Guild Wars 2

I never once did a dungeon in Guild Wars 2. My highest character is level 80 since weeks.
Its not that I’m not interested into Guild Wars 2 dungeons or not intereste into dungeons at all. The single reason I’m not doing dungeons is the lack of automatized grouping since:

• Building a group is too much of a chore considering its automatized in other games
• Once I’m in the dungeon I’m comitted and people depend on me continuing to play opposed to getting a new guy in no time
• Someone could leave anytime bringing the group back to the searching phase
• I could become stuck with a bad group, effectively wasting all my invested time

For me thats just unacceptable and makes Dungeons unbearable content until grouping becomes automatized. Once grouping is automatized:

• I don’t have to spend time searching a group but can play the game instead
• I’m not as commited to the group if the real life happens to get in the way, the system will get them a new guy in no time
• Bad groups aren’t much of a loss since I didn’t invest time into searching for them anyway

Although I’m getting enough fun out of PvP to continue playing, it bugs me to have paid for content I won’t see. I’m aware that its quite a casual approach towards dungeon but thats where the money comes from: casuals.

Finding a group on a high population server is pretty easy. But the dungeons are pretty boring/ little to easy and similar to each other so your not missing out in the explore modes. Story on the other hand can be pretty fun as the bosses seem finished and well thought out the Exp modes seem rushed and not very well thought out

1 People call out for dungeon/ groups/members in LA and in the respective dungeon zones all the time. Even when you do have to wait, you can do other things while you wait.
2 ?? – If people need to replace you, they will replace you.
3 See number 1, it’s not that big of a deal to search for a replacement.
4 If members of the group are bad, use the kick feature. If the entire group is bad, leave the party.

Maybe you’re having these issues on your server, but I’ve had no issues waiting for a dungeon group to form. Give it a shot, it’s a shame you’re missing out on a ton (33 dungeon paths) of content, and not to mention rewards.

Join a PvE guild.

Fiesbert.9816:

• I’m not as commited to the group if the real life happens to get in the way, the system will get them a new guy in no time

Everyone will bail at the first sign of trouble. It’ll just make things worse.

Call me spoiled but I’m used to not having to put any effort into playing a dungeon, which makes me unwilling to do so.
I’m not alone with my stance towards “manual grouping”, its quite a flaw.
If I were to start Diablo 3, Battlefield 3, World of Warcraft or Star Wars the Old Republic (just to name a few) I could choose what content I want to play and instantly do so. Any obstacles between me and content are bad for the game, especially if other games don’t have them.

DancingPenguins.9875:

Everyone will bail at the first sign of trouble. It’ll just make things worse.

Can’t confirm this claim. It worked fine in World of Warcraft, DC Universe Online and Star Wars the Old Republic. In all three games you could leave the dungeon until you got a new guy and play other content during the wait. Thats exactly how it should be.

1) Using the chat is a chore? People can selfinvite themselves, you dont even have to type their name in.
2) Dungeons in this game are short, if you can’t commit 40m to an hour, you shouldn’t be doing them anyway. Anet said the explorable dungeons are the hard core content (just like the elite areas in GW1) of the game and by everything you said so far, you are very much a casual player.
3) I’ve done way over 100 dungeons runs so far, and only had maybe 3-4 people leave during the dungeon. Even if they do, it’s no big deal, because you just hop out of the dungeon for a minute (there are waypoint inside the dungeon, so you dont spend 5 minutes running) and get a replacement.
4) You are stuck with bad groups with automated system as well, dont really get this point. This game has kick function.

Al in all, as I said, the explorable dungeons are supposed to be the hard core areas, I’d be very supprised if there was any dungeon finder in the works.
Just a small addition, SWTOR’s dungeon finder was added 6 months after release, WoW – WotLK expansion, no idea about DC universe. If those releases are the examples, then having dungeon finder on release is not the standart, as you’re trying to say.

Depends on your server and when you can play too, though. I’m only available to play at really odd hours for now, and it’s extremely difficult for me to get a group running with the current system, despite having joined a dedicated PvE dungeon guild. I spent a full hour and a half yesterday just looking to run CoE explorable. The end result? I gave up and ran CM instead, even though I really don’t need to run CM, and zerged in Orr for an hour. No CoE runs. I still need ~1650 tokens from CoE to get what I want, and the hardest part about getting tokens by far for me is just finding groups that are running it. At this point I don’t even care if the group is terrible, I just want to be able to run the freaking thing.

