Guild Wars 2

Post Quickness Nerf
Video I created to showcase some guardian dps. I know a lot of guardians probably have trouble getting into CoF speed clear groups. Perhaps this will enlighten some people. Not my fastest time, but fast none the less at 5:18.

Gate only:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcaLXVLUm88

I don’t get the point of showing the 1 guardian in the group. You got 3 warriors doing most of the dps and you as a guardian just bangwagoning on. You could have been a thief, ranger, necro etc and clear time wouldn’t have changed much. If you cleared it with 4 guardians + 1 mesmer in 5:18 minutes then I’ll be impressed.

Guardian’s dps has always been lackluster compared to warriors since they don’t inflict massive invulnerability + raw damage to boot in PVE.

Thanks for the vid! We do a 3 War/1 Mes/1 Guard set up quite frequently in P1 for fun, and it’s always been at the 6 min or under mark. In my opinion, other set ups can be faster, but it’s easier to manage condi removals/stability/might stacks/etc. I mean, if you got a really good group that doesn’t need that stuff, then 4 War/ 1 Mes or other set ups can be faster.

ya i mean, if you can show 4 guardian 1 memser and do comparible time etc etc… i can agree but i don’t think you can.

The main thing is those banner, vulnerability stack, might stack. Guardian can do might stack but they can only do it using staff with empowered while not attacking.

What it really shows is 3 warrior isn’t too much diff from 4 warrior since they get enough might/fury/banner/vulnerability stack.

My friend is actually a guardian, and rightfully so there isn’t too much a diff between 1 guardian/3warrior/1 memser group compare to 4 warrior/1 memser. But that is mainly because you only need 2 banner, and there’s enough vulnerability/might stack.

Its generally understood Guardian DPS is good, but warrior is better. If a warrior is going to fail his WW against the wall, interrupt his 100b before it hits etc… then sure a guardian will be better. But a good war will always be faster. Also most guardians play “Cleric/Bunker” Guard. Its semi – rare to find a good zerk guard

Forestgreen.7981:

I don’t get the point of showing the 1 guardian in the group. You got 3 warriors doing most of the dps and you as a guardian just bangwagoning on. You could have been a thief, ranger, necro etc and clear time wouldn’t have changed much. If you cleared it with 4 guardians + 1 mesmer in 5:18 minutes then I’ll be impressed.

Guardian’s dps has always been lackluster compared to warriors since they don’t inflict massive invulnerability + raw damage to boot in PVE.

I would like to see that. I am sure that is a faster time than some 4 warrior groups. Point is, most people like you can’t see outside the box. I am sure 4 guardians + 1 mes could do that time, but its hard to find 4 good fully zerked out guardians. Not saying a guardian can out dps every warrior(some yes ^ ^ ), but if you spec them right, and with buffs, it could be a smoother/faster run with one in your party.

laokoko.7403:

ya i mean, if you can show 4 guardian 1 memser and do comparible time etc etc… i can agree but i don’t think you can.

The main thing is those banner, vulnerability stack, might stack. Guardian can do might stack but they can only do it using staff with empowered while not attacking.

What it really shows is 3 warrior isn’t too much diff from 4 warrior since they get enough might/fury/banner/vulnerability stack.

My friend is actually a guardian, and rightfully so there isn’t too much a diff between 1 guardian/3warrior/1 memser group compare to 4 warrior/1 memser. But that is mainly because you only need 2 banner, and there’s enough vulnerability/might stack.

Actually guardian can get 3 stacks of might from activating virtue of justice if trait correctly. As well as get stacks of might every second for every crit attack, if trait ed right. Both while attacking of course.

^ I actually bothered to retrait my guardian to test that. Is that buff a party buff? only seem to last 5 second or less?

Quite honestly I don’t know. I think maybe just maybe if every guardian use save yourself, you can maintain fury stack. For might stack I think it is a bit tough to maintain 25 stack, and you also need to maintain 25 stack of vulnerability.

“But” I think the reality is warrior does do it faster. But really there is only 2 times you are dps checked so that probably won’t matter that much. Even if warrior can do it faster, really by how much? less than 1 minutes if even that? I think the thing is any class could potentially speed run cof, just a “tiny” slower.

The problem is just about everyone have alt, and people just use warrior since that is the fastest class to do it. I actually ran with a guardian friend, and we did like 5-10 hours a day cof run, untill he get a warrior alt and he use that after.

laokoko.7403:

Quite honestly I don’t know. I think maybe just maybe if every guardian use save yourself, you can maintain fury stack. For might stack I think it is a bit tough to maintain 25 stack, and you also need to maintain 25 stack of vulnerability.

