Guild Wars 2

Before someone calls me elitist for the following body of text, save your breath/typing fingers, everyone’s heard that one and nobody cares.

I PUG dungeons. Every day. I run with 1-2 friends and then fill the group out with whoever is willing. We have a regular rotation (AC3, SE1, HotW1, CoF1/2, the quick ones). I don’t have a problem with people who are new to these particular dungeons. I have a problem when they’ve obviously never done this before, yet vehemently deny this fact. Some quick examples:

SE1, elementalist spends the whole Nokk fight in water attunement, DPSing from the edge of the platform. I have to wizard stability to keep him from flying off for the whole fight. Fun. We establish the projectile blocking/reflecting order for golems, 2/3 of this is up to me and my friend. the last 1/3rd doesn’t go so well.

Another example from the same night:
AC3, we get a 3 man party merge. These guys were obviously looking to do story mode (highest level one was 50). Me and my friend stack up at the usual spot and request the others follow suit. No dice. We get one dead on the stairs, the other two run out into the spider room and die almost instantly. After waiting a particuarly long time for them to waypoint, they stack up. I expressly request that nobody moves. Well they do, and we wipe. They promply mass offline.

Don’t get me wrong, I have no problem running dungeons with people who’ve never done them, and I’ve taken more than a few people through their first SE1/COF2 rodeo (I always tell my PUG what we’re doing next and ask if they wanna tag along). It’s always been smooth sailing, as we take care to instruct these players beforehand what they need to do and so on to ensure a quick, clean run. Now that gw2lfg is more in-game than ever, it seems more and more people are taking to run dungeons, and that’s great. But there is an alarming trend of people not having any experience and turning what is usually a leisurely stroll into pulling teeth because they both deny not knowing what to do and refuse to follow advice given by the people who do. I run a full cleric guardian for pug dungeons, and I can usually keep even the mostly glassy people alive through most fights by sheer healing output, but there are limits to what this healing output can do.

Let me make one more thing clear, I don’t like to kick people, though my buddies will frequently request a second. But when someone pretends to know what they should do (when it is painfully obvious they don’t) and cause all sorts of trouble that makes everyone waste their time, resulting in people leaving or the player in question getting kicked. This wastes everyone’s time, and it’s not cool. It also puts my jeffries in a fluster something fierce.

I’ll just end this thread with the following plea: If you don’t know what to do, please kindly say so, we’re not gonna bite your head off or show up at your house with a baseball bat. And when someone outlines the strategy for a given boss fight, don’t spout your “play muh way” mantra when you’re DPSing a perfectly meleeable single target boss fight with a freaking shortbow, while claiming you’ve done this dungeon hundreds of times.

Bash me if you will, I’ve said what we’ve all been thinking.

You’d probably be able to carry pugs better if you weren’t using awful cleric gear. I hope you aren’t an AH guard.

None of this is tied to the LFG tool at all. The type of people you seem to be complaining about have always existed, and this type of thread has been made many many times. The new LFG tool hasn’t changed this in any way. Your sample set may seem worse off than it was before, but your hasty conclusion serves no purpose. All that is happening is that a wider variety of people are going to be doing dungeons now because more of them have a tool to find groups right in front of them that they don’t have to go to a browser for. This however says nothing about which of them are going to be cooperative and attentive to those trying to explain things. Your question is just pointless.

Edit: Also colesy…just…what?

colesy.8490:

You’d probably be able to carry pugs better if you weren’t using awful cleric gear. I hope you aren’t an AH guard.

If you know of any builds that let me force my party members to dodge out of stuff they don’t stand a snowball’s chance in hell in facetanking, do tell.

It’s called “screw you guys, you can res after the fight”. I PUG’d COE a few days ago with some random guild group and I completely ignored their bearbow ranger who kept downing because they were useless and we might as well have 4-manned. I don’t think he even used frost spirit, he used storm and sun instead.

Again in COE with PUGs, they were all faceplanting and then I went to solo the rest of second alpha’s HP when my mouse and keyboard spazzed and I missed a dodge.

Seriously, don’t rely on PUGs at all.

