New Dungeon Idea

New Dungeon Idea

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Posted by: Tears.5627

Tears.5627

I miss the feel The Deep and Urgoz Warren had in GW1. I was just thinking how neat it would be to have a dungeon that puts a constant debuff on you until you down the boss of the section. I would be especially excited to see a dungeon like this that specifically murders the META groups that just copy and paste everything they see online to farm this game of any fun for casual player or players that don’t want to be limited to 3 classes just to shave off 2 minutes a run.

Running Axe on Necro since April 27th, 2012 (Before it was cool)

(edited by Tears.5627)

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Posted by: Ariete The Phoenix.8276

Ariete The Phoenix.8276

Can you imagine perma Chill? nope, nope, nope, nope.

Also known as Liahm Lee

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Posted by: Purple Miku.7032

Purple Miku.7032

Can you imagine perma Chill? nope, nope, nope, nope.

Elite risen elementalists in Arah are pretty good at chill upkeep.

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Posted by: maha.7902

maha.7902

I miss the feel The Deep and Urgoz Warren had in GW1. I was just thinking how neat it would be to have a dungeon that puts a constant debuff on you until you down the boss of the section. I would be especially excited to see a dungeon like this that specifically murders the META groups that just copy and paste everything they see online to farm this game of any fun for casual player or players that don’t want to be limited to 3 classes just to shave off 2 minutes a run.

This doesn’t sound like someone extremely bitter about people who they don’t even play with and wants to offer a terrible suggestion to punish them for no logical reason.

Not at all.

Serah Mahariel – Death and Taxes

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Posted by: Tears.5627

Tears.5627

I miss the feel The Deep and Urgoz Warren had in GW1. I was just thinking how neat it would be to have a dungeon that puts a constant debuff on you until you down the boss of the section. I would be especially excited to see a dungeon like this that specifically murders the META groups that just copy and paste everything they see online to farm this game of any fun for casual player or players that don’t want to be limited to 3 classes just to shave off 2 minutes a run.

This doesn’t sound like someone extremely bitter about people who they don’t even play with and wants to offer a terrible suggestion to punish them for no logical reason.

Not at all.

I am a player that likes a little punishment with my dungeon runs. They made the dungeons in this game so mind numbingly easy that the only way for people to apparently make it fun for themselves is to exclude other to save a measly 2-5 minutes a run. Everyone can do CoF in their sleep. AC is the same way. Fractals has even made it to that point where all you have to do is stack and mash on most of it (not to be mistaken for all of it). Not one person can deny this.

EDIT: Typo

Running Axe on Necro since April 27th, 2012 (Before it was cool)

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Posted by: Barbarka.9362

Barbarka.9362

I miss the feel The Deep and Urgoz Warren had in GW1. I was just thinking how neat it would be to have a dungeon that puts a constant debuff on you until you down the boss of the section. I would be especially excited to see a dungeon like this that specifically murders the META groups that just copy and paste everything they see online to farm this game of any fun for casual player or players that don’t want to be limited to 3 classes just to shave off 2 minutes a run.

This doesn’t sound like someone extremely bitter about people who they don’t even play with and wants to offer a terrible suggestion to punish them for no logical reason.

Not at all.

Maha why do you even post anymore… You mad BRO? Cause people laugh at your corner camping.

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Posted by: cranked.3812

cranked.3812

I miss the feel The Deep and Urgoz Warren had in GW1. I was just thinking how neat it would be to have a dungeon that puts a constant debuff on you until you down the boss of the section. I would be especially excited to see a dungeon like this that specifically murders the META groups that just copy and paste everything they see online to farm this game of any fun for casual player or players that don’t want to be limited to 3 classes just to shave off 2 minutes a run.

This doesn’t sound like someone extremely bitter about people who they don’t even play with and wants to offer a terrible suggestion to punish them for no logical reason.

Not at all.

Maha why do you even post anymore… You mad BRO? Cause people laugh at your corner camping.

Maha’s point to the OP is, you shouldn’t come in here with poor suggestions because you are mad that you were excluded from a group that you don’t fit into.

