Guild Wars 2

As in the title, I am wondering how you can ever possibly get into raiding unless you have been doing so from the very start.
Even for the Vale Guardian groups now demand 25+ insights and an eternal title.
I supported raids when they were announced, and I still do.
But I am currently losing hope of ever being able to get into a party reliably.
I do not have a ton of insights, nor do I have the eternal title.
In the current situation, that means no party will ever take me, with most even flaming and shaming me upon joining ( EU server).

Currently I feel like I have almost exhausted all options available to me.
People only want experienced players, but how do you even get experience if nobody is willing to help new people get into raids at all?

I have tried to join parties while being honest.
result: got flamed and kicked.

Tried several guilds who claimed to have a raiding presence among other pve things.
result:Raiders sticked together and only laughed at new people in the guildchat, making fun of them while linking their raid shinies.

Tried raid roster guilds.
result:Only form parties with eternal title and 25+ insights at minimum.

Joined guilds that train/teach raids.
result: Rarely see a run forming, if ever.

Also tried making my own parties.
result: people leaving the second they see people who needed a bit of explanation or unable to link the desired amount of insights or if the party composition is not 100% to their liking, or people who do not want to take suggestions.

After a while, raid wing 2 came out, and a lot of people claimed that that would be the perfect point to get into raiding. So I went out there again.

But once again, the people forming parties demanded eternal title and 30+ insights or even more.
Doesn’t matter, people said, they just want their experienced buddies with them for a first kill, new people will get their chance afterwards!
I am still waiting for that chance, since all parties for wing 2 also demand massive amounts of insights and usually eternal title and killproofs as well.

I have basically been trying since day 1, not saying no to any party or any attempt.
After all this time, I got 9 insights to show for it.
9.
From wing 1, in all this time.
I have never even got the chance to try out wing 2, every time I try and be honest about my insights I get so many profanities and insults at my head it is not even funny and makes me actually afraid to join anything at all.

Do I really have to pay precursor-level prices to get into a raid or straight up lie to people about insights and experience, just to set foot inside of the raid wings?
I am not an idiot, willing to learn, and generally won’t make the same mistake twice.

I really do not blame raiders for wanting to play with those who know their stuff, but please do realise that the entry barrier into raids for people without dedicated raiding guilds is being made very high this way.

It seems like you are either a dedicated high end pve raider with a raiding guild and a big friendslist, or you are a filthy casual who doesn’t care.
But the middleground, people like me who can do it if gotten the chance, are willing to man up and train to ‘git gud’, it seems like we will not get that chance.

I am sure a lot of people will claim otherwise and will tell about their weekly pug succes-stories, but I am really starting to lose hope.

idk man, about 40% of the pugs I’ve joined had 1-2 people who didn’t know the fight
and even if you haven’t done it before, you can still read a guide and watch a few videos and know what to do

I know the feeling, I came back to the game just over a month ago and wanted to try the raids, it was very difficult getting groups at the start but fortunately a raid training guild got me my first couple of kills. I then got more confidence and pugged vg, gorseval and slothasor whenever there were lfg’s that didn’t specify li’s (from my experience there were plenty). Importantly I did this more than just once a week for the kill as I loved raids and so got a lot of experience with those bosses even with a relatively low amount of insights. Eventually on Mondays I joined full wing 1 runs which always went super smooth until sabetha and so people were willing to be patient with me on sabetha due to my performance earlier in the raid. Similarly now I’ve got to the stage where I can kill trio and matthias too and expect to kill all 6 bosses every week. My legendary insights? 20 and I’ve never had to lie about them.

Basically my advice to you is a) have more than one class that is able to raid with as much ascended gear as possible b) regularly check lfg whenever waiting around in lions arch etc. c) Start with a couple of bosses and actually learn the fights properly to the point where you can carry inexperienced players (I still join training runs to help out).

To be honest you’ve already past the biggest hurdle imo, just sneak another li and pugging past 10li will open more doors. Don’t give up, I know it can be disheartening!

Don’t PUG.

In general, doing any group content in any game ever with a PUG is a less accessible experience than finding a group of like minded players with similar interests.

Your mistake is attempting to treat content designed for static groups of players as content designed for PUGs. The fact that people PUG raids doesn’t mean they were designed for it.

