Guild Wars 2

There is a “plank” on a wall you can stand on while fighting Frost in CM in order to not be hit by his frost gun. I got kicked from the group for not wanting to exploit along with ****** . They knew what they were doing.

RubberDougie.2750:

There is a “plank” on a wall you can stand on while fighting Frost in CM in order to not be hit by his frost gun. I got kicked from the group for not wanting to exploit along with * . They knew what they were doing.

One don’t post people’s names on the forums or you will have problems, from the dev I know in QA, they know about it don’t like it but don’t have a fix for it. And since dungeons are very much back seat to everything else don’t expect anything anytime soon, and I feel you pain.

If they know about it, why don’t they just change the geometry a little bit? ANet is incompetent if they really knew about this.

Was it their party? If so, then just roll with it.

Same thing if they’re advertising a party with an AP requirement and you don’t meet it, then don’t join.

You might want to just find a dungeon guild to do stuff with to avoid having to pug and possibly getting kicked all the time.

RubberDougie.2750:

If they know about it, why don’t they just change the geometry a little bit? ANet is incompetent if they really knew about this.

There are ~4 spots I know of at frost where you can afk him. Some require to you clear the turrets first. They need to basically make everything chin level on an asuran or taller than a human to avoid afking melee/conical attacking mobs. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfcTkIUqhOA look at what I do in this video against the melee mobs. It works on basically every melee mob minus the risen balth priest in arah p4.

Its not really an exploit, just a savespot that is caused by a flaw in the game’s mechanics.
Its pretty useless to use it in a 5 man group, since Frost is a pretty easy boss that you can just faceroll, savespot or not.
Only place where its usefull is when you’re soloing/duoing, but even then its still not that hard to do it normally

bladex.9502:

caused by a flaw in the game’s mechanics.

That IS the definition of an exploit.

SlyDevil.3952:

RubberDougie.2750:

If they know about it, why don’t they just change the geometry a little bit? ANet is incompetent if they really knew about this.

There are ~4 spots I know of at frost where you can afk him. Some require to you clear the turrets first. They need to basically make everything chin level on an asuran or taller than a human to avoid afking melee/conical attacking mobs. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfcTkIUqhOA look at what I do in this video against the melee mobs. It works on basically every melee mob minus the risen balth priest in arah p4.

Could you please send the info on how to do what you did to exploits@arena.net ?

That end section of CM is just poorly designed, you can literally walk out of the map from the corner gate where the water is. Easiest fix would be to patch those terrain spots and it would take the least effort of any alternative.

That being said if it takes longer than killing him on spot (which it does) then it isn’t as big of a deal as one shotting lupi for example, which is something only pugs seem to do and always seem to enforce.

The definition of an exploit could start a big discussion (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/So-about-lupicus/first).

Either way, ANet’s not focusing on dungeons right now, especially because of HoT. What I suggest you do is not join LFGs with people who want to do the exploit.

Axelwarrior.9084:

The definition of an exploit could start a big discussion (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/So-about-lupicus/first).

Either way, ANet’s not focusing on dungeons right now, especially because of HoT. What I suggest you do is not join LFGs with people who want to do the exploit.

Chris Cleary.8017:

Avoiding mechanics by standing in a singular area isn’t an exploit, it’s possible bad dungeon design (for example the cage room in the newer flame and frost fractal…sorry I can’t remember the name of the dungeon it’s late). In that fight there are areas in which you can avoid almost the entire fight mechanic, that’s an example of poor dungeon mechanic design.

Standing on a rock/ledge/platform while the boss attempts to hit you from below (yes there are some bosses that still have abilities that hit you), is a problem with pathing and the boss not resetting when it can’t reach the target. This is exploiting a bug.

Kiting and using geometry (running AROUND pillars and such) is a perfectly valid tactic.

Standing outside a stationary boss’s range is not an exploit, the boss “should” reset after an extended period of time, but is not. This is an example of poor boss implementation, and not an exploit.

Using terrain to block/dodge boss mechanics is also considered a valid tactic (standing behind a pillar when a boss charges).

