Reflects and Dungeons
plz tell us how you know developers meant for bosses to be kited
kthx
If you stack in front of Malrona without any reflect, you’ll die instantly.
The reflect doesn’t hurt her but it negates her only damagesource outside of her highly telegraphed poison.i can just dodge/evade that, without kiting her. the timing is incredibly easy to figure out. i usually run a full glass, no defense LH ele in this fight and stay entirely in melee. next?
dodging is kiting…
O.o Kiting is running around at range with a weapon so a boss can’t touch you with their attacks— like dragging a kite behind you in the park when you’re a kid. I’m talking about using evade frames and staying within range of the boss at all times. But ok, if that’s what you meant, I guess we agree.
Example: http://www.wowwiki.com/Kiting
Edit: I’m not going to respond to the replies: I was objecting to your wording that kiting was needed. Kiting is not. Damage mitigation is, definitely.
(edited by maxinion.8396)
plz tell us how you know developers meant for bosses to be kited
kthx
If you stack in front of Malrona without any reflect, you’ll die instantly.
The reflect doesn’t hurt her but it negates her only damagesource outside of her highly telegraphed poison.i can just dodge/evade that, without kiting her. the timing is incredibly easy to figure out. i usually run a full glass, no defense LH ele in this fight and stay entirely in melee. next?
Just b.c we dont “need” reflects in the same way many players dont “need” heals, elites, utilities DOESNT make it ok to render a skill uslless b.c we are using it the way it was made, even tho it made some encounters easier. Just fix the mechanic dont remove it.
SAB or RIOT
plz tell us how you know developers meant for bosses to be kited
kthx
If you stack in front of Malrona without any reflect, you’ll die instantly.
The reflect doesn’t hurt her but it negates her only damagesource outside of her highly telegraphed poison.i can just dodge/evade that, without kiting her. the timing is incredibly easy to figure out. i usually run a full glass, no defense LH ele in this fight and stay entirely in melee. next?
dodging is kiting…
O.o Kiting is running around at range with a weapon so a boss can’t touch you with their attacks— like dragging a kite behind you in the park when you’re a kid. I’m talking about using evade frames and staying within range of the boss at all times. But ok, if that’s what you meant, I guess we agree.
Example: http://www.wowwiki.com/Kiting
kiting = damagemitigation
dodging = damagemitigation
plz tell us how you know developers meant for bosses to be kited
kthx
If you stack in front of Malrona without any reflect, you’ll die instantly.
The reflect doesn’t hurt her but it negates her only damagesource outside of her highly telegraphed poison.
The projectiles are just as obviously telegraphed as the poison. As for stacking, well…
1) Stack in front on Malrona
2) Notice tell, dodge through her
3) Stack behind Malrona
4) Malrona turns around
5) Go to 1.
No kiting needed without reflects.
plz tell us how you know developers meant for bosses to be kited
kthx
If you stack in front of Malrona without any reflect, you’ll die instantly.
The reflect doesn’t hurt her but it negates her only damagesource outside of her highly telegraphed poison.i can just dodge/evade that, without kiting her. the timing is incredibly easy to figure out. i usually run a full glass, no defense LH ele in this fight and stay entirely in melee. next?
dodging is kiting…
O.o Kiting is running around at range with a weapon so a boss can’t touch you with their attacks— like dragging a kite behind you in the park when you’re a kid. I’m talking about using evade frames and staying within range of the boss at all times. But ok, if that’s what you meant, I guess we agree.
Example: http://www.wowwiki.com/Kiting
kiting = damagemitigation
dodging = damagemitigation
“Kiting” typically means running around while the boss chases you.
“Stacking” means standing on top of boss.
“Dodging” is useful in both cases, but these three things are not the same.
plz tell us how you know developers meant for bosses to be kited
kthx
If you stack in front of Malrona without any reflect, you’ll die instantly.
The reflect doesn’t hurt her but it negates her only damagesource outside of her highly telegraphed poison.The projectiles are just as obviously telegraphed as the poison. As for stacking, well…
1) Stack in front on Malrona
2) Notice tell, dodge through her
3) Stack behind Malrona
4) Malrona turns around
5) Go to 1.No kiting needed without reflects.
And? One reflect can still protect your whole party without any need to dodge or kite. That’s not how this bossfight was designed.
