Guild Wars 2

I have an idea. I’ve been playing since BETA and never was interested in dungeon master until recently which resulted me in going through all paths of dungeons I’ve never run. I’ve come across it the whole time, but not so much as LFG for Arah. The dungeon is probably the most difficult and has resulted in the players who have learned it to shun new guys. Most posts in Arah LFG consist of “no noobs” and “exp only.” So I decided to form a group of all noobs and watch a YouTube video of a group doing Arah P1 and lead my group based on the vid. After an hour, we managed to get past the Ancient Ooze and have struggled for the past 15-20 minutes trying to get everyone up to the Crystaline Entities. Growing frustrated, I came up with an idea…

How about Anet add some incentives for the many elitist veterans players to be less unwelcoming of inexperienced players. Something such as upon completing a dungeon with another player’s character(s) who’ve never completed the path, they get some bonus loot or money. There can be a multiplier of sorts where the more first timers, the more you get for helping.

I think some variation of this may be a great idea to change the kittenbaggery into camaraderie and provide less of a deterrent to the inexperienced who are intimidated by the excessively difficult dungeons. It would also get more people engaged in more of the content Anet has to offer and ultimately keep people playing.

I’ve added a screenshot of the very first result I saw when hopping back into LFG.

FYI, I took 3 minutes to type this while the rest of my group tried to get to me. When I went back to the game, they understandably gave up and all left. After about 1.5 hours wasted, it’s back to square one unless I can form a new group of noobs to continue.

Are you from EU or NA, pretty sure there is a lot of people in this forum willing to help, /w me if you’re EU but don’t really count on me being online for a while because I have exams.
I’m guessing EU though, you’re from EU, right?

Bismuth.3165:

Are you from EU or NA, pretty sure there is a lot of people in this forum willing to help, /w me if you’re EU but don’t really count on me being online for a while because I have exams.
I’m guessing EU though, you’re from EU, right?

I’m on NA, and I appreciate your offer to help, but more than looking for help, I’m trying to bring light to and find a resolution for a clear problem. Something that could change people from their natural, selfish, impatient ways. The dungeons that I do normally, often times I end up with inexperienced players. Most of the time, I do take the time to explain and teach. There have been times I couldn’t stay. I’ve seen the same reciprocated too, but 9 times out of 10, people seem to be unwilling to help or teach.

lol who joins groups advertising for no knob heads???

i actually like this idea. the first time i did arah was p3 ( i had watched a guide on p3) and i joined a group and told them that i had never done it before but that i thought i would listen to them and that i had a rough idea of what was going on. They said it was fine. Turned out the whole path went quite well with no wipes.

Personally i like to take newbies on runs whenever i have time. The only dungeon i dont advertise for newbies is arah because i dont get more than 1hr and a half to play but the days i do ac or ta or se or something i take newbies along and often times the ones that listen are fun to play with.

You’ve not created a distinction between an elitist and someone who is actually a skilled player that doesn’t mind helping. Elitists want to sit around together and brag about how good they are, and that mentality isn’t just limited to Guardians and Warriors that want to speedclear something. There are elitists that are Staff condition damage tank Necros that will preach how Berserkers gear is destroying the game and how Anet needs to fix it etc, and there are elitists that think they are the best Warrior on the planet because they could do CoF1 in 8 minutes while bragging about how their “Hundred Blades hits for 30k damage on the last hit alone.” Those are not good players that are willing to help, and you don’t want to give them incentive to join your run and troll you for an hour.

Bismuth.3165:

I’m guessing EU though, you’re from EU, right?

… ‘Open World Content (Fort Aspenwood)’

… i actually kind of like this idea… i had a great time teaching three newbies CoE a few days ago (after joining two god awful speedrun groups; left one because they couldnt dodge, the other disbanded because someone pulled Abom(b) – i believe thats called ‘cutting off your nose despite your face’?)… and normally put ‘experienced only’ in my descriptions (just because ive joined so many stupid speed run groups and dont have the patience to deal with bad newbies -the ones who dont listen or run around like idiots… i had two SE newbies join one of my experienced only SEp1+3 runs a couple of days ago… they immediately mentioned they were new… that told me that they would be attentive and listen so i didnt care – the other guy in the party at the time didnt either – and we had a pretty good run)

… that was rambly… something about… i dont mind attentive newbies; but i generally avoid all newbies because of bad experiences with ones that dont listen, run ahead or do stupid stuff (bowbear)

Here’s a good incentive: how about bads stop demonising us and calling us elitists?