Full automated LFG usually breeds bad community, spoiled brats and tons of griefers. Its not hard to find a group or does it require too much effort. (for example kicking non-lvl80 player that come from the finder)

But for those playing at odd hours, a semi automated system where you can “find” and “group” with people from other servers would be a welcomed addition.

I don’t really care for a fully automated dungeon finder. Anet has already said they don’t want a fully automated dungeon party system, and that’s fine with me. But at the very least, let me look for a dungeon party in a way that doesn’t force me to either waste time in a map I’ve already completed spamming /map message or sit in Lion’s Arch… spamming /map messages. And then getting message suppressed (yes, I know zoning fixes it, but it’s stupid regardless). Do this with an actually useful LFG list, or a LFG chat, or whatever. But the current system is…, well, nobody actually uses the system implemented for this because it’s useless, which is kind of sad.

youre a baddie as well since you got no experience doing dungeons.so you dont want to be grouped with other baddies but you want others to be grouped with you.thats some nice logic there

urtv.8791:

youre a baddie as well since you got no experience doing dungeons.so you dont want to be grouped with other baddies but you want others to be grouped with you.thats some nice logic there

Quite a daring assumption. I’ve been a succesful raidleader in several MMOs, know all 8 Professions and their abilities and I’m a baddie for not knowing the dungeons yet? I don’t think so.
Its just that I can’t be bothered to look for groups like its the MMO stoneage.

nemeth.4196:

…
Just a small addition, SWTOR’s dungeon finder was added 6 months after release, WoW – WotLK expansion, no idea about DC universe. If those releases are the examples, then having dungeon finder on release is not the standart, as you’re trying to say.

You can expect a game released in 2012 to meet the standards of other MMOs that are out now. It doesn’t matter what WoW was like in 2004, its 2012. It matters whats out there today.
SWTOR paid deerly for this 6 month delay. They lost the majority of the PvE crowd to waiting too long with implementing a dungeon finder.

In general content has to be just one button away. GW2’s developers seem to know that, having their travel (instant travel without cooldown to every waypoint) and PvP (again instant travel without cooldown, automated grouping) systems in mind. I can’t wrap my head around why they wouldn’t approach instanced PvE content in the same manner.

Don’t get me wrong, there should be content you won’t be able to just faceroll your way through with a PuG but it should be at least possible to try.

Sry , but to me you re plain lazy & an elitist

if you really think youre that good then transfer to a higher population server where there are groups running dungeons all day and show everyone your skills then.otherwise youre just a lazy bum that thinks hes good

I have a level 80 and two characters at 60 plus. So far, on my 80 I’ve done all the storymodes, and finished 4 of the explorable dungeons (3 paths x 4), and did all the storymodes availible to my lower characters.

A few of these, probably 4-5 runs I’ve done with real life friends of mine. The rest of them have been PUG’ed.

Some runs have been dreadful, some runs have been absolutely amazing. I have made several friends, with whom I continuously run dungeons, through this. I’ve even found a new guild from this.

Searching for groups brings people together. The automated dungeon grouping, and the lack of commitment to the group, makes the MMO feel like a single player game. You could just as well be playing with bots. It’s horrible.

Do not judge an MMO as “unmodern” and “stoneage-y”, just because you’re lazy and unsociable. Acctualy completing the dungeon with people that you get to know through chat, and have the option of seeing again (cross server LFG… Urgh!) makes the sense of accomplishment so much greater.

(edit)Go play Skyrim or something if you wish for a great gameplay experience without social interaction.

People these days…

OP talks like a guy who has never even tried to get into a dungeon, let alone play one.

Those issues are all negligible or avoidable.

I’m not antisocial nor am I exceptionally lazy. Its rather a mix of being spoiled and not that interested into PvE.
I’ve got a few friends that stoped playing GW2 one of the reasons is the lack of a dungeon finder.

