Deadeye the new "PS"?
I like the idea and maybe with Rune of Strenght it might become something that could replace pPS
However say we have One in the Chamber , Peripheral Vision AND Fire for effect it might be fun to run Leadership runes and use deadeye as a support DPS/Boonkit
Though that sounds more like a fun/troll build more than a META one it might be kidna funny to see what it can do.
P.S – using stolen skills twice is Deadly Arts – Improvisation
I think you would just run strength for the 45% duration and 5% mod, it’s a decrease against scholar but it won’t make you fail anything. With 2 cantrips (heal, mercy/shadow gust/elite) you can upkeep 10 stacks permanently on 10 people with some overlap. You could technically run scholar but you’d need precise timing on the cantrip use and stolen skill use.
You also only need to take Fire for effect and one in the chamber, can run every other DPS trait from DA and CS. There will be a PS war in one subgroup because of banners and they may have some spill over. 2 deadeyes in one subgroup to have a power group, a few random blasts of might and the might sharing of the chrono should keep 25 up all the time for the power group especially if there’s a power ele there and going off the preliminary weaver rotations I’ve seen there will be blasting of fire fields from ele for 6-9 might at 20s.
‘Nobody touch my cPS warrior meta! I’ts MY raiding entry ticket!’
When discussing those things you need to make a clear distinction between optimal and viable/good/decent/whatever wording you want to use.
Also you have to look at the big picture, because it doesn’t matter if you can out-DPS a Warrior, rather than: whether you can out-DPS him by a large enough margin.
As of right now, Banners are too good to drop so you will always have at least one Warrior in a squad, so the following is with the assumption that you have Banners, and Might output is the same, so we can ignore the DPS increase from both.
Look at some dummy numbers:
From an optimal standpoint: Each Warrior brings 30k DPS and Empower Allies, which is about 2-4k~ group DPS increase (for the sake of math lets say 2k), so the total DPS of both Warriors, counting personal DPS and EA is 64k.
Now if you want to drop one of them for an alternative Might stacker, that means you lose EA on one sub-group (2k) and about 2k from the first Warrior who has to drop Shattering Blow for an extra Banner. Meaning that the first Warrior will be doing a total of 28k DPS now (counting the lower personal DPS and the 2k DPS loss of the second sub-group for dropping EA), which means the the alternative Might stacker will have to do over 36k (personal + increase from w/e unique buff they may give) to overcome the 64k that 2 Warriors can achieve.
Any class that could pull off something like that would be definitely over tuned.
There is the option that Condi PS will be nerfed with the upcoming expansion, but judging by the looks of Spellbreaker being a non PvE spec, I have a feeling that Condi PS will keep it’s current state, and the the latest buff to it (which seemed unreasonable in the current meta) was only meant to keep Warrior in the game for PvE.
So to sum all the above, it will require a lot to remove the double Warrior setup from the optimal composition unless there are some big overhauls.
From a viable standpoint: Alternate Might stackers were already viable (Condi Tempest, Rev) in the last few patches, for most groups the outcome will be the same, and timers only vary by a couple seconds.
If you look at the typical PuG, where the DPS dealers do 50% of their expected DPS (making EA half as effective) and there’s not enough Alacrity to maintain a full Condi PS Warrior rotation (losing a couple more k’s of DPS), you might actually get better results with an alternate Might stacker.
So if you don’t care about optimal setup, dropping the second PS won’t matter, but don’t expect PuGs to have a similar mindset ^^.
tl;dr: Without a major overhaul you will always keep 1 Warrior in the squad, bringing 2 is the current optimal choice and it will be very hard to change without introducing a new broken spec. Alternative Might stackers are viable, use them at your own risk.
*All the above is from looking at DPS numbers only and not taking into consideration the supreme CC and Cleave from Condi PS, as well as gimmicky situations on some encounters.
When discussing those things you need to make a clear distinction between optimal and viable/good/decent/whatever wording you want to use.
Also you have to look at the big picture, because it doesn’t matter if you can out-DPS a Warrior, rather than: whether you can out-DPS him by a large enough margin.As of right now, Banners are too good to drop so you will always have at least one Warrior in a squad, so the following is with the assumption that you have Banners, and Might output is the same, so we can ignore the DPS increase from both.