If the gw2 community wasn’t so entitled and full of zerker-hating scrubs I’d be more willing to spend my time teaching people, but they’d rather defend their use of bad gear and their poor attempts of imposing a trinity by “being tanky” or “giving lots of heals”.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Helping-new-people-with-Arah/first#post2820407

colesy.8490:

Here’s a good incentive: how about bads stop demonising us and calling us elitists?

If the gw2 community wasn’t so entitled and full of zerker-hating scrubs I’d be more willing to spend my time teaching people, but they’d rather defend their use of bad gear and their poor attempts of imposing a trinity by “being tanky” or “giving lots of heals”.

First, I love zerkers. Four of my (all exotic geared or better) 80 toons are zerker including War, Thief, Ranger and Mes. I also have 80 support Guard (in SS on original post) and 80 support Ele. I don’t feel entitled at all, but I am sick of the kittens like yourself who are concerned only of yourself. There are people like you appear to be who the moment something doesn’t go perfectly, leave the group and refuse to slow down a bit to teach and accept the fact that not everyone yet has the same experience as you do.

It’s kittens like you that fail to realize that if more of you who knew exactly what you were doing and were willing to help others that you would over time help potentially increase the base of experienced players making the grouping experience even better. I think the satisfaction of running a group of new guys through something is great. I go the extra mile to stop the group and explain WHY we’re doing a certain something instead of just telling them what to do.

I play most of my classes well. With my altruistic guard, I run support and keep everyone buffed and healed as often as I can. But it doesn’t help when no one knows what is going on. All I’m asking is that people be a little less selfish and come to the realization that the stronger the base is, the better it is for you, too. And if Anet can assist in this by adding an incentive for you to not be a kitten, it would be great.

^ I dont’ think you realized you guys quit after a few wipe.

Most of the elitist talk can be translated to I’m a new and want veteran to carry me. Eventhough it is perfectly easy to find a group. And I want easy run myself, so veterans should party with me. But when they don’t, I need to say they are selfish and they want easy run.

If you want my advice. Just make a group called “P1”. You actually do meet veterans who will join. Not everytime, but it do happen.

And I realize your party quit on you. But nothing stop you from keep going. You could have just make a new listing called P1 half way cleared.

If you want to know. It take me a few hours to clear P1 for my dungeon master too.

generalizations everywhere…

FrankGrimey.7032:

colesy.8490:

Here’s a good incentive: how about bads stop demonising us and calling us elitists?

If the gw2 community wasn’t so entitled and full of zerker-hating scrubs I’d be more willing to spend my time teaching people, but they’d rather defend their use of bad gear and their poor attempts of imposing a trinity by “being tanky” or “giving lots of heals”.

First, I love zerkers. Four of my (all exotic geared or better) 80 toons are zerker including War, Thief, Ranger and Mes. I also have 80 support Guard (in SS on original post) and 80 support Ele. I don’t feel entitled at all, but I am sick of the kittens like yourself who are concerned only of yourself. There are people like you appear to be who the moment something doesn’t go perfectly, leave the group and refuse to slow down a bit to teach and accept the fact that not everyone yet has the same experience as you do.

It’s kittens like you that fail to realize that if more of you who knew exactly what you were doing and were willing to help others that you would over time help potentially increase the base of experienced players making the grouping experience even better. I think the satisfaction of running a group of new guys through something is great. I go the extra mile to stop the group and explain WHY we’re doing a certain something instead of just telling them what to do.

I play most of my classes well. With my altruistic guard, I run support and keep everyone buffed and healed as often as I can. But it doesn’t help when no one knows what is going on. All I’m asking is that people be a little less selfish and come to the realization that the stronger the base is, the better it is for you, too. And if Anet can assist in this by adding an incentive for you to not be a kitten, it would be great.

People don’t want to be told how they can play better. The amount of times I’ve heard “I’m always res’ing zerkers” or “if you go zerker you just die” – so many people in this game are beyond hope.

Personally I’m burnt out, I only ever run with contacts, sometimes guildies or if using LFG, “experienced only”.

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve. I hate the entitlement rampant on the forum and it’s at the point where all I really have the strength to do is troll, condescend or just laugh at it all.

Spend five seconds in this forum, I’m pretty sure I get told “I play how I want” like at least once a day on this forum.

Linguistically Inept.6583:

generalizations everywhere…

Yes I generalized people. Because you can basically see a bunch of newbie calling out name for other veteran that don’t want to group with them. When they are pretty much the same people.

People are people weather they play video game 10 hours a day or 10 hours a week.