Searching for groups brings people together. The automated dungeon grouping, and the lack of commitment to the group, makes the MMO feel like a single player game. You could just as well be playing with bots. It’s horrible.

It doesn’t have to be that way. It would be the simplest thing to priorize players from your servers to form a group, before taking people from other servers.
Unless I end up with a horrible group, I stay to finish the dungeon. Though it has been 8 years since 2004, my live changed. Sometimes I have to get up and stop playing if real life calls. If that happens I don’t want to have a bad consciousness for forsaking the players I started the dungeon with. If they’d get a new guy within seconds, it would be a whole different story.
Of course everyone is entitled to his opinion but I consider the lack of a dungeon finder a flaw, a big one.

OP talks like a guy who has never even tried to get into a dungeon, let alone play one.

Those issues are all negligible or avoidable.

I didn’t try to get into a dungeon so far. There are fresh memories of how annoying manual grouping is from my time in SWTOR. Won’t even try to group manually unless 4 guildmates where asking and I were confident to have the time to finish the dungeon.

EDIT: Whats with the hostility? Don’t get me wrong, I love Guild Wars 2! The PvP part alone will keep me with the game for month, one more reason to be sad about the yesterdayish stance towards PvE and automated grouping.

Fiesbert.9816:

urtv.8791:

youre a baddie as well since you got no experience doing dungeons.so you dont want to be grouped with other baddies but you want others to be grouped with you.thats some nice logic there

Quite a daring assumption. I’ve been a succesful raidleader in several MMOs, know all 8 Professions and their abilities and I’m a baddie for not knowing the dungeons yet? I don’t think so.
Its just that I can’t be bothered to look for groups like its the MMO stoneage.

nemeth.4196:

…
Just a small addition, SWTOR’s dungeon finder was added 6 months after release, WoW – WotLK expansion, no idea about DC universe. If those releases are the examples, then having dungeon finder on release is not the standart, as you’re trying to say.

You can expect a game released in 2012 to meet the standards of other MMOs that are out now. It doesn’t matter what WoW was like in 2004, its 2012. It matters whats out there today.
SWTOR paid deerly for this 6 month delay. They lost the majority of the PvE crowd to waiting too long with implementing a dungeon finder.

In general content has to be just one button away. GW2’s developers seem to know that, having their travel (instant travel without cooldown to every waypoint) and PvP (again instant travel without cooldown, automated grouping) systems in mind. I can’t wrap my head around why they wouldn’t approach instanced PvE content in the same manner.

Don’t get me wrong, there should be content you won’t be able to just faceroll your way through with a PuG but it should be at least possible to try.

Whoa there my friend, until you have experience in the dungeons you can’t judge your own ability. Just because you have done ok in another game doesn’t translate to you will be good here. Firstly the dungeons are the first real showing of what the lack of a trinity is all about. Being that deep rooted in a different style of play isn’t a good thing.

Secondly, I’d like a lfg system of some kind simply so I can go off and do other things instead of sit infront of the dungeon waiting. But thats the only reason most of us want a lfg dungeon type of system or a better one I should say.

If you can’t be bothered to look for a group without the tool though… thats on you, until you have experience you aren’t anything special. Get over yourself, get out there and either shout or wait for a shout. If you won’t thats on you.

Global user created chat channels would really help this one along as it would still require some sort of initiative to engage with the people you are going to group with but you would not feel like you were pushed towards some specific zone while you were trying to find people.

Full on LFG tools (while convenient) start pushing things in a different direction for a game and not always for the better. Everyone ends up in a global pool so it is far less likely people will ever see each other again and so they tend to be far nastier and more impatient with each other as soon as something goes slightly wrong. It ends up pushing the game designers to design the content to require less coordination as they now have to balance around strangers getting through the content.

Fiesbert.9816:

Call me spoiled but I’m used to not having to put any effort into playing a dungeon, which makes me unwilling to do so.
I’m not alone with my stance towards “manual grouping”, its quite a flaw.
If I were to start Diablo 3, Battlefield 3, World of Warcraft or Star Wars the Old Republic (just to name a few) I could choose what content I want to play and instantly do so. Any obstacles between me and content are bad for the game, especially if other games don’t have them.

DancingPenguins.9875:

Everyone will bail at the first sign of trouble. It’ll just make things worse.

