Guild Wars 2

Cynz.9437:

maddoctor.2738:

Cynz.9437:

Except there is.

There are always exceptions.
Do people really count the dps on Matthias with all his invulnerability phases and the need to run around to cleanse?

What’s next? Kicking people when their dps is lower because they are on slubling duty (Slothasor) or cannon duty (Sabetha)? A tool doesn’t cure human stupidity

The tool gives more reasons for “stupid” people to be toxic.

All the more reason for them to be toxic so I can weed out the idiots onto my block list!

Just joking, you make some good points in a previous comment about rezzing but it entirely depends on when and where people go down.

Someone mentioned KC and they’re right an ele should ignore downs and generally it’s safe for druid and mesmer to rez as both will have done their bit for the burn phase within a second or two, though you might argue the druid didn’t if the guy went down.

In your VG example the druids would be there in the green circle usually and most have the traited search and rescue so they will be up in a flash. I do agree it would be silly for a warrior or mesmer to run there to rez unless a back up was needed, like I say it really depends on the boss and the time.

@topic

I’m not personally against DPS meters if someone wants to improve however I don’t feel they should be enforced and I certainly think consent should be obtained before estimating or getting other people’s data.

The problem I find is that as mentioned by others sometimes mechanics do lower your DPS, not talking adds but things like green circles, poison, corruption and other RNG mechanics. Only yesterday when I was doing Matthias one of our chronos got poison, corrupt, poison, poison, corrupt, poison, she didn’t go down but needless to say her rotations were completely messed up. The thing is a lot of people will read DPS as the gospel truth and that as long as they’re in the top 2 then the fault is with everyone else

It also creates a toxic attitude towards people learning a new class, I have someone wanting to learn ele, they’ve practised on golems but obviously it’s a lot different in the fights. They have maybe less than 100 hours on ele total and we had someone raging because he didn’t do much DPS, mostly because he was down a lot of the time. Was he bad at the class? Yes, no-one would say otherwise however he won’t learn or get better without experiencing the raids on the class and the DPS meters from others reading his data won’t help him nor will the belittling comments that follow.

We should be careful not to deny all of the good features of any tool or content, modes or additions to the game simply because they might cause some “toxicity”.
This seems to be yet another discussion just like the ones about “raids”, “dungeons”, “PvP”, “gearcheck” and my personal favorite “dueling”.

Cynz.9437:

maddoctor.2738:

Astralporing.1957:

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You think raiding community is great and won’t abuse dps meters for griefing? Here is example: i got kicked from Xera group because my LI was the lowest and i am supposedly trash and inexperienced, meanwhile i am sitting at 10 stacks where whole team is having silver/gold stacks and 2 were dead (some clown went burning retreat off edge, other ate orbs 24/7) before labyrinth phase even started. I join another Xera group, we kill her on first try. This is nice and friendly raiding community for you.

Your post kind of baffles me.
Shouldn’t you be the one to welcome a meter that clearly shows your own worth to the party? A tool that doesn’t provide information on just DPS but also healing done, buffs provided, damage avoided, etc. Something that shows that LIs do not matter.

Cynz.9437:

maddoctor.2738:

Cynz.9437:

Except there is.

There are always exceptions.
Do people really count the dps on Matthias with all his invulnerability phases and the need to run around to cleanse?

What’s next? Kicking people when their dps is lower because they are on slubling duty (Slothasor) or cannon duty (Sabetha)? A tool doesn’t cure human stupidity

The tool gives more reasons for “stupid” people to be toxic.

personally i would like screenshots proving most of the raiding community is getting more and more toxic with this. so far youve had 1 bad example. ive been kicked several times for having low LI before meters. please provide your sources before we start allowing ALL anecdotal evidence to be allowed and not just your own. or just stop relying on anecdotal evidence as a whole because it means nothing?

Henry.5713:

We should be careful not to deny all of the good features of any tool or content, modes or additions to the game simply because they might cause some “toxicity”.
This seems to be yet another discussion just like the ones about “raids”, “dungeons”, “PvP”, “gearcheck” and my personal favorite “dueling”.

