a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Ya same thing just not in an instance it in an open world.
No not the same thing at all, one is a zerg amongst people you don’t know and will never speak to and will likely be over in anywhere between 10 seconds (Maw) and 10 minutes (Claw), the other is a raid amongst people who are in your group and are communicating via speech and / or text.
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Ya same thing just not in an instance it in an open world.
No not the same thing at all, one is a zerg amongst people you don’t know and will never speak to and will likely be over in anywhere between 10 seconds (Maw) and 10 minutes (Claw), the other is a raid amongst people who are in your group and are communicating via speech and / or text.
Just because you find something easy dose not mean its not a raid. Most of these ppl who are running these world events have done it before and know what going on but if its your first time you got to talk to other ppl to work out what going on. There also more then just the one shot bosses that i am talking about temples are major raid like events. They do take some level of coronation all of them.
Main : Jski Imaginary ELE (Necromancer)
Guild : OBEY (The Legacy) I call it Obay , TLC (WvW) , UNIV (other)
Server : FA
So you saw the word “raid” in the description “prepare for an underground raid against the molten alliance” and automatically assume it’s a “raid” in the traditional MMO sense? Prepare to be disappointed.
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Ya same thing just not in an instance it in an open world.
No not the same thing at all, one is a zerg amongst people you don’t know and will never speak to and will likely be over in anywhere between 10 seconds (Maw) and 10 minutes (Claw), the other is a raid amongst people who are in your group and are communicating via speech and / or text.
According to the wiki page on Raids in gaming, Dynamic Events fit the definition.
“A raid is a type of mission in a video game in which a very large number of people (larger than the normal team size set by the game) attempt to defeat a boss monster. This type of objective is most common in MMORPGs, where the servers are designed to handle the number of users. "
It does not specify that it has to be instanced.
Also, raids in WoW (At least in Cataclysm, which is what I played) did not require strategy, thought or skill. It was the same thing, dps it down for 10 minutes. Utterly boring stuff.
With respect, they don’t. They just take the majority of people to understand what the mechanics of the fight are, which is why Grenth usually fails. If I do a guild run on Grenth, it succeeds, if I just turn up at Grenth..it 90% doesn’t. Which is why I don’t.
Edit for post above: Warcraft stopped requiring proper coordination at WoTLK. Prior to that, with the gear that was around….you could not pug raids.
With respect, they don’t. They just take the majority of people to understand what the mechanics of the fight are, which is why Grenth usually fails. If I do a guild run on Grenth, it succeeds, if I just turn up at Grenth..it 90% doesn’t. Which is why I don’t.
And being in that guild give you no communication? You know there more then just talking and typing that you can call communication.
Main : Jski Imaginary ELE (Necromancer)
Guild : OBEY (The Legacy) I call it Obay , TLC (WvW) , UNIV (other)
Server : FA
You are missing the point by a large country mile. It succeeds because we have done it all before, we also communicate via mumble. Either way, every single temple event can and is regualrly being zerged. Apart from Grenth, which for some reason always seems to have everyone stack Champions and Veterans that do massive AOE right on top of the guy you are meant to be protecting.
You are missing the point by a large country mile. It succeeds because we have done it all before, we also communicate via mumble. Either way, every single temple event can and is regualrly being zerged. Apart from Grenth, which for some reason always seems to have everyone stack Champions and Veterans that do massive AOE right on top of the guy you are meant to be protecting.
Blaz cant be zerged only the last part can but the lead up its better to not have a zerg. That part of the temple runs. This is why i am calling them raided because just betting the boss at the end if only a small part of the over all event.
Main : Jski Imaginary ELE (Necromancer)
Guild : OBEY (The Legacy) I call it Obay , TLC (WvW) , UNIV (other)
Server : FA
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Ya same thing just not in an instance it in an open world.
No not the same thing at all, one is a zerg amongst people you don’t know and will never speak to and will likely be over in anywhere between 10 seconds (Maw) and 10 minutes (Claw), the other is a raid amongst people who are in your group and are communicating via speech and / or text.
Just because you find something easy dose not mean its not a raid. Most of these ppl who are running these world events have done it before and know what going on but if its your first time you got to talk to other ppl to work out what going on. There also more then just the one shot bosses that i am talking about temples are major raid like events. They do take some level of coronation all of them.
A huge Zerg of people spamming dps at an npc is not a raid. The temple events are burn boss and Rez downed. Nothing complex about them.
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Ya same thing just not in an instance it in an open world.