This is just another "I got excluded because ‘X’ reason threads. How many times do people here have to say it: MAKE YOUR OWN GROUP. Do you even realize how easy that is? I can make a group anytime with any description and it fills in minutes. Stop complaining here and put some effort in.

EDIT: Attacking him in a personal matter makes you look even more childish.

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Posted by: Heltzer.2435

Heltzer.2435

Honestly, the current dungeons should remain easy IMO. Many established players forget those dungeons were where we got our first sets of exotic armor paid with tokins or karma down at the temples and lord knows karma is not as easy to get these days (except in EOTM). I’m surprised by the number of under 2k AP players I see lately and I’d hate to make it harder for them to get their exotic sets.

Anet knows there is a need for harder content…they just have a problem balancing hard content with a proper level of reward with time invested. Perhaps the new dungeons and zones will have harder content for us.

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Posted by: NovaanVerdiano.6174

NovaanVerdiano.6174

I miss the feel The Deep and Urgoz Warren had in GW1. I was just thinking how neat it would be to have a dungeon that puts a constant debuff on you until you down the boss of the section. I would be especially excited to see a dungeon like this that specifically murders the META groups that just copy and paste everything they see online to farm this game of any fun for casual player or players that don’t want to be limited to 3 classes just to shave off 2 minutes a run.

This doesn’t sound like someone extremely bitter about people who they don’t even play with and wants to offer a terrible suggestion to punish them for no logical reason.

Not at all.

I am a player that likes a little punishment with my dungeon runs. They made the dungeons in this game so mind numbingly easy that the only way for people to apparently make it fun for themselves is to exclude other to save a measly 2-5 minutes a run. Everyone can do CoF in their sleep. AC is the same way. Fractals has even made it to that point where all you have to do is stack and mash on most of it (not to be mistaken for all of it). Not one person can deny this.

EDIT: Typo

Most of it? Not really imo. Don’t know of any boss you stack with pugs in fractals, except the golems in aetherblade retreat.
Also, hell, even if you couldn’t lure enemies around corners, a guard would run in first, pull them together with binding blades and then it would be pretty much the exact same thing.
If you think using LoS to pull enemies around corners, start your own “no stacking/LoS-pulling” groups, then you can play without having to stand in any of those stupid corners.
AC and CoF are easy dungeons in comparison. Yet, there are still a lot of people who struggle with any dungeon, simply because they’re not used to them, the game or whatever. You on the other hand probably are.

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Posted by: robertul.3679

robertul.3679

Yea cause like harder dungeons/fractals will absolutely murder meta groups while phiw groups will manage just fine. Because reasons I guess.
0/10 bad troll.

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Posted by: Saint.5647

Saint.5647

For some reason PHIW community always assumes the meta crowd will be hit hardest by any change. It’s never been the case.

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Posted by: dlonie.6547

dlonie.6547

Yea cause like harder dungeons/fractals will absolutely murder meta groups while phiw groups will manage just fine. Because reasons I guess.
0/10 bad troll.

That’s why PHIWs are so highly sought after in the existing “hard” PvE content like Arah p4. Bearbow at Simins is OP.

For some reason PHIW community always assumes the meta crowd will be hit hardest by any change. It’s never been the case.

True, since meta means “play the best setup available”, we just adapt. The PHIWs who only want to play one build are the ones who get shafted.

OP might have had an interesting post if he hadn’t gone all QQ at the end there. Doesn’t even make sense, how would a debuff affect meta any differently than PHIW?

Please explain OP. I’d love to hear the thought process that went into this amazing concept.

(edited by dlonie.6547)

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Posted by: IndigoSundown.5419

IndigoSundown.5419

I would be especially excited to see a dungeon like this that specifically murders the META groups that just copy and paste everything they see online to farm this game of any fun for casual player or players that don’t want to be limited to 3 classes just to shave off 2 minutes a run.

Ah, I see that you prefer the PuG experience to reflect exactly what you like in a dungeon party, rather than what other people like. It’s a pity that your desires will kill all those casual, fun runs for all the people that advertise “anything goes.” Good thinking!

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Posted by: Saint.5647

Saint.5647

I’ve been hoping for something like this for a while to be honest. I’ve wanted a HM/Gambit system for dungeons or some elite dungeons with exactly what the OP describes.