FrankGrimey.7032:

colesy.8490:

Here’s a good incentive: how about bads stop demonising us and calling us elitists?

If the gw2 community wasn’t so entitled and full of zerker-hating scrubs I’d be more willing to spend my time teaching people, but they’d rather defend their use of bad gear and their poor attempts of imposing a trinity by “being tanky” or “giving lots of heals”.

First, I love zerkers. Four of my (all exotic geared or better) 80 toons are zerker including War, Thief, Ranger and Mes. I also have 80 support Guard (in SS on original post) and 80 support Ele. I don’t feel entitled at all, but I am sick of the kittens like yourself who are concerned only of yourself. There are people like you appear to be who the moment something doesn’t go perfectly, leave the group and refuse to slow down a bit to teach and accept the fact that not everyone yet has the same experience as you do.

It’s kittens like you that fail to realize that if more of you who knew exactly what you were doing and were willing to help others that you would over time help potentially increase the base of experienced players making the grouping experience even better. I think the satisfaction of running a group of new guys through something is great. I go the extra mile to stop the group and explain WHY we’re doing a certain something instead of just telling them what to do.

I play most of my classes well. With my altruistic guard, I run support and keep everyone buffed and healed as often as I can. But it doesn’t help when no one knows what is going on. All I’m asking is that people be a little less selfish and come to the realization that the stronger the base is, the better it is for you, too. And if Anet can assist in this by adding an incentive for you to not be a kitten, it would be great.

Using a support build is a detriment to the team you are playing with. It makes you feel useful when you actually aren’t.

Anyways, I’ll speak about what you were focusing on. I used to do pugs so I could teach people what to do. I still make build videos, and before I had my own channel I helped Strife with a lot of his stuff. I answer questions when someone whispers me in game, I respond to pretty much every Youtube comment or private message that I get, but I don’t do pugs much anymore and I don’t bother trying to teach people how to play by playing with them and taking them through a dungeon. Whenever you devote a lot of your time to trying to make other people better players by coaching them along or holding their hand, you realize that it takes a lot of time. You also come to an even greater realization: there are an infinite amount of people like this, and you can’t help them all. You also come in contact with idiots that think they are carrying their group by using an AH Guardian with 4000% boon duration and Hammer just because they are so afraid of dying and looking bad since they’ve convinced themselves that they are good. Trying to teach people how to do every path of Arah every single day you play Guild Wars 2 is tiring and draining, and you realize that it’s pretty much a waste of time. People could watch your videos instead, people could learn by themselves just like I did, people could make an effort to find a guild that has players willing to take them along, whatever the case is. And now, since I don’t want to waste time coaching people through Arah, I’m being called an elitist with no distinction being made about my actual level of skill and people ridicule my good builds because they think heal support Cleric’s gear is better. We wanted to help at one point, but a community of infinite juvenile tools drove us to where we are today: taking shots back at those people on forums because there is nothing left for us to do. We mastered the game and we can do nothing more with our knowledge because most people aren’t willing to listen to it. They want to call us elitists instead.

And the TL;DR version since people are casuals at reading

Most, based on their experience seem to have the opinion that running with noobs and trying to explain to them is some god-awful experience. I guess I hold the opinion I do because it’s mostly been the complete opposite with me. After the first encounter or two in a dungeon, I can usually tell who is new. I’ll then ask in the party if anyone is. When they raise their hand, I proceed to explain and in most situations like this, the group goes fine. It’s not fast like when I run in all zerk groups, but it’s still done in a reasonable amount of time. They may be accepting of me guiding them cause I don’t have a condescending tone and don’t belittle anyone, but I guess that’s just me.

Forgive me (all of you who oppose my opinion) for asking people to try and do the same. I’m (and many others new to some content) not looking for a handout. I’m looking for help. I pull my weight. It’s easier done with some experienced mixed in who are willing to teach then trying to learn from scratch with an all inexperienced group and again, it works out better for everyone because it increases the base of players who know what to do.

It seems people find it absurd when helpfulness is asked of them.

If you really want to do arah P1. I’ll do it with you. I’m pretty bad myself, only did it a few times, but at least I won’t quit. So set up a time and I’ll join.

And there are other people who say they willing to join you in this post, or have post about helping new people out for the dungeon.

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

FrankGrimey.7032:

colesy.8490:

Here’s a good incentive: how about bads stop demonising us and calling us elitists?

If the gw2 community wasn’t so entitled and full of zerker-hating scrubs I’d be more willing to spend my time teaching people, but they’d rather defend their use of bad gear and their poor attempts of imposing a trinity by “being tanky” or “giving lots of heals”.

