Guild Wars 2

Hello,
I have all classes available and thinking about making ascended gear for raids. I am quite intrigued by Condi warrior, but I am not sure it will stay like it is now and then condition heavy armor would not that useful. Do you think it is safer to go for Medium armor, so if something happens to either Ranger or Engi, I would have still the other one as an alternative? Is condi ranger good?
Thanks

You can change stats on ascended armor if condi gets nerfed.

Oh right I forgot, feel like a noob now.

condi ranger was brought down with HoT. It’s still good but engi/warrior are way better.

Paging particlar for condi tempest advertisement

Engi condi best condi

Sanderinoa.8065:

Paging particlar for condi tempest advertisement

Been doing testing with one of the other guys in my raid. On vale guardian, with alacrity/quickness from myself he’s seeing pretty consistent 20k+ burn ticks, not counting any power dps from the actual direct damage he’s got going, it’s quite impressive.

Condition Reaper is good, has quite fun gameplay, tanky, doesn’t require boss being a DPS dummy which stands in one place, doesn’t lose nearly as much damage as Engineer or Warrior when moving or attacking from range, clears adds.

What we have for now is one raid wing with 2 very static bosses which are more of a DPS race than anything. You don’t know what next encounters will be – and I say they will be improved based on feedback from first wing. People base their opinions on just 3 boss fights for now. What if next boss moves around? Or applies conditions – most will struggle, Necromancer just transfers them, boosting personal DPS.

Think ahead.

Condi reaper is actually a lot weaker than Warrior and Engineer, it’s suprising how much of a gap there actually is.

As far as I know you have

Warrior and Engineer on top by a good margin.

Then you have Ele, Ranger, Guardian and Reaper that come after. They are good, but not the best condi. Ranger and Guardian are about equal condi or zerker. I’m not sure about zerker reaper. Ele is better in zerker.

That said, reaper is actually pretty good at Gorseval because of Epidimic. I wouldn’t bring a Reaper condi over a Warrior or Engineer in another fight than Gorseval for now.

If you want to raid. Warrior or Engineer is your best choice. Reaper only for Gorseval. The remaining are decent, but if you can choose don’t take them.

I have a full Ascended Condi engineer it’s great and is the top Condi class but…

For Gor your raid group is going to want Burnzerkers as they’re incredible on the fight. They’re easily 2nd in Vale although you won’t want many.

I would look at it this way, engi or warrior are both A+ to A choices but also look at what the other heavies can do in Condi. You’re right to mention Ranger B to B- although I’m never running Ranger Condi over an Engi, ever. Also Condi thief has no seat at the table. My ratings of the Condi classes for raids would be.

A+ Engineer
A Warrior (except in Gor when it’s A+)

B Necro (except Gor when it’s A- to B+)
B Ele
B- Ranger (unless your comp needs spotter / spirit B )

Burnzerker < Engineer + Ranger

But it’s close enough to come down to your preference. In my raid group we NEED Condi heavies and are gearing them but your group may need medium.

Difficulty in pulling off the max DPS engineer rotation should settle your issue nicely. If you’re new to Engi you will likely not out DPS a burn warrior so there you have it.

If you’re new to ENGI go for Warrior. Its easy to pump out ridiculous burn stacks on a Burnzerker.

What? Is condi rev a thing now?

Sanderinoa.8065:

Paging particlar for condi tempest advertisement

Did anyone say CONDI TEMPEST ????????

On a more serious note, tempest is pretty competetive to warrior in condition specs. Warrior do better on big hitboxes while tempest does better on stationary target. Ele also stacks up the burns exceptionally quick making the ramp up time pretty minor.

Ryn.6459:

What? Is condi rev a thing now?

I just updated it. We are testing out Condi Herald it’s promising

No condi herald is bad, it never will be a thing.

No condi herald is bad. it wont ever be a thing no matter how hard people want it to be

Aidenwolf.5964:

Ryn.6459:

What? Is condi rev a thing now?

I just updated it. We are testing out Condi Herald it’s promising

I’d be very interested in your research. I’ve been trying to make condi Revenant work for weeks and I’m pretty sure I’m pulling the best out of the class already. Unfortunately it’s still miles behind other condi builds.

flame thrower !

