Guild Wars 2

This is beyond dumb. Exp mode should be for every1 and not just level 80s. I went in with my lvl 35 and the group disbanded mid dungeon because i refused to go on my lvl 80. I also poped 3 xp items just for this run.

They complain that the scaling of an 80 compared to a regular 35 makes a difference and i agree with them but thats whats wrong with the scaling then. I should be able to run anything within my level but I am not going to find a group of players who will do this.

Do something about this because this just turned me off from playing this game

I’m not sure myself how to fix this issue. The thing is 80s have more traits and (most likely) better gear than non-80s. Traits are not scaled down. There are also the sigils and runes that certainly make a difference.

Yeah, it’s possible to take lower level characters to exp modes, but it’s not optimal. I’ve done TA with a 67 and a 55 in the group – the 55 kept dying and ended up quitting, and we had to bring in an 80. The 67 did well for her level, but still died a lot compared to the rest. I honestly don’t know what they were thinking, exp modes are pretty much made for 80s.

They’ve always said you can complete a dungeon at whatever level it takes to get in but it doesn’t necessarily mean it’s as efficient as 80s in exotics. That’s just the way the game and scaling is, deal with it bro.

You want them to scale down every single trait and sigil and rune in the game just because you had a random pug that wanted to use an optimal class? I’ve run AC plenty of times at lower levels with guild groups, go do that instead of subjecting random pugs with your 35. You can always switch to your 35 at the end to get exp for it if that’s why you want to do it.

I allow anyone who is the minimum level to run and I never have any problems. Spread the love people.

It is an easy fix. The stats one can have in a dungeon need to be hard-capped.

Right now, a level 80 player in exotic gear will be 13% better than a level 35 player in rare gear, because of how scaling works. Even thought he points from traits do not impact much, the higher number of major traits is of high impact, further complicating the problem.

But to be honest, if a group asks for level80 characters or specific professions , you should stay as far away from them as possible, because they most likely are bad to begin with. That goes double for non-maxlevel dungeons.

Having said that, Dungeons are still a great way to level your character.

In my guild we often run AC explorable with 2-3 players on their low level alts (lvl 35-50 usually)
If the player know how to play at lest a bit (and is able to dodge Kholer attacks) it usually doesn’t make any difference and we also usually don’t skip.

My problem with low level alts are, why don’t you play on your main char then swap in when the final boss is at 30% hp and get the exp then? A 80’s gear and trait will ALWAYS be better.

Given how little effort it takes to get to level 80 in this game, I just can’t see this as an important problem. It means your dungeon run with that character is delayed by 2-3 weeks at most?

Not true. As long as you are not under leveled its never a problem with me. I’ve had lvl 80’s who cant even find the dungeon in the map. Pull your weight instead of going AFK or standing in the back doing nothing. As for refusing to change, how do you justify making your teammates suffer because of your stubbornness and wanting to lvl faster? Please think of other players who want to have fun.

Going through AC at level 35 is actually a bit hard. Doing it at 80 in full exotics is a faceroll. That’s why you get kicked, everyone preferes a faceroll.

Warchiefomega.2738:

d the group disbanded mid dungeon because i refused to go on my lvl 80.

This bit stands out. Why did they wait until mid-dungeon to disband instead of telling you to switch characters at the start ?

Snoring Sleepwalker.9073:

Warchiefomega.2738:

d the group disbanded mid dungeon because i refused to go on my lvl 80.

This bit stands out. Why did they wait until mid-dungeon to disband instead of telling you to switch characters at the start ?

Obviously they died a lot. Any guesses why OP wont share the reason?

i did ac yesterday on lvl 42, and i can tell you it wasnt fun at all.
It was my first dungeon, i told everyone i was new to it.

No one even took time to explain anything, not even my own guildie.
Then the tgv took off at 300km per hour, and the moaning started.

Hmmm baddest experience ever.