“Kiting” typically means running around while the boss chases you.
“Stacking” means standing on top of boss.
“Dodging” is useful in both cases, but these three things are not the same.
Same as above.
How do you know how the fight was meant to be designed?
Serah Mahariel – Death and Taxes
The right way to improve Malrona is not to make her projectiles unreflectable. Instead, a much better approach would be to have players to fight Malrona and the adds at the same time.
I have no idea why she just sits there as you murder all the little spiders, doesn’t make any sense to me.
Let’s petition to replace malrona fight with vevina.
Would just need to ret-con fyonna Convo after. But really how could fyonna kill vevina.
[ARES]
And all who stood by and did nothing, who are they to criticize the sacrifices of others?
Our blood has bought their lives.
And all who stood by and did nothing, who are they to criticize the sacrifices of others?
Our blood has bought their lives.
(edited by Lilith Ajit.6173)
If you stack in front of Malrona without any reflect, you’ll die instantly.
The reflect doesn’t hurt her but it negates her only damagesource outside of her highly telegraphed poison.
Oh boy it does hurt her. Actually it can hurt her so much that she, given the right conditions (enough vuln etc.) almost dies instantly. You easily were able to take 50% of her HP away.
How do you know how the fight was meant to be designed?
I say that the bosses were not meant to be fighted by just stacking in front of them, putting down one reflect and kill them without them being able to hit you. The recent changes proved me right, didn’t they?
Actually it’s just ANet pandering (again) to the crybabies like with their genius spider queen change where they thought “a boss with melee and ranged skills? meh, lets just make it spam everything instead, to hell with actually adapting to player proximity”.
Serah Mahariel – Death and Taxes
How do you know how the fight was meant to be designed?
I say that the bosses were not meant to be fighted by just stacking in front of them, putting down one reflect and kill them without them being able to hit you. The recent changes proved me right, didn’t they?
No because the changes are undocumented. What you are saying is just an assumption of why this change occurred. For all I know it could be a bug or unintended (e.g. Alphard change)
Actually it’s just ANet pandering (again) to the crybabies like with their genius spider queen change where they thought “a boss with melee and ranged skills? meh, lets just make it spam everything instead, to hell with actually adapting to player proximity”.
That was ANet listening to those who said “stacking is cheesy and bad!”, so they changed the spider queen. The changes to reflects should’ve also influenced the stacking.
ANet just didn’t realized that you could kill the most bosses even if stacked and without reflect before those bosses were able to seriously hurt you.
No because the changes are undocumented. What you are saying is just an assumption of why this change occurred. For all I know it could be a bug or unintended (e.g. Alphard change)
And the CoF P1 change? Did they just accidentally added a door at the ritual event? Or did they try to hide something behind it? Or did they just want to stop the players resetting the aggro?
Alphard was just one boss (and most likely done intentionally), whereas the reflect changes affect multiple bosses of different types.
No because the changes are undocumented. What you are saying is just an assumption of why this change occurred. For all I know it could be a bug or unintended (e.g. Alphard change)
And the CoF P1 change? Did they just accidentally added a door at the ritual event? Or did they try to hide something behind it? Or did they just want to stop the players resetting the aggro?
Alphard was just one boss (and most likely done intentionally), whereas the reflect changes affect multiple bosses of different types.
Point is nobody knows so why is anyone trying to say ArenaNet intended X when it isn’t documented. Logically you can only assume why something was done. Even then people have different ideas why something was done. On top of the bias too.
You can still reset CoF p1 anyhow, nothing changed.
As for TA spider boss. You can fight it without reflect stacked and you do just fine. Just have to dodge tbh.
If Alphard was intentional why was it changed back? It was changed where the bomb explodes instantly for months then recently changed back. See we will never know
Point is nobody knows so why is anyone trying to say ArenaNet intended X when it isn’t documented. Logically you can only assume why something was done. Even then people have different ideas why something was done. On top of the bias too.
As for TA spider boss. You can fight it without reflect stacked and you do just fine. Just have to dodge tbh.
That still doesn’t discard the fact that one reflect made this boss very easy and to no threat at all.
If Alphard was intentional why was it changed back? It was changed where the bomb explodes instantly for months then recently changed back. See we will never know
Aren’t they allowed to undo things they’ve done? How should they broke Alphard’s kegs in the first place? The kegs aren’t reused anywhere else, so they had to change that intentionally.