I think the boons you get from Save Yourself apply to the shouter only. If all Guardians were Charr they could probably manage to keep Fury up with the racial skill Battle Roar.

Keeping up the 25 stacks of might shouldn’t be too much of a problem with the Might on Critical Hits trait and all four Guardians using the staff secondary. That way Empower could be chained.

Cheers.

What build are you running? 15/25/0/20/10?

Nice one at the gate controller. Even faster than some warriors doing it.

Altered Dimension.2834:

Post Quickness Nerf
Video I created to showcase some guardian dps. I know a lot of guardians probably have trouble getting into CoF speed clear groups. Perhaps this will enlighten some people. Not my fastest time, but fast none the less at 5:18.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPTcE5MXjGY

Just to debunk a few things in this post. The timer started when the door busted down, not when the dungeon was initiated.Your real time would be more like 5:55.
I could easily notice the foundry defense took 3-4 seconds longer to kill.
Slave driver was notably slower. If you can’t kill slavedriver in 1 timewarp than your dps is low.
For 25 stacks of might from signet of inspiration, you were also quite slow. According to your youtube timer, it took you 8 seconds. Post quickness nerf a warrior can kill gate controller within 3.5-4 seconds.
Your effigy was also slower than normal.
Guardians don’t come evan close to the raw DPS of warriors.

jul.7602:

Altered Dimension.2834:

Post Quickness Nerf
Video I created to showcase some guardian dps. I know a lot of guardians probably have trouble getting into CoF speed clear groups. Perhaps this will enlighten some people. Not my fastest time, but fast none the less at 5:18.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPTcE5MXjGY

Just to debunk a few things in this post. The timer started when the door busted down, not when the dungeon was initiated.Your real time would be more like 5:55.
I could easily notice the foundry defense took 3-4 seconds longer to kill.
Slave driver was notably slower. If you can’t kill slavedriver in 1 timewarp than your dps is low.
For 25 stacks of might from signet of inspiration, you were also quite slow. According to your youtube timer, it took you 8 seconds. Post quickness nerf a warrior can kill gate controller within 3.5-4 seconds.
Your effigy was also slower than normal.
Guardians don’t come evan close to the raw DPS of warriors.

As a rule of thumb for dungeon run timer, no one times it when you step in the dungeon, most time it when the gate busts down -.-. We’re not timing if you can bug ferrah or how long it takes for members to enter the dungeon. Like mentioned not the fastest run. Slave driver is normally killed prior to tw ending, think it was due to me casting tome of wrath, to drop zealots fevor, rather than attacking when tw was already up(not knowing if tw was on CD).

Gate time like mentioned depends on if quickness activates on my weapon, then I could do it in about 3 seconds, and it was 6 seconds from when I hit it to when it got destroyed on that one. A video of me just doing gate in 5.3seconds(ive had faster) for the Mr. Debunker.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcaLXVLUm88

All depends on RNG, crits ect. Still faster than most wars i’ve seen, even without quickness activating :P.

When you run fast, mesmers TW will ususally be on CD for slave driver anyway, which is when guardians zealots fervor comes in handy, another full party quickness + fury.

Some people will always be critics or biased. Those are the people that will always stick to the meta. For all the others-

Point of this video is:
When I first started farming CoF, I had trouble getting into groups, as most were stuck in the 4 war 1 mes META. I would get kicked, and common reason would be, we get 5 min runs with 4 wars. I rarely pug now, but this could show other guardians it can be done, or change a farming groups mind, on giving them a chance, if a 5 min run is good enough for you that is.

I absolutely agree with you. In my opinion, as long as the end result is 5 tokens, then I could care less what the group set up is. A Guild friend of mine can burn down the gate controller extremely fast with his necro, and It’s always fun to see the words, “I’ve never seen a necro kill the gate so fast” pop up in the chat box.

Everyone has their right to run whatever group they desire, however. I won’t agrue against the standard 4 War/1 Mes group since that’s your prerogative to do whatever you want. But I appreciate other group set ups (Like your 3 War/1 Mes/1 Guard) that are able to clear P1 efficiently and fast.

jul.7602:

For 25 stacks of might from signet of inspiration, you were also quite slow. According to your youtube timer, it took you 8 seconds. Post quickness nerf a warrior can kill gate controller within 3.5-4 seconds.
Your effigy was also slower than normal.
Guardians don’t come evan close to the raw DPS of warriors.

