Guild Wars 2

Can someone name some of these bosses?

Instant death abilities are fine if they are avoidable, no game is fun if you have a percent chance to die no matter what. But if a boss is about to use one of these abilities try to make the warning very clear. I have heard that many bosses charging up is not very clear and I think that if I am about to die from one hit I think its only right I am clearly warned so I have a time to react. I don’t want to put my head at the screen trying so hard to look at a small change on the boss mixed in with all the other effects.

Well, most of them have kind of obvious animation that warn you.
However:
-Many are almost impossible to see because of all the fireballs etc. raining down on the boss, some on-hit effects even look exactly like the telling animation. At least the spider in TA up seems to have the same effect for its cast time as a thief or ranger with a shortbow… maybe it was also some other class?
-It is not always clear when during those animations you have to dodge. This can be found out by repetition but some abilities seem to be really funky there.
-Trash mobs also have those charge up animations. However, the above two problems still exist. They also tend to be a lot smaller so they are even harder to spot.

First boss in Mursaat path likes to instagib people without any obvious mechanic (at least not any that I’ve been able to see after killing it almost a dozen times). I know it does that lightning orb thing which leaves a red circle on the ground right before it hits, but sometimes I just die instantly, no red circle anywhere near me.

Could just be all the effects flying around, as it’s sometimes difficult to tell with my groups mesmer throwing down chaos storm, the elementalist throwing around ground AoE as well, and all the smoke and flames in the room. /shrug

Other than that, I can’t think of anything that has instagibed me without any proper warning.

The final boss at the end of the Jotun path in Arah instant kills you if you get hit by the blue orb. But it’s very easy to counter…

The lieutenant in AC.
Mass pull+Mass oneshot ftw.

It never gets me due to Balanced Stance / Dolyak / Endure pain / Defy Pain, but I love seeing others getting sucked in and going downed.
I can’t help but explode in laughter :p

Red Falcon.8257:

The lieutenant in AC.
Mass pull+Mass oneshot ftw.

It never gets me due to Balanced Stance / Dolyak / Endure pain / Defy Pain, but I love seeing others getting sucked in and going downed.
I can’t help but explode in laughter :p

break stun + dodge helps to evade damaging ability (if you dodge without break stun – you have chance to stay alive if your reactions are good – done that with glass cannon build warrior), it is also possible to evade his pull as he charges it for some time.

There are no instant death abilities. All have warnings and can be countered with dodge at the minimum.

Instant death would be getting Death Touched by Cazic-Thule. Big difference.

Subject alpha in CoE explorable. Getting crystal’d then aoe on top of you is instant death unless you can teleport out like a mesmer or thief. That, or hopefully your party breaks the crystal.

Icey.6045:

There are no instant death abilities. All have warnings and can be countered with dodge at the minimum.

Instant death would be getting Death Touched by Cazic-Thule. Big difference.

You are correct as far as I have seen. But I think your example is only going to make sense to 2 other people that play this game.

Icey.6045:

There are no instant death abilities. All have warnings and can be countered with dodge at the minimum.

Instant death would be getting Death Touched by Cazic-Thule. Big difference.

Kudu’s killing shot has hardly visible charge animation because he is kitten halfhalflingasura and there are a lot of effects from party members.

I second the request for some “impending attack” GUI element which doesn’t require me to use a magnifying glass on the monitor.

Checking minute animation differences is hard enough, but when you factor in the total overkill Arenanet pulled off on lights and particle effects for just about any player ability, it becomes nearly impossible to see what the boss is actually doing.

Why don’t we have a (relocable) enemy castbar?

Lt Kholer is a pushover once you see the animation and keep him crippled the whole fight, cripple, kite, dodge..

The second golem boss in SF though… the fire projetiles hitboxes are much bigger than the actual projectile and as a result is kitten hard to dodge, sideways is wrong, backwards is wrong, forward works occationally…

Has everyone forgotten about the BEES? Who has NEVER been roflstomped by one of those Deathly Swarms in the fwd/up path of Twilight Arbor?

I know they aren’t a boss or anything… But c’mon, Zhaitan isnt the problem, we need to look out for them bees man.

…hate those bees…

Red Falcon.8257:

The lieutenant in AC.
Mass pull+Mass oneshot ftw.

Lol, if I fail that dodge I switch to Earth attunement for 33% less damage and survive his combo.xD Not a 1-hit kill attack.

