Guild Wars 2

NikeEU.7690:

phys.7689:

its good at unique party buffs, and increasing party burst.

so yeah its better for the 30 second party spike, but better overall? not really.

Yeah so double Time Warp double quickness well will only be good in short fights. FWIW, time warp is like casting a skill that does about 250k-300k damage. Getting to cast it twice in any fight is by far the most OP single thing in the game. So yeah, you’re totally right that other specs are way better for PvE.

time warp only increases AA dmg by 50% over time in exchange for doing that double timewarp, you are giving up shatter dmg/utility or phantasm upkeep/utility.
which is worth it if that was all, but you are also giving up either direct stat boosts, more conditions, more lockdown, or more shatters in addition to that.

also note, from what we have seen quickness is more common in most classes now.
its not all that.

That’s the thing, often you’re unable to utilize your phantasms anyways, and shatter has it’s limitations as well.

And while TIme Warp’s biggest effect is on AA, you’re also increasing the DPS of every other skill, getting back into AA’s faster, add in Alacrity and you’re back to using your skills faster too.

Pretty big effect.

And with the massive increase to burst that we’re seeing the HP would have to jump quite a bit to create a situation where burst isn’t the main focus.

Think its doable to do at least some 45 seconds of quickness with the mesmer, just using time warp + quickness well and the chronomancy shatter thing. Which should be more than overkill.

phys.7689:

time warp only increases AA dmg by 50% over time in exchange for doing that double timewarp, you are giving up shatter dmg/utility or phantasm upkeep/utility.
which is worth it if that was all, but you are also giving up either direct stat boosts, more conditions, more lockdown, or more shatters in addition to that.

also note, from what we have seen quickness is more common in most classes now.
its not all that.

So you sacrificing a percentage of your own damage as a mesmer (which is terribly low anyway in PvE dungeon), to increase the damage of the whole part by 50% during specific fight. Even if taking chronomancer over any other trait line could reduce the damage of the Mesmer by 50% (which it doesn’t), it will still be worth taking chronomancer.

Jerus.4350:

That’s the thing, often you’re unable to utilize your phantasms anyways, and shatter has it’s limitations as well.

And while TIme Warp’s biggest effect is on AA, you’re also increasing the DPS of every other skill, getting back into AA’s faster, add in Alacrity and you’re back to using your skills faster too.

Pretty big effect.

And with the massive increase to burst that we’re seeing the HP would have to jump quite a bit to create a situation where burst isn’t the main focus.

you get back to AAs faster, thats about it.
the DPS of other skills is irrelvent because they are limited by recast times, not by cast times. (in a long fight)

think about it like this, if time warp is so great, why do people barely want one mesmer in a party? 2 mesmers should own right?

not really because quickness isnt as valuable as might, high dps, fury distribution etc.

now alacrity is something new, and i agree that when it comes to creating a party burst, CM is the go to guy.
but outside of that? CM is worse at everything else, (which is fine)

all they would have to do to destroy even that bonus, is make a boss who changes position every X hp%, or puts down aoe that you will want to move out of.

Well its because Guardian also has a timewarp. In the current dungeon setting, tome of wrath’s 5sec quickness is enough to nuke most bosses. So in terms of DPS guardian is better. Where mesmers shine is their ability to run ahead of the group and provide portals to reduce the time to get from point A to point B. However this strategy prevents the mesmer from getting loot, which is why you only see mesmers being played in record runs.

With the increase in burst damage, being able to get all the skills out quicker will be pretty big, and while we don’t value it enough for a mesmer now it’s because we’re talking like 2 uses over a whole dungeon, now we’re going to get multiple sets of quickness. Longer fights Alacrity will make a play, short fights we may just have the mesmer toss down quickness and start running to the next fight with a portal, dropping the second time warp/well at it, we’ll see.

phys.7689:

you get back to AAs faster, thats about it.
the DPS of other skills is irrelvent because they are limited by recast times, not by cast times. (in a long fight)

think about it like this, if time warp is so great, why do people barely want one mesmer in a party? 2 mesmers should own right?

not really because quickness isnt as valuable as might, high dps, fury distribution etc.

now alacrity is something new, and i agree that when it comes to creating a party burst, CM is the go to guy.
but outside of that? CM is worse at everything else, (which is fine)

all they would have to do to destroy even that bonus, is make a boss who changes position every X hp%, or puts down aoe that you will want to move out of.