Can’t confirm this claim. It worked fine in World of Warcraft, DC Universe Online and Star Wars the Old Republic. In all three games you could leave the dungeon until you got a new guy and play other content during the wait. Thats exactly how it should be.

This post ends this thread right here. You are comparing GW2 to some games that arent even in the same genre. BF3, DIII… those games are not MMOs. BF3 is ment to be hot joinable, which by the way is available in GW2’s PvP (I dont understand how BF3 can even be used here, seeing as dungeons are exclusively PvE content). Next up DIII. Sure you can hot join, good thing DIII is purely story driven, doesn’t require any content to have more than 1 player, and thus is not related to GW2 (Just because both are RPGs doenst mean you can compare 1 to 1).

Next up, your comparison to WoW and SWTOR. Sure, you bring a valid point that barriers to content are bad. However, you must be kidding yourself if you think it is difficult to find and form a group. Not to mention joining a guild or making friends are a very viable way to create groups quickly.

If I may be completely honest, you sound like a 12 year old who is upset because everything in your life isnt being handed to you. Welcome to the real world, sometimes things take a little effort.

If I may be completely honest, you sound like a 12 year old who is upset because everything in your life isnt being handed to you. Welcome to the real world, sometimes things take a little effort.

I like most others I play games to be entertained, to take a break of the hardships of real life.
One thing the current most succesful games have in common, regardless of genre, is how conviently accessible content is. Which especially applies to succesful MMOs.
By having content not being available by simply pressing a button a developer blocks off a huge part of his player base of the content. (20% of the players have 80% of the playtime in WoW Source http://www.google.de/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=5&ved=0CEwQFjAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fcs.hiram.edu%2F~walkerel%2Fcs363%2FWowGameHoursPresentation.ppt&ei=1Ux4UKWtM4zHsga49IHYCw&usg=AFQjCNEYjXUaceQVfxXH7yy2HrHhmBOEhg&sig2=lYKQNC5YVtRbwkmmrooxWQ&cad=rja )
Those that don’t have much time to invest in a game are also those guys that consume content the slowest and the customers with highest buying power.
Due to not having much time, for whatever reason, they are also impatient and will quickly abandon a game if it fails to deliver fun. The same kind of guy that wouldn’t bother to read a forum.
The game wouldn’t be damaged by an LFG tool, it would only gain by it.

PUGs are terrible.

Flippetized.2657:

PUGs are terrible.

Naw, they aren’t.

Fiesbert.9816:

If I may be completely honest, you sound like a 12 year old who is upset because everything in your life isnt being handed to you. Welcome to the real world, sometimes things take a little effort.

I like most others I play games to be entertained, to take a break of the hardships of real life.
One thing the current most succesful games have in common, regardless of genre, is how conviently accessible content is. Which especially applies to succesful MMOs.
By having content not being available by simply pressing a button a developer blocks off a huge part of his player base of the content. (20% of the players have 80% of the playtime in WoW Source http://www.google.de/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=5&ved=0CEwQFjAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fcs.hiram.edu%2F~walkerel%2Fcs363%2FWowGameHoursPresentation.ppt&ei=1Ux4UKWtM4zHsga49IHYCw&usg=AFQjCNEYjXUaceQVfxXH7yy2HrHhmBOEhg&sig2=lYKQNC5YVtRbwkmmrooxWQ&cad=rja )
Those that don’t have much time to invest in a game are also those guys that consume content the slowest and the customers with highest buying power.
Due to not having much time, for whatever reason, they are also impatient and will quickly abandon a game if it fails to deliver fun. The same kind of guy that wouldn’t bother to read a forum.
The game wouldn’t be damaged by an LFG tool, it would only gain by it.

MMOs are a different beast. They are ment to be played over long periods of time while investing your time and energy. If you are purely interested in content and content only why are you playing a game that is based purely around social interaction with other players?

And you will most likely never do a dungeon before they implement a tool for it since people only take ‘people who have done it before’ :P

The lacking of a LFG tool is the main reason I’ve stopped playing.
I did quite a good number of exp runs, but I cant’t stand anymore wasting my time spamming “LFG CoF exp” (or similar) while sitting in areas I’m not interested in and also having to cope to a flawed antispam. Not in 2012.
I’ll get back to the game when (if) they add an automated LFG tool.