At this point we are getting very nitpicky at each individual boss and each mechanic in question. I’m sure most of you are aware of what is an exploit and what is a mechanic/tactic. We are working on fixing these “Safe Spots”, but it’s going to take some time to get it done, and will probably happen over time. (Sorry I am not going to go into particulars for fights/changes)

I’ll be very clear here:
If a GM finds a player that is using a “Safe Spot”, that player will be moved out of the safe spot and warned (via in-game text). If they are caught again, that account will be temporarily suspended.

If a GM finds a player that is using a “Safe Spot” and selling the dungeon run, that account will be temporarily suspended without warning.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Safespots-and-Exploits/page/2#post4338224

There’s a huge amount of safespots and oversights, some of them being more obvious as bugs than others. If you were kicked for refusing to abuse an unintended mechanics, that’s bad and you can report it, although I’m afraid not much is gonna happen, just as nothing is gonna happen regarding the needed dungeon fixes.
Anyway, using this very old pug strategy is time inefficient, anyone using it basically punishes himself for not even trying this laughably easy boss. For solos, this could be discutable, but for 5-man groups, you’re paying for the “safety” with a noticable time loss.

Also, while I’m not a fan of using these “bugs”, you have no right to complain about other people using them if you’ve ever used one yourself. How come everyone in the pug world is perfectly okay with bugging TA UP champ and CM is somehow wrong? If you’re strictly against EVERY type of boss disable, then you probably need to find like minded people and play dungeons the intended way. Otherwise, you’re gonna run into these things with pugs a lot, especially since no one at Anet is gonna do anything about it.

There was a red post about this, I think. Let me try to dig it up…

…ah, here it is:

GM Totes Legit

Fix it?

No. kitten you. Leave us alone.

How ’bout dat Scarlet doe?

Taku.6352:

Axelwarrior.9084:

The definition of an exploit could start a big discussion (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/So-about-lupicus/first).

Either way, ANet’s not focusing on dungeons right now, especially because of HoT. What I suggest you do is not join LFGs with people who want to do the exploit.

Chris Cleary.8017:

Avoiding mechanics by standing in a singular area isn’t an exploit, it’s possible bad dungeon design (for example the cage room in the newer flame and frost fractal…sorry I can’t remember the name of the dungeon it’s late). In that fight there are areas in which you can avoid almost the entire fight mechanic, that’s an example of poor dungeon mechanic design.

Standing on a rock/ledge/platform while the boss attempts to hit you from below (yes there are some bosses that still have abilities that hit you), is a problem with pathing and the boss not resetting when it can’t reach the target. This is exploiting a bug.

Kiting and using geometry (running AROUND pillars and such) is a perfectly valid tactic.

Standing outside a stationary boss’s range is not an exploit, the boss “should” reset after an extended period of time, but is not. This is an example of poor boss implementation, and not an exploit.

Using terrain to block/dodge boss mechanics is also considered a valid tactic (standing behind a pillar when a boss charges).

At this point we are getting very nitpicky at each individual boss and each mechanic in question. I’m sure most of you are aware of what is an exploit and what is a mechanic/tactic. We are working on fixing these “Safe Spots”, but it’s going to take some time to get it done, and will probably happen over time. (Sorry I am not going to go into particulars for fights/changes)

I’ll be very clear here:
If a GM finds a player that is using a “Safe Spot”, that player will be moved out of the safe spot and warned (via in-game text). If they are caught again, that account will be temporarily suspended.

If a GM finds a player that is using a “Safe Spot” and selling the dungeon run, that account will be temporarily suspended without warning.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Safespots-and-Exploits/page/2#post4338224

First of all, I was not referring to GW2’s definition of an exploit specifically.
Second of all, what is the difference between a “poor dungeon mechanic design” and a “bug”? Isn’t a “bug” also “poor dungeon mechanic design”?

A Bug is when what they intended isn’t happening correctly. A poorly designed mechanic is when what they intended ended up being pretty stupid and “exploitable” (in the more general sense). You’re right though Exploit is a term that can be debated for ages in regards to games. Luckily we do have some direction thanks to Mr. Cleary

Chris Cleary.8017:

If a GM finds a player that is using a “Safe Spot” and selling the dungeon run, that account will be temporarily suspended without warning.