The reason why Mesmer isn’t wanted in dungeon (except for record run), is because at best you can do 1 or 2 timewrap, while having a really bad dps compare to other profession. Now, if you can do 2-4 timewrap in a path AND decrease some of your team cooldown, you start to be valuable enough in a team to be worth the drop in dps of taking a mesmer over another profession.

Let’s not forget that Time Warp is now a Glamour for purposes of Temporal Enchanter and Glamour recharge being made baseline. That is going to help a lot for its uptime.

Jerus.4350:

With the increase in burst damage, being able to get all the skills out quicker will be pretty big, and while we don’t value it enough for a mesmer now it’s because we’re talking like 2 uses over a whole dungeon, now we’re going to get multiple sets of quickness. Longer fights Alacrity will make a play, short fights we may just have the mesmer toss down quickness and start running to the next fight with a portal, dropping the second time warp/well at it, we’ll see.

party alacrity support is pretty weak honestly

you got 3 seconds on a 45 second cool down
and a 30 second recast phantasm with low dmg who gives 1 second to one ally per slow attack (if you dont have phantsmal haste)

the 3 second one is the big deal, when used in conjunction with Continuum shift.

anyhow, im not saying CM isnt good for a party, im saying they have a pretty specific use of boosting everyone else to sacrifice their own power.

this means if the spec changes make mesmer other builds competetive, they will still be competitive for doing whatever their focus is.

short version, CM is only OP, if every other mesmer build is UP, which means it probably isnt OP, its just powered.

Thaddeus.4891:

phys.7689:

you get back to AAs faster, thats about it.
the DPS of other skills is irrelvent because they are limited by recast times, not by cast times. (in a long fight)

think about it like this, if time warp is so great, why do people barely want one mesmer in a party? 2 mesmers should own right?

not really because quickness isnt as valuable as might, high dps, fury distribution etc.

now alacrity is something new, and i agree that when it comes to creating a party burst, CM is the go to guy.
but outside of that? CM is worse at everything else, (which is fine)

all they would have to do to destroy even that bonus, is make a boss who changes position every X hp%, or puts down aoe that you will want to move out of.

The reason why Mesmer isn’t wanted in dungeon (except for record run), is because at best you can do 1 or 2 timewrap, while having a really bad dps compare to other profession. Now, if you can do 2-4 timewrap in a path AND decrease some of your team cooldown, you start to be valuable enough in a team to be worth the drop in dps of taking a mesmer over another profession.

yall are ignoring that the changes to the core spec and conditions/defiance, are supposed to change their UP builds to competitive builds.

if the mesmers other builds stay garbage, then of course CM is going to be the only choice.

EcoRI.9273:

Well its because Guardian also has a timewarp. In the current dungeon setting, tome of wrath’s 5sec quickness is enough to nuke most bosses. So in terms of DPS guardian is better. Where mesmers shine is their ability to run ahead of the group and provide portals to reduce the time to get from point A to point B. However this strategy prevents the mesmer from getting loot, which is why you only see mesmers being played in record runs.

then a mes can now double that quickness time, with signet of inspiration, without taking the CM line.

phys.7689:

EcoRI.9273:

Well its because Guardian also has a timewarp. In the current dungeon setting, tome of wrath’s 5sec quickness is enough to nuke most bosses. So in terms of DPS guardian is better. Where mesmers shine is their ability to run ahead of the group and provide portals to reduce the time to get from point A to point B. However this strategy prevents the mesmer from getting loot, which is why you only see mesmers being played in record runs.

then a mes can now double that quickness time, with signet of inspiration, without taking the CM line.

Don’t need double the quickness time for a single encounter when the boss is dead within 5seconds also atm quickness is not a boon. I am commenting on why no one takes mesmer in their party in the current meta.

EcoRI.9273:

phys.7689:

EcoRI.9273:

Well its because Guardian also has a timewarp. In the current dungeon setting, tome of wrath’s 5sec quickness is enough to nuke most bosses. So in terms of DPS guardian is better. Where mesmers shine is their ability to run ahead of the group and provide portals to reduce the time to get from point A to point B. However this strategy prevents the mesmer from getting loot, which is why you only see mesmers being played in record runs.

then a mes can now double that quickness time, with signet of inspiration, without taking the CM line.

