Guild Wars 2

I’ve been through 6 groups today of trying to kill the Spider queen in AC. The speed run group(first group) I was with, went flawlessly. After that, the groups couldn’t even get her down to 50%. What is going wrong here?
We’re stacking as tightly as we can get, she just wipes everyone out in a few hits.

Also, why don’t people fight her around the statue like everyone used to fight her?

I’m really frustrated with this because I’ve wasted my entire Sunday with this Dungeon. Any advice you guys can give would be greatly appreciated!

If the party isn’t all or at least mostly zerker, then stacking will just get you killed. PUGs don’t get this, I did AC recently and told them before kholer “if you aren’t DPS spec, own up now otherwise we’ll wipe in the stack”. Nobody ’fessed up so I use my common sense and cleaved him and the mobs outside the stack, waited for his tell, dodged and then used battle standard to res basically the entire team.

We skip Kholer, The boss I was having trouble with was the Spider queen.

The point is still the same, you can’t stack against these bosses if your group has poor DPS because you’ll just get wiped.

Oh, pugging and failing all day must be horrible, I wonder how any sane person can stand it without feeling sick.
I’d just destroy all gargoyles and kite her around the statue, honestly. No way you’ll be able to melee her if you do no damage… The room is big enough to move and at best you can always quickly jump in for a few melee hits.
Now try to convince other puggies to do that and I’ll send you a cake. With chocolate.
“strife did dat so we have to do dat too lulzlulz we pro”

colesy.8490:

“if you aren’t DPS spec, own up now otherwise we’ll wipe in the stack”. Nobody ’fessed up

I hate this so much. You ask a general question and you get no responses and then they wonder why people get upset and kick them or tell them off.

Axyl.9408:

I’ve been through 6 groups today of trying to kill the Spider queen in AC. The speed run group(first group) I was with, went flawlessly. After that, the groups couldn’t even get her down to 50%. What is going wrong here?
We’re stacking as tightly as we can get, she just wipes everyone out in a few hits.

Also, why don’t people fight her around the statue like everyone used to fight her?

I’m really frustrated with this because I’ve wasted my entire Sunday with this Dungeon. Any advice you guys can give would be greatly appreciated!

People don’t fight like before because the majority of the population doesn’t know how to dodge and avoid circles. They will always find a away to avoid having to dodge to make fights more of a face roll such as stacking in a corner for the spider queen, forcing Statue of Dwayna into the wall, etc etc.

Active defense is quite important even when stacking on Queen. If you let that Weakness stick it will seriously lower your DPS.

The spider queen still do considerable amount of damage even without casting her aoe.

So if your group just stack and auoattack, they either have to have enough dps to kill fast enough or have enough healing to keep everyone up.

I just always run guardian when running AC. Since even if my group have poor dps, I can still heal enough to keep people up.

colesy.8490:

The point is still the same, you can’t stack against these bosses if your group has poor DPS because you’ll just get wiped.

^This pretty much. When melee she won’t do the AOE, but she’ll poke you direct damage.

Just go range. Take the small spiders first, don’t stand in AOE. After she has thrown her AOE around, go far away from her (or if you’re good at dodging, dodge to her other side) to avoid the white web-attack. She just does those two attacks when range. The rotation being AOE > web > AOE > web > AOE > web etc.

I have had trouble with the Spider Queen before, but usually it is one group that fails and not 6. One thing I found is the classes, having 1 or no heavy armour classes will usually mean a fail. Also bring lots of group condition removals i.e Shake It Off. She deals a few bleeds quite regularly and that deals a lot of damage if not dealt with. Also bring a fear skill. Big mobs such as Spider Queen and others from AC do not run from fear but are still paralysed so that can help. Otherwise get a few conditions on her and DPS it back to where it came from.

As other said: in those stacking you’re facetoface with the boss in a “Will i kill you before you kill me?” race.

So, DPS is important, that’s not said for elitism or anything else – if you don’t have the dmg to take queen/kholer down before they kill you, you’ll be much better going to the open field.

That said, a thing that hels a TON there is projectile defence/blocking/reflection.
Slap a WoR at your feet when doing those stacks, and it will negate Queen’s poison fields (they comes after a projectile) and Kholer spin (afaik he won’t spin if the scorpion wires get reflected. Not sure on this tho).

Learn to evade, her melee attack doesn’t have a very large tell but it’s enough. If you have condition remove tank the immobilize, otherwise evade behind the queen without leaving melee range.

Husky.6018:

Big mobs such as Spider Queen and others from AC do not run from fear but are still paralysed so that can help.

That’s because of the champs’ stacks of defiant.

Everybody else’s answers are true if your group was doing it correctly.