Look at some dummy numbers:
From an optimal standpoint: Each Warrior brings 30k DPS and Empower Allies, which is about 2-4k~ group DPS increase (for the sake of math lets say 2k), so the total DPS of both Warriors, counting personal DPS and EA is 64k.
Now if you want to drop one of them for an alternative Might stacker, that means you lose EA on one sub-group (2k) and about 2k from the first Warrior who has to drop Shattering Blow for an extra Banner. Meaning that the first Warrior will be doing a total of 28k DPS now (counting the lower personal DPS and the 2k DPS loss of the second sub-group for dropping EA), which means the the alternative Might stacker will have to do over 36k (personal + increase from w/e unique buff they may give) to overcome the 64k that 2 Warriors can achieve.
Any class that could pull off something like that would be definitely over tuned.
There is the option that Condi PS will be nerfed with the upcoming expansion, but judging by the looks of Spellbreaker being a non PvE spec, I have a feeling that Condi PS will keep it’s current state, and the the latest buff to it (which seemed unreasonable in the current meta) was only meant to keep Warrior in the game for PvE.
So to sum all the above, it will require a lot to remove the double Warrior setup from the optimal composition unless there are some big overhauls.From a viable standpoint: Alternate Might stackers were already viable (Condi Tempest, Rev) in the last few patches, for most groups the outcome will be the same, and timers only vary by a couple seconds.
If you look at the typical PuG, where the DPS dealers do 50% of their expected DPS (making EA half as effective) and there’s not enough Alacrity to maintain a full Condi PS Warrior rotation (losing a couple more k’s of DPS), you might actually get better results with an alternate Might stacker.
So if you don’t care about optimal setup, dropping the second PS won’t matter, but don’t expect PuGs to have a similar mindset ^^.tl;dr: Without a major overhaul you will always keep 1 Warrior in the squad, bringing 2 is the current optimal choice and it will be very hard to change without introducing a new broken spec. Alternative Might stackers are viable, use them at your own risk.
*All the above is from looking at DPS numbers only and not taking into consideration the supreme CC and Cleave from Condi PS, as well as gimmicky situations on some encounters.
Something to bear in mind, you said assuming warrior doesn’t get nerfed but most people are of the belief that blade master will be toned down. Should chop significantly into the current CPS build especially for how much buffing it gives. Think Nike had a decent video on replacing warriors but that was back in May so might be a little outdated but it essentially said a DPS build doing >31k and providing 25 might would be enough to change 2 PS wars to 1 PS war.
When discussing those things you need to make a clear distinction between optimal and viable/good/decent/whatever wording you want to use.
Also you have to look at the big picture, because it doesn’t matter if you can out-DPS a Warrior, rather than: whether you can out-DPS him by a large enough margin.As of right now, Banners are too good to drop so you will always have at least one Warrior in a squad, so the following is with the assumption that you have Banners, and Might output is the same, so we can ignore the DPS increase from both.
Look at some dummy numbers:
From an optimal standpoint: Each Warrior brings 30k DPS and Empower Allies, which is about 2-4k~ group DPS increase (for the sake of math lets say 2k), so the total DPS of both Warriors, counting personal DPS and EA is 64k.
Now if you want to drop one of them for an alternative Might stacker, that means you lose EA on one sub-group (2k) and about 2k from the first Warrior who has to drop Shattering Blow for an extra Banner. Meaning that the first Warrior will be doing a total of 28k DPS now (counting the lower personal DPS and the 2k DPS loss of the second sub-group for dropping EA), which means the the alternative Might stacker will have to do over 36k (personal + increase from w/e unique buff they may give) to overcome the 64k that 2 Warriors can achieve.
Any class that could pull off something like that would be definitely over tuned.
There is the option that Condi PS will be nerfed with the upcoming expansion, but judging by the looks of Spellbreaker being a non PvE spec, I have a feeling that Condi PS will keep it’s current state, and the the latest buff to it (which seemed unreasonable in the current meta) was only meant to keep Warrior in the game for PvE.