Don’t need double the quickness time for a single encounter when the boss is dead within 5seconds.

then why woould you want the CM at all?

phys.7689:

EcoRI.9273:

phys.7689:

EcoRI.9273:

Well its because Guardian also has a timewarp. In the current dungeon setting, tome of wrath’s 5sec quickness is enough to nuke most bosses. So in terms of DPS guardian is better. Where mesmers shine is their ability to run ahead of the group and provide portals to reduce the time to get from point A to point B. However this strategy prevents the mesmer from getting loot, which is why you only see mesmers being played in record runs.

then a mes can now double that quickness time, with signet of inspiration, without taking the CM line.

Don’t need double the quickness time for a single encounter when the boss is dead within 5seconds.

then why woould you want the CM at all?

Quickness on each fight is >>> quickness on 1-2 fights per dungeon.

phys.7689:

EcoRI.9273:

phys.7689:

EcoRI.9273:

Well its because Guardian also has a timewarp. In the current dungeon setting, tome of wrath’s 5sec quickness is enough to nuke most bosses. So in terms of DPS guardian is better. Where mesmers shine is their ability to run ahead of the group and provide portals to reduce the time to get from point A to point B. However this strategy prevents the mesmer from getting loot, which is why you only see mesmers being played in record runs.

then a mes can now double that quickness time, with signet of inspiration, without taking the CM line.

Don’t need double the quickness time for a single encounter when the boss is dead within 5seconds.

then why woould you want the CM at all?

Because you can cast Time Wrap for two consecutive fight.

phys.7689:

EcoRI.9273:

phys.7689:

EcoRI.9273:

Well its because Guardian also has a timewarp. In the current dungeon setting, tome of wrath’s 5sec quickness is enough to nuke most bosses. So in terms of DPS guardian is better. Where mesmers shine is their ability to run ahead of the group and provide portals to reduce the time to get from point A to point B. However this strategy prevents the mesmer from getting loot, which is why you only see mesmers being played in record runs.

then a mes can now double that quickness time, with signet of inspiration, without taking the CM line.

Don’t need double the quickness time for a single encounter when the boss is dead within 5seconds.

then why woould you want the CM at all?

I guess best way to sum it up is your agrument for mesmer being useless is irrelevant to chronomancer(CM?). You are saying no one takes mesmers in the current meta, chronomancer is future meta and the one thing it has is you can have time warp up for more encounters.

If you cant see the overwhelming value of chronomancer in a speedrun. You need to go back to speedrun school.

Its not just doubling up on good skills. Its using skills in CS and then resetting. This essentially means you dont have any skills on cooldown for the next fight. You may even be able to use a CS out of combat (illusionary persona baseline) and switch skills due to no cooldown once you revert time. So for example CS > time warp > return > swap to mass invis and start your portal skip.

EcoRI.9273:

phys.7689:

EcoRI.9273:

phys.7689:

EcoRI.9273:

Well its because Guardian also has a timewarp. In the current dungeon setting, tome of wrath’s 5sec quickness is enough to nuke most bosses. So in terms of DPS guardian is better. Where mesmers shine is their ability to run ahead of the group and provide portals to reduce the time to get from point A to point B. However this strategy prevents the mesmer from getting loot, which is why you only see mesmers being played in record runs.

then a mes can now double that quickness time, with signet of inspiration, without taking the CM line.

Don’t need double the quickness time for a single encounter when the boss is dead within 5seconds.

then why woould you want the CM at all?

I guess best way to sum it up is your agrument for mesmer being useless is irrevelent to chronomancer(CM?). You are saying no one takes mesmers in the current meta, chronomancer is future meta and the one thing it has is you can have time warp up for more encounters.

This pretty much, it’s not eevn so much that chronomancer is wtf amazing, it’s just that old mesmer was a bit /meh. Though CM will have some wtf amazing elements if you can utilize them to the fullest, same with mesmer but the reason mesmer is /meh is because you just can’t the vast majority of the time.

spoj.9672:

Its not just doubling up on good skills. Its using skills in CS and then resetting. This essentially means you dont have any skills on cooldown for the next fight. You may even be able to use a CS out of combat (illusionary persona baseline) and switch skills due no cooldown once you revert time. So for example CS > time warp > return > swap to mass invis and start your portal skip.