Hmm, imagine a WoW-like LFG system BUT, thanks to the class system of GW2, without any 1 tank, 1 healer, 3 dps spots. There wouldn’t be any 20 minute queue as dps, 1 minute queue as healer or 3 second queue as tank.
A system that would let you specify which dungeon, story/explorable mode and which path of explorable mode.

I don’t have a problem with using chat, tho it’s very rare that my dungeon group has a free spot for a pug, I’m just saying that it would be nice tool to have

All arguments about "making friends" hold no water. Especially considering the separate currencies also separate friends, forcing them to run different dungeons. When your friends are not online, you’re stuck with an EQ1 method to find dungeons and that’s just bad, period. If not fully automated, at least some sort of smart listing feature should be in place. Spamming chat or convincing your friends to run a dungeon with you (for nothing they would want) IF they’re all online is not an option.

Arq.8026:

Full automated LFG usually breeds bad community, spoiled brats and tons of griefers. Its not hard to find a group or does it require too much effort. (for example kicking non-lvl80 player that come from the finder)

We already have people that vote kick others at the end of the dungeon to invite their guildies/friends.

It isn’t that hard since they can freely swap servers w/o paying. No real penalty.

Silly suggestion. Find a guild or a group of friends and your group finding problems are solved.

Btw you can report people who kick at the end of a dungeon for griefing reasons. 5 day suspension on first offense I heared.

Maybe now you’ll believe me that there is a demand for LFG tools. I even dare to say its a necessety if you want players of the PvE crowd.

I agree with both sides. But like many said here, having to go to a specific city and spam LFG in chat is just an outdated way of looking or a group. Let’s be honest, it’s completely unnecessary for people to have to use map chat in a city to get a group. Just make any kind of system really that involves forming parties to dungeons. It doesn’t have to be “click one button and auto group”. Make it a list or something where you can sign up interest of a specific dungeons and add a little comment. Does not automate things but removes all the outdated unnecessary ways of finding a group.

LukeTheQuke.4079:

I agree with both sides. But like many said here, having to go to a specific city and spam LFG in chat is just an outdated way of looking or a group. Let’s be honest, it’s completely unnecessary for people to have to use map chat in a city to get a group. Just make any kind of system really that involves forming parties to dungeons. It doesn’t have to be “click one button and auto group”. Make it a list or something where you can sign up interest of a specific dungeons and add a little comment. Does not automate things but removes all the outdated unnecessary ways of finding a group.

Lists like the one you suggest doesn’t work. They never did for a variety of reasons (shyness, not wanting to invite other people, feeling it as a chore, not wanting to lead, etc.)
Lotro had one like it. Nobody used it, ever. People still spam chat channels.
The Secret World has a system like it, nobody uses it, people still spam chat channels.
It doesn’t work, period.
This game needs a LFG tool exactly like the one WoW has.

OP, the dungeon pve, as it is at this build, is not much fun anyway so your not missing much.

If you don’t want to do dungeons that’s fine. That’s basically what you’re saying.

Personally I’d never use a “dungeon finder” if this game implemented one. What has worked for me was in finding story mode groups I found players I enjoyed grouping with and added them to my friend’s list. Got a big list now and a pretty static group.

These dungeons aren’t designed for a group of random people to come together and breeze through. They’re especially not designed to be something that doesn’t rely commitment.

Sure it might work for finding more players. More than likely though if you put a tool in for automated dungeon pugging then dungeons have to be toned towards automated pugged groups.

Yea, coming into this game I was really looking forward to a lfg system with very short queue times due to to lack of holy trinity. But turns out I still end up having to idle in town asking for a group. It’s such a primitive system.

Leveling my alts, I haven’t done any story modes since most LFMs are for explorer mode now. Instead I waste time & get message-suppressed looking for story mode at Lion’s Arch.

This game needs a LFG tool exactly like the one WoW has.

Not exactly like WoW. I’d prefer if the system would priorize players from your server over the rest, so you can get to know other players from your server while doing dungeons.

