Guild Wars 2

Playing on EU, maybe it is slightly different in NA

I did quite a few dungeons runs on pug’s. Sometimes i joined “metazerk” groups with properly geared characters, but more times simple “p1 exp” groups.

Some results:
- The AP of the “metazerkers” is usually between 5k and 10k. I rarely see anyone above 10k.
- They know the typical pug tactics including prestacking might (takes up to 15s), lupi OS (guard only) and Icebow 4 with some typcial DPS rotations.
- Stealth blasting is practiced a lot, but sometimes they forget to keep up swiftness or the thief is running ahead
- Utilities or builds are rarely changed during the run, usually only at tar in arah p1.
- If guard fails to OS lupi, the whole party wipes. These parties generally struggle if someone does not go the “zerker” way.
- Surprisingly high number of staff guards or pistol offhand “defiance stripping” thieves.

Now for the “p1 exp” groups
- AP ranges from 2k up to 25k.
- About equal waiting time for lfg (looks like many people like “metazerk” on eu)
- Groups still have 2-3 “metazerk” classes.
- People know their classes, the runs are quite the same time as meta runs.
- I did not encounter any bearbow ranger or fear necro in those groups. However some more staff guards or FT camp engis.

However i had some really good runs with “up to date metazerk” groups. It means they know that not only thief has stealth. The lfg looks like “metazerk 1 ps war 2 ele 1 guard/mes 1 thief/engi” . A lfg like this shows that these guys actually know the latest meta and they are usually a lot more experienced than the usually metazerks. I had a very good CoE full run with them in just 35 minutes, including evolved husk in p2 with group stacking and icebow stun chaining. The usualy pug full run takes about 60 minutes.

Some last words: Most of the “metazerk” people are not the “kickers” some people encounter. They just want fast runs. If you join a “ps war 2 ele guard thief group” as mes or engi and explain to them that you can do the necessary reflects/stealth skips, they will accept you most of the time. Linking gear increases the chance further. Still, i recommend the “p1 exp” groups for daily runs since they are better for the community and our fellow ranger/necro/engi/mesmer players.

I pug arah and fractals a lot and apart from the fact that I haven’t gotten a single warrior in the lfg tool who could actually kite mai trin I’m getting smooth runs 95% of the time when I join parties that require meta comp, gearcheck and everything. Not as fast as my guild parties but still smooth and relativly fast. Maybe I’ve just gotten lucky so far but I think metazerk pugs are not as bad as most people think they are.

I think the reality is you exclude enough noobs, that’s why you have smooth runs.

If you compare pug meta zerk group, they are usually 2x slower for normal dungeon compare to world record, and 1.5x slower compare to world record in fractal. Those kind of time are doable even in 5 necro group.

For me I dont’ really care about group composition. Because unless I get into a group which can get close to meta time which is almost impossible for pug. I just hope my teamates isn’t a bunch of new players who spend 1 hour in cliffside, since even 5 bowbear can run it in 18 minutes, which is usually the time for meta zerk “PUG”.

laokoko.7403:

I think the reality is you exclude enough noobs, that’s why you have smooth runs.

If you compare pug meta zerk group, they are usually 2x slower for normal dungeon compare to world record, and 1.5x slower compare to world record in fractal. Those kind of time are doable even in 5 necro group.

For me I dont’ really care about group composition. Because unless I get into a group which can get close to meta time which is almost impossible for pug. I just hope my teamates isn’t a bunch of new players who spend 1 hour in cliffside, since even 5 bowbear can run it in 18 minutes, which is usually the time for meta zerk “PUG”.

18 minutes for cliffside? I don’t know which kind of “zerk” pugs you got but the average metazerk pug i get for 40 or 50 is usually done with all 4 fractals in 30 minutes. Sometimes less if we get lucky and get short fractals like grawl or molten duo.

Keksmuffin.1450:

laokoko.7403:

I think the reality is you exclude enough noobs, that’s why you have smooth runs.

If you compare pug meta zerk group, they are usually 2x slower for normal dungeon compare to world record, and 1.5x slower compare to world record in fractal. Those kind of time are doable even in 5 necro group.

For me I dont’ really care about group composition. Because unless I get into a group which can get close to meta time which is almost impossible for pug. I just hope my teamates isn’t a bunch of new players who spend 1 hour in cliffside, since even 5 bowbear can run it in 18 minutes, which is usually the time for meta zerk “PUG”.

18 minutes for cliffside? I don’t know which kind of “zerk” pugs you got but the average metazerk pug i get for 40 or 50 is usually done with all 4 fractals in 30 minutes. Sometimes less if we get lucky and get short fractals like grawl or molten duo.

I’ll never run that fast anyway. Only time I run that fast is with people I know.

If you run that fast good for you. Just for me weather fractal is 30 or 40 or 50 minutes, I really don’t care. I just hope I dont’ get into those 1hour+ runs.

laokoko.7403:

I think the reality is you exclude enough noobs, that’s why you have smooth runs.

If you compare pug meta zerk group, they are usually 2x slower for normal dungeon compare to world record, and 1.5x slower compare to world record in fractal. Those kind of time are doable even in 5 necro group.

For me I dont’ really care about group composition. Because unless I get into a group which can get close to meta time which is almost impossible for pug. I just hope my teamates isn’t a bunch of new players who spend 1 hour in cliffside, since even 5 bowbear can run it in 18 minutes, which is usually the time for meta zerk “PUG”.

The latest balance patch makes “sorting out noobs” kinda easy. Was kinda similar before with thief vs engi, but now with ele nerfed, guard nerfed and ranger/mesmer buffed, groups still asking for thief/guard, 2ele/war are simply not reading patchnotes.

