Hello,
I’ve just noticed if I go higher level fractals then more people kill bosses at range, because there boss can one shot your character. So in that case ranger seems to have pretty large advantage over other classes, because of superior ranged damage.
What are your thoughts ?
I know that somebody will say that every class is even, but when i see that only way to do boss is ranged in most situation, so its logical that ranger is strongest ranged class, am I right?
Well, rangers don’t really have superior ranged damage (staff ele ftw).
Ranged is a tactic often used if you’re incapable of melee’ing which many PUG groups or weaker groups fall into. Personally there are some bosses I still have trouble meleeing >.< but yeah Melee is still better than range.
Curious what bosses you are referring to though? In a Meta group a guard should be able to block tank Mossman/archdiviner long enough to have the rest of the group burn them down, it’s only when you run with unorganized groups or bad players that you really have to back out to range.
Only eles have high ranged damage. You can melee every boss in fractals but many groups prefer ranging everything because it is a lot easier and you don’t need to do much.
learn to dodge and stay in melee to actually deal damage
yeah you get me wrong… I’m not sayin I wasn’t meele or I can’t dodge, All I’m sayin that I often only meele in random party, so I’m forced to use ranged weapon because my build is not tanky, to not die as only target for a boss
Curious what bosses you are referring to though? In a Meta group a guard should be able to block tank Mossman/archdiviner long enough to have the rest of the group burn them down, it’s only when you run with unorganized groups or bad players that you really have to back out to range.
Yeah mossman is that example, literally I almost never fight him with meele group, except underwater bug
It gets really annoying to melee in pug groups. I dont do anything but melee except if im on ele and even then i go into melee range to stack might and to kite the boss. But yeah in unorganized groups where everyone is ranging it can be risky to melee because the boss can change aggro pretty quickly so you have to pay attention. Also on bosses like archdiviner and shaman that have projectiles the stupid guards in pugs will put reflects where it benefits them and not the party….. so you will have little to no support in melee range
learn to dodge and stay in melee to actually deal damage
yeah you get me wrong… I’m not sayin I wasn’t meele or I can’t dodge, All I’m sayin that I often only meele in random party, so I’m forced to use ranged weapon because my build is not tanky, to not die as only target for a boss
When I pug and they range, I still melee and live. Except mossman, where I basically always play it safe. Bosses usually cleave/aoe so it doesn’t matter how many people stand at him – everyone has to dodge anyway. I don’t range lupicus if pugs in my party do.
Curious what bosses you are referring to though? In a Meta group a guard should be able to block tank Mossman/archdiviner long enough to have the rest of the group burn them down, it’s only when you run with unorganized groups or bad players that you really have to back out to range.
Yeah mossman is that example, literally I almost never fight him with meele group, except underwater bug
yeah most pugs or weaker groups (honestly most of mine, he’s a pain) range him, though if you send in the guard first (and wearing some toughness gear helps) you can do a block rotation on him and burn him down quick. I’ve seen a few guys do it excellently, though personally I’m not quite there on my guard. Melee again is ideal, whether you can pull it off or not is another question.
I also have a 2 engi group that rocks his world, ohh billy that silly shirtless boy (immob is a strong tool in fractals).
Both methods are viable. I prefer to melee. This is because I run guardian (Zerk-AH Hammer) and know when to dodge/aegis/imob,etc, but ranging a boss isn’t bad either.
This is for Bosses as they do hit pretty high and there’s no negatives with ranging it out and doing constant DPS instead of going down / dying from that one boss hit that you don’t dodge fast enough / not aegis blocked / run out of vigor, etc.
Just don’t be that guy who camp’s a freaking Rifle/Longbow on warrior while fighting trash mobs and the like.
You should be happy in fractals bosses don’t hit behind their backs with their melee swings like that kitten boss from honor of the waves path 1. Now that’s what I call ridiculous.
So if you want to melee, just get behind the boss, you know you’ll have to dodge whenever his back is not facing you.
Of course sometimes it can be hard to hug the back of the boss because some morons see it fit to run circles around the boss turning him around.