I don’t think raid means what you think it means lol. or are you trolling?
I am not trolling i think ppl views are too WoW minded as in if its not like the way it is in WoW then its not the real way. I am trying to get ppl out of this very non progression for mmorpg mind set. In effect if you want to call it an instanced only event then we have a zone wide instanced because most of these big events take up or use most of the maps that they are in.
Main : Jski Imaginary ELE (Necromancer)
Guild : OBEY (The Legacy) I call it Obay , TLC (WvW) , UNIV (other)
Server : FA
Never knew raids had to be instanced, then again, I never played WoW.
I always thought of them as encounters, whether it’s a dungeon, or some boss in open world that required a good amount of people, and some planning. (no planning at all if the encounter has been done so much, most people already know what to do)
“Caithe, someday you’ll see, Tyria needs me. -Scarlet”
Never knew raids had to be instanced, then again, I never played WoW.
I always thought of them as encounters, whether it’s a dungeon, or some boss in open world that required a good amount of people, and some planning. (no planning at all if the encounter has been done so much, most people already know what to do)
There more then just playing WoW most other mmorpg have adapted WoW way of making mmorpgs. There is some planing when it comes to these big events in GW2 but a lot of what you need to do it told to you by the game it self. You can set up a plan of an attk for these events if you want but its not a must. Now if you just wait for all the pre-events to be over and jump on the only part that give you a chest your some what leeching off the players who where in the even from the start. This for the player who jump in only by the end of it make it no longer a true raid for them. The ones who are there for the full event or most of it will get the feeling of working to something and this is where the raid effect comes into play.
In ff11 (before WoW) raid where fake instanced base called dynamis max number was 64 players that where mostly “trash” pulls that ended up every mob getting changed sleeped and kill off one at a time for some mobs and in mass for the other type of mobs. Most of the bosses where kited and only hit with “big” hits to keep the boss from spamming its big attks. I call it a fake instanced because it was a one only zone that was made or made available to one group of players who had that item to get in. It was an large event that was timed in its one time only zone. This is a lot like GW2 but you can have more players in the zone (the map that your on) and with out the need for an item to get in.
Main : Jski Imaginary ELE (Necromancer)
Guild : OBEY (The Legacy) I call it Obay , TLC (WvW) , UNIV (other)
Server : FA
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
On the other hand, they said you’d never have to grind for power and here we are with ascended items and WoW-styled dungeon gating mechanics.
So, I would be absolutely unsurprised if they ended up adding wow-style instanced 20 – 40 man raids at some point even though they said they wouldn’t.
and there’s no point in getting ascended items. So no, in order to get your initial level 80 gear that most people use you don’t need to grind (exotics) and most of the ascendeds are a time gated thing (laurels) and do not require a grind to obtain them.
As a primary Open world player i feel this patch to be lackluster, i’m glad others seem happy with it but to me yeah not much to be excited about, i’ll wait till it drops as i’m more eager for fixes and balancing than anything else.. i guess i’ll see what it brings but not overly excited in more PvP content i never bother with..
I feel sorry for people who think a gw2 world event is a raid. There’s a difference between and having to work so closely and precisely with 24 other people for hours that voice comms is mandatory.
No game has given me the same sense of group accomplishment since getting my iron bound protodrake in wow from 25hm Ulduar.
Well, since lfr raid difficulty was introduced in wow 4.3 (dragon soul) which is pretty much, let me quote you: " mashing 1 at a dragon" is considered to be a raid. I think I should be the one to feel sorry for you. As long as I recall, raid synonym isn’t heroic nor hard.
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Can you give me a link to that definition please?
http://www.wowwiki.com/Raid
that’s what a raid is in most MMOs. I’ve never seen anyone in any MMO refer to the world bosses as raids and yet Guild Wars 2 is not the only MMO with actual world bosses.
If to be pedantic about it you could go with this http://www.thefreedictionary.com/raid . In that case any attack is a raid and Guild Wars 2 dungeons could be called raids too.
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Can you give me a link to that definition please?
http://www.wowwiki.com/Raid
that’s what a raid is in most MMOs. I’ve never seen anyone in any MMO refer to the world bosses as raids and yet Guild Wars 2 is not the only MMO with actual world bosses.
If to be pedantic about it you could go with this http://www.thefreedictionary.com/raid . In that case any attack is a raid and Guild Wars 2 dungeons could be called raids too.
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Can you give me a link to that definition please?
http://www.wowwiki.com/Raid
that’s what a raid is in most MMOs. I’ve never seen anyone in any MMO refer to the world bosses as raids and yet Guild Wars 2 is not the only MMO with actual world bosses.