I think completely refusing to do dungeons because of a lackluster LFG system is a bit extreme don’t you think? To some extent, this is a huge first world problem especially from the attitude of your OP.

Also, the way you advertise usually affects how it goes too. “LFG -insert class + dungeon- Explorables” usually won’t work as well if you just took the initiative to write “LFM -insert dungeon- Explorables” even if you’re still not in a party. The moment you get another it’s LF3M.

While I have been in disaster groups that make me want to gouge my eyes out, my experience has been overall really positive. I’ve found numerous buddies that I play with regularly both in and out of dungeons by pugging, I’ve also found myself in amazing groups that eventually led to me being recruited to a guild that had multiple dungeon groups going on. LFMing in Guild first then Pugging the rest in LA became a quick ~10 minute process max to get a dungeon group going.

I agree that the LFG tool NEEDS to be improved, it’s no wonder that no one uses it. However, they need to fix instance ownership issues before even considering what you propose. If there was a way to categorize people LFGing by instance they want to do in the current tool and just picking people from the list, then we wouldn’t need a dungeon finder. Think of it like the old raid finder interface WoW had before it became automated. It would be much better to use simply because every player is just as valuable as the next, not just Tanks and Heals.

http://s1.hubimg.com/u/2348480_f248.jpg

In the end, the biggest limiting factor in your equation right now is YOU. There are so many people complaining that GW2 and other recent release MMOs are not social games, this type of mentality is why. Because no one wants to reach out to anyone anymore.

How do you know how hard it is to find a group if you’ve never done one?

You obviously have done a dungeon and if you haven’t and you’re moaning about all of this. Well, then your moaning is justified. Try it out first.

Dungeons are good and I’ve never had a problem finding a group. Guildies are always up for a dungeon run and if not pugs do the job (on occasions pugs do leave and leave us left for dead and that is so annoying. So I do agree with that)

I don’t know if its difficult to find a group now.
Though I know what its like in other games. Eventually there won’t be enough lower level players to start a lowlevel dungeon on your server. People working in shifts will not find enough players to do a dungeon on their servers during non-primetime hours.
Players on low population servers, which exist in every MMO successful or not, will have a hard time finding people for dungeons anytime during the day.
I don’t mind not having an LFG tool, I play GW2 for its PvP. I love this game though and want it to be as successful as humanly possible. The lack of an LFG tool will and probably already does lead to loss of customers, whom otherwise would’ve supported and played the game.
So guys, drop your pitchforks. There is no need for a witchhunt and building stakes for the heretic. I love this game as much as you do. However it does lack an LFG tool and it is a flaw.
The majority of players expect convenient, instant fun, which can’t be delivered without an LFG tool, at least for PvE.
The whole rest of the game delivers convenient, instant fun. Porting wherever you want, UI mailing system, PvP from everywhere, up- and downscaling, events, rewards for about everything, sending collectibles to your bank from everywhere,…
So I assume its been a conscious decision to not have an LFG tool. All I want to do here is pointing out “Sorry guys, thats not a design or artistic decision but rather leaving out a standard feature, a necessety!”

The problem comes down to what is needed and what a few want. Whats needed is a simple system that has your level, name, and what kind of group you are looking for with maybe a path option for dungeons. What a few seem to want is a dungeon finder system like in WoW which most that have come to GW2 will not find acceptable.

Being able to open a lfg that you can sort to show those looking for a specific dungeon and path is what is needed and that is all.

If grouping is automated…

-I’ll kick anyone for stopping to res me up because it’ll be a lot easier to get someone new. If he isn’t willing to sacrifice 1 silver to repair his armor to res me all the way, then he is a noob. Besides, it’ll be easy to get someone new.

-If I see anyone under level 80 or not wearing exotic running the dungeon, I will kick that person because they don’t contribute as much as a level 80 in exotic can.

-If they don’t know the dungeon, I will kick that person so that the automated system will get me a player that does know how to do the dungeon.

Without an automated system, it’ll be a pain in the kitten trying to find new members, so I have to do something with what I have.

it bugs me to have paid for content I won’t see.

Correction: Content you chose not to see for silly reasons.

Not all industry standards are good, and the dungeon finder is one of these that simply is a bad standard and that should not be included. It’s a good move that Anet didn’t.