Raids really are designed for players that take the same or nearly the same group of ten individuals, learn the encounters together, and progress on to the next encounter. They were designed that way because its a subset of the community (progression/mechanics endgame PvE) that GW2 was previously not creating content for.

The redesign for fractals and subsequent removal of plans for future dungeons is the PvE content they have designed around PUGs. They’re short, bite-sized instances where you’re not overly inconvenienced be someone leaving or needing to kick people.

It’s hard to PUG raid simply because the entire concept of raiding as a style of PvE play is about as anti-PUG as you can get.

Have you exhausted the idea that it may be you? Maybe you’re not a good or experienced player (Not assuming you are or anything but I had a very easy time getting in to raids with little-no experience). And a really good and very underrated idea imo is if you want to look like a good or experienced player, look like one. Equip all the shinies you have on your character so people know you haven’t just hit lvl 80.

Inverted.7439:

Have you exhausted the idea that it may be you? Maybe you’re not a good or experienced player (Not assuming you are or anything but I had a very easy time getting in to raids with little-no experience). And a really good and very underrated idea imo is if you want to look like a good or experienced player, look like one. Equip all the shinies you have on your character so people know you haven’t just hit lvl 80.

His post was not about him being super good, it’s him wanting to be honest and find groups to learn with, and he’s right, a lot of elitists will check your stuff beforehand.
There’s nothing wrong with not being good, as long as you’re willing to learn, but unlike fractals for example there is no level of difficulty setting that will let you learn the mechanics of raids. And that’s the real problem here.

Inverted.7439:

Have you exhausted the idea that it may be you? Maybe you’re not a good or experienced player (Not assuming you are or anything but I had a very easy time getting in to raids with little-no experience). And a really good and very underrated idea imo is if you want to look like a good or experienced player, look like one. Equip all the shinies you have on your character so people know you haven’t just hit lvl 80.

Sigh. You are part of his problem, not him! I still find it unreal that people in LFG want ‘gear checks’ to do a full run of Ascalonian Catacombs. Come onnn people. Don’t you remember your first dungeons/raids/fracs??

I agree entirely with the op, it’s gone completely bonkers and unfair. GW2 has some excellent devoted chilled players too who don’t need to complete a dungeon in 3.5minutes or whatever the hell the idea is to get super rewards and legendary gear crazy fast. Some of us enjoy what the game has to offer and enjoys all the story telling, the pace at which you want to go. This does not make someone a bad player.

My suggestion would be perhaps look for a guild that do raids a lot, people who are willing to show you the way. That’s where we’re lucky but getting 10 of us together for the amount of time a raid takes not even taking into account teaching, is very difficult and I too am anxious to see a raid through.

Just started reading this and was in your position earlier this week with being in the instance once with my guild when they first came out and never went back in. When the Aerodrome came out I thought I would try again and was only lucky enough to join because someone didn’t know what to do and we agreed since neither of us were prepared to jump in together with a PUG team and see how far we got. Considering we could only find 8 of us we still jumped in just so we could start to learn the mechanics. This was all because we got lucky and tried asking people in map chat. If you still want to try the raid send me a message in game and we can team up with some more so we may finally be able to beat the Vale Gaurdian.

Celine.6857:

Sigh. You are part of his problem, not him! I still find it unreal that people in LFG want ‘gear checks’ to do a full run of Ascalonian Catacombs. Come onnn people. Don’t you remember your first dungeons/raids/fracs??

Please, you have to respect everyone’s personal desires ingame. If people want to have gear checks in AC, you have absolute 0 right to intervene. Accept and respect that others want to play like this. You have many opportunities to avoid them and get your own thing done!

Celine.6857:

I agree entirely with the op, it’s gone completely bonkers and unfair. GW2 has some excellent devoted chilled players too who don’t need to complete a dungeon in 3.5minutes or whatever the hell the idea is to get super rewards and legendary gear crazy fast. Some of us enjoy what the game has to offer and enjoys all the story telling, the pace at which you want to go. This does not make someone a bad player.

