Guild Wars 2

shonn.5037:

Writetyper.1985 go tank Jormag the dragon and tell me how well you dodge out of his attack when your at his feet !

Those two bolded words. That there is your problem.

Firstly, Jormag isn’t meant to be tanked in the traditional sense of the word, not with an event with a hundred-plus people. There is simply no point. Secondly, there is a place for melee in the fight, but it’s not as straightforward as facerolling his legs.

Phase 1- If you like melee, grab bombs and rush to the wall while dodging all the spikes and etc. If not, grab a zooka and stand back. When the ice wall goes down, you can melee him with no danger, but when it goes back up, it’s back to bombs and zookas. I personally get bored with zookas and always run bombs, as an elementalist. So far I have not died once.

Phase 2- Ranged can stand on the cliffs and attack from there. Melee can focus on killing spikes and adds in order to allow the golems to stun the boss. When the boss is stunned, you can melee him- when he’s not, get out of the way and continue killing spikes. Judging by how many ranged players go down during this phase, I’d almost say it’s safer to just use the golems and burst him when he’s stunned. Of course, if you’re extra daring, you can charge in and attack him, then escape to recover from his ice breath while killing spikes and adds, then charge in again, etc. I’ve seen a number of people do it with ease. Again, I melee this phase as well and never get killed.

Yeah, there are some parts which reek “go ranged or you’re kittened.” But overall, melee is a viable and effective option. It’s just that melee =/= stand in one place mashing keys while hoping someone heals you.

Titan.3472:

AC p3 encounter is broken aka Gigantus Lupicus

Then it’s perfectly fine and people can do it naked then.

To the op, you wouldn’t have had a problem in my party I ran AC story 5 times in a row for last months monthly. Did it last minute as I was leveling up a new ranger. I did the runs with lvl 27 gear on a level 28 Ranger. Pretty much full glass too. Ran through it in under 25 minutes each.

As mentioned, you need to use the boulders, interrupts, and conditions. Ralena and Vassar was the only issue I ran into. The can be such a fussy couple at times ;-)

Try it again. I think you’ll see how easy it can be.

AC is all about teaching newbies how to use Dodge properly.
Also Red Circle Of Death has it’s name for a reason.

I just don’t get posts like this. I’m not trying to be elitist or anything like that but two guildies and I did AC story last week with 3 people, and I was a 34 engineer.

I’m genuinely puzzled at this stuff.

Just seems to me that many people are still stuck in the tank/healer/dps thing.

I quit the game for awhile and just came back. After completing the 30, 40 and attempting the 50 dungeon I can still say, without a single doubt, the dungeons in this game are neither fun nor rewarding. They are absurdly difficult unless you focus on running and gunning. Essentially, all mechanics and classes are moot, just range dps and run. Melee, strap on your ranged anything and prepare to be forced into ranged combat. It’s hilarious that heavy armor wearers take virtually the same amount of damage as light. Something is clearly not working!

Now doing Twilight whatever and we were kicked mid dungeon, for apparently no reason. No one left the group, but one guy crashed to desktop.

If not for being free, I’d have not come back.

This is an unbelievably great game during the lvling process, the end…

PyrophoricX.7540:

I quit the game for awhile and just came back. After completing the 30, 40 and attempting the 50 dungeon I can still say, without a single doubt, the dungeons in this game are neither fun nor rewarding. They are absurdly difficult unless you focus on running and gunning. Essentially, all mechanics and classes are moot, just range dps and run. Melee, strap on your ranged anything and prepare to be forced into ranged combat. It’s hilarious that heavy armor wearers take virtually the same amount of damage as light. Something is clearly not working!

Now doing Twilight whatever and we were kicked mid dungeon, for apparently no reason. No one left the group, but one guy crashed to desktop.

If not for being free, I’d have not come back.

This is an unbelievably great game during the lvling process, the end…

If it was the case that range is the only viable option, then warriors in dungeons would not exist, mesmers using sword, guardian, axe-wielding rangers and more, all these classes would not exist in dungeons.