It’s progress. You will have to deal with that. The dungeonfinder in WoW was one of the worst changes the game ever experienced. We should learn from mistakes, not repeat them.

Zefiris.8297:

it bugs me to have paid for content I won’t see.

Correction: Content you chose not to see for silly reasons.

Not all industry standards are good, and the dungeon finder is one of these that simply is a bad standard and that should not be included. It’s a good move that Anet didn’t.

It’s progress. You will have to deal with that. The dungeonfinder in WoW was one of the worst changes the game ever experienced. We should learn from mistakes, not repeat them.

I agree with your fist sentence in contrast to his argument but the rest of what you said is subjective opinion. He obviously liked the dungeon finder in other games so telling him how horrible it is isn’t really going to matter to him, is it? lol

Besides, WoW is far from dead. MoP may have sold the least amount of any of Blizz’s xpacs but a game that sells over 2 million in it’s first week……..a dying game doesn’t sell like that. However you want to slice it. So the presence of a dungeon finder doesn’t hold much of a candle to the argument of what makes and breaks a game. You’d need hard numbers and by hard numbers, I mean written testimony from every active WoW player concerning their opinion of the dungeon finder.

But I digress.

He IS choosing not to participate in content for silly reasons. Stupid ones I may go so far to say. He may enjoy the content he’s missing very much but he won’t see it because of a lazy/elitist attitude.

But everyone’s entitled to their own opinion, however illogical it may be.

Illogical being his choice not to do content purely because the game doesn’t provide what he believes to be the easiest and most efficient way to do so.

Fiesbert.9816:

I don’t know if its difficult to find a group now.
Though I know what its like in other games. Eventually there won’t be enough lower level players to start a lowlevel dungeon on your server. People working in shifts will not find enough players to do a dungeon on their servers during non-primetime hours.
Players on low population servers, which exist in every MMO successful or not, will have a hard time finding people for dungeons anytime during the day.
I don’t mind not having an LFG tool, I play GW2 for its PvP. I love this game though and want it to be as successful as humanly possible. The lack of an LFG tool will and probably already does lead to loss of customers, whom otherwise would’ve supported and played the game.
So guys, drop your pitchforks. There is no need for a witchhunt and building stakes for the heretic. I love this game as much as you do. However it does lack an LFG tool and it is a flaw.
The majority of players expect convenient, instant fun, which can’t be delivered without an LFG tool, at least for PvE.
The whole rest of the game delivers convenient, instant fun. Porting wherever you want, UI mailing system, PvP from everywhere, up- and downscaling, events, rewards for about everything, sending collectibles to your bank from everywhere,…
So I assume its been a conscious decision to not have an LFG tool. All I want to do here is pointing out “Sorry guys, thats not a design or artistic decision but rather leaving out a standard feature, a necessety!”

Everyone’s different but it is not difficult to find a group for me. 1 trip to Lion’s Arch and 5 minutes later I’m golden.

The hostility doesn’t come from your desire for a LFG tool. Everyone wants that in some way.

It comes from the disbelief that you would literally bar yourself from content because it doesn’t have a LFG tool because of your experience looking for groups in other games (which are NOTHING like GW2).

The risk of finding players to do lower level content is nonexistent, primarily because of the scaling system. 80’s come to ashford routinely to farm for those weapons and you’ll continue to see that through the life of the game. Again, a misconception drawn from your experience in other games which, again, are nothing like GW2.

People do want instant fun. I agree. But you’re right in saying you’re spoiled. While a LFG tool would be appreciated, it is far from NEEDED.

Players who want to have fun will have fun and if that means a trip to Lion’s Arch or a post in the forums is necessary, than that’s a small price to pay to participate in hours of fantastic (i think) content.

A player like you is letting his spoiled nature keeping him from something he may find very enjoyable and that, is very sad. You shouldn’t do that.

What you should do is let your voice be heard, obviously. Any suggestion to help better the game is welcome.

But if something ain’t there yet it ain’t there and you shouldn’t bar yourself from playing specific content simply because they don’t currently cater to your self admitted spoiled needs.

I"m sorry but that’s just stupid.

It’s like refusing to pleasure yourself because your tissues are on the other side of the room and you don’t want to get up.