The one that gets me is actually not from the bosses.
The “1 hit” that seriously bugs me is from the gravelings in AC. One of the variants has the ability to KD for a long duration after the initial pounce, and the graveling would just sit on top of you and chew you to death (all through downed state, and all the way to actual death, most of the time, mind you).

Unlike the bosses’ one hit attacks, the charge up for this attack is even harder to see, as there’ll be about a million other gravelings running around at the same time.
And to make things just a tad more annoying, it’s got a deceivingly big area of effect. There were many times when I would try and res a downed party member (from behind them, as far as I can be from the graveling) when they’re hit by this skill, and end up joining them as graveling food.

So far, the only counter I’ve found when being chewed is to pop Blinding Powder or Signet of Shadows as soon as the KD hit. But it seems they love to hit me with the pounce when I have both skills on CD lol.

The Lieutenant in AC frustrates us to no end.

Not only is his wind-up barely noticeable without constantly watching for his animations, but it also breaks through Dodge and even pulls through the Pillars sometimes due to lag.

Also, with the high amount of conditions and damage floating around, we are still supposed to also fit in a stun break somewhere in our 3 utility skills, and if you are distracted for a second – bam insta death.

Rifle bandits in CM, targeted by 2-3 bandits in a row, endurance quickly depleted – insta death.

With the completely random aggro mechanic (? we can’t find a pattern), the bosses still focus on downed players even with others attacking him, so you can watch your character getting beaten to death slowly because its fun!

Our guild consists of rather experienced dungeon runners from previous MMOs (LOTRO), but we cannot figure out how to beat the dungeons with the instant-death penalties on every little mistake and the crazy amounts of damage/conditions/cc enemies inflict with very little recovery options. With the high rep costs, we stop trying to figure out fights after a few attempts because nobody wants to pay precious silver for something that isn’t fun and get’s us nowhere.

So we will completely stop running GW2 dungeons for the time being, besides Arah for the story. Try making them fun next time, Anet.

Killed giganticus with my first time in Arah explorable, cleared tons of other explorables.

“Has everyone forgotten about the BEES? Who has NEVER been roflstomped by one of those Deathly Swarms in the fwd/up path of Twilight Arbor?”

I hate those bees. Lucky I run with people that can easily get by them and disarm the trap for me. If your going to do that stuff ANet use the idea from CoF Boulder trap. At least there only 3 of the 5 players have to make it rather than 1 running and kittening others past it. That way bad players like me don’t have to do that crap, but you need some that can.

What would be great is if the boss mobs’s first ‘one shot’ attack dealt 50% of its intended damage, then 75%, then 100%. This would allow players to adjust their timing, as some bosses have a long wind-up and others have a short wind-up. Unless you have it completely memorized, you are likely to pull a kitten the first time.

Wait you can turn off bees?

downed =/= death… if your team doesn’t suck. Just quit pugging stuff.

The Nightmare Tree in TA has a weird buggy root skill. Usually it has the red circle but in weird situations (even after the last patch) the root can OHKO you without a red circle or warning.

Robert Hrouda.1327:

my contribution:

Kudu from the CoE story mode dungeon.

Oops, spoiler alert! lol

I don’t even want to know who designed this boss.

I have problem with stuff I can’t see that can instant drop someone; for example the gravelings in AC since they can jump you from behind, which you can’t see it’s coming, and just eat you to death while you can’t get up. I don’t have a problem with stuff I can see and avoid.

lieutenant in AC. I love this guy. Personally, I always try to dodge it, rather than just putting up shield block. It’s more exciting A well timed dodge is just so much more rewarding.

I would love to see the difficulty being based more on well timed dodges/reflexes, instead of difficulty based on large health pools and ridiculous skill spam

Although he did pull me through the kitten walls or pillars. That was a bit harsh, because I had no line of sight on him.

Subject Alpha in CoE is pretty difficult in a sense that he doesn’t OHKO per se’ but his crystallization ability makes you good as dead unless you stand ontop of multiple guardians using their AoE abilities.

I do believe some bosses SHOULD be able to OHKO the light armor classes provided that there is a decent AoE notification and he doesn’t stunlock you.

This whole thread is why dungeons are awful. Any time any boss has a 1 hit kill that is either pass or fail to me isn’t a fun mechanic. It just screams poor/lazy design. We can’t figure anything out so we will just give the boss 1 million HP and have him kill you in one shot. And the sad thing is that this is the basic design for all the bosses. Who cares if its a fireball, shadow walk, death touch, or whatever if the basic mechanic is see tell-dodge-profit then they are the same thing.

