Guild Wars 2

It’s gonna be pretty tough to do AC spider queen with people having low dps in PUG groups.

No more carrying lowbies and “play how I want players” for now.

Don’t know what you mean, the spider queen is still pretty easy. You can still safely kill her with 3 people running dps meta assuming you bait the 1st venom spray but I am sure even that is not necessary. It’s the p2 part with Detha and the traps that concerns me when it comes to pugs in AC.

I’d hoped they fix some npc and end reward bugs. Oh well, lfg gear check inc!

For close to a year the spider queen was done by most pugs without stacking in that spot by the stairs. There will be a period of readjustment, but this is still quite doable for even barely adequate groups, especially given that there has been a nerf in the interim.

I want to know why is the very 1st dungeon in the game for NEW players that DONT even know game mechanics yet need to fight this spider boss?

Arah would be easier to show (1st boss speaking)

I’m pretty sure pugs can still do it. They might have to abandon stacking it though, for practicallity sake. Not that bad imo. Players who don’t know the fundamentals of why pros stack will be punished for it.

Ather.5091:

Don’t know what you mean, the spider queen is still pretty easy. You can still safely kill her with 3 people running dps meta assuming you bait the 1st venom spray but I am sure even that is not necessary. It’s the p2 part with Detha and the traps that concerns me when it comes to pugs in AC.

It’s supposed to be a level 35 dungeon
not a level 80 perfect berserker gear dungeon

Trevor Boyer.6524:

Ather.5091:

Don’t know what you mean, the spider queen is still pretty easy. You can still safely kill her with 3 people running dps meta assuming you bait the 1st venom spray but I am sure even that is not necessary. It’s the p2 part with Detha and the traps that concerns me when it comes to pugs in AC.

It’s supposed to be a level 35 dungeon
not a level 80 perfect berserker gear dungeon

But that’s how it is. Even going in at level 60 is half suicide.

I don’t understand it at all – what is the intention behind this buff?
Making the spider queen harder? Preventing players from stacking?
If so, why not buffing all bosses in this dungeon?
I mean we stack for kohler and the endboss in p1 and p3 too.

winterchillz.2564:

Trevor Boyer.6524:

Ather.5091:

Don’t know what you mean, the spider queen is still pretty easy. You can still safely kill her with 3 people running dps meta assuming you bait the 1st venom spray but I am sure even that is not necessary. It’s the p2 part with Detha and the traps that concerns me when it comes to pugs in AC.

It’s supposed to be a level 35 dungeon
not a level 80 perfect berserker gear dungeon

But that’s how it is. Even going in at level 60 is half suicide.

That’s exactly the argument in this and other threads about the same topic
These changes don’t effect level 80 10k APers with full ascended serk
They effect casual players with lesser gear/builds and lower leveled characters
Which is ridiculous considering it’s as hard as it is anyway when it’s labeled level 35

Trevor Boyer.6524:

They effect casual players with lesser gear/builds and lower leveled characters
Which is ridiculous considering it’s as hard as it is anyway when it’s labeled level 35

What I find interesting is that it is EXACTLY those very same casual players who have been requesting for the longest time that the Spider Queen use her Poison AoE in melee range.

Like:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Fixing-dung-corner-stacking-stats-problem/first#post4086725

Trevor Boyer.6524:

winterchillz.2564:

Trevor Boyer.6524:

Ather.5091:

Don’t know what you mean, the spider queen is still pretty easy. You can still safely kill her with 3 people running dps meta assuming you bait the 1st venom spray but I am sure even that is not necessary. It’s the p2 part with Detha and the traps that concerns me when it comes to pugs in AC.

It’s supposed to be a level 35 dungeon
not a level 80 perfect berserker gear dungeon

But that’s how it is. Even going in at level 60 is half suicide.

That’s exactly the argument in this and other threads about the same topic
These changes don’t effect level 80 10k APers with full ascended serk
They effect casual players with lesser gear/builds and lower leveled characters
Which is ridiculous considering it’s as hard as it is anyway when it’s labeled level 35

Well, they don’t really affect the level 60s either – they get wiped anyway.