Part of being good at this game is learning the mechanics and learning how to dodge and move effectively so you are not getting hit all the time (not always possible, of course, but in some cases of course you will have to switch to range)

It sounds like what you are arguing is the result of either
1. grouping with mostly inexp players, which could very well be the case especially in the less played dungeons
2. Inexperience yourself, everyone is here at one point, you just need to put in the time/effort to make yourself better
3. Failing one or two times and saying “kitten it this is bs too hard” many people do this and its extremely aggravating to hear them gripe (not saying this applies to you)

Basically, dungeons are meant to be difficult because your options in pve are somewhat limited to doing events and bosses, which is pretty easy, or doing dungeons with the rewards being increased and the option of getting FREE exotic armor and weapons, so of course the difficulty will be increased comparatively

I understand a dungeon being difficult. I dont understand the primary mechanic or rule being to dodge. Like I said, run and gun thats the dungeon game. Doesnt matter what class youre playing, just dodge. Makes things extremely boring.

And again, difficulty is fine but give some decent reward. Most loot is garbage, no better than open world loot. If you want to grind, which the devs said this game is not about, then you can get some tokens to buy superior weapons, just like WoW.

Again, great open world game, the dungeons just arent fun … at least for me.

I would recommend trying out fractals if you haven’t already.

Doing fractals introduces you to different situations and scenarios where you will have to put different skill sets to use, and kind of eases you into dungeons in general at the low levels. It’s kind of like training for PvE and in my opinion, everyone should try to go through at least a few levels in fotm

I think after going throught fractals 1-30 I got 2x better at the game mechanics in general.

As far as garbage loot in dungeons, this is a RNG so loot is completely random everywhere you go, one run you will get 0 rares and the next you will get 4 rares and a lodestone, plus the tokens you can put towards equipment, or if the dungeon is 70+ rare equipment which you can salvage for up to 3 ectos.

PyrophoricX.7540:

I quit the game for awhile and just came back. After completing the 30, 40 and attempting the 50 dungeon I can still say, without a single doubt, the dungeons in this game are neither fun nor rewarding. They are absurdly difficult unless you focus on running and gunning. Essentially, all mechanics and classes are moot, just range dps and run. Melee, strap on your ranged anything and prepare to be forced into ranged combat. It’s hilarious that heavy armor wearers take virtually the same amount of damage as light. Something is clearly not working!

Now doing Twilight whatever and we were kicked mid dungeon, for apparently no reason. No one left the group, but one guy crashed to desktop.

If not for being free, I’d have not come back.

This is an unbelievably great game during the lvling process, the end…

Now, they are hardly absurdly difficult, find the right build and put together the right party and every dungeon is easy. My party usually consists of 2 guardians 2 war and an ele/mes.. so forced ranged can be annoying, not hard just time consuming. I can quite safely say I could complete all dungeons without a single wipe with the right party…

I can help you with your build/dungeons if you like..

Yes, melee characters can make it through almost everything in this game. However, due to armor types appearing completely irrelevant, it leaves ranged classes with inherent survivability advantages. Given those advantages, even if melee and ranged classes had similar damage stats, ranged classes can consistently deal damage, increasing their dps. That said, I don’t believe melee damage stats are on par with ranged, given the huge damage numbers my elementalist can pull vs my warrior.

I can see rolling through dungeons with melee if you simply want an additional challenge or like the look of melee armor, otherwise ranged has clear advantages in a game without tanking and virtually no 1-1 healing. Two mechanics that don’t make sense to drop, especially if you’re going to go through to trouble of classifying armor into categories such as heavy, medium and light.

I like RNG looting, but they’ve included too many variables to the equation. Either I’m looting something that isn’t my class, isnt my level or isnt an upgrade from story mode loot. On the off chance I get a rare that someone else can use, it almost always seems to be soulbound.

PyrophoricX.7540:

Yes, melee characters can make it through almost everything in this game. However, due to armor types appearing completely irrelevant, it leaves ranged classes with inherent survivability advantages. Given those advantages, even if melee and ranged classes had similar damage stats, ranged classes can consistently deal damage, increasing their dps. That said, I don’t believe melee damage stats are on par with ranged, given the huge damage numbers my elementalist can pull vs my warrior.

I can see rolling through dungeons with melee if you simply want an additional challenge or like the look of melee armor, otherwise ranged has clear advantages in a game without tanking and virtually no 1-1 healing. Two mechanics that don’t make sense to drop, especially if you’re going to go through to trouble of classifying armor into categories such as heavy, medium and light.

I like RNG looting, but they’ve included too many variables to the equation. Either I’m looting something that isn’t my class, isnt my level or isnt an upgrade from story mode loot. On the off chance I get a rare that someone else can use, it almost always seems to be soulbound.