So to sum all the above, it will require a lot to remove the double Warrior setup from the optimal composition unless there are some big overhauls.From a viable standpoint: Alternate Might stackers were already viable (Condi Tempest, Rev) in the last few patches, for most groups the outcome will be the same, and timers only vary by a couple seconds.
If you look at the typical PuG, where the DPS dealers do 50% of their expected DPS (making EA half as effective) and there’s not enough Alacrity to maintain a full Condi PS Warrior rotation (losing a couple more k’s of DPS), you might actually get better results with an alternate Might stacker.
So if you don’t care about optimal setup, dropping the second PS won’t matter, but don’t expect PuGs to have a similar mindset ^^.tl;dr: Without a major overhaul you will always keep 1 Warrior in the squad, bringing 2 is the current optimal choice and it will be very hard to change without introducing a new broken spec. Alternative Might stackers are viable, use them at your own risk.
*All the above is from looking at DPS numbers only and not taking into consideration the supreme CC and Cleave from Condi PS, as well as gimmicky situations on some encounters.
Something to bear in mind, you said assuming warrior doesn’t get nerfed but most people are of the belief that blade master will be toned down. Should chop significantly into the current CPS build especially for how much buffing it gives. Think Nike had a decent video on replacing warriors but that was back in May so might be a little outdated but it essentially said a DPS build doing >31k and providing 25 might would be enough to change 2 PS wars to 1 PS war.
I’m not assuming anything, it’s just my personal opinion based on Anet’s say on reddit (that Spellbreaker was designed for PvP/WvW and that Berserker is the Warrior PvE spec).
Unless they plan to gut every future DPS option for Warrior and leave it as a mere 1 build support class, I don’t think they will nerf it.
But then again, none of us can possibly know what’s on their mind.
With all due respect, Nike’s video is completely irrelevant, and even back in May you would not get better results anywhere by replacing the Warrior (except for maybe Cairn as in the last qT record, though I don’t remember Revenant’s state back in May. And it’s really just a cheesy build that makes use of a weird game mechanic).
Banners and PS simply need nerfing. They’re way too good a boost for how little investment they require.
Banners and PS simply need nerfing. They’re way too good a boost for how little investment they require.
I don’t know if Banners need a nerf, the lack of mobility in them is kind of their downfall (Remember they used to give 90 to each stat and were kind of weak). If anything maybe lower them to 135/150. But I do agree Phalanx Strength needs a nerf. I’m not sure how, maybe a cap of 10 might, at least condi warrior’s damage is high enough they would still be brought along, the banners alone are useful enough. Power Warrior just needs some buffs
Grok Walking Amongst Mere Mortals
Banners and PS simply need nerfing. They’re way too good a boost for how little investment they require.
I don’t know if Banners need a nerf, the lack of mobility in them is kind of their downfall (Remember they used to give 90 to each stat and were kind of weak). If anything maybe lower them to 135/150. But I do agree Phalanx Strength needs a nerf. I’m not sure how, maybe a cap of 10 might, at least condi warrior’s damage is high enough they would still be brought along, the banners alone are useful enough. Power Warrior just needs some buffs
Unlike chrono and druid, warrior gets these huge group power boosts for free in a core spec, which means they can take this powerful utility on any warrior spec.
Banner mobility is a non-issue if people bother to grab the flags and move them. Their range is so large, you’ll never miss their benefits while in combat.
They’re more powerful, unkillable versions of druid spirits that can be moved around once combat ends, and nobody seems to mind (warrior banner elite is a flat out superior version of ranger spirit elite).
Empower Allies is fine, those auras encourage bringing at least one of every class. But PS and banners push warrior utility way over the top.
PS in particular is toxic because it stacks might so effectively, it makes any utilities or traits that grant might obsolete on other classes.
I hope they revisit combo fields, because honestly blasting fire fields and taking advantage of auras in a group should be a group effort to maintain high stacks of might instead of some trivial task fulfilled by a single group member.
Banners and PS simply need nerfing. They’re way too good a boost for how little investment they require.