If anything to add some variety to how we do things. The irony is that the meta crowd will experiment and find new roles for new classes to deal with debuffs while the PHIW will just shift to complaining about whatever the meta for X debuff will be.

Even if it is 2 Engis, 1 Necro, and a Ranger….

It really is a cool concept though. If Anet looks at some of their GW1 dungeons, I think they will find a great deal of inspiration for this game. There was some really great stuff there.

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Posted by: Tears.5627

Tears.5627

Yea cause like harder dungeons/fractals will absolutely murder meta groups while phiw groups will manage just fine. Because reasons I guess.
0/10 bad troll.

That’s why PHIWs are so highly sought after in the existing “hard” PvE content like Arah p4. Bearbow at Simins is OP.

For some reason PHIW community always assumes the meta crowd will be hit hardest by any change. It’s never been the case.

True, since meta means “play the best setup available”, we just adapt. The PHIWs who only want to play one build are the ones who get shafted.

OP might have had an interesting post if he hadn’t gone all QQ at the end there. Doesn’t even make sense, how would a debuff affect meta any differently than PHIW?

Please explain OP. I’d love to hear the thought process that went into this amazing concept.

Because the current meta is to stack and buff and max dps everything. If there was a room that converted boons to conditions or a room that made all buffs unable to be placed half of the copy paste builds would not work. Throw in a room where it changes between physical damage doing nothing and condition damage doing nothing so you have to adapt to the encounter itself instead of mindlessly mashing the same keys over and over. I want skill to be necessary. I want to play whatever class I want to play at that time using the strengths of that class to my advantage vs only being stuck to 3 of my toons. I have 8 level 80’s. The problem is not that I can’t do the content the way THEY want. The problem is this game is turning into “LFG insert class and build here

Running Axe on Necro since April 27th, 2012 (Before it was cool)

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Posted by: DonQuack.9025

DonQuack.9025

itself instead of mindlessly mashing the same keys over and over.

cant wait for that to be possible.

/sarcasm

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Posted by: Tears.5627

Tears.5627

I’ve been hoping for something like this for a while to be honest. I’ve wanted a HM/Gambit system for dungeons or some elite dungeons with exactly what the OP describes.

If anything to add some variety to how we do things. The irony is that the meta crowd will experiment and find new roles for new classes to deal with debuffs while the PHIW will just shift to complaining about whatever the meta for X debuff will be.

Even if it is 2 Engis, 1 Necro, and a Ranger….

It really is a cool concept though. If Anet looks at some of their GW1 dungeons, I think they will find a great deal of inspiration for this game. There was some really great stuff there.

Thank you. Yes I am a little POed at the meta crap and have something against anyone who wants to leech fun out of a game for speed clears but my main point is Elite Dungeons that provide a challenge and does not allow stacking or have an appalling amount of glitches would make me happy. I want something that is both hard to get through and rewards us for it. Fractals are not fun. They are so repetitive and easy that I no longer go there. I miss vanquishing. Maybe HM Dungeons with Vanquishing bonuses for killing everything in the area. That would be awesome

Running Axe on Necro since April 27th, 2012 (Before it was cool)

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Posted by: maha.7902

maha.7902

So you think a room which literally blanks your entire build and utilities is good design? Boon conversion is a terrible idea. Take guardian for example. You no longer gain might with your greatsword auto chain, symbol of wrath retaliation is converted in to a condition, you can’t retreat for aegis and swiftness, you can’t use any of you virtues since they will basically read “apply two conditions to your party”. Hammer auto chain will get the protection converted to a condition.

A room with things becoming immune to physical/condition damage at certain times just means you get one or two guys retraiting to a condition build so that they can burn the boss/mobs down during condition phases while the physical damage players basically just go afk. Then when direct damage is useable again, the condi users go afk. You will have fights with half your party literally standing around doing nothing.

If you think this game is just mindlessly mashing the same keys over and over again, you clearly don’t play it to any decent standard – every time I press a skill in the game I do it with full intention.

Serah Mahariel – Death and Taxes

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Posted by: NovaanVerdiano.6174

NovaanVerdiano.6174

So a room where either physical or condition damage doesn’t work = skill?
No boons allowed = skill?