First, I love zerkers. Four of my (all exotic geared or better) 80 toons are zerker including War, Thief, Ranger and Mes. I also have 80 support Guard (in SS on original post) and 80 support Ele. I don’t feel entitled at all, but I am sick of the kittens like yourself who are concerned only of yourself. There are people like you appear to be who the moment something doesn’t go perfectly, leave the group and refuse to slow down a bit to teach and accept the fact that not everyone yet has the same experience as you do.

It’s kittens like you that fail to realize that if more of you who knew exactly what you were doing and were willing to help others that you would over time help potentially increase the base of experienced players making the grouping experience even better. I think the satisfaction of running a group of new guys through something is great. I go the extra mile to stop the group and explain WHY we’re doing a certain something instead of just telling them what to do.

I play most of my classes well. With my altruistic guard, I run support and keep everyone buffed and healed as often as I can. But it doesn’t help when no one knows what is going on. All I’m asking is that people be a little less selfish and come to the realization that the stronger the base is, the better it is for you, too. And if Anet can assist in this by adding an incentive for you to not be a kitten, it would be great.

Using a support build is a detriment to the team you are playing with. It makes you feel useful when you actually aren’t.

Anyways, I’ll speak about what you were focusing on. I used to do pugs so I could teach people what to do. I still make build videos, and before I had my own channel I helped Strife with a lot of his stuff. I answer questions when someone whispers me in game, I respond to pretty much every Youtube comment or private message that I get, but I don’t do pugs much anymore and I don’t bother trying to teach people how to play by playing with them and taking them through a dungeon. Whenever you devote a lot of your time to trying to make other people better players by coaching them along or holding their hand, you realize that it takes a lot of time. You also come to an even greater realization: there are an infinite amount of people like this, and you can’t help them all. You also come in contact with idiots that think they are carrying their group by using an AH Guardian with 4000% boon duration and Hammer just because they are so afraid of dying and looking bad since they’ve convinced themselves that they are good. Trying to teach people how to do every path of Arah every single day you play Guild Wars 2 is tiring and draining, and you realize that it’s pretty much a waste of time. People could watch your videos instead, people could learn by themselves just like I did, people could make an effort to find a guild that has players willing to take them along, whatever the case is. And now, since I don’t want to waste time coaching people through Arah, I’m being called an elitist with no distinction being made about my actual level of skill and people ridicule my good builds because they think heal support Cleric’s gear is better. We wanted to help at one point, but a community of infinite juvenile tools drove us to where we are today: taking shots back at those people on forums because there is nothing left for us to do. We mastered the game and we can do nothing more with our knowledge because most people aren’t willing to listen to it. They want to call us elitists instead.

And the TL;DR version since people are casuals at reading

I completely understand what you’re saying. You can’t teach everyone all the time. And I know it can be frustrating. I’ve been in the seat often. But what caused me to make OP, was after the all noob group was taking so long, prior to hopping in LFG, there were ~10 posts for Arah and EVERY SINGLE ONE was essentially saying no noobs. That’s kitten sad.

Also, in response to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting harder/faster. 2) no one else in my group had a support build, so I used it. I usually run zerk because it’s fun. But I’ll bring to the group what I feel is the best fit.

FrankGrimey.7032:

Most, based on their experience seem to have the opinion that running with noobs and trying to explain to them is some god-awful experience. I guess I hold the opinion I do because it’s mostly been the complete opposite with me. After the first encounter or two in a dungeon, I can usually tell who is new. I’ll then ask in the party if anyone is. When they raise their hand, I proceed to explain and in most situations like this, the group goes fine. It’s not fast like when I run in all zerk groups, but it’s still done in a reasonable amount of time. They may be accepting of me guiding them cause I don’t have a condescending tone and don’t belittle anyone, but I guess that’s just me.

Forgive me (all of you who oppose my opinion) for asking people to try and do the same. I’m (and many others new to some content) not looking for a handout. I’m looking for help. I pull my weight. It’s easier done with some experienced mixed in who are willing to teach then trying to learn from scratch with an all inexperienced group and again, it works out better for everyone because it increases the base of players who know what to do.

It seems people find it absurd when helpfulness is asked of them.

And let me bluntly ask you how often you run dungeon. It’s easy for someone who don’t run dungeon often to say that. But for people who run the same dungeon everyday it is much harder.

If you ran a dungeon a few hundred times, and you still do that instead of making post which say “LFM experience only”, you are a better man than alot of us.