By that logic, basically every “Boss at 1%” sell group would have been banned by now, yet I highly doubt anyone ever got banned for it…

Jerus.4350:

A Bug is when what they intended isn’t happening correctly. A poorly designed mechanic is when what they intended ended up being pretty stupid and “exploitable” (in the more general sense). You’re right though Exploit is a term that can be debated for ages in regards to games. Luckily we do have some direction thanks to Mr. Cleary

His example of a poorly designed mechanic is perfect for showcasing how it’s not necessarily intended.

Even if that was their defining difference, however, we still can’t know what’s intended and what’s not. Therefore it’s pointless debating it, as, in the end, only the devs can decide what’s an exploit.

bladex.9502:

Chris Cleary.8017:

If a GM finds a player that is using a “Safe Spot” and selling the dungeon run, that account will be temporarily suspended without warning.

By that logic, basically every “Boss at 1%” sell group would have been banned by now, yet I highly doubt anyone ever got banned for it…

Some people were indeed banned for this. Though there is very little activity from the GMs in this regard. Also, based on the reports I’ve heard of (of course I can be wrong here), I came to the understanding that these things happen more frequently on NA, people on EU are monitored much less intensively.
But yeah. They really should put an autoban on the “[SELL] boss at 1%” text.

Oh and just for the record, I’ve even heard (again, cannot know this for sure) that some of the banning happens pretty much automatically. How simple is it to put a detector+counter below the stairs in AC and once you’ve found yourself in the void a number of times, you’ll get banned automatically (or it is reported to a GM, who proceeds to inspect you for suspicious activity).
So yeah, you’re mostly safe bugging the game to your heart’s content but it’s your own risk, I’ve seen people getting banned on multiple occasions.

bladex.9502:

Chris Cleary.8017:

If a GM finds a player that is using a “Safe Spot” and selling the dungeon run, that account will be temporarily suspended without warning.

By that logic, basically every “Boss at 1%” sell group would have been banned by now, yet I highly doubt anyone ever got banned for it…

No, for example Brie at the end of Arah2, you’re simply staying within range to hold the agro preventing the reset but out of range of her attacks and out of danger. This is what he defined as bad design.

Axel, again, exploit can be debated all day long. However, the guy in charge of enforcing behavior in this game set up some guidelines for us. His definition is the only one that matters in this game, there’s no arguing it. Like the example above, you’re simply outsmarting their bad design, not finding a glitch in their system. According to his definition that’s ok.

Putting Turmaine on the rock or up in the treehouse is an exploit by ANet’s definition. Holding Brie at 1% however is not. Safespotting Frost (what this thread is about) is an exploit. The kicker with Frost is there are multiple options, so they fix one people tart using another, they fix that, they use another, etc etc. Not saying they shouldn’t be fixed but it’s more than just the plank is all and I’d imagine they’d want a full list of options before going in and starting work so they can get it all done at once. So with that if anyone knows a spot and feels so inclined they should report it to them.

Hey just wanted to drop by and tell my side of the story. (Im the one that kicked this guy)

Me and some friends posted a LFG for CM and a lvl 75 joins, we didnt put “lvl 80 only” in the LFG but we wanted a lvl 80 party so we ask him to switch to a 80 and at the end boss switch his toon.
He started arguing how he had all his traits and it wouldnt make a diffrence, we thougth we would never get this guy to switch so we kicked him.

When we reached the first boss ww had a leaver so we posted in the LFG again.
This guy joins again on his lvl 75 again so we try to kick him rigth away, he flipps and tells us that we dont give him time to switch so we cancel the kick. He gets on a lvl 80 and we kill the boss in the barn.

After the boss we decide to skip the trash-mobs since we have a thife in the party, this guy didnt realize tha twe where skipping so he gets himself killed, we didnt mind and decide to 4-man the boss that stealths while giving him one chance to make the skip on his own while we kill the boss, He died and when we killed the boss he switched bak to his 75, saying where where at the last boss soon.

We tell him you usally switch when the boss is at 50% but lets him join sinc eit wouldnt really make a diffrence at this point, stealth to the room with the snipers and clear the trash.

We now make the easy skip to the last boss, Frost.
Everyone jumps up on the plank OP was talking about, since tha tis hte usual way you do it with a group from the LFG, and this guy starts to kite the boss around saying we are all kittenty exploting cheaters and he will not have anything to with that spot.