You can still reset CoF p1 anyhow, nothing changed.
That’s ANet being du … not efficient. Like always.
(edited by HHR LostProphet.4801)
Point is nobody knows so why is anyone trying to say ArenaNet intended X when it isn’t documented. Logically you can only assume why something was done. Even then people have different ideas why something was done. On top of the bias too.
As for TA spider boss. You can fight it without reflect stacked and you do just fine. Just have to dodge tbh.
That still doesn’t discard the fact that one reflect made this boss very easy and to no threat at all.
I agree that the reflect damage against this particular boss was way out of whack. But the solution is not to make all reflects useless. We’ve just moved from one bad extreme to another.
Point is nobody knows so why is anyone trying to say ArenaNet intended X when it isn’t documented. Logically you can only assume why something was done. Even then people have different ideas why something was done. On top of the bias too.
As for TA spider boss. You can fight it without reflect stacked and you do just fine. Just have to dodge tbh.
That still doesn’t discard the fact that one reflect made this boss very easy and to no threat at all.
I agree that the reflect damage against this particular boss was way out of whack. But the solution is not to make all reflects useless. We’ve just moved from one bad extreme to another.
The reflect did literally no damage… It just protected you and your mates from taking any damage, making that encounter way too easy.
And I’ve already said that this change did not being the smartest one. Just the easiest.
Point is nobody knows so why is anyone trying to say ArenaNet intended X when it isn’t documented. Logically you can only assume why something was done. Even then people have different ideas why something was done. On top of the bias too.
As for TA spider boss. You can fight it without reflect stacked and you do just fine. Just have to dodge tbh.
That still doesn’t discard the fact that one reflect made this boss very easy and to no threat at all.
I agree that the reflect damage against this particular boss was way out of whack. But the solution is not to make all reflects useless. We’ve just moved from one bad extreme to another.
The reflect did literally no damage… It just protected you and your mates from taking any damage, making that encounter way too easy.
And I’ve already said that this change did not being the smartest one. Just the easiest.
If you’re still talking about Malrona here I’ll simply repeat myself: She can be almost killed with a single reflection.
Point is nobody knows so why is anyone trying to say ArenaNet intended X when it isn’t documented. Logically you can only assume why something was done. Even then people have different ideas why something was done. On top of the bias too.
As for TA spider boss. You can fight it without reflect stacked and you do just fine. Just have to dodge tbh.
That still doesn’t discard the fact that one reflect made this boss very easy and to no threat at all.
I agree that the reflect damage against this particular boss was way out of whack. But the solution is not to make all reflects useless. We’ve just moved from one bad extreme to another.
The reflect did literally no damage… It just protected you and your mates from taking any damage, making that encounter way too easy.
What is this I don’t even… did you even fight this boss?
Reflects did an incredibly huge amount of damage to Malrona. A solo mesmer could literally kill this boss with just two feedbacks.
Moreover, Malrona has two attacks, one of which was never reflectable. So it’s also wrong to say that reflects prevented all damage.
@CuRtoKy.8576: I’m gonna have to call you out on your statement of LoSing. True the Devs made it possible to herd nearly every mob in the game into tight locations, which is why players use it in almost every encounter in the game. However, the word “intended” carries a lot more weight then you seem to realize. Do you really think that one day during development the Devs had a meeting where they decided, “You know, we’ve made all sorts of movement skills in this game, leaps, dashes, launches. I don’t know what we were thinking by making all these. Psha. Let’s make the Apex of skill in PvE be standing in corners, trying to remain as immobile as possible. Who cares if renders; blowouts, cripples, pushes, immobilize, fear and chill, useless and possibly detrimental”
I’m not saying don’t LoS, or Stack or Zerk. If you find a way to beat the hardest boss in the game in 3 seconds with a simple reflect, go ahead and do it. There’s teamwork in it, and there’s play. Not so much for spectacle, but w/e. Go ahead and use it till you can’t anymore.
What I’m saying is I see the word “intended” thrown around a lot in these threads and I don’t think that it’s an appropriate use of the word. Intended suggests it was their primary aim, as if they want all players to aspire to it. Imo, a better word would be “sanctioned”, or “allowed”, but “intended” doesn’t sit well with me.