I melee in pugs, but if the guardian in party isn’t enabling the party to do this safely with proper aegis use, I switch to Gaurdian so team can melee. I don’t mess with captain ashm after 50% though unless I am warrior with high vitality.
It honestly doesn’t matter if you are in pug or not, if group does front and follow, you can melee. Person with aggro back straife max melee everyone else follow max melee. Range is very situational and almost never ideal. Even for a boss like fire shaman, one person needs to melee at least to make the fight easier for group.
PS there are plenty of times people have gotten me killed on arch diviner from range spam during reflect, sometimes it is your fault.
It gets really annoying to melee in pug groups. I dont do anything but melee except if im on ele and even then i go into melee range to stack might and to kite the boss. But yeah in unorganized groups where everyone is ranging it can be risky to melee because the boss can change aggro pretty quickly so you have to pay attention. Also on bosses like archdiviner and shaman that have projectiles the stupid guards in pugs will put reflects where it benefits them and not the party….. so you will have little to no support in melee range
At the same time melee is way more fun!
Thats solely a l2p issue, and can be said for any profession in a pug group. I find most pug players can’t be bothered to optimize their traits and utilities based on the upcoming fight. They would rather be lazy and put on sub optimal gear,traits and utilize utilities that benefit themselves over others. Forget about switching food/potions for specific encounters. Thats the “joy” of pugging.
Someone in your party using ranged auto ends up knocking off your aegis right before you get hit by hammer and you were planning on just soaking it.
…..Why are you placing any trust on pugs at all?
I had a pug that insisted not only that i switch from mesmer to ele if I didn’t want to get kicked, which out of expediency I did, but demanded after that my ele use food on a pitiful fractal 40. I called the bluff.
Needless to say we got to volcanic fractal and urban battleground and said people were eating the dirt 24/7, just standing in place as the ascalonian warriors charged them because they think hiding behind a pillar absolves them of preemptively dodging. But nope, they were sure it was that lack of food that was holding them back and not constantly eating fire shaman arrows or getting downed by warrior charges or Ashym’s flame burst.
see i strongly disagree with this. It last 3 second. Maybe you should just back out. And you can position yourself not in between person ranging.
The way I see it is, if you die, doesn’t matter how bad the group is, it’s always the dead person’s fault.
If you are truly pro, you should be able to melee regardless how bad your group is.
Whatever your level, you can’t always melee regardless of your group. You can melee most, but not all boss. Mossman can be melee with a good group, but if you have a bad group, the dps will be so low, the fight so long, that you probably won’t have enough active defence to go through the fight. Maybe a really really good player with some energy sigil and vigor, but the vast majority of players won’t be able. In dungeon, I don’t really see any boss where this apply, they can all be soloed. But in fractal, there a couple of them that are not really solo able.
But you are right. It’s always the fault of the dead guy. If you know what you do, you should figure out the level of your party and change your tactic accordingly. If you are alone meleing the Mosman and the boss don’t drop fast enough, you should back in range before you die. If you stay in melee, the fault is not on your party (except if you ask for melee only or something like that in the LFG description).
Ranging isn’t better DPS than meleeing unless you’re an ele, but you should play however you’re comfortable as. Just make sure that depending on which that is, you are not imposing yourself on your group.
If you’re with people that want the group to all be together, do so. If you are with people that want everyone to spread out and range then do so. Respect LFG wishes!
Someone in your party using ranged auto ends up knocking off your aegis right before you get hit by hammer and you were planning on just soaking it.
I know your pain. I pretty much have to range archy second fight in pugs because this always happens. I’m not good enough to rely on dodges alone for this fight.
If your whole party ranging then even staff ele isn’t necessarily that good. Most likely the boss is moving around a lot so will not be staying in your Lava Fonts, greatly reducing your DPS.
I would always melee even if my pug is ranging. For parts of the fight where you don’t have agro you can just stay behind the boss and there is little danger to you, he will mostly be chasing other players so won’t even attack that much unless he has a ranged attack. If the boss stops moving thats a good indicator he’s going to attack so just dodge as soon as he stops. If you have agro then you want to keep the boss crippled or chilled, you can then just keep backing off him while hitting at maz melee range and he won’t be able to attack back unless the gap is closed.