Slower by how much?

The quickest cof boss kill I’m in kill slave driver in 12 second with no time warp, and effigy in 10 second pre quicknesss nerf neglecting the 2 second warbanner cast time.

Even if a group kill 2 times slower. They are really slower by 20 second. Now if you include the beginning turret part, acolyte kill, gate, you won’t be slowed by anything more than 1 minutes. That is presuming you kill 2 times slower compare to a warrior.

Altered Dimension.2834:

Post Quickness Nerf
Video I created to showcase some guardian dps. I know a lot of guardians probably have trouble getting into CoF speed clear groups. Perhaps this will enlighten some people. Not my fastest time, but fast none the less at 5:18.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPTcE5MXjGY

Gate only:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcaLXVLUm88

You’d need a full group of guardians and a mesmer to get your point across.

What I find sad about this entire thread is how many of you are placing speed over fun. I’d rather run this with a suboptimal pug that’s easy-going than with OCD speedrunners that obsess over every second.

Crossplay.2067:

What I find sad about this entire thread is how many of you are placing speed over fun. I’d rather run this with a suboptimal pug that’s easy-going than with OCD speedrunners that obsess over every second.

Most people find speed fun.

When doing things mindless and easy that you have done hundreds of times, trying to run as fast as possible which requires organization and teamwork is what keeps people interested and challenged.

There’s a reason there is competition in every aspect of life, from eSports, normal sports, even random activities like eating, speed runs of single player games on youtube, etc. People like competition, like improving, like seeing how fast they can do things, etc. If this stuff wasn’t fun, it wouldn’t exist.

What I find sad is you don’t realize this and think everyone finds it fun to be slow, “easy-going”, and doesn’t like to improve/compete. I also find it sad that you think speed runs are mutually exclusive from fun, while most people who actually do speed run dungeons find that is the only fun part of dungeons left and is the main reason they still run them. For many people, an inefficient pug would be less fun then trying to speed run.

The only way a guardian is worth it is if all 3 warriors are running 20/25/0/10/15 (tactics for +damage per boon). You will never come across this scenario in pugs. 4 war/1 mes is still by far the best currently. Either way though its fairly neglibile as we’re talking the difference of 30-60 seconds a clear on average between the group setups.

ya just want to extend on Strifey said. I played a game where dungeon is timed and have a leaderboard on who can complete dungeon the fastest. And I can honestly say I had a blast trying to compete for fastest dungeon completion.

That being said I doubt it’ll ever happen in this game. If there ever is, you just get outcry from people complaining about class balance.

That being said, we are really having this conversaion because in this game, people grind for gold. In other games, I usually won’t run the same dungeon more than 20 times. Boss in other games drop loot or have tokens which I can buy gear with. And usually 20 times is enough to get everything I need in those dungeon.

In this game, where you grind for gold, you’ll be keep doing the same dungeon over and over again till they release the expansion.

Crossplay.2067:

What I find sad about this entire thread is how many of you are placing speed over fun. I’d rather run this with a suboptimal pug that’s easy-going than with OCD speedrunners that obsess over every second.

because your definition of fun is what we all should conform to?

even mario had speed runs

There is an old saying in pro-cycling, “the riders make the race,” which means no matter how hard or easy the race course is, if the riders are aggressive or relaxed that’s how the race will be or vice versa.

This applies to dungeon runs in gw2: if the dungeon is super hard people will compete to do it first or cleanest or fastest. If the dungeon is super easy, people will compete to do it fastest or solo. It’s the players who create the competitive environment. People voted with their feet in games like this, and the verdict is in as to what the majority prefer.

Slightly tangential, but can someone link me one of these Warrior builds? My guard feels a bit lacking in dungeons.

Oyjord.2508:

Slightly tangential, but can someone link me one of these Warrior builds? My guard feels a bit lacking in dungeons.

I like 30/25/0/0/15. It give you the flexibility to use axe or greatsword.

For greatsword build I use (5,9,3), (5,10), (5)

For Axe I use (5, 8, 10), (5, 1), (5)

I think being full time axe is probably the best way to max dps. Especially for cof because you can use both sigil of night and sigil of smothering. And usually you can kill the boss in 1 time warp. So you can just use on my mark and spam 1 on axe without using other vulnerability skill which might slow your dps.

The fastest cof group I’ve seen finish slave driver in 12 second without timewarp. And final boss in 1 timewarp pre quickness nerf. I never seen any group do it faster.

I really hope the OP or some other guardian can post their trait for dps build.