Guild Wars 2

Define Good at GW2

A curious thought on what the community defines as a good player. So what would you describe a good player is? Here is my take what is yours.

Every day there is someone calling someone a baddy for a different reason. So I thought why not create benchmarks that can be used as proof that someone is a baddy, struggler or above average, and I leave out top tier because it is only a handful of people in their own little club that can solo half the game (If you can solo or even duo any dungeon you probably an above average player). The final goal is to create benchmarks that people can clearly tell people who read this thread what their skill level is. Give me feed back and tell me if there are more types of players out there. Also tell me about any encounters that you think are good benchmarks. Tell me about anything I should edit thanks

Listings that I will edit based on feedback.

The philosophy these benchmarks are based is: Dungeons should be completed in a timely manner not world record times but you do not want to spend more time than you have to.

Section 1: List of types of players

So the worst type of player in GW2: Like it or not if you are one of these the community will consider you a BADDY.

-Never listens to any input from anyone.
-Disagrees with others without fact based reasons not to. Sadly in most cases if you use any non Power primary statistic equipment and believe it is a good choice you fall into this category.
-Never dodges ever
-People who do not want to work as team.
-Ignores boss and game mechanics usually causes team wipes in hard content
-Believes every monster must be vanquished

Welcome the Struggler:

Often a person who understands the game but for some reason just cannot effectively execute the correct actions all the time. This player is usually deficient in some skill set required for higher level of play.

-Knows how to dodge but does not always dodge at the right time or wastes dodges.
-Often understands the fight but cannot perform to certain degree of skill to be above average.
-Does not use zerker but uses Knights for example because this player knows he takes hits and needs buffer. This player would ultimately strive to achieve a full zerker build
-This type of player knows what they are good at and what they are not so good at.
-Is usually a team player

Above Average Player

An above average player Uses Zerker gear just about possible scenario in GW2.
-Dodges effectively rarely gets downed
-Understands mechanics for fights knows many strategies.
-Understands how to maximize DPS but may not be able to perfectly achieve said maximization.
-A group of above average players will tend to no deaths and maybe a couple downs on average

Benchmark Encounters:

Aether Blade dungeon

A good place to test teamwork nothing too hard inside the dungeon but there are mechanics where playing poorly is hurts your team. Examples are Killing Holograms on mass on your teammates causing them to die. Kiting the Clockheart counter to where your team is going. All of the above can cause team wipes. The less you do this the better you are at GW2

Subject Alpha:

If you wipe lots on Alpha you are probably not good at GW2 sorry.
If you downed vs. Alpha every encounter you might be a struggler.
Rarely get hit by Alpha’s attacks you might be an above average player

Mossman without gimmicks

Baddy

Mossman always hits you with his axe, you probably need to l2p
You needlessly kite away from Mossman when he uses stealth increasing the duration of the fight, that is a baddy thing to do please do not do that

Struggler

Gets downed a several times in the fight
When Downed attempts to rally off a wolf kill

Above average

Does not get downed often
Capable of weaving in and out of melee versus the Mossman when not the primary target

Grawl Shaman

Baddy

Gets killed several times during this fight
Kites in a way that causes elementals to spread out

Struggler

Takes hits and is prone to wasting dodges.
Understands how to keep elementals clumped

Above average

Does not get downed outside of add phase
Capable of sometimes weaving into melee with the Grawl shaman
Fully understands how to position Grawl shaman to maximize the time available to wipe adds before the bubble needs to be broken.

Lupicus-Is a bad benchmark boss since he requires a high degree of skill proficiencies that are otherwise unused outside of his specific fight. So I am not using him

This boss has a high dodge tax he demands you to dodge any move he performs. His moves are difficult to read unless you have studied how to fight him. Phase 1 kicks are hard to dodge based on reflex alone, using energy sigils to gain enough dodges to dodge regardless of whether Lupicus kicks or does another move is not an indicator of skill. Most of lupicus phase 3 moves deal constant heavy damage with a quick animation. Conclusion Lupicus is a boss that demands higher than normally required reflexes than other bosses in the game thus should not be used as a benchmark in testing Player skill.

Anyone who can do a melee run of Lupicus is above average. Any team that can consistently beat Lupicus without wipes with any generally accepted non-exploit strategy is above average. Convince me otherwise and we can add a section

tl;dr Learn to dodge mechanics

I primarily run dungeons. Arah P1-3 always the days I play(which are most). My friend who runs Arah with me, we use Lupicus as the great equalizer. It is in there we test if people are actually experienced in Arah. There is no way to hide inexperience in there, unless its only 1 pug, and we get him down so quick we don’t notice the nubulus in him.