I’ve finished every path in every dungeon with minimal required level. I’ve never kicked anyone from group who had level appropriate for the dungeon. Is it harder than taking level 80s with full exotics?- sure it is, but the dungeons are not so hard that it’s necessary to do it.
On the side note: I had few runs with lower level characters which went easier than full 80s squads- the reason: the knowledge and skill beats gear and stats in this game.

Here’s a trick I’ve been using …

Do the dungeon on your lvl 80 and when the last boss is at 15% log off and log on your alt and zone into the dungeon and you get credit on your alt.

Just make sure you’re not the instance host or you’ll kick everyone out and make them angry.

as lvl 80 you got the best gear in game, always since its easy to get becouse the stats on the very hardest gear to get is equel to easy mode gear to get (hmm should be fixed).

therefore all lvl 80 got maxed gear, downscaling that to maxed lvl x gear will always be better then the gear you have at that lvl.

definitely found AC easier alot easier at 80 then 35-40, the scaling system just works against you in dungeons which is stupid.

other mmo’s general have the dungeons at a certain level then a heroic/expert mode of that dungeon at level cap. i don’t see why they don’t do the same thing here with fractals, just scale all explorer modes to 80 and players to 80 on entry. i’d even do the same thing with story modes but yeh people hardly do it anyway except maybe that one time to see it.

Or maybe they can actually fix the content where its balanced to people the original level in Masterworks instead of Scaled Down with Exotics?

With a team of level 30s, AC Story is an example of bad design because foes poorly telegraph their attacks and they are impossible to melee due to constant CC attacks being used on the player. Not to mention the fact they are just too kitten strong compared to foes in later dungeons, it’s as if they’re balanced for level 80s in exotics scaled down instead of the intended level.

Another example of where ANET messed up the scale-down bullkitten is where they thought it was a good idea to have the Graveling mound events in a dungeon where you do half-damage if you’re the actual recommended level instead of 80. Go ahead. Try to do AC Exp with a team of lvl 35s, and do not cut corners with things like Ice Bow. Because it is a time event where you have to spike them fast enough before it spawns more gravelings, being level 35 and doing it clearly doesn’t work well enough.

As endgame content I would say that the dungeons work. But they are not balanced to their respective levels, and especially in the case of AC Story, it sours people’s taste of dungeons when the first enemy they fight is a single Ascalonian Warrior who can 2KO them.

Kain Francois.4328:

Or maybe they can actually fix the content where its balanced to people the original level in Masterworks instead of Scaled Down with Exotics?

With a team of level 30s, AC Story is an example of bad design because foes poorly telegraph their attacks and they are impossible to melee due to constant CC attacks being used on the player. Not to mention the fact they are just too kitten strong compared to foes in later dungeons, it’s as if they’re balanced for level 80s in exotics scaled down instead of the intended level.

Another example of where ANET messed up the scale-down bullkitten is where they thought it was a good idea to have the Graveling mound events in a dungeon where you do half-damage if you’re the actual recommended level instead of 80. Go ahead. Try to do AC Exp with a team of lvl 35s, and do not cut corners with things like Ice Bow. Because it is a time event where you have to spike them fast enough before it spawns more gravelings, being level 35 and doing it clearly doesn’t work well enough.

As endgame content I would say that the dungeons work. But they are not balanced to their respective levels, and especially in the case of AC Story, it sours people’s taste of dungeons when the first enemy they fight is a single Ascalonian Warrior who can 2KO them.

You are not supposed to be able to pug explorable mode actually. They are not designed for a team of random baddies.

That is why you will pretty much never see a pug consisting of level 35’s complete AC. Poor down scaling allows for pugs to complete these dungeons though, but just take a look at Arah. The amount of pugs completing that dungeon is about 5% of the amount that completes AC.

Gab Superstar.4059:

You are not supposed to be able to pug explorable mode actually. They are not designed for a team of random baddies.

That is why you will pretty much never see a pug consisting of level 35’s complete AC. Poor down scaling allows for pugs to complete these dungeons though, but just take a look at Arah. The amount of pugs completing that dungeon is about 5% of the amount that completes AC.

People pug CoE and HoTW EXP all the time.