And this is why you are in a conflict with solid raiding people. Raids are no chillout zones when you visit them for the first time. Well, it’s not serious business but you can’t jump in like a freakin drag queen and welcome the encounters with your open world mentality. That doesn’t work and there are players out there who want to avoid getting people like that because these are the ones who are responsible to let the group fail over and over again. Had people in my first runs who were grouped for the green circle. They failed so hard just to run into even though we told them not to focus on any other things like this and you know what is happening then to the whole team.
Yes, you can enjoy the content, but it’s on a different level many players aren’t able to reach rudimentary.

xrayane.1842:

The raid state is just terrible right now. Not only is it needed for the first ever GW2 legendary armor, but it isn’t achievable by the vast majority of players.

It is, if they would stop pressing only 1 on their chars and actually learn how to play their class properly.

If you want to find a group on the LFG and you don’t have a lot of experience ( even if you know what you’re supposed to do, you play your class perfectly ) it’s just completely over. The raid community is extremely toxic in PU raids, people leave after 1 fail, you end up searching for other players, then others leave, etc.. It’s just horrible.

Open a “training group” via LFG and people will join. Watch out for players that perform well in your opinion and add them to your friend list.
Go into forums, try several raid guilds, raid communities. There are dozens of them and they don’t prevent searching for players, they really do.
The problem on your side: You have to be patient and bring lot of time, effort, sweat and nerves. But that’s your entry into raids. Once you’ve done this raids can be chill mode.

xrayane.1842:

The big problem is indeed people asking you to have x LI, otherwise you’re kicked, it doesn’t matter if you’re very good, doesn’t matter if you perfectly know the boss but you’ve killed him only a few times, you’re worthless. Some groups even ask for the Eternal title, like, wtf… You can be good and lucky and you didn’t die during boss fights but one of your mates did, what’s the point with your own skill?!? I find this perfectly absurd and stupid, but it perfectly reflects the state of mind of most of raiders right now.

Since raids are time consuming and you don’t want to spend or waste any more like you did when you were learning the encounters, it’s their right to ask for special requirements showing possibly skill and experience. You have no idea where

xrayane.1842:

The other point is fully asc gear, I do own it myself because I love optimisation, but asc vs exotic armor is just an anecdotic amount of stats, well those people don’t give a f*** if you’re good and you know how to play your class/you know the bosses, you have an exotic armor ? You’re a complete s*** and you deserve to get kicked.

Sry, but you don’t know what you are talking about. We have a wing clear of a full exotic team but they are organized and very good players. So, actually it is completely insane not to insist on asc gear, at least weapons and trinkets.

xrayane.1842:

Raids made a kind of player coming back into the game, those very elitist players, that we used to meet when CoF p1 farm was a thing, who are extremely toxic, unpleasant, and who don’t hesitate to trash talk/flame and to tell you that you’re a big trash ( have never lived it myself but happened to friends ).

Well, people were and are mostly toxic if you join their group and you don’t meet the requirements. It is an hostile move of those players but since I have beenduoing and soloing dungeons it is a mess with players joining your sell runs and don’t understand any word I write. Same goes with harder fractals when people join your group with less AR than needed. See it from that perspective, please.

xrayane.1842:

You now have two options : -creating your guild. This is probably the best solution as you’ll have the controle over it and you’ll be able to take some beginners and slowly progress into the raids.
-what I did, joining a raid guild, a raid guild with good and less good players, and killing at least the VG once every week, or even other bosses if you’re in a good guild. I highly recommand not to get in a speed clear guild, first they’ll refuse you if you have never beaten the bosses, and the atmosphere is very toxic with a lot of pressure, you honestly don’t even feel good when you’ve finished your raid with them.

Exactly, except the fact that the atmosphere in a speed clear guild is not very toxic per se.

Vinceman.4572:

Celine.6857:

Sigh. You are part of his problem, not him! I still find it unreal that people in LFG want ‘gear checks’ to do a full run of Ascalonian Catacombs. Come onnn people. Don’t you remember your first dungeons/raids/fracs??

Please, you have to respect everyone’s personal desires ingame. If people want to have gear checks in AC, you have absolute 0 right to intervene. Accept and respect that others want to play like this. You have many opportunities to avoid them and get your own thing done!

Please, you really misunderstand my point. I don’t care how others wish to play, some people prefer a slower-paced game, want to teach others, want everything nowwwwww etc, each person is an individual. I am merely saying that a lot of players out there make it difficult for newbies to the point where I remember feeling nervous to do a dungeon for the first time, worried I’ll get flamed and or kicked. Accept and respect that people are doing things for the first time all the time and if some players try and remember that was once themselves, there will be more patience overall. There is way way too much pressure for people to conform to a ‘meta’ and that is sad imo. Furthermore, people in this thread are finding problems in this regard and so something needs to be done.