I’m not sure where you’re getting that an ele can be out dmging a war, certainly they have their perks and utility, but straight damage is not what an ele is best at in most situations.

It also seems like you’re judging how good your loot is on whether or not you can use it immediately on your chars? This is not the case at all and is the reason TP exists. Most gear you get as loot is not going to be exotic and tailor fit to your build, which is what you should be aiming for.

And about the different armor types, there is a significant difference especially vs trash mobs where you’re getting hit more times for less dmg, heavy armor protects you a whole lot more in that situation. Also as a heavy armor you will get more mobs attention which takes the pressure off lighter classes allowing them to do their job better.

itt ppl having troubles with AC

If you really want to tank then use a build that focuses on that. I assure you it can be done. However, prepare to under-perform. Teamwork will get you much further than any build in this game.

@OP

You’re most certainly not the first to feel the way you do.
You will in general, get one of two responses from the people here;

1) “You’re doing it wrong”, “Think about it, look at it this way”
2) “Yeah, the dungeons are too hard, they’re awful”

The truth is, both #1 and #2 are both right!
What’s wrong about this is that, I believe, it’s just bad design;

That dungeons play entirely different from PvE is not good design because not only was there was no explanation by Anet or expectation from players for this to be the case, it is simply illogical. Why is a level 35 bandit in the dungeon multiple times more powerful than the same level 35 bandit in PvE? One-shot kills? Removes any opportunity to use a variety of skills to defend, and besides, what’s fun about being instantly put on your kitten (whether you’re doing anything wrong or not)

When we as the player make the necessary ‘adjustments’, the dungeons can be completed some more easily than others—whether they’re enjoyable or not, that’s an entirely different story—though in my view, most of the time they’re not particularly enjoyable.

Theres no such thing as tank in GW2, its all about avoiding damage and dodgerolls.

But, I never tried this dungeon but CM is pretty mean as well, one thing is true though, Anet likes to put stuff there that if you knew about it, it will be a lot easier, as in CM storymode you have a boss that has a ton of hp and hits hard (well pretty much all bosses) and to avoid him you stand on the stairs and because hes too short none of his attacks will land on you. But if you did melee him, you wouldn’t last more than 10 seconds without good dodgerolling and kiting.

The easiest dungeon is FoTM and you get ascended gear from it as well, the trash mobs don’t hit like trucks or have truckloads of hp unlike the regular dungeons. I don’t think FoTM is considered a dungeon though because there is no story to it.

But just saying these normal dungeons are just crazy, like in CM p1 you’ll come to a point where theres a boss and like 10 archers up top, time you get to archers you die, meleeing the boss you die, hide underneath the archers (they don’t move) and autoattack boss that cant hit you, is only way to defeat him, no skill involved at all, just silly mechanics, theres a lot of stuff like this in other dungeons as well.

uberkingkong.8041:

Theres no such thing as tank in GW2, its all about avoiding damage and dodgerolls.

But, I never tried this dungeon but CM is pretty mean as well, one thing is true though, Anet likes to put stuff there that if you knew about it, it will be a lot easier, as in CM storymode you have a boss that has a ton of hp and hits hard (well pretty much all bosses) and to avoid him you stand on the stairs and because hes too short none of his attacks will land on you. But if you did melee him, you wouldn’t last more than 10 seconds without good dodgerolling and kiting.

The easiest dungeon is FoTM and you get ascended gear from it as well, the trash mobs don’t hit like trucks or have truckloads of hp unlike the regular dungeons. I don’t think FoTM is considered a dungeon though because there is no story to it.

But just saying these normal dungeons are just crazy, like in CM p1 you’ll come to a point where theres a boss and like 10 archers up top, time you get to archers you die, meleeing the boss you die, hide underneath the archers (they don’t move) and autoattack boss that cant hit you, is only way to defeat him, no skill involved at all, just silly mechanics, theres a lot of stuff like this in other dungeons as well.

I beg to differ with you. My Guardian feels little different than my Prot Paladin in WoW did, and tanks nearly as well. Outside of dungeons there is little I cannot solo (although it might take me all day), outside of major zone events. Inside of dungeons I can “tank” most bosses, although there are a few that, due to screwy mechancs, make this impossible or undesirable because everyone just glitches them (just as in your example).

AC Story is actually ez mode

I’d just like to join the chorus of players that ask for a Lv80 Hard mode that offers more tokens and better rewards for dungeons and a normal level mode that, for instance Lv35 players can do and not get exploded in Ascalonian Catacombs.

