Guild Wars 2

This wing isn’t even a week old, and people already expect experienced only.

What is going on?

unrealistic expectations amongst the people who have cleared it already and dont want someone bringing them down

These group always exist and always will exist. You could always just make your own group and write all welcome.

They are asking for experienced with this wing, or with raids in general?

Experienced here could refer to amount of practice as opposed to actual kills. Someone really consistent with Keep Construct’s orb pushing is desired for that fight for a more consistent kill. The more exposure you’ve had to mechanics, the more likely you are to contribute to a fairly quick kill.

Of course, I’ve had other kinds of groups too: ones with little experience, but over the course of our attempts, got well enough to get Xera down to 20%. Our main problem was composition and not clearing bloodstone shards quick enough.

Experienced with raids in general is desired as it shows dedication to raid progression.

Simple, it’s for people who actually has experience with the wing, which means they don’t need to learn about the mechanics of the wing anymore. I myself am experienced with the second boss, but haven’t got around to actually kill it (my pug keeps wiping at the last 33%), so yeah, you could say I’m experienced.

They have every right to choose who they want to play with, just like you have every right to choose who you want to play with. The difference is they actually put up an lfg to find the people they want to play with (experienced) whereas you come to the forums to complain instead of putting up an lfg to find the people you want to play with (no experience required).

You can always just watch a video/read a guide so you know the mechanics and then join, just so you are not completely clueless. Most people’s definition of experienced in this game seems to refer to “experienced at getting carried” anyway.
But yeah people are asking for experience as early as day 1, they also asks for insights because having killed vg and gorseval 20times will totally make you good at the new raid wing :^)
On the one hand it is silly but on the other hand, having someone who has successfully played the more difficult content in this game, might give you hope that he/she can at least press his/her his buttons and perhaps even walk out of red and into green circles. I don’t mind first timers though, if they bring a proper build/gear and are not completely inept.

edit: You could also open your party with whatever requirements you like because if you gear/LI vcheck them, they wont check you Or maybe you have an experienced friend who vouches for you.

As long as you get players with 200 AP in the group running to the first mine and die instantly it’s absolutely ok to ask for at least “experienced” players.
I pugged the event several times after release and I lead it as a commander yesterday with 4 guildmates. You actually won’t believe what players are joining and ruining the runs over and over because they don’t listen to proper TS commands, aren’t prepared, have no stun break and position themselves horribly (for example in the middle of the path next to a mine —> fear into oblivion = death) and don’t know how to play their class at least decently. And that’s only for the first event which is as easy as an open world event.

Sry, but I don’t want to deal with those players if I have to wipe over and over again. Those players should form training runs and get used to the mechanics. And that’s why ppl came up with “exp” after a few days.

Probably means experienced at raiding and also somewhat experienced at the bosses even if they haven’t killed it.

Some people don’t like teaching other people the mechanics and that’s fine, they’re free to play how they like to just like you’re free to make an LFG yourself.

Idk I went into a training run with 1 experiened player and 9 new/“knows some” to the fight and killed KC in less than an hour. I didn’t watch a video or have any idea what the boss did prior to fighting it.

Or just start a group with “Experienced Only” in the title, and have fun laughing when they realize you aren’t experienced.

GW2 is fun in so many ways.

Shiyo.3578:

Idk I went into a training run with 1 experiened player and 9 new/“knows some” to the fight and killed KC in less than an hour. I didn’t watch a video or have any idea what the boss did prior to fighting it.

My bad, I guess your cherry picked anecdotal evidence of an outlier clearly disproves the trends observed by most.

I’ll be looking for only new players from now on, I’ll get the raid done super quick guaranteed.

I have to admit, I’ve seen people already asking for exp and I just kinda chuckled to myself. But I’ve also seen people looking for SV requiring 60 li which I just think is hilarious. I find it an intriguing irony, that often the most demanding of players who are extremely critical of others are actually pretty horrendous themselves.

For example, last night on VG, we had an ele who literally complained about everything. Our dps was bad, heals were crap, tank wasn’t rotating the Guardian correctly. Yet she kept dying every single kittening time. So I said rather succinctly, dead dps don’t do any dps and we are spending too much time ressing you. She left, we got someone else and got it down with no drama.