And if you are, all I can say is you are one good man. I ran AC twice this week just to help low level. But I surely won’t do it everyday.

FrankGrimey.7032:

Most, based on their experience seem to have the opinion that running with noobs and trying to explain to them is some god-awful experience. I guess I hold the opinion I do because it’s mostly been the complete opposite with me. After the first encounter or two in a dungeon, I can usually tell who is new. I’ll then ask in the party if anyone is. When they raise their hand, I proceed to explain and in most situations like this, the group goes fine. It’s not fast like when I run in all zerk groups, but it’s still done in a reasonable amount of time. They may be accepting of me guiding them cause I don’t have a condescending tone and don’t belittle anyone, but I guess that’s just me.

Forgive me (all of you who oppose my opinion) for asking people to try and do the same. I’m (and many others new to some content) not looking for a handout. I’m looking for help. I pull my weight. It’s easier done with some experienced mixed in who are willing to teach then trying to learn from scratch with an all inexperienced group and again, it works out better for everyone because it increases the base of players who know what to do.

It seems people find it absurd when helpfulness is asked of them.

I pugged Arah path 4 twice a day for 2 months so I could help people with their DM title and also try and farm the Bloodstone Fragment recipe. You haven’t done enough teaching to know how I feel about pugs.

FrankGrimey

Also, in response to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting harder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in response to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting harder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

The valor tree dont’ actually support your group. But I’m say most of the AH guardian spec in honor tree anyway.

I’m actually pretty bad for specing in AH myself. But at least I wear full zerker so hopefully that isn’t too bad.

Broadicea.8294:

if pugs weren’t so kittening horrible and so godkitten unkittening grateful to be taught something and so kittening resistant to changing their idiotic training wheel, non-contributing-kitten -kittenin-no-damage-kitten -doin-kittenin-20-minute-lupicus-killin-kitten ways I might be more inclined to help them out

GW2 worst player base in mmo history, BELIEVE DAT

I never seen an mmo where people complain that they need to get carry because they quit on a dungeon after 90 minutes. NEVER.

Helping people is one of the most rewarding things to do, for me at least. I enjoy knowing that at the end of it, the time I invested was worth it, because the people I helped appreciated it and gained something from it.

But there is absolutely nothing worse than a bad investment. Knowing that you put time and effort into helping people, just to get abused at the end of it, not to be shown any appreciation at all for your efforts. It sucks.

Does anyone here want help with Arah? Sure. These are my conditions.

-You are using Berserker gear.
-You are willing to listen to me, and respect what I have to say.
-You have the desire to actually learn and improve.

These aren’t very demanding conditions. If people can abide by these, I will help them. I will take time out of my day to teach them what they want to know.

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in response to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting harder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

CoE Path 2 and 3. Aplha. It varies but sometimes, its too much too often with the AE he does Support helps there. Just one example.

FrankGrimey.7032:

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in response to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting harder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

CoE Path 2 and 3. Aplha. It varies but sometimes, its too much too often with the AE he does Support helps there. Just one example.

Unless I’m a noob, AH don’t actually heal you ally. Nothing in that tree even support your ally. All it does is make you survive better, but nothing about your ally.

laokoko.7403:

FrankGrimey.7032:

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in response to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting harder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

CoE Path 2 and 3. Aplha. It varies but sometimes, its too much too often with the AE he does Support helps there. Just one example.

Unless I’m a noob, AH don’t actually heal you ally. Nothing in that tree even support your ally. All it does is make you survive better, but nothing about your ally.

I have symbols, dodge roll (which on avg heals about 10% per roll, AND I can roll 3-4 in a row before no endurance. I have the F2 forgot the name. And that combined with the elite that resets F1-F3, I heal a lot. That in addition to the fact that I prioritize empowering over my own damage which is low. I also can take a hit. Often times, I can stand and take damage then others can’t. But this is all besides my point which people don’t seem to care about being selfish so I give up. Be selfish. I’ll learn via YouTube and join the no noob groups.

You really don’t need to put a LFG title which says “I’m new”. That usually just attract a group of 5 newbie.

Just put a title which says LFM P1. I think the chance you met 1 or 2 experienced people is quite good if you do that. At least it is for me.

FrankGrimey.7032:

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in response to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting harder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

CoE Path 2 and 3. Aplha. It varies but sometimes, its too much too often with the AE he does Support helps there. Just one example.

Support does nothing there because Alpha hits like a train. And the attacks are so clearly choreographed that you’re better off just dodging.