I don’t get it. For the first situation, you’d either be completely useless or have to run a half condition, half physical damage build (also useless). Also, why no boons in a room? Explain why that would make sense.

Furthermore, it isn’t turning into “Lfg insert class and build here” and you aren’t restricted to three of your chars either. If you want to play whatever class, do it. I play my necro often, even in pugs and except for some rare cases, no one ever complained.

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Posted by: Tears.5627

Tears.5627

So a room where either physical or condition damage doesn’t work = skill?
No boons allowed = skill?

I don’t get it. For the first situation, you’d either be completely useless or have to run a half condition, half physical damage build (also useless). Also, why no boons in a room? Explain why that would make sense.

Furthermore, it isn’t turning into “Lfg insert class and build here” and you aren’t restricted to three of your chars either. If you want to play whatever class, do it. I play my necro often, even in pugs and except for some rare cases, no one ever complained.

Most people seem to want an Ele, War, or Guard. I have seen multiple LFG’s up looking for very specific classes. The time I get to play (after work and hanging out with my daughter) I am running into more of these than normal PUGs.
Adapting to a situation=Skill
Copy and Paste Dominating every aspect of the game is not.

Running Axe on Necro since April 27th, 2012 (Before it was cool)

(edited by Tears.5627)

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Posted by: NovaanVerdiano.6174

NovaanVerdiano.6174

So a room where either physical or condition damage doesn’t work = skill?
No boons allowed = skill?

I don’t get it. For the first situation, you’d either be completely useless or have to run a half condition, half physical damage build (also useless). Also, why no boons in a room? Explain why that would make sense.

Furthermore, it isn’t turning into “Lfg insert class and build here” and you aren’t restricted to three of your chars either. If you want to play whatever class, do it. I play my necro often, even in pugs and except for some rare cases, no one ever complained.

Most people seem to want an Ele, War, or Guard. I have seen multiple LFG’s up looking for very specific classes. The time I get to play (after work and hanging out with my daughter) I am running into more of these than normal PUGs

I can only say it again, open your own groups. If you only see groups which search for specific classes on lfg, that’s the logical thing to do. Your groups will fill up, trust me.

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Posted by: maha.7902

maha.7902

Most people seem to want an Ele, War, or Guard. I have seen multiple LFG’s up looking for very specific classes. The time I get to play (after work and hanging out with my daughter) I am running into more of these than normal PUGs

1. go on to lfg
2. go to dungeon of choice
3. click advertise your party
4. type in “looking for more path [number] anyone welcome”
5. group fills in like 2 minutes
6. ???
7. Profit

I did not say blanks out entire builds.

Except it does. Boon conversion shuts off trait options, it prevents you using utilities, it makes certain weapons completely unviable.

Adapting to a situation=Skill. Copy and Paste dominating EVERY aspect of the game is not.

build #1 is bad so let’s copy paste build #2 for this situation
lets go back to build #1 after this is done

How does this fix anything?

Serah Mahariel – Death and Taxes

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Posted by: Tears.5627

Tears.5627

So a room where either physical or condition damage doesn’t work = skill?
No boons allowed = skill?

I don’t get it. For the first situation, you’d either be completely useless or have to run a half condition, half physical damage build (also useless). Also, why no boons in a room? Explain why that would make sense.

Furthermore, it isn’t turning into “Lfg insert class and build here” and you aren’t restricted to three of your chars either. If you want to play whatever class, do it. I play my necro often, even in pugs and except for some rare cases, no one ever complained.

Most people seem to want an Ele, War, or Guard. I have seen multiple LFG’s up looking for very specific classes. The time I get to play (after work and hanging out with my daughter) I am running into more of these than normal PUGs

I can only say it again, open your own groups. If you only see groups which search for specific classes on lfg, that’s the logical thing to do. Your groups will fill up, trust me.

Funny thing is I did just that and Got kicked from my own group so they could pick up a warrior since I wanted to run my Necro. There the back story is. After that I gave up. I just need to wait for this terrible balance cycle to overcharge buff the Necro and bomb some other class into the crapper.