When I started (at launch) there was no stacking, and yet we could still finish dungeons although it took a bit longer. Supposing the trait reset disadvantage and the mob rescaling advantage from the recent patches successfully negate each other, this dungeon should still be possible for a full lower level group if they know what they are doing, only now stacking at queen will not be possible for them since the DPS might be too low.

Perhaps you will be less likely to find a group, but I think this change is not dramatic enough to cause people that created unrestricted and unoptimized groups before to become very restrictive now. Those that really care about level etc. now would likely not have accepted lower level/undergeared players before patch either.

Ather.5091:

Don’t know what you mean, the spider queen is still pretty easy. You can still safely kill her with 3 people running dps meta assuming you bait the 1st venom spray but I am sure even that is not necessary. It’s the p2 part with Detha and the traps that concerns me when it comes to pugs in AC.

Pugs hardly do p2 in the first place.

Clyan.1593:

I don’t understand it at all – what is the intention behind this buff?
Making the spider queen harder? Preventing players from stacking?
If so, why not buffing all bosses in this dungeon?
I mean we stack for kohler and the endboss in p1 and p3 too.

People complained about the spider stack spot, not about Kholer’s or p1’s an p3’s end bosses.

xallever.1874:

Ather.5091:

Don’t know what you mean, the spider queen is still pretty easy. You can still safely kill her with 3 people running dps meta assuming you bait the 1st venom spray but I am sure even that is not necessary. It’s the p2 part with Detha and the traps that concerns me when it comes to pugs in AC.

Pugs hardly do p2 in the first place.

With the recent changes to crit chance and downlevelling, more and more pugs could do p2 as their dps was doubled.

I can hear the tears. The LFG already mostly asks for Zerk 80 (and gearcheck).

Trevor Boyer.6524:

Ather.5091:

Don’t know what you mean, the spider queen is still pretty easy. You can still safely kill her with 3 people running dps meta assuming you bait the 1st venom spray but I am sure even that is not necessary. It’s the p2 part with Detha and the traps that concerns me when it comes to pugs in AC.

It’s supposed to be a level 35 dungeon
not a level 80 perfect berserker gear dungeon

+1 b.c your know multi big 1 hit kill aoe skills casted in a small area over and over again is a good new play mechanic.

rojak.1894:

I’d hoped they fix some npc and end reward bugs.

Nope, Detha will still bug out p2 regularly.

Even if one doesn’t stack, she goes down only marginally later than usual. Went with a guildie and pugs and yolo’d the queen in the open. Stacked the hatchings though, they’re annoying then just gutted the queen in the open. She really needs to be made tougher. I remember going in early on after release with other low levels (back in the day when WHOA YOU’RE LEVEL 40! COME AC WITH US!) and got shredded. With 80’s a meta gear, there’s no challenge.

Azrael.4960:

Even if one doesn’t stack, she goes down only marginally later than usual. Went with a guildie and pugs and yolo’d the queen in the open. Stacked the hatchings though, they’re annoying then just gutted the queen in the open. She really needs to be made tougher. I remember going in early on after release with other low levels (back in the day when WHOA YOU’RE LEVEL 40! COME AC WITH US!) and got shredded. With 80’s a meta gear, there’s no challenge.

Try not to forget this is still level 30 dungeon. Im reasonably sure <nonmeta’d/unknowledgeable>low levels have their own problems with her.

Though perhaps scale to number of lvl 80’s in groups or something?

Pugging AC today was horrible. Joined a pug which was asking for “exp. fast run”.

Path 1, we wiped at the queen 4 times, I suggested doing it the normal way after our first wipe, because it was obvious that, even with 2 FGS, we couldn’t get the queen down in time. No response, still trying to stack. After the 3rd wipe, I got sick of it and changed skills (took endure pain and defiant stance). Was last man standing and barely got her down so we proceeded and finished.