Hot kitten that’s a pretty sweet idea I hadn’t even considered. Love it.

Rising Dusk.2408:

So Engineer is the last one I have to review, and I know everyone is sick of me bumping this thread up so much but I want to ensure everyone has a chance to respond before I send them along. This is also the class that was given the Powerpoint treatment in the stream, so we don’t have a perfect idea of what any of the traits do exactly (ICDs, etc), so you’ll see a lot of suggestions here to add interesting traits to the mix.

Grenades
[…]

Explosives
[…]

Firearms
[…]

Inventions
[…]

Alchemy
[…]

Tools
[…]

• gotta add in another voice that grenade ground targeting is fine. but then, i got used to it. and if you use nades a bit underwater, especially against people, youll see the targeting subroutines suck and i wouldnt want to subject me/anyone to missing anything and everything that changes direction.

• i think the explosives overhaul actually harkens back to a couple threads over a year ago that suggested in depth complete reworks of grenades traits in order to make them viable untraited.
  • one of those things was make 3 nades baseline. another is that shrapnel actually provides about as much single target dps as IP when you use only nades, and IP is something people hate for its passivity and pressure output in pvp. and shrapnel does it in aoe. and theyre buffing it. so whatever you think about it, shrapnel could make condi engi a monster with perma uncleansable cripple and we need to see it before judging it.
  • esports rocket is a bad idea — passive proc. IP, panic strike, air/fire, chill of death. all are hated. no matter how much damage it does, it isnt gonna be fun. its either useless or OP. your suggestion isnt really any different. another passive proc. meh. (sorry to be so negative about it)
  • currently, if a pve power engi takes nades but not bombs, there isnt a good adept trait for him. empowering adrenaline is meh and the rest are worse. what they had to show is a huge step up from live, and the TBD remains to be seen.
  • as shown, the nades traits dont conflict with explosive descent, so for example a condi nades engi without bombs can just pick those 3 in explosives and call it a day and its very clear and obvious. if he were to take bombs, clearly explosive descent goes away.
  • short fuse is implied carry its functionality through the change, but takes nades out of the picture and instead focuses purely on bombs and improving bomb QoL.

• i dont have much to say about firearms except that i wanna see if theyll take off the icd from IP since burning is going to be functionally like (strong) bleeding, and if they do i would like to see IP not compete with juggernaut as your suggestion to move robo legs to GM would have. because ft can crit a LOT. it could be the ft build everyone is looking for!

• inventions as i know it is getting rekt. the loss of AMR, cloaking device, and stab armor for wvw play is not gonna be worth the consolidation of turret traits and the extremely interesting applications of healy blasts. this line has potential in pve, but the iteration we were shown will wreck wvw for a lot of engis, where one can be extremely potent with a (stunbreakless,) swiftnessless build by taking 4 in inventions.

• alchemy is basically unchanged, except for one thing
  • DONT TAKE 409 OUT OF ALCHEMY OMG
  • this was never a pve line, its really good in wvw and pvp, where transmute and B@75% really shine, along with (arguably) 5 really good adepts and a really good choice for master, be it BPR or 409. the GMs are really lacking (hgh as a build overall is kinda meh but the trait is good), but at the time of the preview alchemy was basically unchanged in a half finished overhaul. make the GMs better.

• i dont think we know enough about tools to say much, and i dont think theyre anywhere near done with it, but 1 thing sticks out as much as the loss of AMR in inventions:
  • kit refinement needs to be changed to in combat only because as both traits are right now, speedy kits is at direct odds with kit refinement and there is almost no reason to ever take both of them in a single build and doing so sucks hairy kittens.

Sins, Jerus, and insane, thanks for the Engineer comments. I’ll reply to some and then edit my earlier posts with adjustments.

I’ll make sure the counter side of the Grenade 1 skill is heard in my report. I’ve seen a lot of in-game and Engineer forum requests for the ability to autoattack with Grenades, and I personally would really like to autoattack with grenades, so I want to make sure I at least capture that. I especially think that not being able to autoattack with it is a major QOL loss for the kit. That said, I certainly don’t want it to be harder to hit with or miss wildly all of the time.