Anyone that can melee phase 2 lupicus the whole time while not getting downed is above above average for sure.

Tl;DR. For arah dungeon only, Lupicus is my only test of skill level in that dungeon. Obviously if they fail the runs, then that supersedes Lupicus test, but you get me.

Well, all those cathegories can be summed up under “not good” to me.

Vlad.1739:

Phase 1 kicks are hard to dodge based on reflex alone, using energy sigils to gain enough dodges to dodge regardless of whether Lupicus kicks or does another move is not an indicator of skill.

You don’t have enough endurance with base regeneration rate to dodge 2 kicks + grub spawn, right? No? Well, maybe no.

Anyway, out of above ones, Shaman fight at high levels is really an indicator of ability to work with your team while managing yourself.

I just kind of don’t get the whole point of this topic.

I thought this would be a great way for people to look at themselves. To see where they are at. If you think this topic is useless please stop bumping it up and let it die. Next time I will know better to not make such a topic. Since this is clearly getting negative feedback.

There are different interpretations of “baddies” here. The one that I agree with is those who give up easily, refuse to learn and do not improve. So I treat being “good” as being opposite of “baddies”.

Easy:
One who is successful at GW2 would be one who achieves the goals that they set out to accomplish.

The only truthful benchmark is against the best players this game can provide.
If you watched the solo videos of those have put up against Lupicus, Mossman etc and you don’t know where you’re at, then you are a very bad player. Because only when you’ve tried it then you will know. “I could do it if I want to” excuse just doesn’t cut it.
And this is from the perspective of a casual, slow player and as average as you can get.

I’d rather have an average solo player but knew how to work as a team than a player who can solo lupi and did liadri who doesn’t.

That was my main issue with the gauntlet content. It did nothing to promote team play, build synergies or selfless play. All of which IMHO should be more important than how well a player can play as an individual.

The ignorance level is so high. 99.9% of people soloing hard contents know more about team work than the below average players do but I doubt you know any of them. Because as I said, if you did it, you would know it. Obviously you haven’t done it yet.

I’m with Nike; L2Dodge prettymuch covers it.

I’d give higher marks for somebody carrying the group, but with the exception of rezzing and reflect, the game’s visuals don’t do much to communicate to others the impact your having. So yeah, hard to give kudos.

I’d give lower marks for glitching and bugging out bosses like a pansy, but….
No wait, actually, forget being understanding. I totally think less of people who encourage that sort of thing.

Good:

1) Not being rude.

2) Able to listen and follow directions.

I think these ranking go down a road we shouldn’t go. There isn’t a point labeling anyone, even yourself.

Being good covers so much more than just being able to dodge.
I’ll take a duo arah path 2 run of a mesmer and a warrior.
What the mesmer has to take care of:
-Null Field after getting stacks from spiders.
-time curtain to have it recharged at third defiler group aswell as having perma swiftness together with warriors warhorn
-not get into combat anytime before reaching belka
-proper use of staff 2 to increase movement
-using warden on one of the two defilers at the end of the tunnel
-using curtain to pull back deadeye
-timing reflects at belka so you don’t reflect while sha has shield up
-timing clones to bodyguard both players
-watching her shield timing to use feedback when she teleports
-switching to signet of inspiration instead of nullfield
-using chaos storm before spider tunnel, waiting for protection and use signet of inspiration
-teleport to wp, not getting into combat
-not getting into combat while skipling to abomination
-proper use of phase retreat
-proper timing of curtain
-reaching abomination making sure to aggro abomination and inquest, pulling inquest with curtain while not effecting the abomination
-interrupting abominations first enrage
-get off abominations defiant as quick as possible
-proper use of sword 4, 5, warden and signet of inspiration (right after fgj/might blasts if using an ember
-once abomination is dead don’t get into combat, don’t dodge
-aggro hunter with chaos storm while warrior gets closer trash
-phase retreat + invuln shatter to get into los spot quick
-timing reflects, signet etc.
-warden on first turret (if there is one) feedback on second/last one
-unless the last one is right at the end keep curtain recharged for abominations
-proper use of curtain, interrupts and sword 2
-at lupi: timing phantasms and blocks
-move in a way that gets locusts to the warrior, not touching him
-take the grub in phase 1-2 transition
-warden + curtain for first p2 aoe with 2 clones in warden/curtain, curtain must have a placement kind of creating a triangle with warden
-feedback and warden for second p2 aoe
-proper positioning in phase 3, standing in rapidfire range with warden/curtain up or feedback ready
-standing so close that he doesn’t rapidfire else
-don’t cause bubbles/unintended movement
-timing skills at usual
-wait until warrior gets the alphard wp
-teleport, timing curtain and warhorn 4 from warrior so he doesn’t need stability on inquests
-proper positioning and skill use at alphard
-mantra of stability instead of feedback for the skip
-skipping together (swiftness) with the warrior, not getting into combat
-interrupting brie’s beam when warrior is 100b’ing
-curtain, feedback and warden against projectiles
-signet in right situations