P2, same group. We wiped at the queen again, but only 2 times (they thought it was a good idea to start the fight with just 3 people), then after Kholer it happend…

Someone in the group said, before the fight, that traps don’t work on the champ anylonger, but we should let our (definetly not a DPS) Guardian handle it, while we get rid of the small critters with the traps. Didn’t mind that at first, but then I was staring at the Guardian running circles, barely doing any damage with his staff and it took ages…
When I saw that it was at 80%, after approx. 2 minutes, and that we have killed enough gravelings (bar was full) I decided to jump down and help the guardian to get rid of the champ, since it has low HP anyways.
After finishing the Event in ~30 seconds (stupids knockdowns!! :c), they decided to kick me… for I was not doing what has been said before the fight. Leave it to the Guardian.

They told me I should’ve been sorry and stuff. I don’t know… I was infuriated and told them that they asked for experienced players and a “fast” run. I asked them if they really wanted to wait for 10 minutes untill the guard was done doing his dance. They told me I was a kittenbag, I called them scrubs and blocked them.

I understand getting booted for messing up a pull, or wasting time… like it happend to me when I started running dungeons, inexperienced as I was.
Getting kicked for speeding things up is definetly something I don’t want to experience again and it makes me wonder what the hell is wrong with some people.

This was the worst experience I had pugging AC for at least the past 10 month.

You did the wrong thing by joining groups that say “exp, fast”. Everybody knows post like “exp” “speed” “fast” “80s” all mean the same thing, because people join regardless of their experience/builds.
Speed and exp may mean something different for the person joining and the person making the group.

All I see in the LFG was

AC P1 for sale
AC P2 for sale
AC P3 for sale

Good job on the update anet.

Time for more pug related movie quotes!

This forum is afraid of us. I have seen its true face. The dungeon forums are extended gutters and the gutters are full of nerf threads and when the drains finally scab over, all the playhowiwants will drown. The accumulated filth of all their casualism will foam up about their waists and all the clerics and PVTers will look up and shout “Save us!”… and we’ll whisper “no.”

It won’t change much. The first will take a couple more second when i run with my guild. In pugs, i’ll bring my guardian and not my elementalist any more. That way, even with a bad pugs I can still solo the queen. Maybe i’ll practice a bit with my Ele to be able to solo her with that profession. Don’t know yet.

Endless Fluff.4657:

Pugging AC today was horrible. Joined a pug which was asking for “exp. fast run”.

Path 1, we wiped at the queen 4 times, I suggested doing it the normal way after our first wipe, because it was obvious that, even with 2 FGS, we couldn’t get the queen down in time. No response, still trying to stack. After the 3rd wipe, I got sick of it and changed skills (took endure pain and defiant stance). Was last man standing and barely got her down so we proceeded and finished.

P2, same group. We wiped at the queen again, but only 2 times (they thought it was a good idea to start the fight with just 3 people), then after Kholer it happend…

Someone in the group said, before the fight, that traps don’t work on the champ anylonger, but we should let our (definetly not a DPS) Guardian handle it, while we get rid of the small critters with the traps. Didn’t mind that at first, but then I was staring at the Guardian running circles, barely doing any damage with his staff and it took ages…
When I saw that it was at 80%, after approx. 2 minutes, and that we have killed enough gravelings (bar was full) I decided to jump down and help the guardian to get rid of the champ, since it has low HP anyways.
After finishing the Event in ~30 seconds (stupids knockdowns!! :c), they decided to kick me… for I was not doing what has been said before the fight. Leave it to the Guardian.

They told me I should’ve been sorry and stuff. I don’t know… I was infuriated and told them that they asked for experienced players and a “fast” run. I asked them if they really wanted to wait for 10 minutes untill the guard was done doing his dance. They told me I was a kittenbag, I called them scrubs and blocked them.

I understand getting booted for messing up a pull, or wasting time… like it happend to me when I started running dungeons, inexperienced as I was.
Getting kicked for speeding things up is definetly something I don’t want to experience again and it makes me wonder what the hell is wrong with some people.