Kohler: You can EASILY dodge his pull, and a lot of classes can survive just fine if he does pull them in. On top of dodging you can use anti-projectile stuff like Shield of Absorbtion or Wall of Reflection. Beyond that you can also use stun breakers or stability to just walk away once he pulls you in without eating hits while knocked down.

Jotun Final Boss:

What? You just have everyone pick up a Reflection Crystal then stand around him in a circle. If you see a red circle under you for the Lava Fonts, you dodge. Otherwise, you just sit there and let him kill himself off of the reflects…

Subject Alpha:

Crystal does not mean death, even ignoring the part where your team can break it. I’m fairly certain he will never crystalize the person he is using the ice blast on, and the earth ring can be avoided by just not moving… I guess you could eventually die to the fire thing or the earth spikes, but that’s why your team can just break you out of the crystal.

Kudu:

I remember the animation being fairly obvious, but I only did story once and it was a while ago now, sooo shrug. Assuming it uses the same snipe animation as the Risen Deadeyes, you should also get a targeting indicator below your character when he uses his hard hitting attack on you.

And in regards to TA, I haven’t gotten a chance to see TA explorable yet. So, no comment.

@CtrlAltDel (my quote button is missing and I’m too lazy to do it manually)

The difference is that you can’t use the dodge roll for every mechanic, and many can be avoided in more ways than just the roll. Beyond that there’s also learning when it’s safe to revive a downed ally manually.

The difference is that you can’t use the dodge roll for every mechanic, and many can be avoided in more ways than just the roll.

But one of the absurdly annoying things about these one shots is that to learn you need to either spoil the dungeon for yourself (watching e.g. a youtube video) or learn by dying.
I really think it’s bad design.

Took me three tries to realize you could dodge the AC pull, and another two to roll out of the dog’s howl in CM. It’s easy enough to know that you can dodge out of pretty much everything, it’s still another thing to figure out where and when. I need better tells to do that. I need more of those charge animations. Maybe some emotes for off screen stuff.

gkaare.8576:

Icey.6045:

There are no instant death abilities. All have warnings and can be countered with dodge at the minimum.
Instant death would be getting Death Touched by Cazic-Thule. Big difference.

You are correct as far as I have seen. But I think your example is only going to make sense to 2 other people that play this game.

Cazic Thule shouts: Icey!
LOADING: PLEASE WAIT…

I am one of those two. I’ve even played as ridiculously tough bosses in live events for EQ. Mmm /shapechange 30. -Losing all your gear due to falling down the well in befallen. Good times.

I think the AC Lieutenant is a fun fight. It always reminds me to pay the heck attention when I get pulled in and it can be dodged out of even if you get pulled.

I will say it is often harder to tell these kinds of death-moves while underwater due to the lack of warning rings and significantly higher density of effects around the boss.

I think the one true honest to god great post in here was the one that simply asked

“why don’t we have an enemy castbar”

The particle effect is lovely, I get why it exists, but it’s also a beige brown hard to see and sometimes short windup, I don’t mind it being a short windup and like a bit of a challenge to keep me concentrated, but I would love the option to just have a hud umprovement which simply relayed the information to me in a concise way, and for me a cast bar is superior to everything in that regard.

Angel.4581:

Lt Kholer is a pushover once you see the animation and keep him crippled the whole fight, cripple, kite, dodge..

The second golem boss in SF though… the fire projetiles hitboxes are much bigger than the actual projectile and as a result is kitten hard to dodge, sideways is wrong, backwards is wrong, forward works occationally…

Projectile reflection. I think Warriors and Thieves are the only class completely without it, and they can stand behind someone with it. Like elementalist with their earth bubble up. If that fails, bring a mesmer. Feedback bubble totally nullifies this golem’s big aoe fire bombs. Even throws them back at him. It’s amazing.

@ Sarelm
Actually, thief does have projectile reflection. The elite skill Dagger Storm has the capability. The utility skill Smoke Screen also blocks projectiles, though I have not tried it against Lt Kholer yet.

Warriors can block with shield stance. Haven’t seen many warriors sporting a shield in AC much though.

Lt Kholer’s skill is still not nearly as scary as AC’s graveling scavenger, I’ve died more times from getting the death pounce from behind than to Lt Kholer.

Ahhh, interesting. I did not know that, but it explains why putting a feedback bubble on that skill no longer makes thieves kill themselves. And I honestly forgot about the Warrior’s shield. Probably for the same reason you mentioned, I never seem to see it.
And sanity yes. I have a 6 second get-me-out-of-knocked-down button and then just die to the one that find where I popped too immediately after I hit it. I hate those things so much.

cele.7398:

The Lieutenant in AC frustrates us to no end.