At this point I’m pretty kittened on him since he hadnt done anyhting really the whole dungeon except 1 trash clear and the first boss.
And now he litterly starts to go against us even when we tell him to come up to us, he keeps kiting Frost around so we cant hit him.
I didnt feel like he deserved the free gold he would have gotten for doing not much more than switching characters a few times. So we kick him from the dungeon and Frost comes to us and we finish the boss in a burst.

Now he starts to whisper us and some rude words where sent, it ended in a report.
I dont want to get to much into details about that since its irrelevant to the topic.

I just did the dungeon i have done it in months now and after reading the post you people linked here in the thread i will start using the faster melee spot i nthe cave instead.

TL;DR. He was barely present thro the whole dungeon and refused to cooperate at the last boss and got very offensive so we kicked him.

Grorge.7812:

TL;DR. He was barely present thro the whole dungeon and refused to cooperate at the last boss and got very offensive so we kicked him.

Was with this group and ran into the OP as well, his actions caused him to receive an ignore and reports from everyone. Especially for the threats made against me, and having his guild members start to whisper messages to us.

I think OP stole my turkey sandwich from the fridge at work last Tuesday, too.

Oh, and BTW:

RubberDougie.2750:

If they know about it, why don’t they just change the geometry a little bit? ANet is incompetent if they really knew about this.

Nailed it.

Dungeons are dead, they won’t be adding more or fixing the ones we have. There are literally pages of bugs and exploits that we’ve put together in this forum and had forwarded to the devs with no real outcome.

Think of it this way: Dungeon code has cooties, and the devs are 12 year olds.

They don’t care about supporting or maintaining the content, and if that bothers you, save yourself a few months/years of aggravation and find a new game to play, because believe me: nothing we can do will change this.

Mike.5268:

Grorge.7812:

TL;DR. He was barely present thro the whole dungeon and refused to cooperate at the last boss and got very offensive so we kicked him.

Was with this group and ran into the OP as well, his actions caused him to receive an ignore and reports from everyone. Especially for the threats made against me, and having his guild members start to whisper messages to us.

Threats and having other players continuing it constitute a harassment.
The problem here is more of OP harassing then the plank itself. Self righteous at it’s best here.

This game is full of grey zone area where it can be categorized either bug or bad design.
Look at how grey and flip flopping with inconsistencies was one of anet response.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Safespots-and-Exploits/page/2#post4338224
Every body glitch/exploit/cheat in this game one way or another. From FGS, portal, dungeon bosses, skipping trashes (taking advantage of limited range aggro mechanic), cheating portal to JP, glitch events/champs farming, bugged traits (recent one guardian and engi), bugged runes/sigils, etc. Lots are grey zone where punishment if implemented could alienate a huge player base which anet could not afford. The silence usually means … carry on nothing to see, will fix when we have time.
The last paragraph is dangerous n intended to small segment of the player base. Do not go against this.

Skipping trash is now confirmed an exploit.
Ty for your input Pino, very useful as always!

bladex.9502:

Skipping trash is now confirmed an exploit.
Ty for your input Pino, very useful as always!

Well, considering they were put in dungeon by design for you to fight instead of skipping so actually yes.
Hence grey zone.
Still hypocrite as always i see bladex … taking stuff out of context again? typical.
How is your mossman? lol by definition of anet from my pm to you is actually not a bug and an exploit rather bad design. Sad guy lol.
Whinge some more about every aspect of the game. The fact is GW isn’t perfect, anet knows this, whole player base knows. Well, except you n your cherry picking and hypocrisy.

Pino.5209:

bladex.9502:

Skipping trash is now confirmed an exploit.
Ty for your input Pino, very useful as always!

Well, considering they were put in dungeon by design for you to fight instead of skipping so actually yes.

Actually, Hrouda made a comment about this saying they purposely gave mobs an aggro leash so you are able to skip them.
I can’t find the article right now, but I’m sure someone will be able to link it.

Also, since you’re so interested in me, you should have noticed that I don’t consider GW2 a perfect game at all, and I actually complain about a lot of stuff, your beloved pulling-mossman-underwater being one of those

bladex.9502:

Pino.5209:

bladex.9502:

Skipping trash is now confirmed an exploit.
Ty for your input Pino, very useful as always!

Well, considering they were put in dungeon by design for you to fight instead of skipping so actually yes.