I just can’t see condi herald being a thing due to the main prominence of Conusion + Torment which are situational conditions.

Boss stuck in place and not moving around? There goes Torment potential.

Slow boss attacks or gets blocked, you evade etc? There goes Confusion potential.

Not saying it’s full on moot but agreed with others – would be nice & interesting to see the outcome of your research. Good luck with it.

Zephyra.4709:

Slow boss attacks or gets blocked, you evade etc? There goes Confusion potential.

Once the attack starts confusion will deal its damage, whether or not you avoid the damage is irrelevant.

mallyx rev & venom share thief => pvp because torment & poison
imo.

Zephyra.4709:

I just can’t see condi herald being a thing due to the main prominence of Conusion + Torment which are situational conditions.

Boss stuck in place and not moving around? There goes Torment potential.

Slow boss attacks or gets blocked, you evade etc? There goes Confusion potential.

Not saying it’s full on moot but agreed with others – would be nice & interesting to see the outcome of your research. Good luck with it.

I don’t believe condition Herald is viable in raids. We don’t have DPS meters so results are down to observation and the timer. While torment I believe is viable in raids (at least this wing) applying enough torment to justify losing a burn or poison Condi class is an issue. Condi Herald and 2 Necros with epidemic was the idea on paper, but a burn Engi lit that paper on fire.

I wouldn’t say Condi Herald can’t be a thing, I would say it won’t be in raids though.

Condi Engis are the bomb, and come in 2 distinct very good varieties, full condi (full kit build) and Burn (less kits, specifically focused on burning).

I personally prefer the burn one, problem with full condi engi is that by the time your conditions applied via rotating all the kits actually do some decent damage, many small targets are already dead. Whereas burn engis are more to the point and while may do a bit less on paper and in theorycrafting, they actually do far more in practical application due to not wasting so much time kit swapping.

By default they are also more flexible then the general condi engis and have more space for things other then kits.

JoshuaRAWR.4653:

Condi reaper is actually a lot weaker than Warrior and Engineer, it’s suprising how much of a gap there actually is.

No it’s really not. People need to stop thinking this. Condi Reaper is far easier to execute at a high level while doing boss mechanics. Warriors are obviously insane on Goreseval simply because of his huge hit box but barring that one instance I’d say Reaper is on par with Warrior and only slightly behind Engineer. In fact on Sab Reapers with specific builds can do damage on par with Warrior on Goreseval.

Please stop spreading misinformed information.

Proof: http://sickestguild.com/forum/m/31644179/viewthread/25151391-spirit-vale-condition-reaper

Going back to OP:

If you’re trying to decide what prof to get a condi set on, I would say that you could look at it from 1 of 3 ways.

1) How many viable condi specs are there for the armor type.
– For medium armor, if you have a condi engi, your only other viable option is ranger. Condi ranger is less dps, but it does have spirits (recently fixed), glyph of empowerment, and grace of the land. However, with the nerfs to CAF regen, I don’t think it will ever be worth it to go ranger except maybe if you have an ele healing instead of druid. Check Pernix’s videos on youtube for ranger condi build stuff.
– For heavy armor, if you have a condi war, you won’t really ever have much reason to swap your condi armor to guard or rev. Condi guard doesn’t do anything a warrior does better (less dps and no banners) and rev is in a terrible spot for condi.
– For light armor, you could use the condi set for necro condi on gorseval for epidemic, then go condi tempest elsewhere.

2) Which condi build is best adapted for raids.
– Condi engineer tends to be the most popular due to how high dps the build is and how flexible it is to provide dps and breakbar support. However, warrior condi is up there as well and can bring banners at the same time.

3) Which condi profession has other useful builds.
– This is only worth considering if you’re willing to get multiple sets of armor, but a warrior does allow you to quickly swap between power PS war for might stacking and condi for higher dps and ranged support.

Overall, I’d say that the most flexibility for one set of condi armor would go to light armor due to condi reaper and tempest both being viable. However, condi engi and warrior are generally more accepted as being ideal.