Ranger is not the strongest ranged class, Elementalist is. And fractals are meleeable.
PSA: Flame Axes outdamage Frost Bows on the whole with the exception of FB4. If you’re using FB 4, you should use it and drop it if your sustained DPS is high (staff). If your sustained DPS is low (scepter), you should camp FA instead, then drop in your high bursts in between FAs.
I’ve seen so many Elementalists using Frost Bow’s autoattacks on bosses with no idea why the Frost Bow is used.
Ranger is not the strongest ranged class, Elementalist is. And fractals are meleeable.
PSA: Flame Axes outdamage Frost Bows on the whole with the exception of FB4. If you’re using FB 4, you should use it and drop it if your sustained DPS is high (staff). If your sustained DPS is low (scepter), you should camp FA instead, then drop in your high bursts in between FAs.
I’ve seen so many Elementalists using Frost Bow’s autoattacks on bosses with no idea why the Frost Bow is used.
Don’t forget to use FB3 for the chill, especially on lvl 38 >.<
Ranger is not the strongest ranged class, Elementalist is. And fractals are meleeable.
PSA: Flame Axes outdamage Frost Bows on the whole with the exception of FB4. If you’re using FB 4, you should use it and drop it if your sustained DPS is high (staff). If your sustained DPS is low (scepter), you should camp FA instead, then drop in your high bursts in between FAs.
I’ve seen so many Elementalists using Frost Bow’s autoattacks on bosses with no idea why the Frost Bow is used.
Can i ask why you are even slotting flame axe in the first place? Why not LH? or better yet use D/F? Being stuck on scepter is not a valid excuse in my eyes. Theres no reason to take your scepter into combat.
Don’t forget to use FB3 for the chill, especially on lvl 38 >.<
LOL…oh man i always forget not to
The Deep Freeze is the one that catches a lot of people I’ve noticed… honestly I didn’t know till someone mentioned it in a run a while ago and then a lot of things made sense.
And, on my engi…. so hard to NOT use freeze grenade.
Don’t forget to use FB3 for the chill, especially on lvl 38 >.<
LOL…oh man i always forget not to
I will never understand why people do 38s for daily. 40 instability is the same as 50s, and the instability on 37 literally does nothing. Might as well not be an instability at all.
Honestly I have no idea why we ever do 38, but we generally do it when we have someone who can’t do 40’s yet because of AR and is still leveling up their reward level.
Looking at the list I still need to do a lot of the levels as I simply haven’t done them. Did a 46 the other day and that was actually pretty fun.
Honestly I have no idea why we ever do 38, but we generally do it when we have someone who can’t do 40’s yet because of AR and is still leveling up their reward level.
Looking at the list I still need to do a lot of the levels as I simply haven’t done them. Did a 46 the other day and that was actually pretty fun.
37 is the answer. The instability is “No effect, except Mai Trin regenerates an insignificant amount of health in the cannon phase”.
Ranger is not the strongest ranged class, Elementalist is. And fractals are meleeable.
PSA: Flame Axes outdamage Frost Bows on the whole with the exception of FB4. If you’re using FB 4, you should use it and drop it if your sustained DPS is high (staff). If your sustained DPS is low (scepter), you should camp FA instead, then drop in your high bursts in between FAs.
I’ve seen so many Elementalists using Frost Bow’s autoattacks on bosses with no idea why the Frost Bow is used.
Why use flame axe…?
Just use IB 4, 3, and deep freeze depending on whether or not there’s defiance, then drop. No need to use flame axe.
Flame axe has the advantage of being a total hipster ele weapon, as the summon that nobody ever uses, and is wayyy better for style points than the mainstream ice bow.
Why most of you says that ranger isn’t that good as Ele for single target? I agree with that Ice Bow (not Frost Bow) deals massive damage with Ice Storm, but it ends here with huge CD. While ranger have every 8s ~15k dmg and auto attack deals over 3k dmg every 3/4 sec without might buffs ! while ele on same zerker build deals ~3k every 1s and include lava ~2,5k every 1,3s but boss rarelly stand in one place to deal full damage from lava when you are in ranged team
Why most of you says that ranger isn’t that good as Ele for single target? I agree with that Ice Bow (not Frost Bow) deals massive damage with Ice Storm, but it ends here with huge CD. While ranger have every 8s ~15k dmg and auto attack deals over 3k dmg every 3/4 sec without might buffs ! while ele on same zerker build deals ~3k every 1s and include lava ~2,5k every 1,3s but boss rarelly stand in one place to deal full damage from lava when you are in ranged team
u
wot
m8
A remnant of times past.