I don’t know if Banners need a nerf, the lack of mobility in them is kind of their downfall (Remember they used to give 90 to each stat and were kind of weak). If anything maybe lower them to 135/150. But I do agree Phalanx Strength needs a nerf. I’m not sure how, maybe a cap of 10 might, at least condi warrior’s damage is high enough they would still be brought along, the banners alone are useful enough. Power Warrior just needs some buffs
Not sure if that’s an idea they can make standard across the board. Only being able to do max 10 might stacks to allies (or whichever limited number) in general would incentivize people to rethink the whole two might buff character a bit.
If it really is ideal to overthrow that meta anyway. :P
“It isn’t working!” CL4P-TP
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik
Banners and PS simply need nerfing. They’re way too good a boost for how little investment they require.
why do they need nerfing?
do you want to make warriors absolete?
are you trying to make enemies here?
Banners and PS simply need nerfing. They’re way too good a boost for how little investment they require.
why do they need nerfing?
do you want to make warriors absolete?
are you trying to make enemies here?
Warrior won’t ever be obsolete so long as it has unique buffs. They just don’t need to be utterly broken buffs.
Banners and PS simply need nerfing. They’re way too good a boost for how little investment they require.
why do they need nerfing?
do you want to make warriors absolete?
are you trying to make enemies here?Warrior won’t ever be obsolete so long as it has unique buffs. They just don’t need to be utterly broken buffs.
But im asking you, whats broken about it?
Why do you think they need to be nerfed?
Unlike chrono and druid, warrior gets these huge group power boosts for free in a core spec, which means they can take this powerful utility on any warrior spec.
For free, is just another way of saying, ‘they have nothing better they can take’. Warriors have a good support line, but they don’t have 3 separate dps oreiented lines. As such, you usually see two warriors in a group, but never more than that.
Considering 6 ranger groups were pretty good pre condi food nerf, and mesmer has so many different viable builds I can barely count them, I don’t think either of these classes have any room to complain.
You say that warrior’s core specs are too good, but there are no good core warrior builds I know of, unlike ranger,thief, engi,mesmer, and even ele (arcane-water-fire) to a lesser extent.
They’re more powerful, unkillable versions of druid spirits that can be moved around once combat ends, and nobody seems to mind (warrior banner elite is a flat out superior version of ranger spirit elite).
Battle standard cool down: 240
Nature spirit cool down: 120
Both have a duration of 1 minute.
Effective radius of both: 600.
banner cast time: 2 seconds
spirit cast time: 1.5 seconds
Battle standard’s boons are all redundant, nature spirit pulsing stability is encounter changing for several bosses.
Empower Allies is fine, those auras encourage bringing at least one of every class. But PS and banners push warrior utility way over the top.
Actually they encourage bringing 2 of every class, unlike banners which encourage you to bring only a single warrior. We just have not yet reached that point.
PS in particular is toxic because it stacks might so effectively, it makes any utilities or traits that grant might obsolete on other classes.
I hope they revisit combo fields, because honestly blasting fire fields and taking advantage of auras in a group should be a group effort to maintain high stacks of might instead of some trivial task fulfilled by a single group member.
If you think class exclusion is bad now, just wait until every time a guardian drops a light field, and the entire team can’t stack might anymore.
Also, the might stacking of other classes is not irrelevant. A regen druid provides enough might that warrior can change its build around. Some groups might choose to be lazy and just overcap might, but its hardly fair to blame anything but the players for that. Anet made a system where that might is not irrelevant, players simply ignore it because most players are not interested in optimized runs, just quick and easy ones.
What part of revisit combo fields do you not understand? REVISIT.
Funny you would even mention druid cast time to summon, when that is not when it rezzes. You must summon it, and then wait for the command delay for it to actually summon, upon which it dies and ceases providing its benefits unlike the banner.
I didn’t say warrior core specs were too good. Reading comprehension, please. I said warriors get their utility through core traitlines, which allows them to choose elite specs without losing their vital group utility.
If a mesmer chooses mirage, he loses alacrity and quickness completely. If a ranger chooses soulbeast over druid, he loses grace of the land. And both in turn become kittenty, selfish low tier DPS specs as a result with nothing to offer.
Core warrior would still be taken if only because of PS and banners’ strength, if the alternative were to not have any warrior elite specs.
(edited by Zenith.7301)
Perhaps those trait auras need to be improved to 10 players? That would make it less necessary to dedicate 2 slots to any particular class.
