Guild Wars 2

or classist for that matter) Every single day i search for a party to do fractals i keep getting kicked out as soon they see i play as an engineer seriously? im stuck at lvl 2 simply because no one wants me in a party , i really feel insulted and like its pointless to resume playing the game as it is since this happens with other dungeons too, hardly anyone gives me a chance to show if i got skill or if i lack and can improve.

I’ve never seen this happen. At all. I’ll run a fractal with 4 engis and myself if that’s what it takes. What profession(class) someone is, is completely irrelevant.

If this if your definition of racist, then I almost feel sorry. welcome to the wonderful world of profession discrimination NOT racism.

MMOs will always have those types of players. Personally, i suggest you use gw2lfg, at the minimum if someone invites you it wont kick you. Another suggestion is to join a guild or play with friends.

I don’t run dungeons very often, although the last time I did, I was playing my engineer and I ran support. At the end of the run, which was relatively smooth, one of the members made the comment that, “Wow, the engineer was actually useful!” This comment led me to believe that, while I wasn’t kicked out, this person clearly doubted my being in the group would amount to anything. lol

I’ve heard other players say that engineers, thieves, rangers, and necromancers are the “underdogs” when it comes to dungeons, so I assume this is the reason you’re experiencing problems. I’ve also been told that if I want to do dungeons more, I should be playing a warrior, guardian, mesmer, or elementalist.

The problem mostly is ignorance. Most people have no idea what an engineer actually does because it’s the least encountered profession.

I play a guardian and was invited to a group the other night. A Ranger was invited after me. The leader put up a kick request. I asked why. When no response was given, I dropped from the group with a “Good luck” to them. I won’t group with people like that.

I do fractals with engies all the time, in the 20’s and 30’s. Never had an issue.

Kumu Honua.2751:

The problem mostly is ignorance. Most people have no idea what an engineer actually does because it’s the least encountered profession.

I play a guardian and was invited to a group the other night. A Ranger was invited after me. The leader put up a kick request. I asked why. When no response was given, I dropped from the group with a “Good luck” to them. I won’t group with people like that.

^This.

Yes, there are elitists in the game. And that is completely fine. I just wish they said what classes they were looking for instead of being complete donut-holes and kicking people for their playstyle.

I am an alt-aholic. While I usually fractal with my warrior and guardian, I LOVE my flamethrowing engineer for dungeons.

Bummer, /w me in game.. me and some of my guildies will run with ya.

The engineer race needs a Rosa Sparks.

[note: original thread title and first message said players were “racist against engineers”]

It’s not a GW2 problem, it is an “everymmo” problem.. and is what happens when you put “everymmo” dungeons in a game.

Black Frog.9274:

silvermember.8941:

If this if your definition of racist, then I almost feel sorry. welcome to the wonderful world of profession discrimination NOT racism.

MMOs will always have those types of players. Personally, i suggest you use gw2lfg, at the minimum if someone invites you it wont kick you. Another suggestion is to join a guild or play with friends.

Show me where he said the word “racist.”

It was in the topic title before he or a mod changed it.

I find this amusing only because I main a ranger and this has happened multiple times for me for fractals 10+. Yet when i run with my guild we trio 10+ with 2 rangers and a guardian with no issues. Feel free to send me a friend request as my guild has no class restrictions or you could even join our trio if you would like.

When someone wants X class over other classes, it’s just showing you they themselves aren’t very good, and they need be carried. Now a days I steer clear of those groups advertising need war/guard, because it’s basically advertising they suck.

I’ve done up to level 30 FotM, with a mix every class, and never really had a problem with a specific class, just undergeared or bad players.

Also, if someone is worried about stacking a group at level 2 difficulty, you’re probably lucky they kicked you.

well thanks to the mod who changed the wrong wording. as many have suggested i ll just try find a guild that does fractals and any other dungeon and maybe wvw.

too many noobs watching web vids and trying to make identical parties for “fastest” performance is whats goin on i suppose.

The general playerbase of MMOs has been deterioting ever since MMOs (or most of them) began to base their games on the core principle of farming for gear in an instanced dungeon, not to mention the solofication of the world / questing.