Playing with guildies does not automatically make a team better. However, if a team of lvl 35s can clear AC Path 3 using classes with lower DPS, I will be very impressed. Otherwise it’s not truly balanced.

The part where they say “not designed to be pugged” sounds to me like they’re trying to justify an unbalanced system they had to compromise for when designing.

Kain Francois.4328:

Gab Superstar.4059:

You are not supposed to be able to pug explorable mode actually. They are not designed for a team of random baddies.

That is why you will pretty much never see a pug consisting of level 35’s complete AC. Poor down scaling allows for pugs to complete these dungeons though, but just take a look at Arah. The amount of pugs completing that dungeon is about 5% of the amount that completes AC.

People pug CoE and HoTW EXP all the time.

Playing with guildies does not automatically make a team better. However, if a team of lvl 35s can clear AC Path 3 using classes with lower DPS, I will be very impressed. Otherwise it’s not truly balanced.

The part where they say “not designed to be pugged” sounds to me like they’re trying to justify an unbalanced system they had to compromise for when designing.

Are you disagreeing that AC is easier to pug than CoE or HotW? Because if you are not then I’m not sure what to respond here. I never stated that these dungeons weren’t pugged, I just said that they were pugged a lot less than AC.

The week after release I actually did AC explorable as soon as we had 5 players on level 35. We had 2 rangers, an ele, a guardian and a thief. Not optimal in any way, as rangers especially are quite weak against burrows. Even more so back then since burrows were still bugged. It’s very doable.

And yep, when they wrote that dungeons were probably a lot harder. Remember they reduced the damage & difficulty of enemy mobs drastically after all the BWE’s because baddies who couldn’t dodge and was accustomed to WoW faceroll PvE complained non stop on every forum imaginable.

I didn’t try dungeons until I hit level 80 on both of my characters and I honestly couldn’t imagine being too successful at each dungeon’s “recommended level”.

I just ran AC with my friend who’s leveling up his engineer alt. He’s around 45 now and while he did okay because he knew the dungeon, I was finding that the other 80’s and I had to res him a lot more than we had to res each other.

I play a glasscannon thief so I’m no stranger to being one-hitted. But if those gravelings can knock me down multiple times (I only have so many stunbreakers) and nom me to death in 3 secs being fully traited and in full exotic gear, I can’t imagine what it’s like for the “recommended level” in greens/rares.

HP sponges + one-hit kills =/= a fun, challenging dungeon.

There’s a reason people have ALREADY found another spot to hop through the mountain in CM. People would rather take the time trying to find a glitch than to kill all of those kitten bandits for a “Bag of Purloined Goods”.

Orion the Cursed.1206:

Snoring Sleepwalker.9073:

Warchiefomega.2738:

d the group disbanded mid dungeon because i refused to go on my lvl 80.

This bit stands out. Why did they wait until mid-dungeon to disband instead of telling you to switch characters at the start ?

Obviously they died a lot. Any guesses why OP wont share the reason?

Why there were dying isn’t that important. What is important is what they tried to do about it. It sounds like their suggestion was that the OP get on a stronger character, then when he refused they quit because they didn’t think they could complete the dungeon with the party they had.

The only thing I might do differently is that I might skip asking him to switch characters and go right to the abandon dungeon step.

Snoring Sleepwalker.9073:

Orion the Cursed.1206:

Snoring Sleepwalker.9073:

Warchiefomega.2738:

d the group disbanded mid dungeon because i refused to go on my lvl 80.

This bit stands out. Why did they wait until mid-dungeon to disband instead of telling you to switch characters at the start ?

Obviously they died a lot. Any guesses why OP wont share the reason?

Why there were dying isn’t that important. What is important is what they tried to do about it. It sounds like their suggestion was that the OP get on a stronger character, then when he refused they quit because they didn’t think they could complete the dungeon with the party they had.

The only thing I might do differently is that I might skip asking him to switch characters and go right to the abandon dungeon step.

Really? What if he never helps in a fight and lets the group die so that he can run away? OP joins games and expect to be carried for free xp, gold and token. Is that fair to the other players? Why is OP insistant on getting a free ride?