Actually, Hrouda made a comment about this saying they purposely gave mobs an aggro leash so you are able to skip them.
I can’t find the article right now, but I’m sure someone will be able to link it

Well then by your hypocrisy this is bad design since you can “save time”. What’s the point of putting it there if you can skip? right, hypocrite.

bladex.9502:

Skipping trash is now confirmed an exploit.
Ty for your input Pino, very useful as always!

It’s very easy to argue. With agro I’ve seen games handle it multiple ways. Tethers are almost always abused to run away. The alternative is they follow… and follow… and follow. Gathering more and more aggro meaning more and more processing going and more and more strain on the system. That system strain is something they are rightfully very concerned about. It’s the reason they gave for not addressing condition stacking for a long time. In the end you can only handle so much information. So the tether system is nice. The alternative is no tether system but max amount of aggroed enemies, but then that gets funky and needs it’s own processing and has it’s own abuseable loop holes (used to gather 100-200 enemies in EQ and AE them down before they could properly react and wipe us through kiting or CC, actually getting so bad at one point they did put in new coding and even nerfed the ever living crap out of some abilities that were being used for this).

Now, does ANet consider an exploit, no, and that’s all that matters. But, exploit is a very grey term, you can argue a lot of things. Without talking to the people that designed the stuff many assumptions can be made. I’m curious for example, did the devs really understand when designing some events that guardians can lay down 44s of uninterrupted projectile defense negating enemies that we can burn down in less time than that? I’d really have to hope not otherwise they knowingly put in a boss that is completely trivial and not much more than faceroll and one player paying attention to hit a second ability after the first’s timer hits 22s. And if it’s not something they understood and intended then it can be argued as an exploit, but again, doesn’t matter, only matters what ANet defines as an exploit.

Jerus.4350:

bladex.9502:

Skipping trash is now confirmed an exploit.
Ty for your input Pino, very useful as always!

It’s very easy to argue. With agro I’ve seen games handle it multiple ways. Tethers are almost always abused to run away. The alternative is they follow… and follow… and follow. Gathering more and more aggro meaning more and more processing going and more and more strain on the system. That system strain is something they are rightfully very concerned about. It’s the reason they gave for not addressing condition stacking for a long time. In the end you can only handle so much information. So the tether system is nice. The alternative is no tether system but max amount of aggroed enemies, but then that gets funky and needs it’s own processing and has it’s own abuseable loop holes (used to gather 100-200 enemies in EQ and AE them down before they could properly react and wipe us through kiting or CC, actually getting so bad at one point they did put in new coding and even nerfed the ever living crap out of some abilities that were being used for this).

Now, does ANet consider an exploit, no, and that’s all that matters. But, exploit is a very grey term, you can argue a lot of things. Without talking to the people that designed the stuff many assumptions can be made. I’m curious for example, did the devs really understand when designing some events that guardians can lay down 44s of uninterrupted projectile defense negating enemies that we can burn down in less time than that? I’d really have to hope not otherwise they knowingly put in a boss that is completely trivial and not much more than faceroll and one player paying attention to hit a second ability after the first’s timer hits 22s. And if it’s not something they understood and intended then it can be argued as an exploit, but again, doesn’t matter, only matters what ANet defines as an exploit.

Like i said grey zone … skipping trashes feels as wrong as exploiting/glitching bosses. Both trivialized content by design or not.
Grey zone is grey zone … they’ll fix it when they have time.

Pino maybe you should try taking a break from the forums.
All I see you doing is making fun of yourself by trying to force your opinion upon other people, but using horrible grammar so people cant even understand half of what you’re saying, and every time someone doesn’t with agree you, you start calling them names.

On topic : I think we now know that the OP wasn’t kicked for not wanting to use a savespot, but for his other behavior and basically expecting to get carried.

bladex.9502:

Pino maybe you should try taking a break from the forums.
All I see you doing is making fun of yourself by trying to force your opinion upon other people, but using horrible grammar so people cant even understand half of what you’re saying, and every time someone doesn’t with agree you, you start calling them names.

On topic : I think we now know that the OP wasn’t kicked for not wanting to use a savespot, but for his other behavior and basically expecting to get carried.

Ppl can understand what i am saying perfectly.
When grammar kitten attitude kicks in it’s the sign of a person losing an argument. Cheers.