Every reset night, I put up a lfg, it fills extremely quickly and off we go and get at least vg down quite easy. Some people like the above example come and go and it can be frustrating to swap people in and out but it gets done in the end.

People want experienced teammates because they actually want to clear instead of just fighting it over and over again.

Its not out of the question to want experienced as i know alot of people who have cleared the wing already. I was able to clear it myself 3 days after it came out. People just want others that invest time and knowledge of then class they play to beat it. And as far as people saying they are exp and they are not it normally shows that’s why people ask for ping insights or trophy’s but that can be lied too. That’s why when we pug we have rules like you get egged in gor u get kicked, hit flame wall kick, drop the aoe on zerg in solth kick. Things like that weed out the ones that are just trying to be carried thur. You could try joining a training guild (randomguy.1283 host one) to get your exp. So in short some people have paid there due to get the exp (over 8 hours for 2 days in a row).

fivestar.7830:

Its not out of the question to want experienced as i know alot of people who have cleared the wing already. I was able to clear it myself 3 days after it came out. People just want others that invest time and knowledge of then class they play to beat it. And as far as people saying they are exp and they are not it normally shows that’s why people ask for ping insights or trophy’s but that can be lied too. That’s why when we pug we have rules like you get egged in gor u get kicked, hit flame wall kick, drop the aoe on zerg in solth kick. Things like that weed out the ones that are just trying to be carried thur. You could try joining a training guild (randomguy.1283 host one) to get your exp. So in short some people have paid there due to get the exp (over 8 hours for 2 days in a row).

This is why I have stopped trying to raid. These raids are easier than things I’ve done in other MMO’s yet the community is beyond strict. It isn’t fun being treated like a complete moron just because I haven’t been playing since the raids release. The few bosses I’ve killed I’ve done going in blind and learned all mechanics in less than 20 minutes then cleared in less than an hour with 5+ brand new players.

Every run should be a training AND clear run. I should not have to suffer through ‘“destined to fail” runs where people “learn mechanics” for hours before I’m allowed to join “clear runs”. That isn’t fun, that’s too much grind and commitment, and it isn’t enjoyable playing with subpar players to learn fights before I can play with competent players. I should be able to instantly hop into playing with competent players – something I could do in every other MMO I’ve been playing for over a decade. Much more difficult raiding MMO’s, to boot.

People need to treat people like humans and be understanding and helpful. These are very, very easy raids.

They’re easy raids but you underestimate how bad / unwilling to listen some people are hence the strict rules.

Nobody has anything against you per se but these pug rules are generally aimed at the lowest denominator which is why they’re so strict.

Even though I’m super experienced at raids sometimes I die to stupid things and do things that you wouldn’t expect from an experienced player, it happens.

However, there have been pug runs where you have that guy who doesn’t throw the bomb at sabetha or decides to drop aoes on the group at sloth 3 times in a row etc etc. Those guys end up wasting 9 other people’s time by being inexperienced. Perhaps, they would become a bit better in 30 minutes of wipes but for experienced people who already wiped a couple of hours getting the mechanics down weeks/months ago it is purely wasted time which would be better spent if the new guy was replaced by another individual like themselves who has experience already.

A lot of people prefer their raid runs to be entirely clean and quick 1 pull 1 kill. That’s their right to request as such.

You say that it might take less than 20 minutes to learn the boss but that’s an extra 20 minutes per boss, 9 bosses = 180 minutes which is 3 hours wasted by 9 other people waiting for you to learn the mechanics. Also, you can learn the mechanics in a non clear group before joining a clear group, especially since people learn at different rates.

Also you should note that a lot of us ‘suffered’ through destined to fail runs for hours before the nice raid guilds/dulfy made videos on the raid fights. You don’t seriously believe that we just walked in and somehow 1 shot the boss right? We all had to learn the hard way.

The Zealous Templar.3861:

Shiyo.3578:

Idk I went into a training run with 1 experiened player and 9 new/“knows some” to the fight and killed KC in less than an hour. I didn’t watch a video or have any idea what the boss did prior to fighting it.

My bad, I guess your cherry picked anecdotal evidence of an outlier clearly disproves the trends observed by most.

I’ll be looking for only new players from now on, I’ll get the raid done super quick guaranteed.