Insane, I agree with your comment on the Explosives passive proc… I was just trying to keep my suggestion in the realm of what they originally proposed. Instead I’ll adjust the report to make the case that passive procs aren’t fun or skillful and suggest something else.

I’ll make sure to note that the rifle/harpoon gun trait should add damage, not crit chance, since that trait line is loaded with it anyway.

I’ll adjust the speedy kits/kit refinement suggestion so kit refinement only works in combat and rework other suggestions appropriately.

I’ll ensure that I discuss that mortar kit 1 blast finishering is great, but it should have a minimum range or else it will wholly outclass the blast finisher on dodge trait.

Also, I will say that my FT suggestions aren’t trying to legitimize FT camping, just to make the autoattack relevant. I think if FT were in a place where its autoattack when traited were slightly better than grenades once you hit near vuln cap, that would be the sweet balancing point.

I don’t know if I’d phrase it that way. I mean, yes it’s a limiting factor, but if they intended for mortar kit to be viable close range, that’s fine, just don’t make the 1 a blast and instead go with the making the 5 much more powerful or something else.

I was always under the impression that FT was our Farm tool, and bombs should be the more damage, but that simply isn’t the way it is due to the poor damage of the non-1 bomb skills compared to nades. Confusion bomb for example should probably be similar to prybar, Fire/smoke/glue any one of them or even all of them could use a boost to make the overall kit beat out nades for damage, but nades winning out for vuln, creating a situation where, yes you could have an auto attack weapon for a pure damage build.

So I think you’re right in your desire I just think bombs is where it should be targetted.

Random, but probably relevant to this thread, if you have elite spec skills on cooldown, are out of combat, and unslot the elite spec… what happens?

Windsagio.1340:

Random, but probably relevant to this thread, if you have elite spec skills on cooldown, are out of combat, and unslot the elite spec… what happens?

Good question, and we’ll see. For example Consecrated Ground currently resets cooldowns allowing double wall option. I’d imagine you could do similar things with say Virtue of Resolve going from ground target in specialization to not without. Where that might be handy, not sure.

i really dont want to see minimum range on mortar kit because if we do get a blast finisher on 1 and healy blasts you prolly wont be able to heal yourself with the minimum range.

i too would really really like nades 1 to be an auto, but i dont think the lead-the-target routines will ever be in a good enough place for an autoattack to be effective with the current missile speed and spread, but maybe that situation could improve a lot with this overhaul.

actually, on the subject of engi, i think anet would do well to take a close look at how tera deals with piano classes:

• tera has a combo chain button that you can set. if you do an attack, your next suggested skill pops up on your screen and all you have to do is spam your combo button. after playing gunner for a couple days now (…no gw2 patches…), ive noticed theres a lot of room for improvement in their routines, but the chain system works really really well, and the gunner class plays very similar to a kit based engi — if the engi only needed to push 1 button fairly often after setting a bunch of different combos. or vice versa — gunners would play a lot like engis if they didnt have the combo button and werent severely kitten by not using it.

Exactly Insane, I’m not so much proposing that there should be a minimum range as much as I don’t think we should get a blast if it doesn’t have one, as it invalidates the other GM trait really. So I just think the Mortar Kit trait should be longer fields and something else, maybe extra boons in the fields? More damage? Something. My comment was meant more of “IF they’re leaving the minimum range, sure that’s fine, if they’re not, I don’t think it’s right.”

And if you’re talking about basically in game macros, please no. That literally ruined my favorite class from any game ever (bard in EQ) when they added it. While it felt like a godsend it really killed the active feel and led to eventually finding the game quite boring even though I actually loved the content I hated the play style.

another question – what if you have full inventory with the pop up, use specialisation weapon and slot out of the spec:P

I think in principle I agree that Mortar Kit shouldn’t have a minimum range, but I also agree that it shouldn’t outclass the blast on dodge roll. Thus, maybe you’re right and it shouldn’t be a blast finisher. I’ll make note of that and keep it at that in my report, because otherwise we really have no idea what the skills even do yet. I will note possibility of longer fields.

Jerus.4350:

So I think you’re right in your desire I just think bombs is where it should be targetted.

Hrmm… Possibly. I think bombs’ issue is in the power scaling of the other skills; the 1 is pretty great already. I guess this might be a fair time to bring it up somewhere. I’ll add it to the report.