Just a small summary of things to take care of. The list for the warrior is pretty much as big. Missing a few of those extra things instead of just duo basics (as just being able to duo) makes you an above average player. Missing most of them makes you “average”. Missing none makes you a pretty good player. Excelling at tlall those makes you impressive.

Dear Dub,
1) I am not belonged to your GW2 graduate program so I’m fine where I’m which is average as I’ve already graded myself w/o your help. Thank you very much.
2) I didn’t want to occupy permanently The Grand Temple of The Pantheon like you do so a couple burglaries of the temple after murdering the principal resident is satisfactorily enough.
3) I play how I want it.

Did I miss anything?

I guess I am a struggler in berserkers o_o

Welp.. me in dungeons =

swiftpaw.6397:

Welp.. me in dungeons =

lol

just got off my second ban, what all did I miss

ed: lmbo I have to wait 10 minutes in between each post now

Not being clad in Berserker gear = immediate baddie (or just new?) It shows limited understanding of all dungeon mechanics and that of their own class to wear anything else.
There are bad players in Zerker gear but that first generalisation pretty much trimmed 99% of the fat.

Dolan.3071:

Not being clad in Berserker gear = immediate baddie (or just new?) It shows limited understanding of all dungeon mechanics and that of their own class to wear anything else.
There are bad players in Zerker gear but that first generalisation pretty much trimmed 99% of the fat.

I think new (like, BRAND new) players get a pass on this, because a lot of folks came to GW2 for promises that went unfulfilled and the game is very bad at giving you useful feedback to know how much or how little you’re contributing. But, once you’re past like 200 hours or so, if you’re not already making the move to zerk you’re probably unsalvageable unless you play in a total cocoon. I think a bigger tell is, do you argue against zerk players about what is optimal? Denying the reality of “MORE DAMAGE = BETTER THAN” at any point is grounds to be put on the kittenlist forever, IMO.

Anicetus.1253:

Being good covers so much more than just being able to dodge.
I’ll take a duo arah path 2 run of a mesmer and a warrior.
What the mesmer has to take care of:
-proper use of staff 2 to increase movement
-using warden on one of the two defilers at the end of the tunnel
-switching to signet of inspiration instead of nullfield
-teleport to wp, not getting into combat
-proper use of phase retreat
-proper use of sword 4, 5, warden and signet of inspiration
-phase retreat + invuln shatter to get into los spot quick
-standing so close that he doesn’t rapidfire else
-don’t cause bubbles/unintended movement.

Eww, staff, why wardens instead of stealth, what the hell is sword 4,5? Eww signet of inspiration, Eww more staff, and eww making lupi boring on purpose. guess I’d rather be a bad player. And nobody matches these criteria XD not even you do, better not be using this for your trial runs.

Broadicea.8294:

I think a bigger tell is, do you argue against zerk players about what is optimal? Denying the reality of “MORE DAMAGE = BETTER THAN” at any point is grounds to be put on the kittenlist forever, IMO.

sums it all up perfectly

Sanderinoa.8065:

Anicetus.1253:

Being good covers so much more than just being able to dodge.
I’ll take a duo arah path 2 run of a mesmer and a warrior.
What the mesmer has to take care of:
-proper use of staff 2 to increase movement
-using warden on one of the two defilers at the end of the tunnel
-switching to signet of inspiration instead of nullfield
-teleport to wp, not getting into combat
-proper use of phase retreat
-proper use of sword 4, 5, warden and signet of inspiration
-phase retreat + invuln shatter to get into los spot quick
-standing so close that he doesn’t rapidfire else
-don’t cause bubbles/unintended movement.

Eww, staff, why wardens instead of stealth, what the hell is sword 4,5? Eww signet of inspiration, Eww more staff, and eww making lupi boring on purpose. guess I’d rather be a bad player. And nobody matches these criteria XD not even you do, better not be using this for your trial runs.

The infamous Dub standard

Anicetus.1253:

Being good covers so much more than just being able to dodge.
I’ll take a duo arah path 2 run of a mesmer and a warrior.
What the mesmer has to take care of:
-not get into combat anytime before reaching belka
-using warden on one of the two defilers at the end of the tunnel

I want to be that good.