Just did sloth and bandit trio with 0 experience on a class I’ve never played before in group content and barely played at 80(like less than 10 hours played) with a bunch of new players(but a lot of experienced). Killed both in less than an hour.

People just need to give others a chance! We had a fantastic leader leading us to victory and it made it pretty easy.

Shiyo.3578:

Just did sloth and bandit trio with 0 experience on a class I’ve never played before in group content and barely played at 80(like less than 10 hours played) with a bunch of new players(but a lot of experienced). Killed both in less than an hour.

People just need to give others a chance! We had a fantastic leader leading us to victory and it made it pretty easy.

You have been very lucky then. While pugging is fine in the right groups, setting up a lfg without any requirements will bring you a lot of players that fail over and over again, even at VG. No matter what you say, explain, demand, how kindly you are etc., they aren’t improving over the time. It starts when they refuse to come to a TS just to listen or don’t talk after asking about a specific role in the encounter.
Best example yesterday and this happens a lot: A necro joins at our VG run. Staff usage like it’s a usual thing. I wrote him every little utility skill in whisper chat and told him how and what he had to do although the group was advertised as “experienced”. I don’t have to mention that he wasn’t able to use “epi” at boss when i offered to “epi” the seekers. Same on Gorseval but even worse. I told him all skills to hold the soul and he failed horribly while it’s nearly impossible to let a soul walk through as a necro (orb clear assumed). As exp raider, such things are not funny because it feels like you have to be a primary school teacher or educating people the way you would educate your own kids – over and over and over and over and over again. This is stressful (even with your own kids^^) and I want to have fun in my clears, I have no problem to help afterwards during the rest of the week.

So, I tell you with 100% certainty that usually 10 out of 10 pug groups won’t kill Slothasor while having “a bunch of new players” and you playing a “new class”. Experienced raiders know that and after so much time spent in W1 and also in W2 they don’t want to fail to unnecessary reasons.

PUGS are pot luck. Did VG Monday night no sweat. Went to do it again last night with a few friends I was helping and the rest pugs. Despite excellent dps, we failed about 6 times with at one point the VG having NO health.

Why did we fail? Because those allocated to the greens could simply not get there all the time. Why? Who knows. I’m calling it on on Discord, even describing exactly where they are. There wasn’t much more I could do to help them.

Some people just can’t grasp it, I don’t know.

I just hit 80 & bought HoT.. Looking forward to checking out the whole raid scene on this game..!

i hate that..exp only..i was sitting in the raid area for like 2 hours..couldn’t find a group..used the LFG thing and after a few mins it kicks you off the list..i wish it was like pvp ..press a button and it sticks you in a random group. because sitting around for hours ..isn’t fun.

it is ok, when the first wing opened about an hour after people where only looking for “exp”.

It is just down to luck when going with pugs, I have not completed VG but I have had teams that where full pug and got it down to 5% before they gave up and other times full guilds with me and 1 other as fillers and only me and the other pug knew what to do and the guild couldn’t even get it to the first split phase.

But you will also get people who only want “exp” and they themselves are actually not good at raiding at all. It is the way MMO games are now sadly, you either spoil the excitement of a new thing by having to do alot of researching before to even get taken onto a team or you don’t do it.

“Ping your Li or kick”. This is how it looks like.

I killed VG once – leader allowed me to stay in group, couse “one noob is acceptable”. But even if I know what to do, there is no point to look for group until I have N+ Li… But I have to kill bosses to get Li…
Vicious circle.

It looks like the UW speed clears from gw1. “Show us X uw tokens or kick”. Noone cares if you started raiding one week ago.
Now I’m sick of looking for groups. Looks like the fun with raiding ends here for me.

For everyone looking for groups that aren’t asking for Legendary Insight Pings and are looking to learn and the beat raids, I highly suggest looking into Raid Teaching guilds. A good one that I’m part of is Very OK Guild [KK]. You may not succeed immediately, and don’t expect to be carried, but everyone is active and raiding, and everyone takes part in teaching runs.

Fair warning; if you aren’t willing to change your build/gear to be more effective, then you can’t expect as many people to run with you, since the less you try to optimize the more of a burden you are on your party members. All anyone in a learning run asks is that you try to contribute as much as possible, the same as anyone else.