Guild Wars 2

PREFACE:
When raids came out my guild was excited and willing to try it. We spent the first week bashing our face against the Vale Guardian wall before we finally beat him about 10 days after the raid came out. For this first week we had about 20 out of our 30 regulars give the raid dungeons a try, and only 15 kept going at it after the first few days.

Against Gorseval, we had about 14 try it out of 30 and only 7 or so who kept trying it. We’ve never beat it together. By now only 5-6 are willing to give it a go. We continuously need to augment with pugs. As a guild we have not even tried Sabetha. (except for the hardcore raiders).

I expect that the next raid wings will bring more apathy from the majority of my guild unless there is a significant change. They (mostly) have the skill to do the mechanics (with some survival gear/traits), but because of the DPS check they can’t beat gorseval and most have a very hard time with the Vale Guardian.

Yes, I am aware that Raids are tough as hell and are meant to be tough. However, I thought ANet wanted to do away with the berserker meta? It seems that is what the Raids are enforcing. Thieves are 99% pushed away because anything they can do Rev’s/wars can do better.

SUBSTANCE:
I recommend breaking the reward system into tiers or a sort. For those who can down the boss within X time limit, they earn the Gold reward (tokens + potential exclusive loot), X time they earn silver with just tokens, or X time with bronze with tokens.

Reward players for being able to beat the boss, regardless of using “meta” builds, give them that source of pride. On that note, make the silver and gold rewards significantly better so people have something worth fighting for.

Perhaps rewards for killing bosses in a certain order?

The dps check isn’t remotely difficult on vg. It’s not that difficult on gorse tbh.
It’s mostly learning the mechanics and not being the “rabbit in headlights”.
With a bit of learn your classes mixed in for some players.

My guild is in the same state of numbers as yours. Which is indeed an issue. Reset needs to move to weekend or be daily. More threads and eventually anet may hear us.

DPS check isn’t a problem, the players should not have problems or practice to not have problems using only DPS gear.(without some survival gear/traits)

Berserk Meta is dead, Glass Canon isn’t, arenaNet achieved get condition in the meta.

The Lethe.2953:

PREFACE:
When raids came out my guild was excited and willing to try it. We spent the first week bashing our face against the Vale Guardian wall before we finally beat him about 10 days after the raid came out. For this first week we had about 20 out of our 30 regulars give the raid dungeons a try, and only 15 kept going at it after the first few days.

Against Gorseval, we had about 14 try it out of 30 and only 7 or so who kept trying it. We’ve never beat it together. By now only 5-6 are willing to give it a go. We continuously need to augment with pugs. As a guild we have not even tried Sabetha. (except for the hardcore raiders).

I expect that the next raid wings will bring more apathy from the majority of my guild unless there is a significant change. They (mostly) have the skill to do the mechanics (with some survival gear/traits), but because of the DPS check they can’t beat gorseval and most have a very hard time with the Vale Guardian.

Yes, I am aware that Raids are tough as hell and are meant to be tough. However, I thought ANet wanted to do away with the berserker meta? It seems that is what the Raids are enforcing. Thieves are 99% pushed away because anything they can do Rev’s/wars can do better.

SUBSTANCE:
I recommend breaking the reward system into tiers or a sort. For those who can down the boss within X time limit, they earn the Gold reward (tokens + potential exclusive loot), X time they earn silver with just tokens, or X time with bronze with tokens.

Reward players for being able to beat the boss, regardless of using “meta” builds, give them that source of pride. On that note, make the silver and gold rewards significantly better so people have something worth fighting for.

Perhaps rewards for killing bosses in a certain order?

I have to agree, the dps check (even on gorseval) is not hard to meet, the problem is when the mechanics slow down the dps of individuals because they fail to react properly or they fail to correctly follow their rotations. I suggest to keep practicing or finding the members of your group having trouble and help them learn to get better.

Edit: Also having one thief will NOT stop you from being able to kill gorseval. A thief is fine. Just don’t bring a guard

With the Magnetite Shards being rewarded on tries, isn’t what you are asking for already ingame?

Total numbers of people trying don’t matter to be honest. You started with 30 people, and over half of them quit after 1-2 days? Those were never going to stick with raiding to begin with.

The problem with raiding here is the same as it is in every game:

- a lot of people just want to tag along for the reward, but don’t want to actually work towards clearing the encounter in the first place
- once you have a couple of bosses dead, suddenly every one is a raider and wants to help out
- player inability to face the fact that THEY might be the reason that their raid is failing. Once you accept that it might be you, you will try to improve (or quit)

I’m not strictly against an easier form of raid for a more aasual approach, but that would cost a lot of developer ressources. Also if rewards are made freely available, what point is there to raiding? (and no, no matter how you spin it, making raid rewards easier to be had no matter in which form is devaluing them).

Again, tries reward Magnetite Shards which is essentially the token system youa re asking for. There is a lot of material on how to beat the raid bosses out now. It should not be to hard for a semi-dedicated group/guild to complete the fights.

Cyninja.2954:

With the Magnetite Shards being rewarded on tries, isn’t what you are asking for already ingame?