Cynz.9437:

maddoctor.2738:

Astralporing.1957:

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You think raiding community is great and won’t abuse dps meters for griefing? Here is example: i got kicked from Xera group because my LI was the lowest and i am supposedly trash and inexperienced, meanwhile i am sitting at 10 stacks where whole team is having silver/gold stacks and 2 were dead (some clown went burning retreat off edge, other ate orbs 24/7) before labyrinth phase even started. I join another Xera group, we kill her on first try. This is nice and friendly raiding community for you.

Your post kind of baffles me.
Shouldn’t you be the one to welcome a meter that clearly shows your own worth to the party? A tool that doesn’t provide information on just DPS but also healing done, buffs provided, damage avoided, etc. Something that shows that LIs do not matter.

Maybe she is against it in principle or respects other people’s right to play the game in peace without having their every action monitored and scrutinized? There’s some countries where monitoring everyone in the raid for hours would be considered an invasion of privacy, others might be all in for this though.

apharma.3741:

Henry.5713:

We should be careful not to deny all of the good features of any tool or content, modes or additions to the game simply because they might cause some “toxicity”.
This seems to be yet another discussion just like the ones about “raids”, “dungeons”, “PvP”, “gearcheck” and my personal favorite “dueling”.

Cynz.9437:

maddoctor.2738:

Astralporing.1957:

…

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You think raiding community is great and won’t abuse dps meters for griefing? Here is example: i got kicked from Xera group because my LI was the lowest and i am supposedly trash and inexperienced, meanwhile i am sitting at 10 stacks where whole team is having silver/gold stacks and 2 were dead (some clown went burning retreat off edge, other ate orbs 24/7) before labyrinth phase even started. I join another Xera group, we kill her on first try. This is nice and friendly raiding community for you.

Your post kind of baffles me.
Shouldn’t you be the one to welcome a meter that clearly shows your own worth to the party? A tool that doesn’t provide information on just DPS but also healing done, buffs provided, damage avoided, etc. Something that shows that LIs do not matter.

Maybe she is against it in principle or respects other people’s right to play the game in peace without having their every action monitored and scrutinized? There’s some countries where monitoring everyone in the raid for hours would be considered an invasion of privacy, others might be all in for this though.

you can make your own group kicking anyone who brings or talks about a dps meter in it. its a viable solution for you that doesnt involve banning people because you couldnt be bothered.

Fay.2357:

Cynz.9437:

MrTJpwnz.4710:

I have seen one lfg requiring bdgm, imo if you want to see other ppl’s dps just get arc instead of bdgm. But it is their group, their requirements so if you don’t like it then don’t join

Yeah until everyone and their mother requires them, just like with LI. Make own group? Yeah, i did. Guess what? People have been complaining that LI requirement i put were too low and nobody wanted to join because of it. The moment i put them higher, the group filled.
Same will happen with dps meters. Anet should have never allow them in game. It adds nothing but toxicity to raiding.

If you can pull your own weight in dps, then there’s harm to getting a dps meter. The people fighting the most against them are the ones that would get kicked if people knew how badly they were playing.

Or people that have had a boss fail due to people waiting until the last possible moment to disengage from a boss that really doesn’t even have a very punishing timer, to deal with a mechanic that has the potential to wipe the entire party if it’s not done, and then misjudging how long it’ll take them and end up forcing a recovery that either kills people, or at the very least slows everyone down even more than if they had been willing to er on the side of caution.

It’s mainly an issue on Vale Guardian green circles, but you can see the attitude in other cases too, I think it’s just more pronounced on Vale Guardian because as the very first encounter chronologically, it attracts more new people.

If you take a look at the DPS meter when fighting VG you are either in a very good static raiding squad going for special things, a training group then it also could be very helpful or you are just xxxxxx (censored).

I would never call out for somebody’s dps on VG if you get all mechanics right because this encounter has a very forgiving timer in terms of dps.
So in the end, if you are wiping in enrage although you are handling the mechanics very well, have a look at the meter. Otherwise it’s ridiculous and I suggest leaving such a squad immediately. There are enough other groups out there because with the right mechanics on 10 players you won’t be the only one responsible for doing too less damage.