Might stacking is easy enough to do with a group, even without Phalanx Strength. For example, I don’t think there’s any doubt that any meta Scourge build will run Torch and Blood is Power (the later is currently in the meta Necro build), both of which provide a substantial amount of group might. It’s probably not enough alone, but there are enough other sources scattered throughout the classes that Phalanx Strength is probably going to be superfluous.
(edited by Drarnor Kunoram.5180)
Banners and PS simply need nerfing. They’re way too good a boost for how little investment they require.
why do they need nerfing?
do you want to make warriors absolete?
are you trying to make enemies here?
I don’t necessarily agree with nerfing banners, but they are ridiculously strong.
Spotter “only” gives 150 precision, yet banner of discipline gives 170 precision AND 170 ferocity (more than 11% crit damage)
Pinpoint Distribution “only” gives 150 condition damage.
Empower Allies “only” gives 150 power
Strength in Numbers “only” gives 150 toughness
Assassins presence gives “all of” 225 ferocity
These effects all grant 150 stats with the sole exception of assassins presence which grants 225. Yet each banner gives 340 stats in total, on top of the empower allies that warrior can also bring if they wanted to. That’s a stupid amount of extra stats to give to your party from a single warrior when you compare it to what other classes can give out.
I mean hell, GoTL, despite the fact that the druid has to actually work towards keeping 5 stacks up, can only give 10% bonus damage to the group. Yet banner of discipline will give every player in the raid group more than 11% bonus damage if they are at 100% crit chance. And the warrior can also throw down banner of strength for an even larger damage boost.
People seem to underestimate just how much more powerful warrior banners are compared to other unique effects that you can share with your entire group. They give way more raw stats then they should tbh. And a warrior can also stack them with even more party support via PS and empower allies. Its just absurd.
If a mesmer chooses mirage, he loses alacrity and quickness completely. If a ranger chooses soulbeast over druid, he loses grace of the land. And both in turn become kittenty, selfish low tier DPS specs as a result with nothing to offer.
Oh, I’m sorry I didn’t realize those specs were already released and tested in raids. Please post those logs for us, I’m sure that information would help Anet balance it to be better.
PS in particular is toxic because it stacks might so effectively, it makes any utilities or traits that grant might obsolete on other classes.
The trait itself just shares 6 seconds. What makes it effective are sigils, runes, traits and bufffood that grant might frequently enough to compensate the short duration.
Yet banner of discipline will give every player in the raid group more than 11% bonus damage if they are at 100% crit chance.
Sry to break your math here, but you are incorrect. 11% more critdamage does not imply 11% more total damage. Most power specs run arround 220% critdamage.
(220+11)/220 = 105%, which means 5% more total damage assuming 100% critchance.
(edited by Tornupto.2304)
Banners and PS simply need nerfing. They’re way too good a boost for how little investment they require.
why do they need nerfing?
do you want to make warriors absolete?
are you trying to make enemies here?I don’t necessarily agree with nerfing banners, but they are ridiculously strong.
Spotter “only” gives 150 precision, yet banner of discipline gives 170 precision AND 170 ferocity (more than 11% crit damage)
Pinpoint Distribution “only” gives 150 condition damage.
Empower Allies “only” gives 150 power
Strength in Numbers “only” gives 150 toughness
Assassins presence gives “all of” 225 ferocity
These effects all grant 150 stats with the sole exception of assassins presence which grants 225. Yet each banner gives 340 stats in total, on top of the empower allies that warrior can also bring if they wanted to. That’s a stupid amount of extra stats to give to your party from a single warrior when you compare it to what other classes can give out.
I mean hell, GoTL, despite the fact that the druid has to actually work towards keeping 5 stacks up, can only give 10% bonus damage to the group. Yet banner of discipline will give every player in the raid group more than 11% bonus damage if they are at 100% crit chance. And the warrior can also throw down banner of strength for an even larger damage boost.
People seem to underestimate just how much more powerful warrior banners are compared to other unique effects that you can share with your entire group. They give way more raw stats then they should tbh. And a warrior can also stack them with even more party support via PS and empower allies. Its just absurd.