Allowing him to join shows that the party is willing to give him a chance. This contradicts OP’s claim that no one will run with him.

I ran with level 34-35 characters multiple times with pugs and I didn’t get kicked.

OP just got unlucky.

A key in this discussion is that the OP wanted to run explorable mode. They never said explorable mode could be done by anyone of the appropriate level. In fact they said the difficulty is designed to be a challenge for a coordinated group. My guild mates would run me throught an explorable mode dungeon to help me out, but everyone knows that I’d just be coming along for the ride, and that practically being down a man would make it more difficult for all.

You used 3 exp boosts ? Or things like food and other consumables ? At best this means that this lasted at least an hour, at worst more than 2.

If it took you that long to get “mid dungeon” or even to finish the path, the problem lies somewhere else than not being a level 80 in full exotics. It’s a problem with how your team played.

Well if u ask me some lower lvl characters (no offense) thinks they know it all just like yesterday when I brought my lvl 40 Mesmer to run in ac.
Don’t remember the exact party but there was 1 lvl 80, three b/t 50-60, and me.
For some odd reason there was this guy (forgot who he was, thinks he knows it all) and decides to take charge. Starts telling us how easy it was and how to do this and that, ended up telling me (lvl 40 Mesmer) and lvl80 ele to tank the adds on the last try while they do spikes (took 4tries) and how to do two spikes at the same time (which didn’t make sense to me since it is easier to man 1 on each of the 4 front pillars w/1 tanking, but I let it slip). But really wasnt paying attn since I just wanna finish it.
Well at least that worked, kinda.
Then there was this argument of how to do this and who is better on the mortars. Said something about and killing rangers, then wars, eles, and necro in that order.
Dumbfound for a moment – what did he just type scrolls MSG box back up and reread
He wasn’t kidding about the kill order….
While that was happening I looked at this guy’s achievement score
Total: 800
Yep, a total of 800 pts. Anyways, they argued, kicked him out b4 the end, I grabbed my lvl 80, and did it in15 min while lvl 50-60 ppl keep dying trying to make it back. This warrior guy (lvl 56) probably died 10 times trying to make it back.

That is why lvl 80 are preferred. At least we knew that they did it sometime in the past. Also they can at least not die a billion times.

Anyways u could have used ur lvl 80, then switched on the final boss. Wouldn’t that be easier?

It’s not a question of level, nor a question of achievement points. It’s a question of experience and there is no way to be sure of that until it might be too late.

Someone could be in full Arah armor, even have the dungeon master title and still be a total idiot in a path he only did once. Even in full AC armor he could have gotten it by repeating the same path over and over again or his guild carried him every time, basically doing it as a 4-man team.

I don’t mind players who suggest that we do something their way. If I don’t agree with it, I’ll nicely tell him how I want to do it and why I don’t want to do it his way.
But players who forces their stupid idea on others are a nuisance (like killing necromancers last…).

Orion the Cursed.1206:

Really? What if he never helps in a fight and lets the group die so that he can run away? OP joins games and expect to be carried for free xp, gold and token. Is that fair to the other players? Why is OP insistant on getting a free ride?

If the problem was him not helping in fights, I don’t see them asking him to switch characters, since they would just expect him to run on whatever character he switched to. But if he’s fighting, but they are still losing, then I can see them asking him to switch to a stronger character.
Maybe not even a stronger character, but a more suitable one. For example, if the groups problem is that they can’t destroy condition immune objects in time, I’d expect them to ask anyone running a condition build to switch characters.

Allowing him to join shows that the party is willing to give him a chance. This contradicts OP’s claim that no one will run with him.

Agreed. Also I don’t think they disbanded because he was low level, I think they disbanded when they realized that they couldn’t complete the dungeon.

I’ve been in Fractals groups that have disbanded when they hit bits they couldn’t do. Those were all parties of full level 80s and the problem was that we didn’t know what we were doing, except the times when we stopped being a full party due to disconnects. Lower level characters were never a problem.