Though carry on proving my point about people not listening.

laokoko.7403:

FrankGrimey.7032:

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in response to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting harder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

CoE Path 2 and 3. Aplha. It varies but sometimes, its too much too often with the AE he does Support helps there. Just one example.

Unless I’m a noob, AH don’t actually heal you ally. Nothing in that tree even support your ally. All it does is make you survive better, but nothing about your ally.

The guardian’s valor tree also provides extra toughness, precision based on toughness, and crit damage. I can have over 3k attack and over 100% crit dmg while still having 40% base crit chance and 3k armor on an AH build. It’s hardly worthless just because it’s no longer the flavor of the month build. You just have to know how to make it work.

Talking about how you support with a Guardian isn’t making you sound like someone we would sympathize with. It makes you sound like an ignorant BHB.

laokoko.7403:

You really don’t need to put a LFG title which says “I’m new”. That usually just attract a group of 5 newbie.

Just put a title which says LFM P1. I think the chance you met 1 or 2 experienced people is quite good if you do that. At least it is for me.

I’ll watch the vids and try to follow along.

laokoko.7403:

FrankGrimey.7032:

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in response to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting harder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

CoE Path 2 and 3. Aplha. It varies but sometimes, its too much too often with the AE he does Support helps there. Just one example.

Unless I’m a noob, AH don’t actually heal you ally. Nothing in that tree even support your ally. All it does is make you survive better, but nothing about your ally.

Don’t waste your time.

laokoko.7403:

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in response to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting harder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

I’m actually pretty bad for specing in AH myself. But at least I wear full zerker so hopefully that isn’t too bad.

its 30 trait points that could be better spent elsewhere (fiery wrath,unscathed contender, elusive power and radiant power being low cost, big effect or having several other powerful traits in their trees)

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey.7032:

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in response to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting harder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

CoE Path 2 and 3. Aplha. It varies but sometimes, its too much too often with the AE he does Support helps there. Just one example.

Support does nothing there because Alpha hits like a train. And the attacks are so clearly choreographed that you’re better off just dodging.

Though carry on proving my point about people not listening.

I know CoE well. And it varies. Sometimes, the zergers can’t dodge often enough. When I run my zerk War, I keep energy sigil on offhand to swap to which helps. But this kinda is the point too. If me running supportis useless, playing with someone who knows better would make me wise to that and I can run something else better for the situation.

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

………

This post reminded me of this

FrankGrimey.7032:

laokoko.7403:

FrankGrimey.7032:

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in response to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting harder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

CoE Path 2 and 3. Aplha. It varies but sometimes, its too much too often with the AE he does Support helps there. Just one example.

Unless I’m a noob, AH don’t actually heal you ally. Nothing in that tree even support your ally. All it does is make you survive better, but nothing about your ally.

I have symbols, dodge roll (which on avg heals about 10% per roll, AND I can roll 3-4 in a row before no endurance. I have the F2 forgot the name. And that combined with the elite that resets F1-F3, I heal a lot. That in addition to the fact that I prioritize empowering over my own damage which is low. I also can take a hit. Often times, I can stand and take damage then others can’t. But this is all besides my point which people don’t seem to care about being selfish so I give up. Be selfish. I’ll learn via YouTube and join the no noob groups.

I didn’t say guardian is bad at support. I just say that tree actually didn’t support your group at all.

And I like your attitude. Other people are selfish to care about their time when you can’t stand to take your time to do the dungeon yourself.

Linguistically Inept.6583:

laokoko.7403:

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in response to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting harder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

I’m actually pretty bad for specing in AH myself. But at least I wear full zerker so hopefully that isn’t too bad.

its 30 trait points that could be better spent elsewhere (fiery wrath,unscathed contender, elusive power and radiant power being low cost, big effect or having several other powerful traits in their trees)

I blame strife lol. I copied his build. But I’m kind of a noob. Those toughness helped me from getting 1 shot when I missed my dodge.

But having more toughness do help grab more agro, so if you mean support as in tanking. I suppose.

Bismuth.3165:

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

………

This post reminded me of this

It’s more like this:

OP bro I get it, you see a lot of numbers so you think you’re achieving a lot. But they’re not trying to be jerks by telling you [DEFENSIVE] support is useless. They’re trying to help you, and much like a new pug that needs a lesson, you just aren’t accepting that their suggestion has at all any validity.