People used to be far more helpful, far more tolerant, because MMORPGs used to have mechanisms in that encouraged that such as public dungeons where you had to compete against / cooperate with other groups to actually complete (yes I know it is shocking you actually encounter more than 5/10/15 players in a Massively Multiplayer game), which you actually had to travel to and in the case of PvP games / servers had to fight off opposing players whilst trying to complete the dungeon. (Yes this was when PvE was actually a challenge)

Most MMORPGs today are nothing of the sort, they are merely glorified co-ops which edge ever closer to the likes of Diablo where farming loot with little challenge is all that matters, hence situations such as the OP describes are more and more common.

I always let Engis in my teams.
Most are bad admittedly, but the good ones are n ice to have.

What I’m afraid of getting is Rangers, 99% of Rangers are bad players, it’s not the class it’s the fact nubs seem to pick Ranger because it’s “easy”, but to be a good Ranger it isn’t easy.
Most Necros ain’t that good either.

Bottom line, if I get an Engi, a Necro and a Ranger I pick the Engi.
At least I get supply drop/turrets that are worth something better than a dead Ranger or a Necro dealing less DPS than my offhand sigil.

To be fair, I have met some REALLY bad warriors. As word has gotten out that warrior is THE profession to play, there seems to have been a spike in new players choosing it. Lately, I’ve seen more bad warriors than bad rangers.

lolwut?

My whole team wiped at Old Tom, I had to solo him from 40% with my engi.
Same with Raving asura, only me and another member left to kill the last 3 golems, him eventually downed and I’m left to clear the place out.

But yes, I have seen some terrible engi’s who walk around with a flamethrower and elixir gun only for dmg purposes. I was shocked and horrified.

Also, I cannot understand how engi’s are bad in any sense? well at least a good engi will make sure to carry Sigil of frailty, lifesteal food and some good crit.
Spam those 25 vuln stacks (10 on champs and legend), and add another 10~25% dmg to the whole team. Would NOT call that useless.

Considering all fractals up to 10 can be easily 3 manned, I’d just assume any group that kicks someone because of their class is just so bad that they have to min/max the setup to succeed, yet still wipe.

Account.9832:

The engineer race needs a Rosa Sparks.

Tybalt….?

:3

In my experience in online games: when it comes to challenging content, players are going to choose the path of least resistance . hey are going to pick the easiest class, use the best weapon, and try to exploit or abuse any game mechanics to make their experience as painless and/or time efficient as possible.

Since the game has been released, it’s fair to say that the dust has settled on profession balance. And Warriors, Guardians and Mesmers have become the holy-trinity (so to speak) for instanced content. The other classes in can’t really stand shoulder to shoulder to these guys when it comes to damage and support (for now). so just know that.

I can only speak to the engineer profession, but I have to assume if youre not playing a War, Guard or Mez that you will have to work a little harder to prove your worth to a group. Try out some unorthodox traits, some inventive utility skills and weapons. You could be inventing a new style of play that will put your profession on top.

So my advice to you is deal with the rejection (for now). Stay headstrong and keep trying to complete your fractals. Steadily build up your friends list with like-minded, agreeable and forgiving players. and lastly show everyone that engineers do kick some kitten

I run dungeons all the time and never discriminate against any class. Engineers may well be a decent dungeon character but the ones I’ve had in my group dont bring much to the table. Then again I rarely see anybody in PUGs play decently. I’ve been in fotm’s with 2 guardians and never one of them is using wall.

My advice is dont let it get you down and keep plugging away. At higher levels though I hear groups can be quite selective. But you can probably make it up into the 20’s if thats your goal.

Red Falcon.8257:

I always let Engis in my teams.
Most are bad admittedly, but the good ones are n ice to have.

What I’m afraid of getting is Rangers, 99% of Rangers are bad players, it’s not the class it’s the fact nubs seem to pick Ranger because it’s “easy”, but to be a good Ranger it isn’t easy.
Most Necros ain’t that good either.

Bottom line, if I get an Engi, a Necro and a Ranger I pick the Engi.
At least I get supply drop/turrets that are worth something better than a dead Ranger or a Necro dealing less DPS than my offhand sigil.

This is sad. Rangers can be a great boon to a team if played properly.

One should not discriminate against others purely based on class. Most content is playable by practically any mix of classes. I have run many dungeons and fractals, and not once have I ever not taken someone or kicked someone based on class. And were I in a group that did so, I might leave as well. Actions like that are from people that are not the kind of community that I wish to have.