When i ook for a group, i read the lfg and watch the current roster. I am currently playing a lot of ranger and enginner, but also have a well geared warrior and mesmer. I decide dependend on dungeon, whether you need stealth or reflects:
AC: None needed, but stealth makes some things easier
SE: None needed
CF: None needed
CoE: No stealth needed, but can safe 10 seconds on p2 and 3 (not worth the extra wait time). Reflects are useful but not mandatory
Arah: Here i want to see both Stealth and Reflects on a party.
Also i want to see at least 1 warrior in a party (unless i play my own war).

You probably need reflect in AC p2 and p3 at last boss, SE all paths, COF p2, CoE (icebrood, golems) and you don’t need stealth in Arah.

If you want to know where reflect is needed, play a staff ele in a zero-reflect group and always aggro first. Then count the number of time you have to interrupt your rotation for Magnetic Aura and dodge. If you can comfortably solo Bloomhunger many times as a staff ele then yeah, you can safely assume that reflect isn’t needed in any dungeons.

Iris Ng.9845:

You probably need reflect in AC p2 and p3 at last boss, SE all paths, COF p2, CoE (icebrood, golems) and you don’t need stealth in Arah.

If you want to know where reflect is needed, play a staff ele in a zero-reflect group and always aggro first. Then count the number of time you have to interrupt your rotation for Magnetic Aura and dodge. If you can comfortably solo Bloomhunger many times as a staff ele then yeah, you can safely assume that reflect isn’t needed in any dungeons.

But at most of these you don’t need a dedicated reflect build. At AC p2/3 the boss dies so fast that a single ranger axe 5 does the reflect job. Nearly every class has some form of projectile defense if we fail there i simply ask them to use them.
Short list:
Ele: Swirlings Winds, Magnetic Aura
Warrior: Shield Master trait (Reflect on Block)
ranger: Whirling Defense
Necro: Corrosive Poison Cloud
Thief: Smoke Screen, Daggerstrom
Engi: Toss Elixier U, Air Blast, Magnetic Shield

these ones are more than sufficient for most encounters in AC, SE and CoE.

But stealth is necessary for pugs in Arah As well as oneshot at lupi. Most of them do not even know that engineer or mesmer can also OS lupi.

So you admit that reflect and/or projectile defense are necessary?

The stealth and oneshot part. Is it meta now?

UBcktieDL.5318:

But stealth is necessary for pugs in Arah As well as oneshot at lupi. Most of them do not even know that engineer or mesmer can also OS lupi.

I’m guessing most people in pug groups for Arah aren’t interested in raids then? If it’s necessary for them to do this then shows that I guess this game isn’t in need of new content requiring coordination, if Lupicus is already challenging enough to warrant it.

UBcktieDL.5318:

Playing on EU, maybe it is slightly different in NA

- If guard fails to OS lupi, the whole party wipes. These parties generally struggle if someone does not go the “zerker” way.

Is zerker gear and exploiting considered synonymous now?

thrag.9740:

UBcktieDL.5318:

Playing on EU, maybe it is slightly different in NA

- If guard fails to OS lupi, the whole party wipes. These parties generally struggle if someone does not go the “zerker” way.

Is zerker gear and exploiting considered synonymous now?

That’s pretty much standard pugmeta. From what I heard it does not matter if exploit is wasting time or is harder to execute than legit way. “Zerk way or go home”.

TheRandomGuy.7246:

thrag.9740:

UBcktieDL.5318:

Playing on EU, maybe it is slightly different in NA

- If guard fails to OS lupi, the whole party wipes. These parties generally struggle if someone does not go the “zerker” way.

Is zerker gear and exploiting considered synonymous now?

That’s pretty much standard pugmeta. From what I heard it does not matter if exploit is wasting time or is harder to execute than legit way. “Zerk way or go home”.

Reading these forums I have to consider myself lucky. Now I generally play outside prime time, but overall I’ve had a pleasant set of PUGing recently. Fractal last night was good, they did do the mai trin revive thing a couple times, but nothing else. Arah I did 2 of the runs without any naughtiness, heck we didn’t even have much reflect.

I can’t help but feel that the forums overexaggerate a bit, but if not then I’m just lucky.

Jerus.4350:

TheRandomGuy.7246:

thrag.9740:

UBcktieDL.5318:

Playing on EU, maybe it is slightly different in NA

- If guard fails to OS lupi, the whole party wipes. These parties generally struggle if someone does not go the “zerker” way.

Is zerker gear and exploiting considered synonymous now?

That’s pretty much standard pugmeta. From what I heard it does not matter if exploit is wasting time or is harder to execute than legit way. “Zerk way or go home”.

Reading these forums I have to consider myself lucky. Now I generally play outside prime time, but overall I’ve had a pleasant set of PUGing recently. Fractal last night was good, they did do the mai trin revive thing a couple times, but nothing else. Arah I did 2 of the runs without any naughtiness, heck we didn’t even have much reflect.

I can’t help but feel that the forums overexaggerate a bit, but if not then I’m just lucky.

Pug roulette . It is good party with nice people or worst run in the gaming history. I stopped doing that long time ago but I don’t think it changed that much.

thrag.9740:

UBcktieDL.5318:

Playing on EU, maybe it is slightly different in NA

- If guard fails to OS lupi, the whole party wipes. These parties generally struggle if someone does not go the “zerker” way.

Is zerker gear and exploiting considered synonymous now?

Nah just because a meta hating necromancer claim it in his videos?

zerk=high damage builds. i like those. I do not like excluding half of the classes in the game, especially if they can outperform the meta classes. But we already had enough of this discussion.

Pugging ascalon is quite challenging atm. If a pug does the spider queen at first attempt, then you can safely do a full run. Just happens quite rarely, most pugs wipe at her.

achievement points matter. ^^

/s