Edit – So, apparently, ele condi uses primarily Sinister armor since you can only really apply burns and can get the duration increased easily through runes and even sigil if needed. Because of this, you probably wouldn’t want Viper’s armor anyways.

In my opinion, there’s no point in playing condi ele over power ele. Condi ele’s damage is reliant on several hard-to-meet criteria, and is much more burst-y than the other condi builds. Because the condi ele fields are so small/thin, it’s hard to guarantee that the boss will stand in them (other than Sab, who doesn’t move). Not to mention that power ele brings much more general utility (in the form of lava fonts clearing orbs, cleaving ads, etc) with much more consistent dps, it seems like the better choice over condi ele. (Ele’s also have a really hard time running green circles in VG which a lot of groups assign their condi players to run. Replacing an ele in this group could mean a significant dps loss for a power player who needs to be consistently near the boss to continue dps. Then again, VG isn’t actually that hard to that may not be a problem.)

The way I see it, it seems like the two most popular condi classes are war and engi, though I’d actually say the condi classes that are good in the largest number of fights are reaper and engi. While reaper’s condi dps may be slightly (and only slightly) below war and engi, they can bring other utility (epidemic mostly XD) that’s quite useful on both the Gorseval and Sabetha fights. I’d argue they also out-perform condi warriors on VG as the hitbox is much smaller and the boss moves a lot more.

The only time I’ve seen condi ranger (and this is not often) is in druid as the group’s healer and using the condi damage for some dps. Zerker or Zelot’s druid seems to be much more popular currently though (for good reason – you get much more damage from druid staff with zerker gear). I wouldn’t rely on condi druid being at all desired in the future.

softblackcarbon.1537:

The way I see it, it seems like the two most popular condi classes are war and engi, though I’d actually say the condi classes that are good in the largest number of fights are reaper and engi. While reaper’s condi dps may be slightly (and only slightly) below war and engi, they can bring other utility (epidemic mostly XD) that’s quite useful on both the Gorseval and Sabetha fights. I’d argue they also out-perform condi warriors on VG as the hitbox is much smaller and the boss moves a lot more.

I’d disagree on reaper vs war in VG fight. Reaper has a 900 range, which means their dps effectively stops entirely if they have to hit a far lightning circle.

Also, the warrior fields aren’t generally that hard to land as long as you paint them in the direction the boss is walking to keep up dps. This gets tough with distant lightning fields, but it’s no more of a problem than a reaper who can’t reach the boss or an engi who is forced into mortar spam until grenades can reach again.

Warrior will also do amazing dps on the gorseval fight due to the large hit box and while it doesn’t have epidemic, you can still hit multiple targets if you use good directionality on fire fields.

I honestly think 1. you’ll be able to kill VG if you have either a condi war or reaper. It’s not a difficult fight haha 2. Reaper damage will be slightly more reliable on VG for most players because they don’t have the field positioning requirements and the size of VG’kittenbox doesn’t really matter. That said, good condi wars should be able to pull off higher dps, I agree. It’s just harder/less reliable. My group just stacks three condi engis for VG anyway due to the util they bring to that fight (knockbacks, waterfields, reliable condi damage, etc). VG is tuned so loosely that you can beat it with basically any comp that can take down each of the guardians in the split phase anyway, so just play whatever classes you want. :P

And we certainly agree that condi warrior dps is god-tier on gorseval. My point was just that that’s no reason to exclude the other condi classes as condi wars are by no means necessary for the fight. Other condi classes can actually make some mechanics easier for your group if they’re causing problems (epidemic is by far the fastest/most reliable way to kill the adds in both Gorseval and Sabetha). If adds aren’t your problem and dps is, consider taking a condi warrior instead. It’s all about what your group needs.

softblackcarbon.1537:

In my opinion, there’s no point in playing condi ele over power ele. Condi ele’s damage is reliant on several hard-to-meet criteria, and is much more burst-y than the other condi builds. Because the condi ele fields are so small/thin, it’s hard to guarantee that the boss will stand in them (other than Sab, who doesn’t move). Not to mention that power ele brings much more general utility (in the form of lava fonts clearing orbs, cleaving ads, etc) with much more consistent dps, it seems like the better choice over condi ele. (Ele’s also have a really hard time running green circles in VG which a lot of groups assign their condi players to run. Replacing an ele in this group could mean a significant dps loss for a power player who needs to be consistently near the boss to continue dps. Then again, VG isn’t actually that hard to that may not be a problem.)

