Guild Wars 2

You clearly didn’t think this leveling concept through to the end.

Here I am, spamming LFG for almost an hour looking to find members to fill up the ranks of our guild group.

But nobody can be found because everyone is stuck at a different level and nobody feels like investing 1 hour or more just so a group can catch up to his level.

The big joke though is that the increase in difficulty between level 2 and level 6 is barely noticeable. It’s just further artificial segregation of an already segregated player base.

I mean the only way you are going to progress through this Dungeon is by having the exact same people on at the exact same time, with no room for deviation…at which point you might as well be raiding.

What a poorly conceived concept, really.

The least you could do to mitigate the effects is make the difference between different levels more noticeable while reducing the overall number of levels. At least that way the 200 or so level 80 players won’t be spread out across 20+ different levels.

Or allow people to get an increase to their MF if the scale down to other people’s level. Every level you jump down to help is 1% increased MF. The person still could not progress to higher tiers, but wouldn’t be wasting time if they jumped down to help a new guy out for a few hours with anywhere from 1% to 20% increased MF buff.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Unifying-the-FotM-playerbase/first#post779585

Geekcrux – but you’re not wasting time when you’re helping a guildie out to catch up to your 9th level. You keep getting tokens, you keep getting chests with loot, you play together and upbring someone to play with further.
If you’re not obssessed with seeing higher difficulty level every hour, you’re not wasting time. If progressing in your toon’s diff level is more important than playing together with guildies… well, i guess there’s a place for such attitude as well.

Why should random guy help you to progress?

I can’t agree more with the OP, the level segregation by this dungeon is already overwhelming, I’m experiencing the same thing right now, chat is filled with people looking for a group but no one seems to be able to form a group because everyone is at different levels and no one wants to take a step back (which is understandable). So once again I think ANet kinda dropped the ball due to a lack of real playtesting.

Did you hear me ArenaNet? You need to let players really test your content and listen to their feedback and you could avoid SOOO many of your mistakes (they become very apparent once actual players get their hands on this stuff)

Geekcrux.1245:

Or allow people to get an increase to their MF if the scale down to other people’s level. Every level you jump down to help is 1% increased MF. The person still could not progress to higher tiers, but wouldn’t be wasting time if they jumped down to help a new guy out for a few hours with anywhere from 1% to 20% increased MF buff.

Why are you talking about MF anyway. MF does NOT apply to CHESTS only to mobs.

Oh, and I thought that was the point of the whole concept of fractals. To segregate people. Surely designers must have felt that way, can’t imagine otherwise.

People do run fractal levels lower then what they are upto. Especially if they are focused on drops and not advancing in level. I just ran with a group where two people were doing the fractal at lower levels to what they were upto. Both did it for the token and the loot. However, finding higher levels to help with level 1 is going to be difficult.

I mean this is my Fractal experience (all with PuG as my guild dungeon group hasn’t had a chance to do Fractals yet)

level 1 – fail
level 1 – fail
level 1 – success but this was with a group that I was invited to by a guy I knew and it was clear from the get go these were experience dungeon runners even if they were new to fractals
level 2 – success (same group as above)
level 2 (repeat with different group) – success
level 1 (on alt) – fail
level 1 (on alt) – fail
level 1 (on alt) – fail
level 3 – success
level 4 (same group as above) – success

See why I am not keen on helping strangers get past level 1?

Took me 2 hours to find a group for lvl 4 and people kept entering party and turning out to be lvl 1.

We then had people saying they were lvl 4 when actually they were lvl 3 and hoped we wouldn’t notice so they could get it done.

When it comes to tricking parties to get a dungeon completed there is an issue.

I don’t think you have to worry about this too much. After a certain point, most casual will hit the infusion wall. I mean, I have a Vial of Condensed Mists Essence but do not have the materials or the money to buy the materials to make it into Ascended gear.

And even if I did manage to make it into a back slot item, it won’t be infused and getting it infused is a grind in itself. Eventually, things will settle down and most people will run Fractals up to level 9 and thus more then willing to group lower then their level because they aren’t looking to increase their levels, they are only there for the loots.

That’s the issue, IF you want to increase your frac level. You will not group with people lower then you. But if all you want is loot or just something to do, you are not going to care.

This is great. I’m loving it.

I think this is fine. Certain people want feeling of progression. There arent raids there arent true gear tiers you hit lvl 80 quickly. Let those people have this feeling of pve progression. This is about the gentlest form of progression they could realistically put in.

What I find interesting is people are so against going a lower level that they will sit around for an hour waiting when they could have done a lower level fractal and got loot and then have a group closer to their own. These things run so quickly you can do a couple levels with a good group.