If to be pedantic about it you could go with this http://www.thefreedictionary.com/raid . In that case any attack is a raid and Guild Wars 2 dungeons could be called raids too.
Thanks, so GW2 does indeed have raids
with that logic any co-op game has raids too. Like resident evil 6 could be called a raid, because it’s a small army attacking the enemy force fast.
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Can you give me a link to that definition please?
http://www.wowwiki.com/Raid
that’s what a raid is in most MMOs. I’ve never seen anyone in any MMO refer to the world bosses as raids and yet Guild Wars 2 is not the only MMO with actual world bosses.
If to be pedantic about it you could go with this http://www.thefreedictionary.com/raid . In that case any attack is a raid and Guild Wars 2 dungeons could be called raids too.
You really should read the evidence you use to support your argument as in this case it proves you are wrong.
“The terms “raid” and “raiding” primarily and traditionally refer to PVE raid-specific instances and zones"
“instances and zones”
“zones”
“ZONES”
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Can you give me a link to that definition please?
http://www.wowwiki.com/Raid
that’s what a raid is in most MMOs. I’ve never seen anyone in any MMO refer to the world bosses as raids and yet Guild Wars 2 is not the only MMO with actual world bosses.
If to be pedantic about it you could go with this http://www.thefreedictionary.com/raid . In that case any attack is a raid and Guild Wars 2 dungeons could be called raids too.
You really should read the evidence you use to support your argument as in this case it proves you are wrong.
“1. a sudden surprise attack” “1. A surprise attack by a small armed force.”
if you’re playing a co-op shooter with one friend (making it two of you), you’re probably in most mission are taking the NPC’s by surprise. You’re attacking enemy force that did not expect you. There you go. Co-op shooter games are raids if you’re being pedantic about the description of it.
“The terms “raid” and “raiding” primarily and traditionally refer to PVE raid-specific instances and zones"
“instances and zones”
“zones”
“ZONES”
“Raid groups are a way to have parties of more than 5 and up to 40 people, divided into up to 8 groups of up to 5 players.” are you saying that people attacking the world bosses come in well organized groups?
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Can you give me a link to that definition please?
http://www.wowwiki.com/Raid
that’s what a raid is in most MMOs. I’ve never seen anyone in any MMO refer to the world bosses as raids and yet Guild Wars 2 is not the only MMO with actual world bosses.
If to be pedantic about it you could go with this http://www.thefreedictionary.com/raid . In that case any attack is a raid and Guild Wars 2 dungeons could be called raids too.
You really should read the evidence you use to support your argument as in this case it proves you are wrong.
“1. a sudden surprise attack” “1. A surprise attack by a small armed force.”
if you’re playing a co-op shooter with one friend (making it two of you), you’re probably in most mission are taking the NPC’s by surprise. You’re attacking enemy force that did not expect you. There you go. Co-op shooter games are raids if you’re being pedantic about the description of it.
“The terms “raid” and “raiding” primarily and traditionally refer to PVE raid-specific instances and zones"
“instances and zones”
“zones”
“ZONES”
“Raid groups are a way to have parties of more than 5 and up to 40 people, divided into up to 8 groups of up to 5 players.” are you saying that people attacking the world bosses come in well organized groups?
It describs guild mission pretty well. Concerning the rest of your post, I think it’s pointless to argue with you. Ridiculus comparison into a counter fact to your own argument into another counter argument is mindblowing.
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Can you give me a link to that definition please?
http://www.wowwiki.com/Raid
that’s what a raid is in most MMOs. I’ve never seen anyone in any MMO refer to the world bosses as raids and yet Guild Wars 2 is not the only MMO with actual world bosses.
If to be pedantic about it you could go with this http://www.thefreedictionary.com/raid . In that case any attack is a raid and Guild Wars 2 dungeons could be called raids too.
You really should read the evidence you use to support your argument as in this case it proves you are wrong.
“1. a sudden surprise attack” “1. A surprise attack by a small armed force.”
if you’re playing a co-op shooter with one friend (making it two of you), you’re probably in most mission are taking the NPC’s by surprise. You’re attacking enemy force that did not expect you. There you go. Co-op shooter games are raids if you’re being pedantic about the description of it.
“The terms “raid” and “raiding” primarily and traditionally refer to PVE raid-specific instances and zones"
“instances and zones”
“zones”
“ZONES”
“Raid groups are a way to have parties of more than 5 and up to 40 people, divided into up to 8 groups of up to 5 players.” are you saying that people attacking the world bosses come in well organized groups?