When i go, I’ll have my 4 party members stack in the spot. I’ll grab all the spiders on my ele and bring them back. If my party messes up, there’s usually one PUG or something who doesn’t know to wait, and runs out following me.

Another thing is when you’re stacking, stay in the corner. I’ve seen PUGs that roll back and stay behind. They either do this because they don’t run forward when dodging, or they get low health and they are scared to die, so they try to get away. This causes the spider queen to use her range attack, which is the poison aoe that will wipe a stacking group.

Just get a competent zerker ele with fiery greatsword and spam 2,3,4,5 into the corner, she shouldnt take more than 30-45 seconds. You only have to be targetting her for #2.

AndrewSX.3794:

Kholer spin (afaik he won’t spin if the scorpion wires get reflected. Not sure on this tho).

You know, I think he doesn’t do it sometimes because he interrupts himself with the reflected pull, but I often saw my whole team dying from the spin because I put down wor and they didn’t dodge out, even if they weren’t pulled. I do think they are one followed by the other… I could be wrong but then I couldn’t explain why my teammates die from that move even with wor.

Probably due to defiant stacks. Anyways SYG is better than WoR in this case as you don’t have worry about wall placement.

I use that too.

But then if we’re pugging everybody dies anyway because we have no deeeeepz. And no dodge button.

I’m REALLY surprised at how many people don’t know how defiant stacks work. I think Anet failed in explaining it clearly. Perhaps they should have showed off the mechanic prominently early in the personal story?

Lord Kuru.3685:

I’m REALLY surprised at how many people don’t know how defiant stacks work. I think Anet failed in explaining it clearly. Perhaps they should have showed off the mechanic prominently early in the personal story?

When did they ever explain defiant?
I don’t think they’ve failed to explain defiant simply because they’ve never actually explained it anywhere. It is just a matter of hovering your mouse over the icon and reading the description … while you are in the middle of fighting things. -_-

Khisanth.2948:

Lord Kuru.3685:

I’m REALLY surprised at how many people don’t know how defiant stacks work. I think Anet failed in explaining it clearly. Perhaps they should have showed off the mechanic prominently early in the personal story?

When did they ever explain defiant?
I don’t think they’ve failed to explain defiant simply because they’ve never actually explained it anywhere. It is just a matter of hovering your mouse over the icon and reading the description … while you are in the middle of fighting things. -_-

I think adding a scenario where you have to pull defiant off of a mob would be very useful to teach players about their skill set. Heck, ANY type of “learning” instance would be useful, where you get walked through several types of mechanics, and shown which weapons do what, and where they might be useful.

The tutorial is freaking useless, and the pvp NPCs are arguably worse… anything like an training area with timed tasks, and a test of skills would not only be awesome for achievements, but good for training people in the understanding of their skills.

AC – the first dungeon, is horrible for this.

lunyboy.8672:

Khisanth.2948:

Lord Kuru.3685:

I’m REALLY surprised at how many people don’t know how defiant stacks work. I think Anet failed in explaining it clearly. Perhaps they should have showed off the mechanic prominently early in the personal story?

When did they ever explain defiant?
I don’t think they’ve failed to explain defiant simply because they’ve never actually explained it anywhere. It is just a matter of hovering your mouse over the icon and reading the description … while you are in the middle of fighting things. -_-

The tutorial is freaking useless,

what tutorial? o_o

lunyboy.8672:

Khisanth.2948:

Lord Kuru.3685:

I’m REALLY surprised at how many people don’t know how defiant stacks work. I think Anet failed in explaining it clearly. Perhaps they should have showed off the mechanic prominently early in the personal story?

When did they ever explain defiant?
I don’t think they’ve failed to explain defiant simply because they’ve never actually explained it anywhere. It is just a matter of hovering your mouse over the icon and reading the description … while you are in the middle of fighting things. -_-

I think adding a scenario where you have to pull defiant off of a mob would be very useful to teach players about their skill set. Heck, ANY type of “learning” instance would be useful, where you get walked through several types of mechanics, and shown which weapons do what, and where they might be useful.

The tutorial is freaking useless, and the pvp NPCs are arguably worse… anything like an training area with timed tasks, and a test of skills would not only be awesome for achievements, but good for training people in the understanding of their skills.

AC – the first dungeon, is horrible for this.

The devs might still be traumatized from the GW1 Prophecies quest that tried to teach people to interrupt skills.

I think I realized my problem. I was accepting people ranging from 32-80, getting mostly people 32-45. I just realized last night the Explorable is listed as level 35. :/

Also! New question about protecting Hodgins from the Gravelings. What is the reason for leaving the center burrow for last?

Killing the center burrow sooner means getting those two annoying scavengers from east burrow sooner. Those two can wipe most defenders pretty easily with stunlock. Not to mention the ton of gravelings headed straight for hodgins— it can be hard to get aggro on all of them, so a lot of people pay it safe® by killing northeast burrow before north.