“Memories are nice, but that’s all they are.”
It gets annoying playing with other melee pretend to be though
If you die melee, it’s not because other people is ranging. You are just not as good as you think you are.
I don’t mind people melee and die. But it get annoying when the person die complain about other people ranging.
This is wrong.
Melee depends a lot on dps. Most builds have limited tools to survive in melee.
So if you want melee and your ranger insists on using his LB at max range, you might actually die because your melee squad ran out of cooldowns before the boss ran out of HP thanks to your ranger ruining your dps.
Then again both the melee and the range guys are at fault.
But its not like you can go “not my problem” if your group dies because of (your) low dps.
It can be said both ways. If you see half of the group range while you melee, be prepared: you’re on your own! Every hit that kills you is due to your mistakes. If you argue that because someone ranges that you automatically hold aggro then haven’t you got carried this whole time in a full melee group? Experienced solo-ers melee but they kite A LOT when their defensive skills are on CD. Melee doesn’t mean stand still and ignorantly running through your favorite rotation.
It’s unrealistic to rely on pug to be as good and efficient as elite guilds. So I either improve myself, or just choose the easiest way to solve the problem. That said, I do give melee a couple of try before giving up and range.
Besides ele, engi, mesmer have good ranged dps, while ranger, guardian, warrior are also decent.
“Raids are like fortune cookies. You eat the cookie and then read the paper scraps.”
It can be said both ways. If you see half of the group range while you melee, be prepared: you’re on your own! Every hit that kills you is due to your mistakes. If you argue that because someone ranges that you automatically hold aggro then haven’t you got carried this whole time in a full melee group? Experienced solo-ers melee but they kite A LOT when their defensive skills are on CD. Melee doesn’t mean stand still and ignorantly running through your favorite rotation.
It’s unrealistic to rely on pug to be as good and efficient as elite guilds. So I either improve myself, or just choose the easiest way to solve the problem. That said, I do give melee a couple of try before giving up and range.
Besides ele, engi, mesmer have good ranged dps, while ranger, guardian, warrior are also decent.
Deaths are my fault, but if I take a reflected fireball to the face I’m sure to give a dirty look their way, though I’d be lying if I said I was never that guy who failed to swap out of rifle fast enough on archdiviner’s reflect phase and shot some people
Only eles have high ranged damage. You can melee every boss in fractals but many groups prefer ranging everything because it is a lot easier and you don’t need to do much.
not true an engineer can keep up with staff ele and when you combine the big bomb kit cooldowns which are well placed (using grenades while moving into range) u can then blast the target.
bomb kits having 300 range with trait meens u can still stay out of melee range of the boss. still hit the boss. be in range of banners and still get all boons from the group.
its all about knowing the fight and your class and how to maximize your dps while minimizing dmg taken from bosses / avoiding attacks.
stacking works well in normal 5 mans. but a lot of the time spreading out a little while still being in range of boons is nice for certain bosses.
unless you run highly organised groups with voice chat. that’s a different story. but for the vast majority of groups its just standard tacs.
It depends on the group. Even decent groups just dont care enough to risk being constantly 1 shot by a few bosses in fractals.
That said.. if everyone in your group is going to melee, you should try do what your group does. It usually indicates everyone else is good enough to make it happen and you dun wanna be the weak link :P
That said, said, fractals have lots of stuff (specially higher lvl) that’ll 1 shot you, are a bit harder to predict or recover from if you die, so while its obviously not more dps, its just safer. Certain bosses are just better off playing it safe on than trying to shave 10-20 seconds off your total run.
(immob is a strong tool in fractals).
, though I’d be lying if I said I was never that guy who failed to swap out of rifle fast enough on archdiviner’s reflect phase and shot some people