I never have a problem getting a group but then again that is why I am in a guild and don’t try to pug things.

Jairlyn.1429:

What I find interesting is people are so against going a lower level that they will sit around for an hour waiting when they could have done a lower level fractal and got loot and then have a group closer to their own. These things run so quickly you can do a couple levels with a good group.

What I find interesting is that people insist on playing level 80 content on their level 80s, even when there really was only one map for it. The could have easily gone to the level 1-5 areas where there are FOUR different maps to choose from, but they didn’t… Weird, huh.

Low level fractals are easy for a number of people. They want to play the higher levels were it’s more difficult, more challenging, more fun. sadly, despite having completed 44 fractals so far, I am still only on level 8, because of having to redo them OVER and OVER every time somebody has to leave or is unavailable.

This FotM levels invention is only good for one sort of players: hardcores who play with each other all day long and have similar progress, around lvl 20 by now. All the rest is writing “lfg” endlessly. All want to go to FotM but no one can form a group because there is SO MANY levels on the way. Anet made one dungeon work as 20 different dungeons in terms of finding a party.

Well done! Good I have at least my alt to level up while I’m spamming “lfg” on chats.

Dee Jay.2460:

You clearly didn’t think this leveling concept through to the end.

Here I am, spamming LFG for almost an hour looking to find members to fill up the ranks of our guild group.

But nobody can be found because everyone is stuck at a different level and nobody feels like investing 1 hour or more just so a group can catch up to his level.

I mean the only way you are going to progress through this Dungeon is by having the exact same people on at the exact same time, with no room for deviation…at which point you might as well be raiding.

What a poorly conceived concept, really.

’nough said. So much for revolutionizing the MMO genre.

Yeah, because FotM is the only thing to do in the game. There’s nothing else to do, and if there is, it’s just as gated, segregated and problematic as FotM.
How about FotM, especially higher levels, being the equivalent of sPvP tournaments for the PvE folk? Aka, how about FotM being accessible to anyone, but ‘mastered’ and farmed only by the organised teams?

Accessibility should be based on your own skill and not artificial barrier (lfg, lfg, lfg).
Either completing level should unlock 2-3 levels (faster progression!) or some kind of fractal experience bar.

Well, they enforce players to group up in guilds rather than pug, and do things together, help guildies get to higher diff levels and so on. Not the worst thing.

drkn.3429:

Well, they enforce players to group up in guilds rather than pug, and do things together, help guildies get to higher diff levels and so on. Not the worst thing.

In my guild, where’s around 40-50 people online the same time, finding full party for FotM is still very hard. People who already got above lvl 10+ are running with each other, making the separation from the rest even more distinctive.

There are some ideas to run lower levels with guildies but let’s be real: this is not a solution to the problem. You can’t push all people up to your level so fast, this can take weeks or even months for people occasionally being online. Not to mention players who have just started playing GW2: who will be doing runs with them?

Another thing is players ARE FEELING BAD. We all want to experience game on the same rights, not feeling handicapped by the level factor, not being people whom you have to help getting through stuff because we can’t find party by ourselves. I believe many players feel exactly like this, that’s why there is so many topics criticising current mechanics of levels in FotM.

Levels should remain but they should not exclude so many people from teaming up with each other. I’m waiting for Anet’s solution to this problem.

Ivonbeton.6814:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Unifying-the-FotM-playerbase/first#post779585

I’m sorry to say, but on my server LA overflow practically doesn’t exist. This is a band-aid solution only for overpopulated servers, and quirky at best. When people choose a server they take “roots” and grow a community there, don’t expect people to transfer servers just to be able to play fractals.

Demosthene.2195:

Ivonbeton.6814:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Unifying-the-FotM-playerbase/first#post779585

I’m sorry to say, but on my server LA overflow practically doesn’t exist. This is a band-aid solution only for overpopulated servers, and quirky at best. When people choose a server they take “roots” and grow a community there, don’t expect people to transfer servers just to be able to play fractals.

I also enjoy the groups from my server more then the groups I get at overflow. Either because my server just has more friendly people with a sense of humour or I have just been unlucky with my overflow groups. But honestly, even when the run is going well, the overflow groups feel cold and all business and no fun.

That said, I do support cross server LFG and grouping. In fact, I just support getting a better LFG system period! That’s my wish for Winter’s Day! To paraphrase a Maria Carey Christmas song “All I want for Winter’s Day is a good dungeon LFG system!”