It describs guild mission pretty well. Concerning the rest of your post, I think it’s pointless to argue with you. Ridiculus comparison into a counter fact to your own argument into another counter argument is mindblowing.
I thought that we were talking about world bosses and not guild missions, but feel free to change the subject there.
If I’m not mistaken, WoW also had open-world bosses in which you had to form a “Raid” to take them on (assuming those members are of appropriate level instead of over-leveled). For example, that big robot thing in front of Black Temple. I know that most groups needed more than 5 level 70 people to kill that thing. There are obviously more “Outdoor Raid Bosses” than that in WoW, but I do know that you needed a good amount of appropriate-leveled people to kill them at the time.
Technically, a “zerg” (when used as a noun) could be considered a raid group in the simplest sense. They may not be as organized as a “guild raid group”, but they still function more or less like a traditional raid group. With that said, some of the Guild Bounties (in particular, those with anti-zergrush abilities) could be somewhat like raid bosses. Those particular bounties still require “some form of coordination and/or communication” from other members to actually complete them, just like how “some form” of such is required back in WoW raiding (well, before Cataclysm anyway).
Back to the original subject in the OP, I think ArenaNet could have used a different word to describe the actions to be performed by Braham and Rox. Those who have played MMOs for like forever would have ingrained their own meaning of “raid” before the context could be established. On the other hand, they did use the word “Dungeon” in the header text of that segment while the word “raid” is just a regular word.
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Can you give me a link to that definition please?
http://www.wowwiki.com/Raid
that’s what a raid is in most MMOs. I’ve never seen anyone in any MMO refer to the world bosses as raids and yet Guild Wars 2 is not the only MMO with actual world bosses.
If to be pedantic about it you could go with this http://www.thefreedictionary.com/raid . In that case any attack is a raid and Guild Wars 2 dungeons could be called raids too.
You really should read the evidence you use to support your argument as in this case it proves you are wrong.
“1. a sudden surprise attack” “1. A surprise attack by a small armed force.”
if you’re playing a co-op shooter with one friend (making it two of you), you’re probably in most mission are taking the NPC’s by surprise. You’re attacking enemy force that did not expect you. There you go. Co-op shooter games are raids if you’re being pedantic about the description of it.
“The terms “raid” and “raiding” primarily and traditionally refer to PVE raid-specific instances and zones"
“instances and zones”
“zones”
“ZONES”
“Raid groups are a way to have parties of more than 5 and up to 40 people, divided into up to 8 groups of up to 5 players.” are you saying that people attacking the world bosses come in well organized groups?
It describs guild mission pretty well. Concerning the rest of your post, I think it’s pointless to argue with you. Ridiculus comparison into a counter fact to your own argument into another counter argument is mindblowing.
I thought that we were talking about world bosses and not guild missions, but feel free to change the subject there.
Wrong. We were talking about raid.
Guild mission and world boss event fits perfectly to the description in raid-wowwiki that you sent.
@Ari Kagura
We could also add that since wow 4.3, they introduced LFR raid which doesn’t require any communication whatsoever with any random players who joined the queue, in fact, it’s comparable to the “zerg” we’re currently facing in world event.
I once (Probably more, it beens a long time) did LFR raid butt naked. I didn’t get booted as everyone else simply didn’t care, and just wanted to finish the raid, take loot, and leave. Meanwhile, I had time to make some coffe, a sandwish, watch tv, go to the bathroom, read some books, and collect loot at the end. Just wanted to point out that an instance or zone don’t have to be hard to be considered a raid.
It seems this thread has become waaay off-topic.
OP, the new dungeon is just that, a 5-man instanced dungeon with some new mechanics, supposedly, that we haven’t seen before. I am looking forward to getting inside and checking it out! =)
The temple events qualify as raid content in my opinion.
In BWE 1 I got lucky in Queensdale and did Troll > Wasp > Oakheart > Boar > Behemoth after on another with a very large group, worthy of raid status imho.
If I can’t play Guild Wars 2 at work, I won’t work in Guild Wars 2 either.
Delayed content is eventually good. Rushed content is eternally bad. ~ Shigeru Miyamoto
Raid noun
A sudden assault or attack, as upon something to be seized or suppressed: a police raid on a gambling ring.
That’s what they mean. It’s not a 20+ players instance just because World of Kittencraft uses the term to describe that. Just like how some castles have dungeons that you can enter with a random group of tourists, instead of just 5.