What’s the point of putting On Topic … you tried to derail the other thread by making a reference to my previous mossman thread post attacking me. Hypocrite once again.

We are replying to each other posts, you are spending as much time as me here. Hypocrite again.

I’m not forcing my opinion. I’m stating the fact on the state of the game. Grey zone is grey zone.

Pino.5209:

bladex.9502:

Pino maybe you should try taking a break from the forums.
All I see you doing is making fun of yourself by trying to force your opinion upon other people, but using horrible grammar so people cant even understand half of what you’re saying, and every time someone doesn’t with agree you, you start calling them names.

On topic : I think we now know that the OP wasn’t kicked for not wanting to use a savespot, but for his other behavior and basically expecting to get carried.

What’s the point of putting On Topic … you tried to derail the other thread by making a reference to my previous mossman thread post attacking me. Hypocrite once again.

The reason I put “On Topic” was to stop this immature discussion, that we’re both pretty much aren’t achieving anything with, and also doesn’t provide anything constructive regarding the original post

bladex.9502:

Pino.5209:

bladex.9502:

Pino maybe you should try taking a break from the forums.
All I see you doing is making fun of yourself by trying to force your opinion upon other people, but using horrible grammar so people cant even understand half of what you’re saying, and every time someone doesn’t with agree you, you start calling them names.

On topic : I think we now know that the OP wasn’t kicked for not wanting to use a savespot, but for his other behavior and basically expecting to get carried.

What’s the point of putting On Topic … you tried to derail the other thread by making a reference to my previous mossman thread post attacking me. Hypocrite once again.

The reason I put “On Topic” was to stop this immature discussion, that we’re both pretty much aren’t achieving anything with, and also doesn’t provide anything constructive regarding the original post

Hypocrite trying to fix the thread … k. Done.

Pino.5209:

Jerus.4350:

bladex.9502:

Skipping trash is now confirmed an exploit.
Ty for your input Pino, very useful as always!

It’s very easy to argue. With agro I’ve seen games handle it multiple ways. Tethers are almost always abused to run away. The alternative is they follow… and follow… and follow. Gathering more and more aggro meaning more and more processing going and more and more strain on the system. That system strain is something they are rightfully very concerned about. It’s the reason they gave for not addressing condition stacking for a long time. In the end you can only handle so much information. So the tether system is nice. The alternative is no tether system but max amount of aggroed enemies, but then that gets funky and needs it’s own processing and has it’s own abuseable loop holes (used to gather 100-200 enemies in EQ and AE them down before they could properly react and wipe us through kiting or CC, actually getting so bad at one point they did put in new coding and even nerfed the ever living crap out of some abilities that were being used for this).

Now, does ANet consider an exploit, no, and that’s all that matters. But, exploit is a very grey term, you can argue a lot of things. Without talking to the people that designed the stuff many assumptions can be made. I’m curious for example, did the devs really understand when designing some events that guardians can lay down 44s of uninterrupted projectile defense negating enemies that we can burn down in less time than that? I’d really have to hope not otherwise they knowingly put in a boss that is completely trivial and not much more than faceroll and one player paying attention to hit a second ability after the first’s timer hits 22s. And if it’s not something they understood and intended then it can be argued as an exploit, but again, doesn’t matter, only matters what ANet defines as an exploit.

Like i said grey zone … skipping trashes feels as wrong as exploiting/glitching bosses. Both trivialized content by design or not.
Grey zone is grey zone … they’ll fix it when they have time.

If we can get away from personal attacks for a minute.

You seem to realize it’s a grey area. That’s exactly why I doubt they’ll “fix” trash skipping. There are areas I’d agree with you, there are areas where I truly think they were designed specifically to challenge that type of game play (Alphard → Brie for example). Inquest Technicians in Arah are only challenging if you come across them in a skip, if you intend to actually fight them then it’s just 4 people damaging one soaking up very trivial damage.

They gave us stealth for a reason.

It’s a grey area because it can be very easily argued either way.

I look at AC and the ghosts at path 3 before the burrow event. They’re trivial to run past, more of a joke than anything, but they’re lined up waiting for you, I can’t help but feel that was intended to be a road block. But, we don’t even bother to use stealth to get past them even if we have a thief/engi/mesmer. We just waltz right by.