Wukunlin.8461:

lunyboy.8672:

Khisanth.2948:

Lord Kuru.3685:

I’m REALLY surprised at how many people don’t know how defiant stacks work. I think Anet failed in explaining it clearly. Perhaps they should have showed off the mechanic prominently early in the personal story?

When did they ever explain defiant?
I don’t think they’ve failed to explain defiant simply because they’ve never actually explained it anywhere. It is just a matter of hovering your mouse over the icon and reading the description … while you are in the middle of fighting things. -_-

The tutorial is freaking useless,

what tutorial? o_o

The one where you kill a level 1 “world boss” style mob?

Yeah, it’s not that memorable.

Sins.4782:

Killing the center burrow sooner means getting those two annoying scavengers from east burrow sooner. Those two can wipe most defenders pretty easily with stunlock. Not to mention the ton of gravelings headed straight for hodgins— it can be hard to get aggro on all of them, so a lot of people pay it safe® by killing northeast burrow before north.

Mainly this, but that’s mostly for unogranized groups.

When I’m on my ele and confident in my group, or there are two eles, we will split up.

I’ll stay on one side of the room and they stay on the other. This cuts down time from running over, because we both do the first two burrows in the series, then do the other side’s last burrow.

Rather than a wall of text, pm me if you want more info/explanation.

I’ll be uploading a video of an AC duo run tomorrow. If your trouble comes mainly from spider queen, i’ll try to get some decent solo (40 seconds) on tape if i find time for it. Will be working on a p3 solo/duo tomorrow, though.

OP - which server are you on? If it’s EU, just give me a shout in game and I can show you best ways to kill AC bosses. Done this dungeon until my eyes have bled for armor sets and Gift of Ascalon, and yeah, it is one of the worst when it comes to pugging.

Spider queen can be killed in 2 ways: stacking if you’ve got a geared group with dps, or partly ranged partly melee with cond removals.

http://youtu.be/5ey4TLqZwmk

That’s really like saying play the right class.

Which is exactly why some group stack and do it easily, some can’t.

Some of the lower level people tend to not upgrade their gear too. Which is probably why they die so fast.

Or just dodge, like shown in the video? Didn’t even use an energy sigil and had a second delay.

If you are learning, don’t skip Kholer. It is one of the best bosses to learn the basics.

If you are experienced, don’t skip Kholer. It is one of the most fun fights in the game (and what is this game for if its not for fun battles) and has a big chest with chance of precursor drop. Easy money.

/flameshield

Mesket.5728:

If you are learning, don’t skip Kholer. It is one of the best bosses to learn the basics.

If you are experienced, don’t skip Kholer. It is one of the most fun fights in the game (and what is this game for if its not for fun battles) and has a big chest with chance of precursor drop. Easy money.

/flameshield

Does he even drop coin anymore though? I really liked that fight and it taught me a lot about reflects on my ele but for 99% of pugs its unfathomable to even consider attacking him.

Solo.9027:

Mesket.5728:

If you are learning, don’t skip Kholer. It is one of the best bosses to learn the basics.

If you are experienced, don’t skip Kholer. It is one of the most fun fights in the game (and what is this game for if its not for fun battles) and has a big chest with chance of precursor drop. Easy money.

/flameshield

Does he even drop coin anymore though? I really liked that fight and it taught me a lot about reflects on my ele but for 99% of pugs its unfathomable to even consider attacking him.

Those are the pugs that needs him more than any other character. They should stop presuming they are good and start being good.

/recastflameshield

Kholer kind of just melts like 90% of other bosses :|

I prefer to skip him rather than waste time with pugs constantly getting downed. Now if I was in a group with people competent enough, that would be another story.

Kholer could’ve been a challenging fight if his auto-attacks didn’t hit like a wet noodle.

Dub.1273:

Or just dodge, like shown in the video? Didn’t even use an energy sigil and had a second delay.

I said the exact same thing on another post. I remember saying you can always dodge but you can’t always expect your groupmate to be able to dodge.

I’m just explaining why in some group it is so easy some it isn’t. Some group just kill it fast enough or have healers to keep people up.

For example if I play rogue, if my pug is bad, I’ll have to solo spider queen (that is even if I can do it) while I watch my other groupmates on the ground. If I play guardian, I just heal through it and keep everyone up.

It is easier with some class. I’m not sure how much more dps elemntist do but that firesword trick really do make it easier right?

Ayrilana.1396:

I prefer to skip him rather than waste time with pugs constantly getting downed. Now if I was in a group with people competent enough, that would be another story.