Not only is his wind-up barely noticeable without constantly watching for his animations, but it also breaks through Dodge and even pulls through the Pillars sometimes due to lag.

Kholer is actually one of the fairest bosses in GW2. He takes almost 3 seconds to raise his arm, the animation is clearly visible even through spell effects, etc.. It does not “break through dodge”, although lag spikes can make you fail the timing (and some people just dodge too soon, while his arm is still raised).

What you are saying about him pulling people through pillars is true, but not due to lag. A couple of pillars near Kholer (and a few other walls in AC) are immaterial. You can literally walk through them, and the harpoons go through them and pull you through them as well.

I’ve reported that using the bug report form several times, but apparently no one has had time to fix the collision boxes. Or maybe it’s deliberate because they think a dungeon full of ghosts should have ghost walls? If so, it’s a bit of a jerk move on the part of the designers.

In my opinion the messed up “frontal cones” of some of the final bosses and scavengers (that sometimes hit you even when you’re behind them) and the lack of cooldowns on some mobs, coupled with the lack of stunlocking protection (that cause players to get stunned or knocked back multiple times in a row, even if they have a stunbreaker) are far more annoying than anything Kholer does. I would classify those as outright bugs, not just bad or “unfair” encounter design.

Besides, if you find Kholer hard you can always ask a friendly troll to help you.

CtrlAltDel.5309:

Any time any boss has a 1 hit kill that is either pass or fail to me isn’t a fun mechanic. It just screams poor/lazy design.

I disagree, although I do think GW2 abuses one-shot-kill mechanics, and that most GW2 bosses are quite boring (too much HP, too repetitive, no phases, no imagination, no good use of the environment around them).

But I do think that one-shot-kill mechanics are acceptable in boss fights. Where I think they are pretty much unacceptable is mob fights, but GW2 abuses that even more. When a group of 5 or 10 mobs reacts together, and when there’s a chance that all of them will shoot the same player at the same time, that’s bad design (realistic, maybe, but still poor gameplay design). When one or two mobs in that group have a one-shot-kill ability (or an ability that takes >50% HP and can be cast in quick succession), that is bad design (even if they have a “tell” – there’s no way you can see them through GW2’s particle effects). When mobs have the ability to stun you or knock you back before the previous stun is even over, that is bad design. When mobs can hit you and pin you down even when they’re clearly facing away from you, that is bad design. When a mob can remove control of your character (through fear, stun, knockback, etc.) and keep damaging you while that mob itself is immune to pushbacks, interrupts or stuns cast by the rest of your party, that’s bad design.

And so on.

When you’re fighting a single boss, I find a one-shot-kill mechanic far easier to accept, because that’s the only thing you really need to be paying attention to (although some could use better “tells” – namely in terms of audio, since the image can get messy with all the spell effects that other players cast and you have no control over).

Trick to Kholer.

Bring a necro, every time he does the animation that winds himself up, do this combo. Roll backwards, F1, 3, F1. People may get pulled, but it voids the death move. He USUALLY has a 20 second delay so we can fear it every time. But then again, if you arent pugging, nobody should get pulled. L2D

Gravelings in AC path 1 I think it was hit harder than CHAMPIONS!! A lvl 35 quest is harder than lvl75 CoF, what the heck? Also, why is it impossible to hit any static object like graveling burrows with melee weapons? I hit once or twice then it says MISS all the time. I change to bow, and only my aoe skills hurt it, all the rest of my bow skills show either OBSTRUCTED or OUT OF RANGE when I am just 1 or 2 metres away from it!! Without fixing this, doesn’t matter your gear, your build, traits, skill with dodging, etc. Just tried AC and with the gravelings burrows and them zerging you with 50 gravelings at the same time, with invulnerable burrows…. this is NOT fun ANet. Not fun at all. I just closed the game in frustration. Ridiculous bugs keeps spoiling what could be the best game of the year.

Have only done a few explorable’s myself so far but my most hated is the worm at the start of TA explorable.
Not cause of the worm.. it wasn’t that bad.
But moving out of the way of the huge area of worm spit to have a kitten flower spawn under you and explode before you even saw it was so kitten annoying! And to make it worse because its a huge poison cloud unless your a mesmer you are guaranteed to be dead because your downed state heal is less than the damage and kitten if anyones coming over there to res you.