So I ask, if you’re doing Alpha, what do you think is better? Killing him in 2 seconds with no need for [defensive] support? Or killing him in 2 minutes, giving him more and more opportunity to catch someone slipping up on a dodge roll, one after another, until it’s just you and one other guy their, and you’re still just healing yourself?

laokoko.7403:

FrankGrimey.7032:

laokoko.7403:

FrankGrimey.7032:

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in respons. to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting . rder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

CoE Path 2 and 3. Aplha. It varies but sometimes, its too much too often with the AE he does Support helps there. Just one example.

Unless I’m a noob, AH don’t actually heal you ally. Nothing in that tree even support your ally. All it does is make you survive better, but nothing about your ally.

I have symbols, dodge roll (which on avg heals about 10% per roll, AND I can roll 3-4 in a row before no endurance. I have the F2 forgot the name. And that combined with the elite that resets F1-F3, I heal a lot. That in addition to the fact that I prioritize empowering over my own damage which is low. I also can take a hit. Often times, I can stand and take damage then others can’t. But this is all besides my point which people don’t seem to care about being selfish so I give up. Be selfish. I’ll learn via YouTube and join the no noob groups.

I didn’t say guardian is bad at support. I just say that tree actually didn’t support your group at all.

And I like your attitude. Other people are selfish to care about their time when you can’t stand to take your time to do the dungeon yourself.

My sarcasm detector is broken. But I wasn’t even talking about any tree for my spec. I’m an altruistic on my guardian by definition of the word altruistic. My heals focus on group healing. Contrary to what someone else said, it is useful. And again, I reiterate (in response to whoever said support guard or altruistic guard is pointless in Arah) that if people were willing to be a little more helpful, I would have known.

But I give up. I’ll follow someone else’s advice and just join a group after I watch the vids. Then I’ll start open groups when I know what I’m doing in there.

FrankGrimey.7032:

My sarcasm detector is broken. But I wasn’t even talking about any tree for my spec. I’m an altruistic on my guardian by definition of the word altruistic. My heals focus on group healing. Contrary to what someone else said, it is useful. And again, I reiterate (in response to whoever said support guard or altruistic guard is pointless in Arah) that if people were willing to be a little more helpful, I would have known.

But I give up. I’ll follow someone else’s advice and just join a group after I watch the vids. Then I’ll start open groups when I know what I’m doing in there.

… it is in wvw… in pve you should focus around preventing taking hits (guardian does it amazing with blinds, aegis and projectile reflect/deflect) and killing stuff before they can kill your team

FrankGrimey.7032:

laokoko.7403:

FrankGrimey.7032:

laokoko.7403:

FrankGrimey.7032:

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in respons. to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting . rder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

CoE Path 2 and 3. Aplha. It varies but sometimes, its too much too often with the AE he does Support helps there. Just one example.

Unless I’m a noob, AH don’t actually heal you ally. Nothing in that tree even support your ally. All it does is make you survive better, but nothing about your ally.

I have symbols, dodge roll (which on avg heals about 10% per roll, AND I can roll 3-4 in a row before no endurance. I have the F2 forgot the name. And that combined with the elite that resets F1-F3, I heal a lot. That in addition to the fact that I prioritize empowering over my own damage which is low. I also can take a hit. Often times, I can stand and take damage then others can’t. But this is all besides my point which people don’t seem to care about being selfish so I give up. Be selfish. I’ll learn via YouTube and join the no noob groups.

I didn’t say guardian is bad at support. I just say that tree actually didn’t support your group at all.

And I like your attitude. Other people are selfish to care about their time when you can’t stand to take your time to do the dungeon yourself.

My sarcasm detector is broken. But I wasn’t even talking about any tree for my spec. I’m an altruistic on my guardian by definition of the word altruistic. My heals focus on group healing. Contrary to what someone else said, it is useful. And again, I reiterate (in response to whoever said support guard or altruistic guard is pointless in Arah) that if people were willing to be a little more helpful, I would have known.

But I give up. I’ll follow someone else’s advice and just join a group after I watch the vids. Then I’ll start open groups when I know what I’m doing in there.

Stop making a case for your AH build helping things. It doesn’t. It draws fights out and gives you a false sense of being helpful. It’s also very lazy because people use it so they don’t have to dodge.

Young Somalia.1706:

OP bro I get it, you see a lot of numbers so you think you’re achieving a lot. But they’re not trying to be jerks by telling you [DEFENSIVE] support is useless. They’re trying to help you, and much like a new pug that needs a lesson, you just aren’t accepting that their suggestion has at all any validity.