Sylosi.6503:

The general playerbase of MMOs has been deterioting ever since MMOs (or most of them) began to base their games on the core principle of farming for gear in an instanced dungeon, not to mention the solofication of the world / questing.

People used to be far more helpful, far more tolerant, because MMORPGs used to have mechanisms in that encouraged that such as public dungeons where you had to compete against / cooperate with other groups to actually complete (yes I know it is shocking you actually encounter more than 5/10/15 players in a Massively Multiplayer game), which you actually had to travel to and in the case of PvP games / servers had to fight off opposing players whilst trying to complete the dungeon. (Yes this was when PvE was actually a challenge)

Most MMORPGs today are nothing of the sort, they are merely glorified co-ops which edge ever closer to the likes of Diablo where farming loot with little challenge is all that matters, hence situations such as the OP describes are more and more common.

This!

I’ve been waiting and waiting for a lot of time now. I haven’t found 1 newish mmorpg with those elements.
I love non instanced/non party instanced dungeons, where you had to always be careful of PKers hiding in a corner. Or when you had to be really careful when a different party was incoming, dragging 10+ mobs. A bad use of a skill could cause your party to aggro the said 10 mobs and die miserably . Non to mention full pvp everywhere.
I also miss completely non instanced worlds, with the confusion it resulted in chat.
I guess some things where left out, and maybe we’ll never get them back. (I’m keeping my eyes open for some incoming games like ArchAge and the like)

If its not stated in advance such as COF P1 LF Mesmer or Need 1 more ele for AC then they shouldnt be picking on you after you join. If they cared they should state it up front. Those people dont sound too nice, but remember in beggining level fractals, people are wary, new, unsure of what is good etc…

You might actually have better luck just doing fractals a few levels above your current level like 5-9 so people are more adjusted in what to expect etc..

You know, I’ve made a few hundred trips through the fractals at this point and I don’t recall any situation where someone was kicked unless they went offline or literally couldn’t enter (pre patch, like we’re running FOTM 26 and the person doesn’t have it unlocked yet).

Have randomly had every profession in the game in my groups many times…

Think there’s some exaggerating going on here.

Or he’s on a server filled with jerks, one of the two. Because I’ve NEVER seen somebody kicked out a fractal group because of their class. We’ve had a party of 4 Rangers and a warrior running a set of fractals for pete’s sake, and nobody got kicked (then again, we also kicked enough kitten to avoid having to redo spots).

this is all lies… not because you got kicked once for X reason that you have to say you’re getting kicked often and stuck at level 2…

Its not lies my Engineer has been kicked too, i now no longer play my Engineer because its to difficult to get anything done.

I totally understand OP..

I pug a lot, I have 5 maxed toons war/ele/guard/ranger/thief, and done a few fractals and have seen this happen a lot of times. This mess was the reason why I quit playing WoW just for that reason. Too many people either a) want to cover their own poor skill, b) want fast runs and go by stupid guides they find on reddit, c) never played the class to the point where they dont understand it. All this causes people to play new classes or think they are forced to roll new toons just so they can actually get the tokens needed for dungeon gear or stuff for their legendary.

I love all my classes and play them well since whenever I play a class I would do my research before rolling dungeons with them. I used to hate running dungeons with thieves until I played one and decided to max him. I rolled through my whole story by my self and only died once out of all 80 levels of it. I even run a dungeon spec ranger that can do really well DPS without sacrificing vitality and can evade about 9 times before waiting 5 secs for endurance or skills to refresh. I even use both bows and can still 10k with longbow because I fully understood how to run it and realize rangers are better damaging from a flanking position with full endurance.

I think before people run around just kicking people, they should try other classes before even bothering to find a poor excuse to kick someone just by class alone.

AlecFair.1270:

I think before people run around just kicking people, they should try other classes before even bothering to find a poor excuse to kick someone just by class alone.

Seconded. Give everyone a chance and see how they play first.

I’ve been pleasantly surprised by people playing the less OP classes and I’ve been unpleasantly surprised by people playing the more OP classes. Class and level do not determine skill. Skill does. And you cannot determine skill without watching how they do.

When they kick someone on fractals lvl 2 based on class, shows how bad they are. Unless they were asking for a specific class, but those are the teams i avoid.

So chill out and join another group, because you were better off anyway.

SynfulChaot.3169:

This is sad. Rangers can be a great boon to a team if played properly.