Well… o/c you are totally right and I get your point but try to understand them.
You think you are useful with your cleric gear and help pugs with that (what is absolutely wrong) and they think it’s fine what they do.
I have the same problem with cleric guards who claim to be experienced – like you with new players who claim to be experienced.
Obviously you both aren’t, but it isn’t worth getting upset about.

Anubarak.3012:

Well… o/c you are totally right and I get your point but try to understand them.
You think you are useful with your cleric gear and help pugs with that (what is absolutely wrong) and they think it’s fine what they do.
I have the same problem with cleric guards who claim to be experienced – like you with new players who claim to be experienced.
Obviously you both aren’t, but it isn’t worth getting upset about.

I could easily bring my glassy thief and survive the aforementioned encounters just fine. If I wanted to two man dungeons I’d just do that though, the faceplanted audience doesn’t really do it for me.

Well OP there is no solution to newcomers who won’t sound off they are new and yet refuse to listen. Just advertise the best you can and hopefully the right kind of players join. I, too have no problem with teaching newcomers and have done so. But sometimes I enjoy smooth runs when everyone reads the description and joins.

Maybe the lfg tool made it marginally easier for newcomers to join and somehow some of them don’t think its necessary to sound off and ignore advice. But in time, it should level out as ppl who currently enjoy dungeons should continue to do so.

Colesy forever beating me to the punch <_<
It’s like that staff camping Rampager Ele complaining about his low DPS team.

My favourite COE pugs are when I neglectfully let my team die to Alpha then remember I needed at least one to break me out of crystals. Or! When I do keep one alive and they don’t break me out of crystals anyway Q _Q

SpeedFiend.4521:

Anubarak.3012:

Well… o/c you are totally right and I get your point but try to understand them.
You think you are useful with your cleric gear and help pugs with that (what is absolutely wrong) and they think it’s fine what they do.
I have the same problem with cleric guards who claim to be experienced – like you with new players who claim to be experienced.
Obviously you both aren’t, but it isn’t worth getting upset about.

I could easily bring my glassy thief and survive the aforementioned encounters just fine. If I wanted to two man dungeons I’d just do that though, the faceplanted audience doesn’t really do it for me.

Well then… Why don’t you play a glassy guard?
Would be much better

Anubarak.3012:

SpeedFiend.4521:

Anubarak.3012:

Well… o/c you are totally right and I get your point but try to understand them.
You think you are useful with your cleric gear and help pugs with that (what is absolutely wrong) and they think it’s fine what they do.
I have the same problem with cleric guards who claim to be experienced – like you with new players who claim to be experienced.
Obviously you both aren’t, but it isn’t worth getting upset about.

I could easily bring my glassy thief and survive the aforementioned encounters just fine. If I wanted to two man dungeons I’d just do that though, the faceplanted audience doesn’t really do it for me.

Well then… Why don’t you play a glassy guard?
Would be much better

Already had the gear and I’m cheap. I got alts to feed.

Tbf the amount of people who dont read the lfg and just join with 500ap is getting a bit tiresome. After several awful pugs we decided to just learn to 3man coe lasers. So now we pretty much 3man every dungeon atm.

colesy.8490:

It’s called “screw you guys, you can res after the fight”. I PUG’d COE a few days ago with some random guild group and I completely ignored their bearbow ranger who kept downing because they were useless and we might as well have 4-manned. I don’t think he even used frost spirit, he used storm and sun instead.

Again in COE with PUGs, they were all faceplanting and then I went to solo the rest of second alpha’s HP when my mouse and keyboard spazzed and I missed a dodge.

Seriously, don’t rely on PUGs at all.

Had this exact experience myself yesterday. Entire team faceplanted on Alpha and I had to solo him. And on the husk/bomb golem section again they all faceplanted from trying to faceroll the boss. I again had to solo the Husk. The alpha fight right after 3 died leaving my guard and an ele to finish him off. And this was with them stacked for easy dodge rolls.

Friends don’t let friends rely on pugs. Colesy beating us to the punch indeed.

You should never let pugs into the husk room. Just solo it.

Yeah, I’ve run with a lot of complete newbies just hopping in expecting fun times and loot, only to have their kitten handed to them a few times and then quit. If a significant portion of the experienced dungeon community has experiences like this on the LFG tool, I think they’ll avoid it and stick to gw2lfg.com for PUGs….or become a lot more stringent with gear and AP checks like in the old CoF P1 days.