It has been said already: If a group is toxic to you and uses the dps meter to spread out the toxicity you don’t want to be in that group anyways. It’s most likely that they wouldn’t get the kill even after having you kicked out of the group. Just go on and find your luck elsewhere.

sophiewhite.3149:

apharma.3741:

Henry.5713:

We should be careful not to deny all of the good features of any tool or content, modes or additions to the game simply because they might cause some “toxicity”.
This seems to be yet another discussion just like the ones about “raids”, “dungeons”, “PvP”, “gearcheck” and my personal favorite “dueling”.

Cynz.9437:

maddoctor.2738:

Astralporing.1957:

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…

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You think raiding community is great and won’t abuse dps meters for griefing? Here is example: i got kicked from Xera group because my LI was the lowest and i am supposedly trash and inexperienced, meanwhile i am sitting at 10 stacks where whole team is having silver/gold stacks and 2 were dead (some clown went burning retreat off edge, other ate orbs 24/7) before labyrinth phase even started. I join another Xera group, we kill her on first try. This is nice and friendly raiding community for you.

Your post kind of baffles me.
Shouldn’t you be the one to welcome a meter that clearly shows your own worth to the party? A tool that doesn’t provide information on just DPS but also healing done, buffs provided, damage avoided, etc. Something that shows that LIs do not matter.

Maybe she is against it in principle or respects other people’s right to play the game in peace without having their every action monitored and scrutinized? There’s some countries where monitoring everyone in the raid for hours would be considered an invasion of privacy, others might be all in for this though.

you can make your own group kicking anyone who brings or talks about a dps meter in it. its a viable solution for you that doesnt involve banning people because you couldnt be bothered.

Which is why I personally only raid with people I know and we had a chat last night about DPS meters and set out that Arc DPS is considered banned in our regular raids which I lead. I have no issue with people wanting to run a meter to make sure they’re not missing something like gotl, quickness, full might, seaweed etc buffs and to make sure they’re doing as well as they can but I won’t have people checking others DPS in my raids.

The issue is about consent to having people collect data on you and whether it should be allowed without your knowledge. This is why I like BG meter as if you want squad wide information you need to all run it.

sophiewhite.3149:

apharma.3741:

Henry.5713:

We should be careful not to deny all of the good features of any tool or content, modes or additions to the game simply because they might cause some “toxicity”.
This seems to be yet another discussion just like the ones about “raids”, “dungeons”, “PvP”, “gearcheck” and my personal favorite “dueling”.

Cynz.9437:

maddoctor.2738:

Astralporing.1957:

…

…

…
You think raiding community is great and won’t abuse dps meters for griefing? Here is example: i got kicked from Xera group because my LI was the lowest and i am supposedly trash and inexperienced, meanwhile i am sitting at 10 stacks where whole team is having silver/gold stacks and 2 were dead (some clown went burning retreat off edge, other ate orbs 24/7) before labyrinth phase even started. I join another Xera group, we kill her on first try. This is nice and friendly raiding community for you.

Your post kind of baffles me.
Shouldn’t you be the one to welcome a meter that clearly shows your own worth to the party? A tool that doesn’t provide information on just DPS but also healing done, buffs provided, damage avoided, etc. Something that shows that LIs do not matter.

Maybe she is against it in principle or respects other people’s right to play the game in peace without having their every action monitored and scrutinized? There’s some countries where monitoring everyone in the raid for hours would be considered an invasion of privacy, others might be all in for this though.

you can make your own group kicking anyone who brings or talks about a dps meter in it. its a viable solution for you that doesnt involve banning people because you couldnt be bothered.

Once again, eventually dps meters requirement will become as widespread as LI and you won’t be able to found people that would want to join your group unless you use it. I already have such issue with LI when i lead raids – if i post too low requirements, nobody want to join; if i post high requirements, group fills pretty fast. Meanwhile i think LI is a joke.
P.S. yes, i am in a guild, i don’t have to resort to pugging a lot thankfully but we all have RL and not always able to kill all bosses with the guild group.