Yes, seasoned players can do Ascalonian Catacombs at Lv35 on their alts. It IS doable. But as much as I love the teamworky-challenges of AC, it isn’t acting as the great teaching tool it really should be for newer players. Something with a lighter hand that makes newer players actually enjoy the dungeon is called for. (No newer player is going to be enthused having spent most of the time faceplanted during a boss.)

Also the normal mode could offer level-appropriate weapons and/or armor at a cost that the Lv35 player could get it before hitting Lv 45. :P

Aomine.5012:

especially many of them do NOT know how to run pass mobs and just keep on dying.

Well….don’t try to run past mobs then. IMHO, unless everyone is a seasoned vet at the dungeon and the game plan to run the mobs is set by chat in stone, running will go horribly wrong. The new waypoint mechanics make sure of that.

The devs would prefer that you actually do the content.

Tanking? As a Warrior? There’s your problem. I don’t consider myself an expert on dungeons, but I can see right there, that there’s a problem. Warriors are a relatively fragile class, and you’r supposed to juggle attacks, not tank. Guardians can take more punishment than most classes (depending on your build and everything) but even they can’t withstand many attacks. Coordinate, target, discuss strategy, and learn each others roles. Your first time is always the worst, and I hate to be the one to tell you this but AC is a fairly easy dungeon. It also depends on your group. If you have all Warriors you’ll have insane DPS, but no survivability, you’ll be the definition of a glass cannon. Try not to have more than 2 of any of the same class, but 3 might be workable (but is NOT suggested for a new group). Overall though, don’t give up. You’ll learn your role as you play, but throw out whatever you remember from other RPGs. In this game, there is no tank, dps, or healer (you could try, and it’s possible but it wouldn’t be very efficient). Some of the roles I’ve found are DPSer (great path for Warrior) Boon-er (Guardian) Conditioner (Necro) and a billion other things. Just take your time, and learn a role for your Warrior.

When you people say “tanking”, do you mean holding threat, because as far as i know, this is not possible in gw2. There is no skill to force a mob on you, such as taunt.

PyrophoricX.7540:

Ok, out of 4 different classes, no one could tank. Specifically, no one could survive more than a few hits.

The nests of spiders were especially horrible. Attacking the nest directly, we had at least 10 spiders at once. The warrior last about 2 seconds, surprisingly dps characters had more utility to actually stay alive but not for much longer.

Before you go into the dungeon, you should discuss general strategy and tactics with your group. One of the ways to do this is to discuss builds.

It helps to know some good builds to fit different for every class off the top of your head, or, assuming that you don’t, it would be a good idea to make sure your partners run builds that support their role in the dungeon. Failing that, if you’re good at coming up with innovative, creative build ideas off the top of your head, then that’s a great way to organize your team. I can’t remember very good builds off the top of my head, but in my experience, as soon as I rolled a profession, I went straight to PvP and went and BS’d my own build. It wasn’t necessarily unique or original, but it did what it had to do, so I’d probably fall into the second or third categories.

For example, here are some different thief builds that would work well in a dungeon, I think (haven’t done one in a while):

Venom Share, Team Direct Support

D/P Tanking Build (by the way, this is a build that I am certain is unique to me, I created it myself and have yet to see another person make something even remotely close to it. It’s a shame that I’m one of very few people who use this (the others being people who asked me for build advice), because it’s a very good build.

Bleeds Err’where

My warrior is a tank and he does the best at dungeons out of my other 8 characters. I draw aggro as well as you can expect in GW2, so the rest of the team really needs to protect themselves. But with very high vit and toughness I devote myself to evading to anyone that’s downed and reviving them. My abilities allow me to invince through some damage and my traits help me to revive faster. Rampage also raises my health to around 46k for as long as the ability lasts. It’s been working pretty well in dungeons, WvW, and PvP.

I stopped reading when you started suggesting that ranged classes dominate the dungeons and your elementalists does more damage than your warrior. Oh and dropping bound on pickup yellows.

I’m usually a pretty patient guy but really, get a clue dude.

Jzl.8715:

“Warrior Tank”, there is your issue.

Yep theres the issue theres no trinity everyone is dps how fun is that

Akame.1073:

We arent in .Azeroth any more, Jzl gave you a great hint.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-WJP0LR5VU watch this video & try to actually understand the game machanics, then youll laugh at your own post & at the same time improve your game-play.

How is this tanking?