Running Axe on Necro since April 27th, 2012 (Before it was cool)

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Posted by: Tears.5627

Tears.5627

Most people seem to want an Ele, War, or Guard. I have seen multiple LFG’s up looking for very specific classes. The time I get to play (after work and hanging out with my daughter) I am running into more of these than normal PUGs

1. go on to lfg
2. go to dungeon of choice
3. click advertise your party
4. type in “looking for more path [number] anyone welcome”
5. group fills in like 2 minutes
6. ???
7. Profit

I did not say blanks out entire builds.

Except it does. Boon conversion shuts off trait options, it prevents you using utilities, it makes certain weapons completely unviable.

Adapting to a situation=Skill. Copy and Paste dominating EVERY aspect of the game is not.

build #1 is bad so let’s copy paste build #2 for this situation
lets go back to build #1 after this is done

How does this fix anything?

Make some suggestions to fix the problem then. If ANet simply fixes Condition Damage to work well and brings in new weapon choices to give a little more diversity maybe we would not run into this crap. ANet nerfed almost everything fun in GW1 and here I am playing a game where people throw tantrums when you just want to play for fun.

Running Axe on Necro since April 27th, 2012 (Before it was cool)

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Posted by: maha.7902

maha.7902

Make some suggestions to fix the problem then.

This may surprise you but

wait for it

-

-

-

-

-

there is no problem

If ANet simply fixes Condition Damage to work well

brings in new weapon choices to give a little more diversity

From the classes I play…

Warriors make use of greatswords, axes, warhorns, swords, maces and longbows (this is referring to at a speed clear level)

Guardians make use of greatswords, swords, hammers, foci and scepters

Mesmers make use of swords, pistols and foci

Thieves make use of daggers, pistols, swords and shortbows.

Sounds like a lot of weapons are usable to me.

Serah Mahariel – Death and Taxes

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Posted by: DonQuack.9025

DonQuack.9025

mad cuz kicked.

Also PHIW 101 Enter the instance select path then list party.

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Posted by: Rising Dusk.2408

Rising Dusk.2408

If you create a dungeon that kills the current meta, then the meta changes to adapt and optimize runs in the new dungeon, and that new meta develops the same optimization-bent that has always been there. Your suggestion changes nothing.

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Posted by: Tears.5627

Tears.5627

Make some suggestions to fix the problem then.

This may surprise you but

wait for it

-

-

-

-

-

there is no problem

If ANet simply fixes Condition Damage to work well

brings in new weapon choices to give a little more diversity

From the classes I play…

Warriors make use of greatswords, axes, warhorns, swords, maces and longbows (this is referring to at a speed clear level)

Guardians make use of greatswords, swords, hammers, foci and scepters

Mesmers make use of swords, pistols and foci

Thieves make use of daggers, pistols, swords and shortbows.

Sounds like a lot of weapons are usable to me.

Lets add in engineer and necro weapon choices.

Running Axe on Necro since April 27th, 2012 (Before it was cool)

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Posted by: Tears.5627

Tears.5627

If you create a dungeon that kills the current meta, then the meta changes to adapt and optimize runs in the new dungeon, and that new meta develops the same optimization-bent that has always been there. Your suggestion changes nothing.

Then there needs to be a balance that does not limit 3 or 4 professions while making the rest of them godlike. There is still a problem with being barred from a group for wanting to play a class you enjoy.

Running Axe on Necro since April 27th, 2012 (Before it was cool)

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Posted by: Tears.5627

Tears.5627

mad cuz kicked.

Also PHIW 101 Enter the instance select path then list party.

I did. I was immediately asked to change to a different 80 like an ele or war. I said “I am good thanks.” I was dropped, they posted in LFG, they got their warrior, I logged off.

Running Axe on Necro since April 27th, 2012 (Before it was cool)

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Posted by: Rising Dusk.2408

Rising Dusk.2408

Then there needs to be a balance that does not limit 3 or 4 professions while making the rest of them godlike. There is still a problem with being barred from a group for wanting to play a class you enjoy.

If your class is bad at PvE, your class is bad at PvE. That’s a challenge for the ANet balance team to resolve, and doesn’t rest with dungeon design.