There is also a much more appropriate and mature way of dealing with people who don’t understand or don’t read an LFG advertisement. There is absolutely zero need to trash talk or be rude to that person and that kind of behaviour is toxic. Please try and remember you are inviting people, human beings from all walks of life and if they joined an unsuitable group, a simple explanation and kick is much more suitable than annihalating their confidence from the start.

Here how I got into raiding.

I started to raid in February so I was pretty much in your situation. Every group would ask for insights that I didn’t have or experience that I didn’t have either so…

1. I opened metabattle in order to setup my 2 favorite class correctly : druid and tempest
2. I gathered information on the next boss I wanted to kill. That meant reading Dulfy guide and watching video until I thought that I knew the fight
3. I created my own training group for boss that I never fought before in order to assimilate the mechanics.
4. Once I got comfortable with mechanics I either formed serious group or tried to find one.
5. With time I met many people and we decided to form a guild together.

You can do it too!

Vinceman.4572:

It is, if they would stop pressing only 1 on their chars and actually learn how to play their class properly.

What if I play a hammer guardian?

Have friends who raid, or make friends with people who raid.

Your best bet is to read up on the raid fights and join a guild that’s open to new raiders. Be friendly, patient, and humble to advice from others.

I am finding the same problem, might also be my play time, its sad that they designed so many features of this game around getting into the game straight away and now there is this…

Same as every other mmo you need to grind just to play the game… time to go back to cs or dota.

@Vinceman

Even though most of your arguments are perfectly legit, this does not excuse the toxicity of the community. Whether you tell someone “Sorry can’t join, we don’t have time to teach people we don’t know” or “Get out you’re too noob [insert random teenager insult]” take the same amount of energy/time.
One is adult, one is just a show off that mostly mean “Hey Im in a guild that did raids so I was able to learn before you did and now you’re stuck hahahaha newb” or something like that.

And this is completely ridiculous.

This a game, some people simply forget it, if you’re not willing to help players, that’s indeed your right, but don’t insult them for trying. As you said, everyone plays the way they want, if someone wants to jump into a raid without knowing a kitten about them, it’s also their right, but it doesnt deserve the trash talk.

I’m starting to do raids and I think for new raids players the best way is to find a mid step between 2 sides:

1) Gear .This means having the best meta equip/build for a very good start point. Food too. Basically everything is required about gear to face raids properly. This is expensive I Know, but no one force us to do raids before we have the necessary equip.

2) Study . Linked to point 1. This means watch videos, read guides, have someone who explains you how bosses work. Having the knowledge of the fight is very very good, doesn’t matter if you don’t have the right experience at beginning, is normal, but this means you want to learn, you want to be good to do raids.

3) Looking for teaching/not too much elitist raids run This is important at beginning. It’ useless to look for raids squad who have too much experience, High LI requirements etc. or you’re lucky and people is patient with you or you risk only a fast kick + more possible block. So Look the LFG A LOT or try to look for a guild who organizes teaching runs.

I’m an experienced pvp player but the initial approach for raids is not really different from an approach to a spvp team.

This will be my tactic, I’m very beginner for raids.

If you have other suggestions, pls give me

Wielder Of Magic.3950:

As in the title, I am wondering how you can ever possibly get into raiding unless you have been doing so from the very start.
Even for the Vale Guardian groups now demand 25+ insights and an eternal title.
I supported raids when they were announced, and I still do.
But I am currently losing hope of ever being able to get into a party reliably.
I do not have a ton of insights, nor do I have the eternal title.
In the current situation, that means no party will ever take me, with most even flaming and shaming me upon joining ( EU server).

Currently I feel like I have almost exhausted all options available to me.
People only want experienced players, but how do you even get experience if nobody is willing to help new people get into raids at all?

I have tried to join parties while being honest.
result: got flamed and kicked.

Tried several guilds who claimed to have a raiding presence among other pve things.
result:Raiders sticked together and only laughed at new people in the guildchat, making fun of them while linking their raid shinies.

Tried raid roster guilds.
result:Only form parties with eternal title and 25+ insights at minimum.