The way I see it, it seems like the two most popular condi classes are war and engi, though I’d actually say the condi classes that are good in the largest number of fights are reaper and engi. While reaper’s condi dps may be slightly (and only slightly) below war and engi, they can bring other utility (epidemic mostly XD) that’s quite useful on both the Gorseval and Sabetha fights. I’d argue they also out-perform condi warriors on VG as the hitbox is much smaller and the boss moves a lot more.

The only time I’ve seen condi ranger (and this is not often) is in druid as the group’s healer and using the condi damage for some dps. Zerker or Zelot’s druid seems to be much more popular currently though (for good reason – you get much more damage from druid staff with zerker gear). I wouldn’t rely on condi druid being at all desired in the future.

Exactly right. Engi is the best Condi class Necro (Reaper) is the 2nd. Even on Gor (the encounter best suited to Burnzerker) you’ll want Necros for epidemic. Every other encounter I’d take Engi then Necro then War in that order.

Tongku.5326:

Condi Engis are the bomb, and come in 2 distinct very good varieties, full condi (full kit build) and Burn (less kits, specifically focused on burning).

I personally prefer the burn one, problem with full condi engi is that by the time your conditions applied via rotating all the kits actually do some decent damage, many small targets are already dead. Whereas burn engis are more to the point and while may do a bit less on paper and in theorycrafting, they actually do far more in practical application due to not wasting so much time kit swapping.

By default they are also more flexible then the general condi engis and have more space for things other then kits.

How does the burn engi gear/build differ from full condi engr? I find myself struggling with getting actual DPS anywhere near the theoretical for full condi because of all the switching. I’d be very interested in a simpler burn version.

Sorin.4310:

Tongku.5326:

Condi Engis are the bomb, and come in 2 distinct very good varieties, full condi (full kit build) and Burn (less kits, specifically focused on burning).

I personally prefer the burn one, problem with full condi engi is that by the time your conditions applied via rotating all the kits actually do some decent damage, many small targets are already dead. Whereas burn engis are more to the point and while may do a bit less on paper and in theorycrafting, they actually do far more in practical application due to not wasting so much time kit swapping.

By default they are also more flexible then the general condi engis and have more space for things other then kits.

How does the burn engi gear/build differ from full condi engr? I find myself struggling with getting actual DPS anywhere near the theoretical for full condi because of all the switching. I’d be very interested in a simpler burn version.

Focus on burn duration not Condi duration. Your rotation is burn focussed ignoring poison unless everything is on CD. You use FT much more as a burn engineer

Tongku.5326:

Condi Engis are the bomb, and come in 2 distinct very good varieties, full condi (full kit build) and Burn (less kits, specifically focused on burning).

I personally prefer the burn one, problem with full condi engi is that by the time your conditions applied via rotating all the kits actually do some decent damage, many small targets are already dead. Whereas burn engis are more to the point and while may do a bit less on paper and in theorycrafting, they actually do far more in practical application due to not wasting so much time kit swapping.

By default they are also more flexible then the general condi engis and have more space for things other then kits.

Umm…wat? (deliberate mispelling necessary for this situation)

Kit swapping doesn’t lower your dps. Not tracking your cooldowns will, but you still need 2 of the 3 kits + pistol offhand to get your high dps burns (blowtorch, fire bomb, and napalm). Unless you’re just camping FT for that one 2 second (+duration) burn at the end of a long melee AA, you’re doing almost the exact same kit swapping except for grenade kit.

And if you’re doing anything mobile, like lightning circles in VG, you’re sacrificing one of your biggest ranged DPS sources.

And why would you even do this? You don’t need the utility spot for anything else. You have huge breakbar utility from powder keg, air blast, and detonating HT. Air blast alone is all you really even need for things like Seekers.

The only real practical dps loss you get from a straight meta kit build is not tracking your cooldowns and being late on a high dps burn skill, which is pretty much just as possible if all you’re doing is dropping grenade kit.