Many of the tactics like skipping and Line of Sight have been used for at least 15 years (I remember doing it within the first year of EQ), they weren’t unknown tactics when they even first started thinking about making GW2, yet they didn’t make adjustments to prevent it. Just now they’re looking at adding some coding that will address the issues that arise from those tactics. So in the future I wouldn’t be surprised to see it punished through mechanics, but I highly doubt they’ll go back to old dungeons and touch much of anything to “fix” it.

I hope by your understanding of it being a grey area you’d agree that just because you may feel it’s an exploit it doesn’t mean you’re right and others wrong.

Taku.6352:

Axelwarrior.9084:

The definition of an exploit could start a big discussion (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/So-about-lupicus/first).

Either way, ANet’s not focusing on dungeons right now, especially because of HoT. What I suggest you do is not join LFGs with people who want to do the exploit.

Chris Cleary.8017:

Avoiding mechanics by standing in a singular area isn’t an exploit, it’s possible bad dungeon design (for example the cage room in the newer flame and frost fractal…sorry I can’t remember the name of the dungeon it’s late). In that fight there are areas in which you can avoid almost the entire fight mechanic, that’s an example of poor dungeon mechanic design.

Standing on a rock/ledge/platform while the boss attempts to hit you from below (yes there are some bosses that still have abilities that hit you), is a problem with pathing and the boss not resetting when it can’t reach the target. This is exploiting a bug.

Kiting and using geometry (running AROUND pillars and such) is a perfectly valid tactic.

Standing outside a stationary boss’s range is not an exploit, the boss “should” reset after an extended period of time, but is not. This is an example of poor boss implementation, and not an exploit.

Using terrain to block/dodge boss mechanics is also considered a valid tactic (standing behind a pillar when a boss charges).

At this point we are getting very nitpicky at each individual boss and each mechanic in question. I’m sure most of you are aware of what is an exploit and what is a mechanic/tactic. We are working on fixing these “Safe Spots”, but it’s going to take some time to get it done, and will probably happen over time. (Sorry I am not going to go into particulars for fights/changes)

I’ll be very clear here:
If a GM finds a player that is using a “Safe Spot”, that player will be moved out of the safe spot and warned (via in-game text). If they are caught again, that account will be temporarily suspended.

If a GM finds a player that is using a “Safe Spot” and selling the dungeon run, that account will be temporarily suspended without warning.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Safespots-and-Exploits/page/2#post4338224

I’ve never heard of nor seen anyone get suspended for using “safe spots”.

Honestly, the only reason I kill Frost from that ledge is because he’s a friggen boring boss. It’s more fun to just hop up on the ledge and afk auto attack than it is to kill Frost the legit way.

I think that says something about the design of that particular boss.

Quarktastic.1027:

I’ve never heard of nor seen anyone get suspended for using “safe spots”.

Being oblivious doesn’t prove anything.

frifox.5283:

Quarktastic.1027:

I’ve never heard of nor seen anyone get suspended for using “safe spots”.

Being oblivious doesn’t prove anything.

But anecdotal evidence does!!! It is interesting though, path to player mobs are only an issue if you are stealthing, does this mean they actually put in counters to stealth tactics, or they just wanted to force fights as you reached thresholds?

It will take so long for anet to fix something like this. I cant pug CM anymore because 98% pugs insist on plank , tree and hill for the bosses. There’s also the kittenty safespot for AC p3 boss, though, Grast can be an kitten sometimes.

The problem with this and other “safe spots” for this boss is that, it isn’t actually a safe spot as the game understands it. Frost can still target you and hit you with his iceblock freeze. The aoe cone attack misses because he can only fire it horizontally, but the game probably can’t tell the difference between it missing when you are above it, and it missing when you walk around him. Because the game’s in-built anti-exploit systems can’t really handle this case, the only options would be to redesign the boss (giving him more attacks that will hit above him) or try and find every little ledge that could possibly be jumped up on and put invisible walls around.

I’m not defending the use of the tactic, I just see a lot of people saying the usually “incompetent anet can’t fix a simple little bug that’s been around forever” and I’ve definitely felt that way sometimes, but in this case I can understand why they haven’t gotten around to it. There’s not a 5 minute fix that would fix the problem long term.