Well, sure, they’re good, but everytime a class is good at something it needs to be nerfed?
If you repeat that cycle for every class and every function, soon everyone will play the grey blob.
Mesmers supply the alacrity that make raids a lot easier, lets nerf that. Oh, amd druids make the best healers, lets cut that in half.
You know what, lets just get rid of classes, everyone plays the “the person”
It has 1 attack skill, 1 selfheal, and it can stun an enemy for 2 seconds, once every minute. Oh, and lets remove stats, choosing between condi, power, expertise, its all a hassle anyway, everything’s now “hit that thing”-stat.
Sorry for the hyperbole, but once you start nerfing things you’re on a slippery slope to World of Warcraft
If anything, the warrior’s finally a bit playable since we only have to carry 1 banner now.
(edited by Amaimon.7823)
If a mesmer chooses mirage, he loses alacrity and quickness completely. If a ranger chooses soulbeast over druid, he loses grace of the land. And both in turn become kittenty, selfish low tier DPS specs as a result with nothing to offer.
Oh, I’m sorry I didn’t realize those specs were already released and tested in raids. Please post those logs for us, I’m sure that information would help Anet balance it to be better.
It’s cute when they have hope.
Well, sure, they’re good, but everytime a class is good at something it needs to be nerfed?
If you repeat that cycle for every class and every function, soon everyone will play the grey blob.
Mesmers supply the alacrity that make raids a lot easier, lets nerf that. Oh, amd druids make the best healers, lets cut that in half.
You know what, lets just get rid of classes, everyone plays the “the person”
It has 1 attack skill, 1 selfheal, and it can stun an enemy for 2 seconds, once every minute. Oh, and lets remove stats, choosing between condi, power, expertise, its all a hassle anyway, everything’s now “hit that thing”-stat.Sorry for the hyperbole, but once you start nerfing things you’re on a slippery slope to World of Warcraft
If anything, the warrior’s finally a bit playable since we only have to carry 1 banner now.
The difference is that Chrono’s bring all that support and do 8k dps… Druids bring GotL and do 2-10k depending on their spec. Warrior’s supply all of their groups Might, Fury, Empower Allies, Banner Buffs, and still do 30k.
I know nobody wants to be nerfed, but don’t you think it’s a little crazy that someone bringing over 1/2 the groups total support buffs is also doing top tier dps? The means that realistically, a group can bring six Condi PS’s, all in their CPS gear/build and do about as good as a group using actual DPS specs. Not 2 PS’s and 4 DPS spec’d wars… Just straight up 6 PS’s and still get the kill in a realistic amount of tme.
Well, sure, they’re good, but everytime a class is good at something it needs to be nerfed?
If you repeat that cycle for every class and every function, soon everyone will play the grey blob.
Mesmers supply the alacrity that make raids a lot easier, lets nerf that. Oh, amd druids make the best healers, lets cut that in half.
You know what, lets just get rid of classes, everyone plays the “the person”
It has 1 attack skill, 1 selfheal, and it can stun an enemy for 2 seconds, once every minute. Oh, and lets remove stats, choosing between condi, power, expertise, its all a hassle anyway, everything’s now “hit that thing”-stat.Sorry for the hyperbole, but once you start nerfing things you’re on a slippery slope to World of Warcraft
If anything, the warrior’s finally a bit playable since we only have to carry 1 banner now.
Sorry to break your hyperbole, but its not at all relevant. Chronos have kitten DPS if they run an alacrity and quickness build. Druids giving out GotL don’t have great DPS. Warriors can still deal ridiculous DPS while still providing the strongest support, and they have so much of it. Banners + empower allies + fury + might, all while dealing really high DPS.
Now compare that to chrono who is “balanced” in that he has the lowest DPS in the game in order to bring less support than the warrior can bring.
Also, in case you forgot, alacrity was already nerfed in half. Its not like it hasn’t been touched. Its also not unique to chronos, yet banners are unique to warriors.
Truth is they give way too many raw stats. And people like you are too stubborn to admit that they are too good.
Here is something people have not really brought up into the discussion.
Yes, condi ps brings a lot of offensive support, but they bring no defensive support. condi ps can’t heal you. Compare to druid which not only brings strong offensive support, but also strong condi clense, strong healing, and other defensive abilities such as projectile conversion, search and rescue, stone spirit for protection, etc.