This was the worst experience I had pugging AC for at least the past 10 month.

Wow, just joined P2 pug run. Exactly same thing. “Tank guard down, Wet use traps”.

Luckily my armor dazzled them so they didn’t see me killing it. That, or the Wall of Reflection the guard was using…

Laar.5476:

Time for more pug related movie quotes!

This forum is afraid of us. I have seen its true face. The dungeon forums are extended gutters and the gutters are full of nerf threads and when the drains finally scab over, all the playhowiwants will drown. The accumulated filth of all their casualism will foam up about their waists and all the clerics and PVTers will look up and shout “Save us!”… and we’ll whisper “no.”

I guess polygamy has to be a thing because I must marry you.

Lilith Ajit.6173:

Laar.5476:

Time for more pug related movie quotes!

This forum is afraid of us. I have seen its true face. The dungeon forums are extended gutters and the gutters are full of nerf threads and when the drains finally scab over, all the playhowiwants will drown. The accumulated filth of all their casualism will foam up about their waists and all the clerics and PVTers will look up and shout “Save us!”… and we’ll whisper “no.”

I guess polygamy has to be a thing because I must marry you.

Oh man lesbian polygamy, imagine the conservative outrage.

Edit: I am surprised that isn’t censored.

Laar.5476:

Lilith Ajit.6173:

Laar.5476:

Time for more pug related movie quotes!

This forum is afraid of us. I have seen its true face. The dungeon forums are extended gutters and the gutters are full of nerf threads and when the drains finally scab over, all the playhowiwants will drown. The accumulated filth of all their casualism will foam up about their waists and all the clerics and PVTers will look up and shout “Save us!”… and we’ll whisper “no.”

I guess polygamy has to be a thing because I must marry you.

Oh man lesbian polygamy, imagine the conservative outrage.

Glorious

My best friend will join us and it will be a triple threat. I saw on Google today they’re finalizing triple donor IVF so if we want kids were golden if they can somehow make one of us a man.

I didn’t even notice the P2 change as I always kill the champion anyway.

Died at the usual time of 90% of graveling bar.

And the puglings didn’t have an issue with queen either. Except they forgot to yolo after the spiderlings were dead so it was mostly a solo/duo deal.

Lilith Ajit.6173:

My best friend will join us and it will be a triple threat. I saw on Google today they’re finalizing triple donor IVF so if we want kids were golden if they can somehow make one of us a man.

I don’t know if the world is ready for these children.

Laar.5476:

Lilith Ajit.6173:

My best friend will join us and it will be a triple threat. I saw on Google today they’re finalizing triple donor IVF so if we want kids were golden if they can somehow make one of us a man.

I don’t know if the world is ready for these children.

You’re probably right. Too fashionable.

Ather.5091:

Don’t know what you mean, the spider queen is still pretty easy. You can still safely kill her with 3 people running dps meta assuming you bait the 1st venom spray but I am sure even that is not necessary. It’s the p2 part with Detha and the traps that concerns me when it comes to pugs in AC.

Not even that. Just get an ele and FGS it: instakill. Traps? Icebow, dead.

The change is nowhere near enough.

(And on a side note: FGS needs a fix, the wall stacking on #4 is just complete nonsense)

If your group has super-good DPS, stack her in the corner and melt her down. If your group does not or is too squishy to survive the stack, then kite her around the courtyard and range/melee her down according to your preferences.

Adapt to the situation as needed.

sorry i just did path one and two with three people in there their first time and your post made me lol

i think ive just been trolled and there was no change…. good one you got me

There are changes.

What we did was stack the same way for the spiderlings but once the Spider Queen came out, we ran into the room and free-style fought her.

She’s not hard without all the spiderling support.

Same here. The fight is way more fun in the open…and coordinated groups can still cheese/speed-clear her. Win-win.

I find this thread amusing.
OP: Lowbies and PHIWs will never be able to do this dungeon again!
Other poster: Actually, we beat her easy without stacking and it didn’t take much longer.