Joined guilds that train/teach raids.
result: Rarely see a run forming, if ever.

Also tried making my own parties.
result: people leaving the second they see people who needed a bit of explanation or unable to link the desired amount of insights or if the party composition is not 100% to their liking, or people who do not want to take suggestions.

After a while, raid wing 2 came out, and a lot of people claimed that that would be the perfect point to get into raiding. So I went out there again.

But once again, the people forming parties demanded eternal title and 30+ insights or even more.
Doesn’t matter, people said, they just want their experienced buddies with them for a first kill, new people will get their chance afterwards!
I am still waiting for that chance, since all parties for wing 2 also demand massive amounts of insights and usually eternal title and killproofs as well.

I have basically been trying since day 1, not saying no to any party or any attempt.
After all this time, I got 9 insights to show for it.
9.
From wing 1, in all this time.
I have never even got the chance to try out wing 2, every time I try and be honest about my insights I get so many profanities and insults at my head it is not even funny and makes me actually afraid to join anything at all.

Do I really have to pay precursor-level prices to get into a raid or straight up lie to people about insights and experience, just to set foot inside of the raid wings?
I am not an idiot, willing to learn, and generally won’t make the same mistake twice.

I really do not blame raiders for wanting to play with those who know their stuff, but please do realise that the entry barrier into raids for people without dedicated raiding guilds is being made very high this way.

It seems like you are either a dedicated high end pve raider with a raiding guild and a big friendslist, or you are a filthy casual who doesn’t care.
But the middleground, people like me who can do it if gotten the chance, are willing to man up and train to ‘git gud’, it seems like we will not get that chance.

I am sure a lot of people will claim otherwise and will tell about their weekly pug succes-stories, but I am really starting to lose hope.

I gotta say, you really seem to have put some serious work into this, you tried several guilds, contacts, training runs, man you have done it all, I am rather amazed you have not been able to really lock into something yet.

It’s not that I am a “Filthy Casual”, that does not care, I have the skills, I have a PS warrior sitting on the side if I ever opted to get into raids, 2 of the 5 guilds I am in, do raids regularly, and I could get another one to get a raid group together if I put some effort into it.

But in the end, it’s just not something I want to be a part of just yet. So, with that put out, take this as the advice from a “Filthy Casual” that does not care.

If it makes you feel any better, I get where you are coming from, not from GW2, but from other games I have played, and I really do wish you well, and I hope that you find what it is you seek.

My Suggestion however:

• Learn the Raid. Watch the Videos, learn the classes, not just the one you want to do, but learn at least 4 other positions, if you can, learn them all.

• Build a Proper Raid ready Build. Find out what you need to make it happen, and then, make it happen.

• Ask in the guilds you are already in for anyone looking to start doing trial runs. Set a time on your calendar, a day you can set aside 3 hours to teach/learn the raid, and have this be constant each and every week.

• Be ready for your first tries to have very few people show up, if anyone. Don’t get discouraged, just schedule for next week, same time. Even if only 1 person shows up, go in, and do something. Learn a boss, or just how to dodge orbs, or how to stand in circles, or just how to die, a lot, ask them about their build, see if you can help them, and if you can, then help them.

• Be willing to laugh at the mistakes, and make everyone who came to learn with you, feel good about the time they spent.

In the end, even if you you don’t get many raids done, you will make a lot of friends, have some good memories, be loved by people in your existing guilds, and in the end, that is what an MMO is really all about.

PopeUrban.2578:

Don’t PUG.

In general, doing any group content in any game ever with a PUG is a less accessible experience than finding a group of like minded players with similar interests.

Your mistake is attempting to treat content designed for static groups of players as content designed for PUGs. The fact that people PUG raids doesn’t mean they were designed for it.

Raids really are designed for players that take the same or nearly the same group of ten individuals, learn the encounters together, and progress on to the next encounter. They were designed that way because its a subset of the community (progression/mechanics endgame PvE) that GW2 was previously not creating content for.

The redesign for fractals and subsequent removal of plans for future dungeons is the PvE content they have designed around PUGs. They’re short, bite-sized instances where you’re not overly inconvenienced be someone leaving or needing to kick people.

It’s hard to PUG raid simply because the entire concept of raiding as a style of PvE play is about as anti-PUG as you can get.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
this, so much this.