The absolute worst I’ve encountered was a <400Ap, 5 signet warrior in AC P1 who kept barking instructions at the other newcomers as if he even knew what he was talking about, and ragequit when we failed to protect Hodgkins.

I wouldnt have agreed with OP a couple hours ago… why should it be different? but then I tried it xD I like teaching dungeons i know well! I really do! but it pains me when people dont listen, generally its just 1 out of a group, and its no big deal, but i swear every freaking party i found today using the lfg tool was worse than the last and nobody would listen to anybody!
Well… a streak of bad luck i thought… then I saw this…

Milo Rock.2457:

I wouldnt have agreed with OP a couple hours ago… why should it be different? but then I tried it xD I like teaching dungeons i know well! I really do! but it pains me when people dont listen, generally its just 1 out of a group, and its no big deal, but i swear every freaking party i found today using the lfg tool was worse than the last and nobody would listen to anybody!
Well… a streak of bad luck i thought… then I saw this…

would be rather surprised if that is actually a power necro AND a power engi in the same group

It’s not making running dungeons worse, it’s encouraging more people to participate, especially the ones that were discouraged by elitists from ever joining a dungeon.

Thats lopez he only does condition necro. I suppose he said no condition builds cause he didnt want people overwriting his bleed stacks.

spoj.9672:

Thats lopez he only does condition necro. I suppose he said no condition builds cause he didnt want people overwriting his bleed stacks.

that makes sense, but the engi… both power engi and condi engi do tons of bleeds of their own no?

Maybe he wants to epidemic the condi engi’s conditions (2 condi builds is usually fine). Its a good combo in pvp and can work for trash in pve. Its just pretty sub optimal because its conditions ofcourse.

I was testing out staff ele in COE yesterday and lol.

I asked for full DPS, experienced players for a P2 run and got merged with four different warriors who I think knew each other. Before the dungeon even starts they’re already telling me to switch to warrior so they can max DPS, so warning signs. I usually go along with these cause they’re funny even though I know they never end well. Anyway, I get downed by the stupid champ wolf (because untelegraphed OHKO spike on a 10k HP light) and they start kittening me out for being too squishy. We Alpha, they’re all still talking kitten cause of the wolf down and then they all down multiple times during the Alpha fight. I notice that not only is our DPS really low for four GS warriors + ele wallstacking on Alpha, but I’m also getting a LOT of shout heals. Like, facetank through Alpha AOE and instantly heal it all back levels of healing.

We get to golem, I die halfway through cause squishy ele on a projectile-spam boss with no reflects, and notice that he’s no longer taking damage despite there being 4 warriors still attacking him with their legendary greatswords. I decide I’ve got enough material for a good forum story and finally ask how many of them are healshouts. Turns out ALL of them were. Also, turns out one of them was a “condition damage might stack” warrior, as he described himself.

He was using a GS.

Sounds like to me your ele build sucks. What kind of dungeon ele doesn’t keep a spare focus?

sorrychief.2563:

Sounds like to me your ele build sucks. What kind of dungeon ele doesn’t keep a spare focus?

He literally explained what he was doing in the first line of his post.

And for the record, staff ele looks pretty cool. Watched a trial of it in CoE earlier.

What spamming Fire auto and Lava Fonts with the ability to AFK at range?…. I could get used to that, maybe take Signet of Restoration so I can watch Youtube in peace.

to get back to the topic of the new lfg tool, it blows big time.
Ignores the mechanic of having to accept party members.
and i ran into these problems:

1- ppl that join and immediately magically “DC”
2- people that merge groups to do what content they wanted even though every person was looking for something different ( story vs. p1 vs. p3 ) -_-
3- people bringing in characters UNDER the minimum required level of the dungeon and refusing to change
4- Upon being kicked for good reasons, person would rejoin when you repost your open spot

And thing is, i wish that we could apply filters to what we accept in party. And it should not be hard to implement. And i dont like the “you are discriminating other players” excuse, because if i dont feel like carrying a lowbie for 2h when i only have that 20 min for 1 run, why should i be forced to. Sure, the pool of players that fit what you are looking for is smaller the more constraints you put, but at least you will be happier with the party you get.