Amonde Daneren.2380:

Low level fractals are easy for a number of people. They want to play the higher levels were it’s more difficult, more challenging, more fun. sadly, despite having completed 44 fractals so far, I am still only on level 8, because of having to redo them OVER and OVER every time somebody has to leave or is unavailable.

Either take the time to wait to get into the group for your level fractal, or do a lower level fractal. You arent having to do anything.

zamrai.3784:

Another thing is players ARE FEELING BAD. We all want to experience game on the same rights, not feeling handicapped by the level factor, not being people whom you have to help getting through stuff because we can’t find party by ourselves. I believe many players feel exactly like this, that’s why there is so many topics criticising current mechanics of levels in FotM.

Levels should remain but they should not exclude so many people from teaming up with each other. I’m waiting for Anet’s solution to this problem.

What we would then get are new threads about people complaining how low level unprepared people who do not know the mechanics of the dungeons and asking what to do then get into 10+ lvl fractals.

I think there is merit in the suggestion of an “experience bar”.

I.e. if I successfully complete a fractal run at my level, I get upgraded to the next level per normal.

However, if I repeat lower level dungeons because of whatever reason, then I get “partial credit” and it take me X runs to get to the next level. Using myself as an example, this is how it might work.

I am level 6 now, to get to level 7 I have to either,

1. Run one successful run of one fractal chain (3 mini dungeons) at level 6

or

2. Run two successful run of one fractal chain at level 5

or

3. Run three successful run of one fractal chain at level 4

etc. This way, you stop people abusing the levels but just running lower level dungeons to get higher level fracs but also give people incentive to run lower levels without being stuck at a given level for want of a group.

HOWEVER

Jairlyn.1429:

zamrai.3784:

Another thing is players ARE FEELING BAD. We all want to experience game on the same rights, not feeling handicapped by the level factor, not being people whom you have to help getting through stuff because we can’t find party by ourselves. I believe many players feel exactly like this, that’s why there is so many topics criticising current mechanics of levels in FotM.

Levels should remain but they should not exclude so many people from teaming up with each other. I’m waiting for Anet’s solution to this problem.

What we would then get are new threads about people complaining how low level unprepared people who do not know the mechanics of the dungeons and asking what to do then get into 10+ lvl fractals.

Yep, this will happen people skip levels.

Dee Jay.2460:

The big joke though is that the increase in difficulty between level 2 and level 6 is barely noticeable. It’s just further artificial segregation of an already segregated player base.

I mean the only way you are going to progress through this Dungeon is by having the exact same people on at the exact same time, with no room for deviation…at which point you might as well be raiding.

What a poorly conceived concept, really.

What’s funny is that the system is actually much worse then raiding. In raiding you would keep a bench, would have people swapping around for various fights to maximize either their potential gain or your group’s performance. There was no problem taking a night off when raiding because of that bench and the spread out nature of gear based progression.

Can’t have a bench or any sort of variation in group composition under the current system unless the group wants to continually have to rerun previous content just to keep catching people up.

It’s just a really bad system the way they implemented it.

You know what would help alleviate this?

A LFG TOOL!

Please ANet add BACKFLAGGING. It is like they looked at Planes of Power and said “how could we make this worse?”

1-4: No backflagging drop
5-9: Small chance to drop a Back flagging token which handed in promotes the player to level 5. At level 9 you have a 100% chance to get a token. Grants players level 10 FoTM. Tradeable/sellable.
10-14: Small chance to drop token
15-19: Small chance to drop that grants level 15/100% at level 19. Grants players level 20 FoTM. Tradeable/sellable.

And so on

That way players can help guildies/buy their way up. I played on a server in another MMO that used a similar mechanic (Each Final Raid T2+ boss had a 50/50 shot of dropping a backflagging token to that tier). It helped smaller guilds VERY much.

This would drop from end boss chests ONLY.

It only takes me few minutes to get a group full. It could be a problem with your server. Also, different levels are a good idea as there’s constant challenge and advancing, also only the elite and skilled players will get to extremely higher level and those runs will actually be fun.

I think the best way to get around this, is by making it so even doing previous difficulties you are able to some how progress with your current difficulties. Throw in DR and that would stop farming.

hello…

This is how LA chat in our server (SoR) looks like. And this is on overflow. >_< I approve of the people saying that we need a dungeon finder/LFG tool. I also approve of those saying that it’s making grouping very difficult. Maybe reduce the level startification? I dunno… probably just make it four of them like – normal, heroic, elite, and inferno mode?

I was lucky enough to find nice people who knew how to play during my first run in FotM so not really feeling the pain… yet. I came into this game expecting a gear treadmill (albeit much less than the one from that game we used to play), so I suppose I’m looking at this from a diff perspective.