Quite frankly, dungeon balance is pretty good on the whole; 6 of the 8 classes are great for dungeons and even speed clears (Ele, Thief, Guardian, Warrior, Mesmer, Ranger), one is decent at best (Engineer), and one is downright bad (Necromancer). It could be far worse.

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(edited by Rising Dusk.2408)

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Posted by: Saint.5647

Saint.5647

I’ve been hoping for something like this for a while to be honest. I’ve wanted a HM/Gambit system for dungeons or some elite dungeons with exactly what the OP describes.

If anything to add some variety to how we do things. The irony is that the meta crowd will experiment and find new roles for new classes to deal with debuffs while the PHIW will just shift to complaining about whatever the meta for X debuff will be.

Even if it is 2 Engis, 1 Necro, and a Ranger….

It really is a cool concept though. If Anet looks at some of their GW1 dungeons, I think they will find a great deal of inspiration for this game. There was some really great stuff there.

Thank you. Yes I am a little POed at the meta crap and have something against anyone who wants to leech fun out of a game for speed clears but my main point is Elite Dungeons that provide a challenge and does not allow stacking or have an appalling amount of glitches would make me happy. I want something that is both hard to get through and rewards us for it. Fractals are not fun. They are so repetitive and easy that I no longer go there. I miss vanquishing. Maybe HM Dungeons with Vanquishing bonuses for killing everything in the area. That would be awesome

I’d wager that no dungeon subforum regulars are still excited about running dungeons or fractals. I log on to play/talk with with my guildmates. The dungeon/fractal is the backdrop. We know them so well that we play whatever classes we want without a thought to the tactic…and are still pushing times that would make PuGs kitten bricks. I would bet all my Gold that this is true for most of the other Meta guilds in this forum.

The OP has a good suggestion that many people here could get on board with except he spins it with this bitterness about class QQ. Are you really such a great player? Get into a good guild then. No one will care if you play your Necro with the right skilled group. If you’re trying to play with PuGs, you’ll probably be kicked for PuG reasons. PuGs can’t take chances on team comp. They barely understand how the game works….of course they don’t know how to switch up their team comp.

Yes, I agree. There should be VQ options for people and a different set of rewards. Perhaps Champs in VQ could drop Dragonite Ore or something. I’ve long wanted additional modes added into dungeons or paths to further the storylines in the dungeons…Don’t hold your breath though. I think Anet doesn’t care for them anymore.

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Posted by: Purple Miku.7032

Purple Miku.7032

Saint is correct. There is pretty much nothing exciting about repeating the exact same thing over and over and over again. I wouldn’t even bother if I didn’t enjoy trying to beat my own personal bests for Arah soloing. Even that grows horrendously dull after a while, which is why I get my fill after a path or two usually and normally don’t do much else besides a pug on my ele here and there.

The content itself is nice, but it has pretty lousy replay value in comparison to say… dungeoneering on Runescape used to have.

A lot of people don’t agree but I really loved the concept of “random” mob spawns and not knowing what room you’d walk into next or knowing what boss you’d have with absolute certainty. I think that to ensure people are more interested in an activity, it needs to have the element of surprise incorporated to a certain degree. Once you know exactly what’s going to happen, it becomes arduous to a certain degree and the exploration aspect is gone. Sure one could argue that you’d eventually reach the point where you’ve tried all possible outcomes and it’d lose its excitement after a while, but what other options for variety do we really have?

If Arenanet simply makes new dungeons, they’re going to just end up the same way all the other ones will in the end.

Unfortunately with what I’ve mentioned in regards to my little Runescape nostalgia example, it would require a lot of development time and testing to implement a system similar to that in GW2.

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Posted by: dlonie.6547

dlonie.6547

I still fail to see how things like dungeon debuffs would make PHIW more viable. The meta would adapt, and PHIWs still wouldn’t be able to play how they wanted.

Are you really such a great player? Get into a good guild then. No one will care if you play your Necro with the right skilled group.

This is the best advice you’ve gotten so far. Trying to pug on one of those classes is a pain. Get with a good guild.

I’d go further and say to do this even if you don’t consider yourself skilled. There are guilds that do casual dungeon runs, search around on enjin or post in the LFGuild subforum.