Total numbers of people trying don’t matter to be honest. You started with 30 people, and over half of them quit after 1-2 days? Those were never going to stick with raiding to begin with.

The problem with raiding here is the same as it is in every game:

- a lot of people just want to tag along for the reward, but don’t want to actually work towards clearing the encounter in the first place
- once you have a couple of bosses dead, suddenly every one is a raider and wants to help out
- player inability to face the fact that THEY might be the reason that their raid is failing. Once you accept that it might be you, you will try to improve (or quit)

I’m not strictly against an easier form of raid for a more aasual approach, but that would cost a lot of developer ressources. Also if rewards are made freely available, what point is there to raiding? (and no, no matter how you spin it, making raid rewards easier to be had no matter in which form is devaluing them).

Again, tries reward Magnetite Shards which is essentially the token system youa re asking for. There is a lot of material on how to beat the raid bosses out now. It should not be to hard for a semi-dedicated group/guild to complete the fights.

Exactly. All of this except for devaluing rewards because other people make them in other ways. We´re talking about 100.000+active accounts of whom a majority will never meet each other and stay anoymus, not many people give a flying squirrel about raid rewards you may have anyway if they can´t earn them after vialantly trying. Most people are self reflected enough to know that they are not the 1%ers then.

On one side, you have people that want the shinies and invest as less as possible into it. Yes, they will change builds and hear you out when you say how it is done, but after they have done it and got from it what they wanted, they never return to it.
On the other side, you have the people that want ot beat it in record time and as soon and as often as possible.
Group 2 needs Group 1 to succeed because there probably are not enough group 2 types of people in the game. Group 1 people need group 2 people to show them how it is done, but for a much lesser timespan.

DPS check really should not be a problem at vale guardian, but if it still somehow is then your group either has horrible gear of just isn’t playing well at all.

after spending some time at raids, not only beating them some times, but also with pug’s i knew after a few seconds we wont be able to get even close, just to get some practice, I’m realy disillusionated.
At first I was looking foreward for “hard” content, you can’t beat wit the 0-8-15 dungeon casual. Now I got to say it realy got messy. Timers are just a problem when you start to learn, when u identifyed the mechanics and run regular max dps gear/build for this mechanic, there will alway be one or two minutes left. The problem is your team. The given mechanics tbh are kitten easy “when this happens 1/2/3/4 ppl move to this spot”. Of cause this might need some practise. But once you reached the point you know you are doing good 99% of time, and days after this you still dont get the kill its frustrating.
I tried to find a guild doing this, but often ppl just do one run kill them and then stop and if you cant join that day… or you know theoretically all can do it but one or two ppl dont focus and all fails.

By now I’m about to give up on it, because I know I could do it at least within 2 tries, but unlike dungeons, this dont help due to you cant carry a team, even when only one, ok, two ppl lack skill/focus.

Raids are already quite approachable. The barrier to entry is practically nonexistant. If failure it your problem, that’s not something the encounter needs to be adjusted around.

The problem is with your guild refusing to adjust or practice content specifically designed to be practiced and adjusted to, and with arenanet for failing to adequately balance classes in their ‘every class has a place’ pve class design.

One of these things you can remedy. The other is on Anet’s head, but the encounter isn’t the thing anet needs to adjust.

I really hope that you need at least 2800 armor in next wing.

I hope the next wings become harder. This first wing was too easy.
The DPS checks are very lenient considering the elitist guilds are finishing VG with just 5 people and other bosses with 3min left.

Our guild had the same issue we started out with 3 groups when raids were released, then after the first night most of them gave up.

Our hardcore members stayed, and asked their friends then they asked their friends and so on. Then eventually our guild, and friends cleared the raid, but very few of our members even raid anymore. Most of our members are casuals and either don’t have the time, or just find raids are not worth the time that they have to play.

The issue I keep seeing is that raids are just not appealing to casuals, which makes up a majority of many guilds, and most of the times the only way to get casuals to do content like raids is to up the rewards, or make the content easier.

Malediktus.9250:

I hope the next wings become harder. This first wing was too easy.
The DPS checks are very lenient considering the elitist guilds are finishing VG with just 5 people and other bosses with 3min left.

But if they make hard content only sPvP players can finish it. Content isn’t never hard if you can just learn it.

Junkpile.7439:

Malediktus.9250:

I hope the next wings become harder. This first wing was too easy.
The DPS checks are very lenient considering the elitist guilds are finishing VG with just 5 people and other bosses with 3min left.

But if they make hard content only sPvP players can finish it. Content isn’t never hard if you can just learn it.

But current one is too easy. Our average guild (not an elitist one like vC or SC) only played the raid for around 13hours until we finished eternal title.

Junkpile.7439:

Malediktus.9250:

I hope the next wings become harder. This first wing was too easy.
The DPS checks are very lenient considering the elitist guilds are finishing VG with just 5 people and other bosses with 3min left.

But if they make hard content only sPvP players can finish it. Content isn’t never hard if you can just learn it.

where did you get that information from?

Don’t answer in a serious way to the user “Junkpile”, dudes.
1. Read his signature.
2. Check his post history
I like him being around here, makes me laughing every day I see a post of him.