Sadly no, they can’t. I mean, they can certainly be competent and help the rest of the team, but any player with experience and good awareness will help the party more if he plays any other class. Rangers have the fewest party utility / survival skills. Maybe Arena Net thought they’d bee to powerful playing “solo” (meaning with their pet) if they had more utility skills, but the fact is they’re just not as versatile or useful to the rest of the party as other classes.

I’ll still take a good ranger over a bad [insert any class here], of course, but the same (good) player will generally be more helpful if he plays a different class.

RyuDragnier.9476:

I’ve NEVER seen somebody kicked out a fractal group because of their class. We’ve had a party of 4 Rangers and a warrior running a set of fractals for pete’s sake, and nobody got kicked

It would be rather odd if two of the rangers decided to kick one of the other rangers because of their class, no…?

Account.9832:

SynfulChaot.3169:

This is sad. Rangers can be a great boon to a team if played properly.

Sadly no, they can’t. I mean, they can certainly be competent and help the rest of the team, but any player with experience and good awareness will help the party more if he plays any other class. Rangers have the fewest party utility / survival skills. Maybe Arena Net thought they’d bee to powerful playing “solo” (meaning with their pet) if they had more utility skills, but the fact is they’re just not as versatile or useful to the rest of the party as other classes.

I’ll still take a good ranger over a bad [insert any class here], of course, but the same (good) player will generally be more helpful if he plays a different class.

Rangers may not have a lot of useful utilities at the moment (spirits are supposed to be the rangers biggest support, but they need more major updates to become useful), but they can still support a group well. They have multiple fields they can lay down, and a bow ranger can combo with practically every weapon attack (4/5 attacks on both SB and LB are combo finishers).

Also, saying that just because the ranger has ‘the fewest party utility / survival skills’ (a questionable statement) they cannot be a boon to a team is a disservice. Not everyone in a party needs to be support focused. As long as everyone contributes to the team effort decently equally (which a ranger can do) then everyone was a boon.

I, personally, run a ranger main and several other level 80 alts (fully geared). I have had others request me to run my ranger (on multiple occasions) over the alts as they (and myself) feel I contribute better with her.

Red Falcon.8257:

a Necro dealing less DPS than my offhand sigil.

You can recognize the good necro by the time he is swapping his weapons. I guess the above statement is about those who play all the time with staff and doesnt swap at all.

In any dungeon where you can find groups of more than 3 mobs, having good condition necro in your group speed up their killing significantly. You can notice it in dredge or charr fractal, if you ever reach lvl 20+.
In hard fights, where you have not just dps spam, but survive also – condition necro can easily outdps any other class. I mean mostly fights like lupi or the Shaman in FOTM .

I play an engineer and have only ever been kicked from a group once, and that I am pretty sure had nothing to do with the class I play but the ‘class’ of the teammates I had at the time.

I run fractals with PUGs all the time, and never have an issue even in the higher 20’s.

Unless a group is looking for a specific class, which they will say up front, this is not an issue. I left a part once because I was the last to join and they desperately needed a heavy class. Wished them luck, moved on to the next party, had fun.

There are plenty of people out there that will play with you. I use gw2lgf.com all the time for my parties and never have an issue. Thankfully.

On a side note, the most ‘painful’ run I have ever done was with me (engineer), a necro, and three rangers. Took a lot longer than it should have, but I do believe a couple of those rangers just didn’t know how to play their class very well. Though I have run with plenty of great rangers.

SET.3275:

In hard fights, where you have not just dps spam, but survive also – condition necro can easily outdps any other class. I mean mostly fights like lupi or the Shaman in FOTM .

That’s really bold statement considering that warrior deals 15-20k with 100b to lupi every few seconds. Haven’t taken my warrior into fractals so can’t say much about that.

Just a little bit to consider:
some people constantly running dungeons/fotm put BAD players in their contact list adding description like ‘never run with him again’.
Not very kind behaviour, though, you have to be really bad to end like this i think.
But this sort CAN be a reason in somebody’s right-after-join-kick, not their profession.

haviz.1340:

SET.3275:

In hard fights, where you have not just dps spam, but survive also – condition necro can easily outdps any other class. I mean mostly fights like lupi or the Shaman in FOTM .

That’s really bold statement considering that warrior deals 15-20k with 100b to lupi every few seconds. Haven’t taken my warrior into fractals so can’t say much about that.