If you can read this then it is proof that ArenaNet’s moderators just, kind and fair.
You all haven’t raided unless you played EQ1 and went on 80 man RZ, Coirnev, Rathe Council, Mith Marr, or the ever fun Xegony. Even WoW raids were pretty plain compared to them(at least up until BC, which is when I quit).
Nothing quite like having 2 guilds trying to race to Coirnev and crashing the zone
Crafted: Meteorlogicus, Incinerator, Juggernaut, Sunrise, Bifrost, The Dreamer, Kudzu
Am I legendary yet!?
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
Can you give me a link to that definition please?
http://www.wowwiki.com/Raid
that’s what a raid is in most MMOs. I’ve never seen anyone in any MMO refer to the world bosses as raids and yet Guild Wars 2 is not the only MMO with actual world bosses.
If to be pedantic about it you could go with this http://www.thefreedictionary.com/raid . In that case any attack is a raid and Guild Wars 2 dungeons could be called raids too.
You really should read the evidence you use to support your argument as in this case it proves you are wrong.
“1. a sudden surprise attack” “1. A surprise attack by a small armed force.”
if you’re playing a co-op shooter with one friend (making it two of you), you’re probably in most mission are taking the NPC’s by surprise. You’re attacking enemy force that did not expect you. There you go. Co-op shooter games are raids if you’re being pedantic about the description of it.
“The terms “raid” and “raiding” primarily and traditionally refer to PVE raid-specific instances and zones"
“instances and zones”
“zones”
“ZONES”
“Raid groups are a way to have parties of more than 5 and up to 40 people, divided into up to 8 groups of up to 5 players.” are you saying that people attacking the world bosses come in well organized groups?
So when pirates come and raid your town in days of old you think they organized and planed it? I think not I think the only proses used was we attack that now lets go! yet it is still a raid!
Raid noun
A sudden assault or attack, as upon something to be seized or suppressed: a police raid on a gambling ring.
That’s what they mean. It’s not a 20+ players instance just because World of Kittencraft uses the term to describe that. Just like how some castles have dungeons that you can enter with a random group of tourists, instead of just 5.
Even WoW doesn’t exclusively use the term raid for instanced large-group content. The nightmare dragons, Doomlord Kazzak and Doomwalker for instance all definitely count(ed) as raid bosses while anyone could join in the encounter cause they were open-world bosses.
Overall im pretty sure raid in one game is different from another depends on how u look at it. GW2 has raids. I mean the dragon boss and any champions takes alot of ppl to beat them. I would consider the dungeons we have now as raids too, u can’t do it alone, u need team mates to do puzzles and help each other out to clear it.
a 5-man story dungeon. There are not going to be any raids in Guild Wars 2.
There are a good number of open world raids.
no, those are group events. A raid is an instanced dungeon designed for a huge amount of people (20, 30..)
No, a raid is an encounter meant for larger groups then the usual dungeons. Expand your horizon about non-instanced games before making blanket statements.
Everquest is probably the best reference for non-instanced raids if you want to look some if it up (the xpacks velious, luclin and planes of power, afterwards they also featured more and more instanced content alongside their regular non-instanced boss fights).
Temple events, dragons and some larger world events are raids in GW2, like the poster above already said.
And I see everyone hinging the definition of raid on the difficulty alone. GW2 raids arent difficult, I doubt anyone claims that much in this game is difficult. But they are still raids, same as the vast amounts of easy mode content in WoW that is for 10/25 players is just as a much raid as the tough cutting edge content.
I havent done any raiding in WoW in the last 7 years, but the hardest raids in the release state (before nerfs/fixes/new levels) were Vex Thal when it still had gflux/blind/wall agro and the initial release version of Uqua.
The outside world events aren’t raids anymore than they are dungeons. Raids in mmo parlance have always been instanced events that require more people than a normal instance run. There are world bosses in most mmos, and they aren’t raids either, although you can form Raid Groups to tackle them. The main difference is that anyone can join them, whereas in actual mmo raids they are for the instance group only. The only difficulty involved is taking on the content with an arbitrary amount of individuals. There is no limit here, until you hit server capacity and go to overflow.
If it makes you feel better to think you are “raiding” when you take on a dragon or any other afk/autoattack world boss here, go for it. I would say go load up WoW and try a world boss there, but they have all been dumbed down. If anyone remembers the world dragons from before WotLK, Emeriss and such, they put these dragons to shame, and they still weren’t raids.