Also compare this to chrono. In addition to great offensive buffs, chrono also has amazing defensive utility. First off, distortion. Distortion share is insanely strong. good chronos consistently distort:
-gorse slams
-sloth shakes
-matthias haduken (especially when rezzing somone)
-kc slams, and pizza cutter after catching orb phase
-samarog slams
-deimos slams
That alone makes chrono defensive utility amazing, but then you have things like permanent protection through chaos line/herald runes, vigor easily accessible through chaos, resistance, and stability, all pretty easily accessible. They can slot things like feedback, disenchanter, and precog for even more defensive utility. They can pull and group mobs together. A 4 condi clense on a 10 second cool down via their healing mantra.
What defensive utility does warrior have for the group? Very little. What I am saying is, your comparing a class that has offensive support and dps to two classes that have both offensive and defensive support, and complaining that the prior class has too much dps.
Personal stance: I don’t see people stacking condi ps in raids. I see 2 warriors in each group, and it could very easily drop down to 1 warrior (which is the point of this thread). Occasionally you get a dps warrior, but that is a seperate build. So no, I don’t think warrior is broken. If people start stacking them, then I will reevaluate my stance.
Banners and PS simply need nerfing. They’re way too good a boost for how little investment they require.
why do they need nerfing?
do you want to make warriors absolete?
are you trying to make enemies here?
While banners are fine, PS really needs the nerf. So long as PS is the way it is, all attempts to grant might sharing to other specs will become null.
Don’t worry, you could change PS to “granting yourself might grants sugar rush to nearby allies” and warrior would still be meta.
Banners and PS simply need nerfing. They’re way too good a boost for how little investment they require.
why do they need nerfing?
do you want to make warriors absolete?
are you trying to make enemies here?While banners are fine, PS really needs the nerf. So long as PS is the way it is, all attempts to grant might sharing to other specs will become null.
Don’t worry, you could change PS to “granting yourself might grants sugar rush to nearby allies” and warrior would still be meta.
Bit of topic, but i just pictured this sugar rush scene. People storm at slothasor, the sugar rush keeps stacking, people getting extremely hyper and fight maxed pace. Then.. the inevitable, the warrior miscalculates a venom drop, and dies, everyone’s sugar rush wears of and then hits..
PS = Phalanx Strength. Has Deadeye this strait? No. End of discussion.
PS = Phalanx Strength. Deadeye has this trait? No. End of discussion.
PS = Phalanx Strength. Deadeye has this trait? No. End of discussion.
You do realize that there were quotes around “PS” for a reason, right?
Anyways, as for the actual discussion itself, I think that the biggest problem with deadeye for a lot of content is that it’s a very single target-based damage spec. Even if you’re not using rifle, the malice mechanic centers around one target. This may be fine for a lot of individual boss fights, but it will probably hamstring the spec a lot in dungeons and other add-based encounters.
However, if the devs do want there to be an alternative might-stacking build for the meta outside of PS, they just need to make sure that PS warriors (or other might stacking builds) don’t deal equivalent DPS to pure DPS classes. This should be fair since it’s the same reason why a Chrono deals low damage.
If they did this, you could still cover banners by bringing a higher damage build of a warrior to the group for something closer to a pure DPS role and just have them drop banners.
PS = Phalanx Strength. Deadeye has this trait? No. End of discussion.
You do realize that there were quotes around “PS” for a reason, right?
Anyways, as for the actual discussion itself, I think that the biggest problem with deadeye for a lot of content is that it’s a very single target-based damage spec. Even if you’re not using rifle, the malice mechanic centers around one target. This may be fine for a lot of individual boss fights, but it will probably hamstring the spec a lot in dungeons and other add-based encounters.
However, if the devs do want there to be an alternative might-stacking build for the meta outside of PS, they just need to make sure that PS warriors (or other might stacking builds) don’t deal equivalent DPS to pure DPS classes. This should be fair since it’s the same reason why a Chrono deals low damage.
If they did this, you could still cover banners by bringing a higher damage build of a warrior to the group for something closer to a pure DPS role and just have them drop banners.