Right now this random crap just makes my dungeon experience kittenty.
For now, im sticking to players from the community or gw2lfg.com, the LFG tool in game does not suit my needs and there are way too many trolls.

I would love to have, just like for contacts, a “blocked/blacklist” list for dungeons to prevent trolls besides being able to report them for abusing the system.
be able to restrict open spot to a minimal required level or a specific class.
ex: need ele in party for AC, well, restrict open spot to ele.

May i say that same things OP said happened with old LFG a lot?
Expecially on the week end.

But the new lfg tool is awesome and has no role in some players bad behavior.

Hmm maybe b/c it’s night time, but for me there’s like no one using the LFG tool…

Pug quality is a complete roulette.

well at least with ppl that join from the site, you can confirm or reject. Also you can get a good idea if the run is for you or not.
With it being in game and having no advanced options, people just join in without reading, its a real pain. At least when ppl tab out to the site they had to pay a minimal attention and read.

GW2 lfg needs a gear and build check system, similar to what exists in spvp. We can already mouse over who is in the party, now we just need to mouse over what they are doing so we can avoid these ‘shout healers’ and etc. It would also motivate players to step up their game instead of expecting to be carried.

I’ve used the lfg tool only for arah so far. Every single person I’ve got was brand new to the dungeon. So i think the lfg has definitely brought more people into dungeons. Some were ok, some bad. They all basically get free completion anyway, then say if they knew arah was so easy they’d have tried it long ago…

The “fake it til you make it” guys are the worst. Just say you’re new right away please. Deadeyes aren’t an OMG OHK SO OP!!!

The last few days I’ve just gone into Arah with a 3-4 premade and filled the last using the LFG tool. So far, we’ve only had 1 out of maybe 8 PUG’s who needed to be kicked because it was clear that he had never done Arah before and was dead literally the entire time. Some players were good, some were bad. I’m not really sure if the players from the ingame tool have been worse than ones from lfg.com, but it’s definitely pretty fun playing ‘PUG roulette’, so to say.

Every time I play pug roulette I get shot in the head T_T

I don’t think the tool will make things worse. Hopefully the quality will improve as some of the inexperienced players actually get a little experience now.
After not doing any of the dungeons for a great while I’ve pugged COF, COE, AC, and 10-20 Fractal the last few days the tool has been active and I have had a pretty good experience.
I’ve only had to leave about 3 times so far at the very beginning of a run.
I guess the thing is you know pretty quickly in the beginning if the group will succeed. If it won’t don’t try to force it. Just leave. There are usually an encounter or two right at the beginning of each dungeon that will tell you if someone is experienced in the dungeon (or at least follows your lead if not) or if the group has enough DPS to make it a run that won’t take 3 hours.
I’m still glad it was implemented. Better than the alternative I had – not go.

In a fit of boredom I decided to try out the new LFG tool and see if it was really as bad as I had heard, after aimlessly scrolling through all the dungeons to see if any of them caught my eye I came across the party listing shown in the screenshot. I didn’t join the group for fear that I would somehow be deemed inadequate.

If this is what a lot of the group listing are going to look like it’s going to be tougher (hilarious?) times ahead for pugging; HoTW P1 is hard.

I like how some of the comments in the thread and shaming the OP for being in cleric’s gear, and completely ignoring the topic of the thread just because they want to troll.
~Bravo

Laar.5476:

In a fit of boredom I decided to try out the new LFG tool and see if it was really as bad as I had heard, after aimlessly scrolling through all the dungeons to see if any of them caught my eye I came across the party listing shown in the screenshot. I didn’t join the group for fear that I would somehow be deemed inadequate.

If this is what a lot of the group listing are going to look like it’s going to be tougher (hilarious?) times ahead for pugging; HoTW P1 is hard.

This is HILARIOUS!!! And I guess that it doesn’t need to be mentioned that not everyone who’s got DM actually got the title themselves…but honestly it’s like everyone expects to be carried…

Do you really think the healing power from your gear is helping you keep pugs alive? If it was, then this post wouldn’t exist. So you might as well switch to useful gear since clearly the cleric’s thing isn’t cutting it. You even get to keep most of your support options.