Lamir.6702:

Anicetus.1253:

Being good covers so much more than just being able to dodge.
I’ll take a duo arah path 2 run of a mesmer and a warrior.
What the mesmer has to take care of:
-not get into combat anytime before reaching belka
-using warden on one of the two defilers at the end of the tunnel

I want to be that good.

Fixed version:
-not getting into combat anytime on the deadeye/berserker group before reaching belka
Yeah, warden pretty much puts you into combat. Also the previos poison clouds sometimes hit you when you’re out of them.

@Sandy: Yes, i’m using this for our trial runs, making a video of it and doing a check point by point. Noone has to match all this, though. That would be a player better than anyone else i know
Nevertheless, in a good duo run (<20 min) most of these things must be matched. We both do not think of all of these but of a majority. And by the way, i didn’t make this list out of nothing. Those are all things i’ve been using in duo speedruns. And i’m sure that if you try to participate in such, you would suceed. Most of the criteria i listed are really easy to match.

I’m back!

Where’s your signature?

Bad kids aren’t allowed signatures until they behave!

My… my… signature
I wasn’t even told about my signature being removed.

I dont know why my signature hasn’t been removed, I am once again taking the kitten out of a t s e…but this one is like on every post…

Broadicea.8294:

swiftpaw.6397:

Welp.. me in dungeons =

lol

just got off my second ban, what all did I miss

ed: lmbo I have to wait 10 minutes in between each post now

Well basically Brazil and I went and had some shenanigans and each got bans. His related to becoming a catfish biologist, mine relates to some random comment of mine about rifle dps being better than hundred blades which is clearly exceptionally offensive. In the end he’s on a 300 seconds limit between posts and I’m on 600. Worth it though I assure you ;D

Oh and they confiscated our signatures LOL

:(

Less frequent posts from my favourite posters.

Where’s colesy?

Also, since I want to be cool as well; I managed to earn a 60 second timer between posts!

Yeah, infraction points are mostly given for stupid things. Asking in what timezone someone lives, telling someone to go to bed, giving dps calculations in a dps thread, asking if someone is on NA/EU and even… proving someone right. kitten , how dare we?

swiftpaw.6397:

Broadicea.8294:

swiftpaw.6397:

Welp.. me in dungeons =

lol

just got off my second ban, what all did I miss

ed: lmbo I have to wait 10 minutes in between each post now

Well basically Brazil and I went and had some shenanigans and each got bans. His related to becoming a catfish biologist, mine relates to poking ‘play how you wanters’ in the guardian forums with Oxxy. In the end he’s on a 300 seconds limit between posts and I’m on 600. Worth it though I assure you ;D

Oh and they confiscated our signatures LOL

sounds like 3 of us are on the outlaw list now.

Ooo! You be Cheyenne Phillips, I’ll be Bobby Sixkiller, and Brazil can be Lorenzo Lamas in our own version of

Dub.1273:

Yeah, infraction points are mostly given for stupid things. Asking in what timezone someone lives, telling someone to go to bed, giving dps calculations in a dps thread, asking if someone is on NA/EU and even… proving someone right. kitten , how dare we?

Reported, called the police, told my mom.

My friends, we have become the batmen of the dungeon forums. We are the heroes the forums deserves, but not the ones it needs right now. So the modbots will hunt us. Because we can take it. Because we’re not heroes.. We’re silent guardians. Watchful protectors. Elitist Knights.

The Mexican Cookie.3690:

Where’s colesy?

Also, since I want to be cool as well; I managed to earn a 60 second timer between posts!

Has probably been banned for slaying casuals down and up instead of left and right.

How did you manage that, you still have your signature :O

Ohhhhh: An Error Prevented Saving:
* Flood Control: Please wait 300 seconds between posts!

Now i’m jealous on you swifty. But oh, no worries, this post will give me an infraction point for criticising HUMAN Moderators in public, bringing me a bit closer to 600 seconds!

I didn’t get a ban, I’m not a big phat elitist like you guys. I just got 1 infraction point for telling people they had an irregular count of chromosomes.

What I consider good is:

• Able to mitigate damage effectively through use of skills/utilities and dodges
• Able to output damage effectively through use of skills/utilities and other boosts
• Able to work as a team and participate as an equal member
• Able to constantly analyze situations and think how you can do them better
• Able to listen and respect your team as well as all players
• Strive to better yourself all the time

These are just a few off the top of my head and by no means all of them.