Whenever I see someone skipping him as default, I automatically assume he is incompetent enough to charge him in the first place

I’m playing support ele and I have never had such a problem, i just heal/buff everyone and noone dies Too bad that in the most cases ppl just want everyone to be full berserkers and don’t want me sometimes…

EpicHedgehog.1754:

I’m playing support ele and I have never had such a problem, i just heal/buff everyone and noone dies Too bad that in the most cases ppl just want everyone to be full berserkers and don’t want me sometimes…

As horribly as off topic as this may be, you aren’t contributing as much as you think you are.

EpicHedgehog.1754:

I’m playing support ele and I have never had such a problem, i just heal/buff everyone and noone dies Too bad that in the most cases ppl just want everyone to be full berserkers and don’t want me sometimes…

I’d take a support ele over yet another zerk guy… the contribution and difference they make, specially while pugging with random people is amazing.

Mesket.5728:

EpicHedgehog.1754:

I’m playing support ele and I have never had such a problem, i just heal/buff everyone and noone dies Too bad that in the most cases ppl just want everyone to be full berserkers and don’t want me sometimes…

I’d take a support ele over yet another zerk guy… the contribution and difference they make, specially while pugging with random people is amazing.

Most of the support in this game is hard coded into skills/traits with little scalability from gear. Gearing for anything except dps only prolongs a fight opening the party up to further attacks. A berserker ele played well can support just as well but also deals like 5x more damage so the threat is eliminated faster.

Solo.9027:

Mesket.5728:

EpicHedgehog.1754:

I’m playing support ele and I have never had such a problem, i just heal/buff everyone and noone dies Too bad that in the most cases ppl just want everyone to be full berserkers and don’t want me sometimes…

I’d take a support ele over yet another zerk guy… the contribution and difference they make, specially while pugging with random people is amazing.

Most of the support in this game is hard coded into skills/traits with little scalability from gear. Gearing for anything except dps only prolongs a fight opening the party up to further attacks. A berserker ele played well can support just as well but also deals like 5x more damage so the threat is eliminated faster.

I know, but I still prefer someone who likes paying support and does it well rather than someone who will go min/max toward dps and be on water for like 1 second to go back to another elem. I’m no one to judge how others enjoy their video game time so I won’t poke on someone who can’t dodge, this (ele) guy will let him last longer and have more fun, thus, I’ll have more fun and we can all laugh like a bunch of ewoks in the forest while slashing foes without worries.

Besides I couldn’t care less about how long the dungeon is, I don’t pretend to have better things to do when I’m actually on my relaxing time enjoying a video game. Unemployed kids tend to do this and get nervous if they “waste time” (biggest irony, they are playing a kitten video game!). I can’t care less for their “eliteness”.

So, hands down, come on in dedicated support guy making our life easier.

Ps. I’m sorry if I’m bringing common sense to the table, I know not many forum posters can handle that.

Warning: this thread has now derailed. Prepare for maximum amount of trolling to begin in 5…..4……3…..2…..1

On topic; AC is such a toss up for me in pugs. I either get fantastic groups, or I’m stuck at the burrows, or hodgins is dead for the 10th time, and I just end up leaving and go do another dungeon. TA is I nice and puggable, so that’s usually my backup.

Solo.9027:

Mesket.5728:

EpicHedgehog.1754:

I’m playing support ele and I have never had such a problem, i just heal/buff everyone and noone dies Too bad that in the most cases ppl just want everyone to be full berserkers and don’t want me sometimes…

I’d take a support ele over yet another zerk guy… the contribution and difference they make, specially while pugging with random people is amazing.

Most of the support in this game is hard coded into skills/traits with little scalability from gear. Gearing for anything except dps only prolongs a fight opening the party up to further attacks. A berserker ele played well can support just as well but also deals like 5x more damage so the threat is eliminated faster.

I mean that sometimes they don’t want me only because im ele (im talking about this “Need 4 warriors and 1 guardian speed run” groups that dont want any other class in their party), not that they don’t want me bevause of my gear.

Im using Knights armor + mix of celestial/berserkers trinkets on my ele but with support traits (0/20/0/30/20) with staff, I know my combos and i think im useful in the dungeons + in AC the “Frost Bow” is OP ^^

EpicHedgehog.1754:

Im using Knights armor + mix of celestial/berserkers trinkets on my ele but with support traits (0/20/0/30/20) with staff, I know my combos and i think im useful in the dungeons + in AC the “Frost Bow” is OP ^^

I don’t mean to derail if I did, I’m just saying full berserkers do A LOT more damage and damage has a real measureable effect.

For example, using your frost bow in that scenario with a low damage build will not be able to kill a burrow in 1 shot, but in full dps build it will. This saves your team+hodgins from countless leaping gravelings whose damage/cc you will not be able to entirely heal/avoid especially when they keep spawning the longer you linger on each burrow.