Get up and have fun MY MAN!

if this thread wants to go useful places, it could stop arguing about the first-world entiteledness of the OP (which, considering all of us play guild wars on what are most likely our personal computers, i’m pretty sure we’re all guilty of that mentality in some respect. it’s usually those most guilty who most like to raise the fuss). the OP seems to be perfectly willing to acknowledge that this is a spoiled mentality, and that he has little interest in dungeons anyway (the wonder, and curse, of such a diverse game is it draws such a diverse crowd).

i feel anyone who’s spent somewhere between 20-30 minutes looking for a group, only to have a dungeon fail miserably, understands that this is extremely frustrating. and i’m the first person to point out that if the dungeon is easily finished by a random, uncoordinated group, then a planned, coordinated group is going to pick it to pieces. i like the dungeon difficulty. so in order to preserve that, and also to preserve and improve the marketability of our game (since we all benefit from a larger, happier community), we should try to make possibilities to learn this difficult content as easy as possible.

personally, i propose a unified, server-wide chat filter for lfg. ideally this would further filter by dungeon. i’m not a designer, i have no inkling of the technical or logistical sides of such a proposal. but it seems simple enough to me that i will consider it simple until someone gives me sufficient reason to believe otherwise.

i’m a member of a guild with a small base of players who run dungeons fairly regularly, and i still feel this would be a massively beneficial improvement, and i’m struggling to see drawbacks here.

is anyone seriously opposed to this? if so, please state your reasons. i’ll be the first to denounce first-world mentality of privilege as gross and unseemly. but come now, if you want our game to succeed, let’s try to look past the flaws that 99% of our base are likely to share, and try to fix flaws in our actual game. the OP is simply pointing out that convenience, in this day and age, goes a long way. he seems like someone who could be a talented and dedicated member of a dungeon squad (and, if he/she wants a dungeon team, should holler at a brother but is passing it up because it’s simply too much a hassle. now, you can argue about it and say they’d be useless in dungeons because they’re entitled or whatever… or you can accept that there’s talent that would benefit all of us that we’re missing out on because of an inefficient system that would be simple to fix.

i say we talk fixes.

@Kuroi
Finally someone who gets me!

I don’t feel cheated of content by not doing dungeons. In fact, there is so much different stuff I want and like to do in Guild Wars 2, its sometimes hard to decide for me how to play the game.

Typically I spend my time playing Guild Wars 2 with:

• trying out builds in the Heart of the Mists
• playing sPvP tournaments
• making heaps of money at the Tradingpost
• leveling one of my 8 chars a little
• goofing around with my level 80 Necro somewhere in Tyria

Sometimes I feel the itch to jump into a dungeon, its just an itch though. If starting the dungeon is more work than playing another round of sPvP or logging onto an alt, I’d rather scratch that itch away with said instantfun.

So again, I’m having fun in Guild Wars 2. For me its a complete experience. Being the “killer type”-player PvP is almost all I want from a game, especially without power progression. However I know that the majority of the theme park mmo crowd are PvE guys. I’ve seen many players complain and eventually leave because they got too frustrated by the lack of an LFG tool. That is what bothers me, the game is incomplete PvEwise and its going to hamper its success, which I consider very very sad.

Yes its a lazy attitude, yes its spoiled, it may even be elitist but its like saying “Sorry guys but you can’t sell a car without a satnav anymore”, its lazy and spoiled but also true. Its not the point if satnavs are necessary or if they are a sign towards a lifestyle bursting from unnecessary luxuaries, its about if the competetion has satnavs and about that customers expect satnavs. Theme park MMOs players expect an LFG tool and arenaNet unfortunately didn’t deliver. Any LFG tool that requires more work than it requires to join sPvP doesn’t suffice.

@the people worrying about the social aspect of dungeons (or rather group finding). Just a little tweak is neccessary to prevent what happened in World of Warcraft (server communities becoming meaningless): priorize players from your server over players from a different server for forming a dungeon group. There goes the big con of LFG tools being antisocial. Friendslist and grouping doesn’t respect servers anyway in Guild Wars 2, just FYI.

Well said.
I’d also like to point out that “LFG AC EXP” isn’t meaningful conversation.