Bunnehboo.6025:

I like how some of the comments in the thread and shaming the OP for being in cleric’s gear, and completely ignoring the topic of the thread just because they want to troll.
~Bravo

Well he came on this forum (which is full of kittens) and started ranting about inexperienced players joining his dungeon runs, when he is the one that is complained about constantly by everyone on this forum for being useless. Maybe all his inexperienced pugs were dying because their team didn’t have any damage.

He is the bane of his own existence!

I like the LFG tool,
I can find pugs for easy dungeons instantly, without the need to alt-tab every time.
the pug quality differs, it is not worse than the gw2lfg.exe at all. it is exactly the same.

I could see the quality of pugs being worse, but I don’t think the LFG tool is entirely to blame.

People need to do 25 dungeons in order to craft an ascended weapon, which means we’re seeing people who wouldn’t normally step inside a dungeon trying to farm.

Bunnehboo.6025:

I like how some of the comments in the thread and shaming the OP for being in cleric’s gear, and completely ignoring the topic of the thread just because they want to troll.
~Bravo

This is the dungeon subforum. These days it seems like it’s sole purpose is to establish how out of touch the dungeon sub forum posters are with the general masses of the game. Must melee every dungeon, must use every stacking trick available, must run zerker builds, must skip every skippable mob in the dungeon, must dump on every ranger that doesn’t run sword.

There is at least five of them, I’m honestly baffled why they are ever pugging – it seems like they prefer each other’s company to everyone else in the game. God forbid someone run cleric’s gear in an attempt to support their party instead of zerking everything down regardless of whether their allies are alive or not at the end.

Shiren.9532:

This is the dungeon subforum. These days it seems like it’s sole purpose is to establish how out of touch the dungeon sub forum posters are with the general masses of the game. Must melee every dungeon, must use every stacking trick available, must run zerker builds, must skip every skippable mob in the dungeon, must dump on every ranger that doesn’t run sword.

There is at least five of them, I’m honestly baffled why they are ever pugging – it seems like they prefer each other’s company to everyone else in the game. God forbid someone run cleric’s gear in an attempt to support their party instead of zerking everything down regardless of whether their allies are alive or not at the end.

General masses are exactly what it says. A mass.

Shiren.9532:

Bunnehboo.6025:

I like how some of the comments in the thread and shaming the OP for being in cleric’s gear, and completely ignoring the topic of the thread just because they want to troll.
~Bravo

This is the dungeon subforum. These days it seems like it’s sole purpose is to establish how out of touch the dungeon sub forum posters are with the general masses of the game. Must melee every dungeon, must use every stacking trick available, must run zerker builds, must skip every skippable mob in the dungeon, must dump on every ranger that doesn’t run sword.

There is at least five of them, I’m honestly baffled why they are ever pugging – it seems like they prefer each other’s company to everyone else in the game. God forbid someone run cleric’s gear in an attempt to support their party instead of zerking everything down regardless of whether their allies are alive or not at the end.

God forbid we try to teach players to not SUCK and help them realise their cleric gear is doing a whopping zero support.

Just got kicked at the last fractal ! I want anet statement that they are not working with the gold sellers / atm i see all that kick players from last fractal / dungeon not being banned and still active everyday in-game ! 2 reasons : anet doesnt ban coz they dont care or anet doesnt ban coz they work with goldsellers ! What is it ?

dani.1956:

Just got kicked at the last fractal ! I want anet statement that they are not working with the gold sellers / atm i see all that kick players from last fractal / dungeon not being banned and still active everyday in-game ! 2 reasons : anet doesnt ban coz they dont care or anet doesnt ban coz they work with goldsellers ! What is it ?

same thing happened to me on SE p1 (lol), 2 guildies kicked all at the last boss on 10% and listed it on lfg as selling last boss for 5g (lol).

shame I rejoined and reported them (lol).

LOL @ “anet working with gold sellers” (which has no relevance to kicking)

even if it was pathsellers instead of gold sellers, you’d have to be preeeetty kittening crazy to think of such a conspiracy theory