the player to dictate what groups require. What you are arguing has been discussed above. What I was saying is the gain in stats with always be mathematically beneficial for a group that is progressing.

Amineo.8951:

Why would people invest over 1000g for something that only increases 2-3% in the stats? Juste because people don’t have it doesn’t mean they suck and shouldn’t raid, I cleared the 1st wing with ascended trinkets only and there was no timer issue at all, so please stop saying it’s required or anything even for a dumb Vale Guardian, maybe for tank or healer but certainly not for DPS and condis…

First of all, I fully agree ascended armor is optional and not a necessity by a long shot to clear the raids. However PUG raids have 2 very simple reasons why they would take ascended armored characters over exotic:

- At the end of the day, its a 2-3% damage increase.

- Ascended armored people are probably more involved, skilled and more familiar with raiding after making such heavy investments in the best gear possible, for so little rewards (2/3% more damage).

These are probably the reasons people craft ascended armor for raiding as well.

Avarice.2791:

Obtena.7952:

Avarice.2791:

Cyninja – I mean ascended armor does provide a stat boost however small. Saying it isn’t worth it is a matter of perspective, but mathematically wrong…

Actually if you look at the cost to stats ratio of Exotic and Ascended gear, I think it’s not mathematically wrong at all. In fact, it’s even more evident that Ascended gear is not really worth the cost. It’s a luxury and luxuries are only ‘worth it’ if the cost doesn’t mean much to you.

Sure, but I view 600g +- chests as worth it for the gain in stats as many players do. It’s all perspective and really not up to the player to dictate what groups require. What you are arguing has been discussed above. What I was saying is the gain in stats with always be mathematically beneficial for a group that is progressing.

Personally I avoid full ascended players (unless they are in speed running groups or use expensive stat sets like vipers), cause who in his right mind would think ascended armor is worth it? Usually they use bad rotations and kitten up.