Honestly give it some time. The people who arent beating her are not on the forums yet. or rather they are sneaking in groups that are probably carrying them thus they are ok… for now.

As it stands I can think its a “reasonable” challenge for any 35-40 only group. Much less one that is fully new.

Pugged AC full runs every day since changed. (A p1 with 3 lowbies in team, under lvl 60) Wiped here and there (max twice the first time before realizing the changes) but always managed to kill Queen without many efforts. Sometimes it causes the fgs bursts to fail, can take a couple of minutes longer but still more than doable.

Don’t think I want to stack for this anymore, even with a good DPS group. I simply dislike being downed and losing my 15-20 stacks of bloodlust, all just for a couple of seconds quicker than fighting it on open area. Not worth it imo.

If you don’t care about kill speed, spider queen is actually really easy even with low dps. Just have to take out the flame turrets and little spiders first. Then, just go in with a ranged weapon and shoot her from 1 side of the room. For some reason, the spider queen doesn’t really move.

She only has 3 attacks: aoe poison, a melee bite, and a net thing, which she does in that order over and over. But since she doesn’t move, the melee bite and the net thing (which is pretty short range) don’t even matter. Just stand on one side (next to a wall helps reduce her aoe spread), and whittle her down. When she shines and shoots her aoe, take 2 steps and walk to the edge of it, and repeat. If the area around you is covered in aoe, walk to the other side of the room and repeat. But if you don’t move much, the aoe should overlap and there should always be free space around you.

A condition removal is nice if you get hit by the net. Remove after all the hits are done, or dodge right after remove, or you just get stuck again. Although, usually its very rare to ever be in range of the net, since she usually just sit there in the middle of the room doing nothing until her AOE is up again.

Not sure maybe its a bug? Make more sense for her to chase players around if they are out of range.

I found a useful tip on the spider queen for speed groups. This is only assuming if you have a ele for AC, which you should anyway, because it makes those run more smooth.

Try to kill off most of the spiderlings before the spider queen comes to the stack. At this point you should already have an ice bow ready to freeze her before she does her aoe. During the freeze, your group should be able to dps her without having to worry.

The only problem with this tactic is that if you pug, which I do often, there will always be a person that doesn’t listen and crowd control the spider queen anyway. UGH. I think it’s because they’re new to the game still and don’t know what cc/defiance does.

There should be an introduction to field/blast effects and cc/defiance tutorials for beginners. I don’t remember doing them if there were, but I do know I looked them up to learn about them.

kowolo.7619:

Make more sense for her to chase players around if they are out of range.

It does doesn’kitten

There’s a reason people here said ranging was easier.

edit: filter pls. wat you doin

I went in with my girlfriend last night as a duo, and I basically soloed the queen (she died when it was 90%) xD

So it’s very much possible to do this one, just range it, and it’ll range back. Only thing you need to do is to dodge the poison.

There’s just panic at the moment because PUG tactics need a change. They will change. PUG groups will then run fine with the new tactics. You never know, those tactics might actually involve some skill and knowledge from the players and that wouldn’t be the end of the world as we know it.

There’s always a panic. Most people don’t actually know kitten about how the dungeons work. They see a video or guide and try to replicate without ever trying to make it more efficient.

As someone who only ever PUGs due to a dead guild, I can say that all of my PUGs successfully killed the spider queen, so no, it’s not “the end of casuals”.

General scenario, with about 10 runs, including one with a party including only two lvl 80s, is:
-someone may insist that we stack, resulting in a “learning wipe”
-group engages queen in the open space, and if people stay out of AoE (sometimes problematic if the queen camps inside an AoE circle or if someone runs out of condition removal just when he gets immobilized in a circle) the queen generally dies with 1-2 defeated people.

Really, people on this board seem to mistake the idea that the meta way is the fastest way to do a dungeon with the misconception that it is the only way to finish one.

Also, it’s much more fun now.