Sublimatio.6981:

another question – what if you have full inventory with the pop up, use specialisation weapon and slot out of the spec:P

It will likely just unequip it.

and put it in an overflow popup.

With the skills, I suspect it will switch but leave on cooldown, like (sometimes) happens when you go into and out of water.

Rising Dusk.2408:

I think in principle I agree that Mortar Kit shouldn’t have a minimum range, but I also agree that it shouldn’t outclass the blast on dodge roll. Thus, maybe you’re right and it shouldn’t be a blast finisher. I’ll make note of that and keep it at that in my report, because otherwise we really have no idea what the skills even do yet. I will note possibility of longer fields.

Jerus.4350:

So I think you’re right in your desire I just think bombs is where it should be targetted.

Hrmm… Possibly. I think bombs’ issue is in the power scaling of the other skills; the 1 is pretty great already. I guess this might be a fair time to bring it up somewhere. I’ll add it to the report.

Sublimatio.6981:

another question – what if you have full inventory with the pop up, use specialisation weapon and slot out of the spec:P

It will likely just unequip it.

Thanks Dusk, you’re doing a kittening awesome job, I hope you don’t take my responses as anything but constructive criticism (maybe with a bit too much of a pessimistic tone ).

I really think Bomb could make the move with simply upping the Concussion Bomb to have the power damage of Prybar and choosing one other (probably Fire) to have similar Power damage to the 1 skill. I haven’t done all the math but that should do the trick I think, especially with new burning stacks. Though you could probably up Glue to do similar damage as well.

I look at it similar to how I look at Ele how I think it should be. Staff should be the best damage but not by the margin it is at, ~5% would be ideal. If we could get Bomb to be 5% better damage, you’d have your best damage with bomb, best team support and decent damage with Nades, best tagging/farming with FT. EG/TK being more situational but very strong when they’re fit for use. That’s what I’d love to see.

I know that’s not at all related to the new traits really, but just worth throwing out there.

Windsagio.1340:

and put it in an overflow popup.

With the skills, I suspect it will switch but leave on cooldown, like (sometimes) happens when you go into and out of water.

The reason I used Virtue of Resolve as an example is because of the Consecrated Grounds trait, the swap from ground target to not seems to require a “different skill” such that it actually uses a different address and it’s not the same skill and wouldn’t register it as having a recast. Just a guess as to how that little trick works. I imagine that we’d have that same thing happen with it.

The others, not sure, they’d be different skills as well I imagine, but we’re going into uncharted territory with them.

Though I can’t imagine it being worthwhile unless say you did a non-DH build and swapped to that specifically for the leap, swapped back and still had your Resolve… but I don’t see that as being a huge deal.

It could relate to some of the chronomaner tricks mentioned above, “Use gravity well, drop chronomancer, quick swap to mass haste”

I’d agree it’s more likely to work with virtues /class abilities than with skills tho

Windsagio.1340:

It could relate to some of the chronomaner tricks mentioned above, “Use gravity well, drop chronomancer, quick swap to mass haste”

I’d agree it’s more likely to work with virtues /class abilities than with skills tho

Ahh I see what you mean now. If you no longer even have the skill availalbe will it drop off your bar completely and give you a free swap option, or will it still keep a cooldown on the slot. Makes sense. No clue how it’ll work.

Jerus.4350:

Exactly Insane, I’m not so much proposing that there should be a minimum range as much as I don’t think we should get a blast if it doesn’t have one, as it invalidates the other GM trait really. So I just think the Mortar Kit trait should be longer fields and something else, maybe extra boons in the fields? More damage? Something. My comment was meant more of “IF they’re leaving the minimum range, sure that’s fine, if they’re not, I don’t think it’s right.”

And if you’re talking about basically in game macros, please no. That literally ruined my favorite class from any game ever (bard in EQ) when they added it. While it felt like a godsend it really killed the active feel and led to eventually finding the game quite boring even though I actually loved the content I hated the play style.

theyre not quite macros cuz you do have to push a button to get the next action, its more like spam 1 button a whole lot to get a bunch of different actions, hopefully with a bit of prior theorycrafted direction so youre spamming things you wanna spam in the right order. it feels very active.