Dungeons are so hilariously easy now that I don’t feel it’s worth bringing them up in any discussion anymore. In terms of encounters, more and more even in story there hasn’t been many with lots of adds that require more attention then cleave it out while killing the boss.
I think it will be fine as it is and run D/D but swap Trickery for Deadeye as you get more damage mods out of malice and with so many kinda meh major traits you’ll have no real down side to running might share unless wanting to absolutely maximise personal damage with that GM trait that grants 200 power and precision.
I would be very surprised if CPS didn’t get toned down as it does way too much damage for the support it brings which would lower the bar for other might stackers.
The real question is how be quick or be killed scales with the insane damage boosts of malice and if it’s just flat out better than fire for effect. Even maleficent seven looks like a hefty boost at max stacks.
Deadeye – a new build that can DPS and stack might? Yes.
Deadeye – a replacement for a condiPS or even condiDPS? No.
CPS have over the top damage, but people are asking for all-around warrior support nerf instead of looking into the condi damage problem. Logic? Ugh.
Kiijna, Xast, Satis Ironwail, Sekhaina, Shira Forgesparkle, Sfeno, Nasibi, Tegeira, Rhonwe…
25 charracters
25 charracters
Here is something people have not really brought up into the discussion.
Yes, condi ps brings a lot of offensive support, but they bring no defensive support. condi ps can’t heal you. Compare to druid which not only brings strong offensive support, but also strong condi clense, strong healing, and other defensive abilities such as projectile conversion, search and rescue, stone spirit for protection, etc.
Also compare this to chrono. In addition to great offensive buffs, chrono also has amazing defensive utility. First off, distortion. Distortion share is insanely strong. good chronos consistently distort:
-gorse slams
-sloth shakes
-matthias haduken (especially when rezzing somone)
-kc slams, and pizza cutter after catching orb phase
-samarog slams
-deimos slamsThat alone makes chrono defensive utility amazing, but then you have things like permanent protection through chaos line/herald runes, vigor easily accessible through chaos, resistance, and stability, all pretty easily accessible. They can slot things like feedback, disenchanter, and precog for even more defensive utility. They can pull and group mobs together. A 4 condi clense on a 10 second cool down via their healing mantra.
What defensive utility does warrior have for the group? Very little. What I am saying is, your comparing a class that has offensive support and dps to two classes that have both offensive and defensive support, and complaining that the prior class has too much dps.
Personal stance: I don’t see people stacking condi ps in raids. I see 2 warriors in each group, and it could very easily drop down to 1 warrior (which is the point of this thread). Occasionally you get a dps warrior, but that is a seperate build. So no, I don’t think warrior is broken. If people start stacking them, then I will reevaluate my stance.
Let’s just agree that all 3 of them are highly over powered in the current meta.
14 Dungeon paths soloed
Lupi solos on 9/9 professions
Wost Engi NA
Lupi solos on 9/9 professions
Wost Engi NA
Well, sure, they’re good, but everytime a class is good at something it needs to be nerfed?
When a class is not only competitive, but straight up optimal to take in pretty much every situation while others struggle to remain even competitive, then yes it should be nerfed. The problem with balance in this game is that Anet basically never changes meta. Warrior is currently optimal for every single raid boss in the game. When raids were first released warrior was optimal for every fight then too. During the dungeon days warrior was optimal or at least competitive for most record speed clears. Warrior has simply always been top tier in instanced pve.
On the other hand we look at say necro. It was never optimal or competitive for speed clearing dungeons, and has never really been optimal for any raid bosses, necro has always been low to mid tier for instanced pve. For the entire duration of the game warrior has been better than necro in end game pve content. Leaving the imbalance in such a consistent state brings the mindset of “warrior is meant to be good while necro is meant to be bad”. Sure it would be impossible for the balance team to make necro and warrior perfectly equal in value, but there should at least be some times when necro is perhaps at least a little bit better. Also you can replace necro in this analogy with most other classes as warrior has always been top tier, while the others have had their ups and downs.
14 Dungeon paths soloed
Lupi solos on 9/9 professions
Wost Engi NA
Lupi solos on 9/9 professions
Wost Engi NA