Just because there are pugs doesn’t mean you SHOULD pug.
Raids are content meant for static groups and you should treat it as such; don’t start by trying to pug, start by trying to find friends/like-minded people (for example here on the forums), form groups, practice etc. – Pugs are your last resort, not your first place to go.
With the amount of posts regarding this exact topic one would believe you could fill 20 squads with new players trying to learn raids easily and still have enough players for more.

Also, don’t say raids/raid-lfg are in a horrible state because you start with the worst option of tackling the content available instead of starting with a much better one.

Deihnyx.6318:

@Vinceman
Even though most of your arguments are perfectly legit, this does not excuse the toxicity of the community. Whether you tell someone “Sorry can’t join, we don’t have time to teach people we don’t know” or “Get out you’re too noob [insert random teenager insult]” take the same amount of energy/time.
One is adult, one is just a show off that mostly mean “Hey Im in a guild that did raids so I was able to learn before you did and now you’re stuck hahahaha newb” or something like that.

And this is completely ridiculous.

This a game, some people simply forget it, if you’re not willing to help players, that’s indeed your right, but don’t insult them for trying. As you said, everyone plays the way they want, if someone wants to jump into a raid without knowing a kitten about them, it’s also their right, but it doesnt deserve the trash talk.

I totally agree, serious insults have no place in an online game but you know, we won’t erase them or change the mentality/mood of some bad apples. Everybody of us has made negative experiences ingame or in any case sooner or later everybody will.
But I also see the joining into a group that made requirements I do not fulfill as rude and ignorant breach towards other players. In terms of raids I’ve never seen people with less than several thousands of AP joining, so it is definite we are not dealing with beginners or players not able to read the english language. If it happens to some rare raid groups ok, but the majority of the cases you have to deal with players trying to cheat their way into a group that put the lfg for a reason. The groups want to play like they described it – same thing if you go out on a sports ground and try to play with others who were there before. You ask them and if they agree you follow their rules and you have fun. If they don’t want you to play with them you have to deal with it. I would love to see peeps running into those groups and interrupt the game. It won’t end up with insults only. ^^ Yeah, I know, violence is not a reason either but we all know that this could happen so that’s why you behave in a certain manner and just don’t do such things unless you are a freak or a lil bit stupid.
What I am trying to say, insulting players are a thing of toxicity but not respecting the rules of others is the same. We all would be happy if both sides acted correctly, resulting in less drama.

Same way you get into dungeons and fractals, just go for it. Get ya gear, read or watch a guide, get on ts and act like ya know what ya doing. First time I did gorseval I watched a guide on my tablet while fighting him. After the 3rd attempt we got the kill and I was invited to the raid guild.

The amount of PUGs clearing raids vividly shows that you do not need a raid guild. However getting a raid team and setting one up is something beneficial to anyone.

There are plenty of training groups out there, or just groups without high requirements (as long as you have proper gear and the right class)..
I usually have everything cleared in the beginning of the week but keep joining SV (I find PuGging there more fun) throughout the rest of the week, most groups I joined never asked me for my LI or the title, as long you give them the impression that you know what you are doing everything will be fine.
For example, only yesterday I joined (as condi druid) two groups that never asked me for anything except for gear and basic knowledge, both killed VG & Gorse with at least 4 people that never had the kills before.
If you cant find a nice guild, My suggestion would be: Start with an easy class that does not have a key role, Rev for example (if you start your first raid as a tank or a healer or some other key role, obviously thing will be a bit harder and the group will notice your mistakes) , read some guides/watch some videos – know your class’s purpose and basic mechanics of the encounter. Join with confidence and do your best.

Sorry to hear you have such problems entering raids, OP.

I find it a rather ridiculous concept anyway, but it is kind of grotesque that you obviously have to enter a waiting line, be willing to be humiliated in several TS sessions because you are new to the concept, and then to get into the waiting line for the real attempt now like some people here suggest.

Best of luck after all your efforts.

Wielder Of Magic.3950:

As in the title, I am wondering how you can ever possibly get into raiding unless you have been doing so from the very start.
Even for the Vale Guardian groups now demand 25+ insights and an eternal title.
I supported raids when they were announced, and I still do.
But I am currently losing hope of ever being able to get into a party reliably.
I do not have a ton of insights, nor do I have the eternal title.
In the current situation, that means no party will ever take me, with most even flaming and shaming me upon joining ( EU server).