Can I just say, trust me, it dumbs down the game quite a bit and leads to a much less active and fun play style?

If not, to further explain, you end up just spamming 1 and actively defending yourself with “out of rotation” skills. 11111 dodge, 11111, dodge, 11111, toolkit block, 11111, bomb smokefield, 11111 etc.

I think the much better alternative is creating alternative that perform less than optimally but not so much that it’s not viable. For instance making Bomb kit solid would go a long way, you could go bomb kit auto, keep concussion bomb(with higher damage) and fire bomb(with higher damage) on cooldown for a nice easy play style, but it’d not be optimal.

Without keeping optimal play requiring you to actively rotate your skills you’re just looking at an easier game, eventually it becomes mundane and not as much fun.

I don’t mean to knock your idea, but I’ve gone through it before, twice, and it’s just ruined games for me. Both EQ and DCUO fell prey to the dumbed down rotations for maximum output, and it was just very disappointing. EQ literally got to the point where I could use a keyboard macro for spamming 1 and walk away and top DPS charts, after I had figured that out I just lost interest in the game and quit. While that’d be technically illegal in this game, it’d still be possible and it’d be foolish to think that people wouldn’t resort to it, especially now with so many people having gaming keyboards/mice that could easily be programmed to do so.

I don’t want to see yet another game fall prey to that. I actually miss the content of both of those games compared to GW2 but because of the easier play style changes I just couldn’t find enjoyment in them anymore. I say this with the utmost respect for the idea, I liked the idea initially when I saw it in EQ, but I just learned after a while that it was probably the worst thing to happen to the game and again, my favorite profession/class ever in any game.

insanemaniac.2456:

Jerus.4350:

Exactly Insane, I’m not so much proposing that there should be a minimum range as much as I don’t think we should get a blast if it doesn’t have one, as it invalidates the other GM trait really. So I just think the Mortar Kit trait should be longer fields and something else, maybe extra boons in the fields? More damage? Something. My comment was meant more of “IF they’re leaving the minimum range, sure that’s fine, if they’re not, I don’t think it’s right.”

And if you’re talking about basically in game macros, please no. That literally ruined my favorite class from any game ever (bard in EQ) when they added it. While it felt like a godsend it really killed the active feel and led to eventually finding the game quite boring even though I actually loved the content I hated the play style.

theyre not quite macros cuz you do have to push a button to get the next action, its more like spam 1 button a whole lot to get a bunch of different actions, hopefully with a bit of prior theorycrafted direction so youre spamming things you wanna spam in the right order. it feels very active.

Downside of the quick cast button in Tera is that it cuts down your dps quite marginally compared to what you get by using the skills manually. Especially on a piano class like the gunner.

oh i agree, its not smart at all. and it very much dumbs things down. but it seems like a really good idea if it could be implemented better. its unfortunate that you kind of need to use it to keep your mana going.

its still just shiny and new for me i guess.

Well for the casual crowd, dumbing things down might be the way to go. I mean they did make that hyena thread.

Jerus.4350:

If not, to further explain, you end up just spamming 1 and actively defending yourself with “out of rotation” skills. 11111 dodge, 11111, dodge, 11111, toolkit block, 11111, bomb smokefield, 11111 etc.

idgi, this is what I do anyway as a pro zerk elitist (>._.)> Do you even GW2 brah?

dlonie.6547:

Jerus.4350:

If not, to further explain, you end up just spamming 1 and actively defending yourself with “out of rotation” skills. 11111 dodge, 11111, dodge, 11111, toolkit block, 11111, bomb smokefield, 11111 etc.

idgi, this is what I do anyway as a pro zerk elitist (>._.)> Do you even GW2 brah?

As long as you also stack in, close to, in proximity of, or around a corner.

deSade.9437:

dlonie.6547:

Jerus.4350:

If not, to further explain, you end up just spamming 1 and actively defending yourself with “out of rotation” skills. 11111 dodge, 11111, dodge, 11111, toolkit block, 11111, bomb smokefield, 11111 etc.

idgi, this is what I do anyway as a pro zerk elitist (>._.)> Do you even GW2 brah?

As long as you also stack in, close to, in proximity of, or around a corner.

ofc, tho i cant get these newb eles to drop an fgs ne more. were did all tha gud players go :-(

Sok, there’s always me /cough