How much warriors you know who do 100b every few seconds to lupi all the fight long? I dont know the guys who solo Lupi, neither i saw anyone to melee him , except in phase 3.

SET.3275:

How much warriors you know who do 100b every few seconds to lupi all the fight long? I dont know the guys who solo Lupi, neither i saw anyone to melee him , except in phase 3.

I’m usually running with 1-3 people I know and they do it. In fact, you can do it with every proffesion.

Well yesterday I was doing CoE and we were stacking Alpha…one of my rangers was attacking the boss with his Longbow in melee range…I don’t even…someone explain…please…

LyzeUH.1398:

Well yesterday I was doing CoE and we were stacking Alpha…one of my rangers was attacking the boss with his Longbow in melee range…I don’t even…someone explain…please…

Its easier to avoid his attacks in melee on most paths. Like his big ice AoE can’t target you if you’re humping him.

Oglaf.1074:

LyzeUH.1398:

Well yesterday I was doing CoE and we were stacking Alpha…one of my rangers was attacking the boss with his Longbow in melee range…I don’t even…someone explain…please…

Its easier to avoid his attacks in melee on most paths. Like his big ice AoE can’t target you if you’re humping him.

I think he’s referring to the ranger’s weapon of choice for the situation as that severely gimps any damage contribution. A shortbow, for example, would be more ideal because its damage is not affected by range and gives an extra dodge on skill 3.

I know what you mean OP. While you weren’t delicate in crafting your point, it is becoming an issue. I farm CoF on my Engi and will get kicked from most groups on the premise of being an Engineer despite having only a bit less sustained damage of a Warrior thanks to Berserker Grenades and all the spike damage of a Thief. People don’t know what a good Engineer is capable of because they think we all stand 30 feet away throwing grenades for entire fights or just stand still shooting off a Flamethrower. A good Engineer skill cycle (I usually go with Pry Bar > Throw Wrench + SD > Point-blank Jump Shot > Point-blank Blunderbuss > Net Shot > Point-blank Grenade Barrage) can down anything and a good Engineer can pull it all off quicker than a Warrior can do the entirety of Hundred Blades. My Grenade Barrage can one-hit a Flame Acolyte during the timed event in CoF Path 1 and then I can immediately Jump Shot + Surprise Shot + Static Discharge + Pry Bar another Acolyte before most classes can down a single one.

But alas, Warrior has the reputation as “da best” and that won’t be changed any time soon. Take solace in the fact that if you’re a good Engineer you’re paving the way for people to be more accepting of Engineers in the long run.

Never seen this happen.

And this coming from ex-engi who thinks engi is a worthless class currently. PUGs rarely display elitism. Unless it’s a CoF speedrun where it’s obvious who is better.
You are more likely to find it in pre-made groups of determined players who expect others to try hard instead of simply “playing the profession I wanna play”.

You ought to just make your own group and then you get to decide who stays and who goes.

Red Falcon.8257:

Most Necros ain’t that good either.

Bottom line, if I get an Engi, a Necro and a Ranger I pick the Engi.
At least I get supply drop/turrets that are worth something better than a dead Ranger or a Necro dealing less DPS than my offhand sigil.

Just keep telling yourself that while I rev the mesmers/warriors/thieves/elementalists with my signet, and still have 15 stacks ticking for 107 dmg on the boss : )

OT: Engis rulez!

Dante.1508:

Its not lies my Engineer has been kicked too, i now no longer play my Engineer because its to difficult to get anything done.

I totally understand OP..

Sounds true to me too. I can’t remember the last time I saw an Engineer in my group. They don’t even seem to try anymore. And I don’t mean “my” groups, but groups I’m also in. And I have seen both Rangers and Thieves insta-kicked as soon as they joined. The first time, I wasn’t sure why, but now I understand it’s just jerks being jerks. I drop those groups when I see it now.

Isslair.4908:

You are more likely to find it in pre-made groups of determined players who expect others to try hard instead of simply “playing the profession I wanna play”.

Those two things are not exclusive. Non-elitists would know that.

Besides, Warriors haven’t had to try hard since release, yet they are always welcome. This is because your logic is flawed. It’s the professions who don’t have to try hard who are most in demand. Those that do are not welcome. Lazy players want an easy ride and they’ll kick without conscience, to ensure they work as little as possible for their reward.