Currently I feel like I have almost exhausted all options available to me.
People only want experienced players, but how do you even get experience if nobody is willing to help new people get into raids at all?

I have tried to join parties while being honest.
result: got flamed and kicked.

Tried several guilds who claimed to have a raiding presence among other pve things.
result:Raiders sticked together and only laughed at new people in the guildchat, making fun of them while linking their raid shinies.

Tried raid roster guilds.
result:Only form parties with eternal title and 25+ insights at minimum.

Joined guilds that train/teach raids.
result: Rarely see a run forming, if ever.

Also tried making my own parties.
result: people leaving the second they see people who needed a bit of explanation or unable to link the desired amount of insights or if the party composition is not 100% to their liking, or people who do not want to take suggestions.

After a while, raid wing 2 came out, and a lot of people claimed that that would be the perfect point to get into raiding. So I went out there again.

But once again, the people forming parties demanded eternal title and 30+ insights or even more.
Doesn’t matter, people said, they just want their experienced buddies with them for a first kill, new people will get their chance afterwards!
I am still waiting for that chance, since all parties for wing 2 also demand massive amounts of insights and usually eternal title and killproofs as well.

I have basically been trying since day 1, not saying no to any party or any attempt.
After all this time, I got 9 insights to show for it.
9.
From wing 1, in all this time.
I have never even got the chance to try out wing 2, every time I try and be honest about my insights I get so many profanities and insults at my head it is not even funny and makes me actually afraid to join anything at all.

Do I really have to pay precursor-level prices to get into a raid or straight up lie to people about insights and experience, just to set foot inside of the raid wings?
I am not an idiot, willing to learn, and generally won’t make the same mistake twice.

I really do not blame raiders for wanting to play with those who know their stuff, but please do realise that the entry barrier into raids for people without dedicated raiding guilds is being made very high this way.

It seems like you are either a dedicated high end pve raider with a raiding guild and a big friendslist, or you are a filthy casual who doesn’t care.
But the middleground, people like me who can do it if gotten the chance, are willing to man up and train to ‘git gud’, it seems like we will not get that chance.

I am sure a lot of people will claim otherwise and will tell about their weekly pug succes-stories, but I am really starting to lose hope.

Hi

I have a bit of really good advice to you and anyone finding themselves in your position based on the recent changes to the game.

Forget all those guys, their DPS meters, their gearchecks, their add-ons, whatever. Just forget it. Instead of raiding, now happens to be a REALLY good time to hop to WVW. Better communities, more people willing to teach you the ropes, overall friendlier playerbase.

On top of that, things can go from much much easier then raiding to same to “surprise!” much much more challenging then the raids, because no matter how you slice and dice it, no scripted encounter that can beat opponents that can think, change tactics, strategies and adapt on the fly.

With the improved rewards, which will get improved even better, there is no reason whatsoever to PVE raid in this game, the challenge is just not there once you learn the encounters, unique skins maybe ? Not sure. So far last week has been such a blast that I just never see myself re-entering the raiding cesspool for any reason.

Deihnyx.6318:

@Vinceman

Even though most of your arguments are perfectly legit, this does not excuse the toxicity of the community. Whether you tell someone “Sorry can’t join, we don’t have time to teach people we don’t know” or “Get out you’re too noob [insert random teenager insult]” take the same amount of energy/time.
One is adult, one is just a show off that mostly mean “Hey Im in a guild that did raids so I was able to learn before you did and now you’re stuck hahahaha newb” or something like that.

And this is completely ridiculous.

This a game, some people simply forget it, if you’re not willing to help players, that’s indeed your right, but don’t insult them for trying. As you said, everyone plays the way they want, if someone wants to jump into a raid without knowing a kitten about them, it’s also their right, but it doesnt deserve the trash talk.

Could not agree more. Excellent comment.

Previously I found this link irritating..

but.. considering I know my guild needs a steady supply of pugs to recruit for raids ( people do have to stop playing from time to time..)

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/47z3d3/how_to_link_legendary_insight/

Have the gear, watch some videos of the fight.. get to know what to expect and most won’t be able to tell the difference ( between actually having insights, and just pinging them from item code) tbh.