So I ask, if you’re doing Alpha, what do you think is better? Killing him in 2 seconds with no need for [defensive] support? Or killing him in 2 minutes, giving him more and more opportunity to catch someone slipping up on a dodge roll, one after another, until it’s just you and one other guy their, and you’re still just healing yourself?

Dont try and mix words. Only numbers I watch are my DPS when I play zerk. When I play guard, I watch party health bars and buffs. And I already admitted I’d run something other than support guard if there were someone to show me a better way. They’re busy playing only with others who know. So until then, I’ll do what I know works.

FrankGrimey.7032:

And I already admitted I’d run something other than support guard if there were someone to show me a better way. They’re busy playing only with others who know. So until then, I’ll do what I know works.

people have just told you theres better ways… its more offensively orientated (i use 20/15/0/25/10… but idk if thats any good "/)

My ACTUAL advice not pertinent to maximum efficiency, but for learning:

Learn the paths in order of 3-2-1. That’s order of difficulty for a pug. It will give you an easing into Arah and the mobs, so when the running portions start adding more and more enemies, you’re more used to it.

But you’ll probably get lost running until you know the paths anyway. But regardless. Don’t start learning Arah on P1. It will hurt more than it will help.

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

FrankGrimey.7032:

laokoko.7403:

FrankGrimey.7032:

laokoko.7403:

FrankGrimey.7032:

colesy.8490:

FrankGrimey

Also, in respons. to the support comment, that’s BS. 1) support helps keep group alive and hitting . rder/faster.

Me

I’m sick of people playing badly, and I’m sick of them not wanting to improve

This is exactly why I hate teaching PUGs. You support just as well in zerker, and AH builds are trash.

CoE Path 2 and 3. Aplha. It varies but sometimes, its too much too often with the AE he does Support helps there. Just one example.

Unless I’m a noob, AH don’t actually heal you ally. Nothing in that tree even support your ally. All it does is make you survive better, but nothing about your ally.

I have symbols, dodge roll (which on avg heals about 10% per roll, AND I can roll 3-4 in a row before no endurance. I have the F2 forgot the name. And that combined with the elite that resets F1-F3, I heal a lot. That in addition to the fact that I prioritize empowering over my own damage which is low. I also can take a hit. Often times, I can stand and take damage then others can’t. But this is all besides my point which people don’t seem to care about being selfish so I give up. Be selfish. I’ll learn via YouTube and join the no noob groups.

I didn’t say guardian is bad at support. I just say that tree actually didn’t support your group at all.

And I like your attitude. Other people are selfish to care about their time when you can’t stand to take your time to do the dungeon yourself.

My sarcasm detector is broken. But I wasn’t even talking about any tree for my spec. I’m an altruistic on my guardian by definition of the word altruistic. My heals focus on group healing. Contrary to what someone else said, it is useful. And again, I reiterate (in response to whoever said support guard or altruistic guard is pointless in Arah) that if people were willing to be a little more helpful, I would have known.

But I give up. I’ll follow someone else’s advice and just join a group after I watch the vids. Then I’ll start open groups when I know what I’m doing in there.

Stop making a case for your AH build helping things. It doesn’t. It draws fights out and gives you a false sense of being helpful. It’s also very lazy because people use it so they don’t have to dodge.

I invite you to run CoE with me. I’ve run it too with all zerk warriors and we’ve ripped through all paths, but with other groups of same composition, it has failed because people ran out of energy, couldn’t dodge and died. It varies. Alpha sometimes spams AE, sometimes he doesnt. I’m all for throwing max damage at everything but in my experience, not all encounters work that way making support necessary. And I’d argue for the last time my preference is zerk. Four of my six 80’s are full zerk. If damage is better for Arah, then that is what I’ll run.

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

Talking about how you support with a Guardian isn’t making you sound like someone we would sympathize with. It makes you sound like an ignorant BHB.

ok ok is this what bhb stands for

kitten kitten

^ didnt work is it
b-tt h—t b-t-h

Young Somalia.1706:

My ACTUAL advice not pertinent to maximum efficiency, but for learning:

Learn the paths in order of 3-2-1. That’s order of difficulty for a pug. It will give you an easing into Arah and the mobs, so when the running portions start adding more and more enemies, you’re more used to it.

But you’ll probably get lost running until you know the paths anyway. But regardless. Don’t start learning Arah on P1. It will hurt more than it will help.

Thanks much. I’ll do that.

The one thing Arah shares is the same halfway/three-quarter-way boss, Lupicus. By doing path 3 a bunch of times, then 2 a bunch, then one, you will learn Lupicus for all paths and not look like a kitten if you did join an exp group trying to slip through the cracks.