Registered Altaholic
Part-time Kittenposter
Part-time Kittenposter
I’m simply going to assume that he never got hit by the poison and then proceeded to reflect or saw someone struck by the poison beforehand do a reflect, seeing as the poison slows you down, amps up your damage and doesn’t count as regular poison at all. This, of course, is never said or shown in any way until it happens to you.
That still doesn’t discard the fact that one reflect made this boss very easy and to no threat at all.
But the question is does this change anything? Answer is not really since good coordinated groups can still stack as before. You just punish the same players that wanted this change.
Aren’t they allowed to undo things they’ve done? How should they broke Alphard’s kegs in the first place? The kegs aren’t reused anywhere else, so they had to change that intentionally.
I never said they can’t undo. I’m saying people made that argument for Alphard. So for AC spider queen, people are making the argument that ArenaNet did it to stop stack, exploit, zerk, or whatever they think this change does. Now if ArenaNet changed it back to how it was before then everyone making the argument this was intended to stop stack and such were wrong. In the same light of how people talk about the Alphard change. These changes are undocumented so nobody knows what is or is not intended (on top of ArenaNet not saying anything about it). So at best you can only say if this change is good or bad and why. But that isn’t what you are doing, you are saying that x was changed because of y and ArenaNet intended to do this because of a,b,c reasons. That flow of logic doesn’t make sense.
What is this I don’t even… did you even fight this boss?
Reflects did an incredibly huge amount of damage to Malrona. A solo mesmer could literally kill this boss with just two feedbacks.
Moreover, Malrona has two attacks, one of which was never reflectable. So it’s also wrong to say that reflects prevented all damage.
The second attack is a poison which doesn’t kill you but buff your damage by what? 500%? Something like that.
plz tell us how you know developers meant for bosses to be kited
kthx
If you stack in front of Malrona without any reflect, you’ll die instantly.
The reflect doesn’t hurt her but it negates her only damagesource outside of her highly telegraphed poison.So what are reflects/walls for then? Trash adds? negligable boss attacks? If that’s all it’s for then there’s no point, and we’ve just eliminated another build for guard/mesmer and quite frankly the need for either in many cases.
What’s next? Defiance being on them initially so we can’t pull them into corners? Just to solidify the uselessness of mesmers? Then get rid of Aegis so we can have the same for Guards? Lets all just play warriors and ele’s!
1) I’ve neither said that I’m happy with this change, nor that it was a wise one. But it was a reasonable one.
2) Let’s take a look at AC P2 endboss. The boss has basically just 2 different attacks and both could be reflected, which meant that your whole party could not die if you had just one well placed reflect. Same applies to the triple golems in SE P1, to Bloomhunger in FotM, Deadeye Dunwell in the Queen’s Gauntlet and many more bosses whose damage can be signifcantly reduced, if not negated, through reflects.
That’s ANet’s problem: Their bosses are too easy and they’ve fixed it. They’ve not chosen the best way, they’ve chosen the easiest one.
I don’t feel it was reasonable at all. It’s removing skills from doing what they pretty clearly are supposed to do. Yes it is very powerful, but again, it’s a tool used how the tool was made to work, it’s just that it really shines in those situations. Just like FGS shines in a corner. Or Icebow4 shines for a burst of AE damage. Or evade attacks like Whirlwind/Blurred Frenzy/Pistol Whip shine in situations where you have to dodge a lot.
If we keep nerfing things in the situations where they are really good, then pretty soon we’re all going to be either warriors, or we might as well be because the tools other professions have will be made mediocre at best.
If I wanted to play a game where the core mechanics were pretty much all that mattered I’d go to Wildstar, they seemed to have perfected that there. But I like that there are tools in this game that make it something more.
The only problem is that we’ve mastered the content, we know how to do it, we know what to use where and when. Anet hasn’t fixed their problem in any way. They’ve simply broken more things. Their problem is the content is extremely stale, making certain professions pointless doesn’t fix that, we’re still stuck with basically the same dungeons just instead of team composition and proper planning being a key element it’s just going to be all about learning when to dodge…something that those crying “it’s too easy” will already know how to do.
PS. doesn’t Dunwell’s 1 shot go through walls but the rest of the attacks don’t? I’m ok with exceptions to walls, and this change as far as I know is only a few specific situations, and not that big fo a deal, but if it’s a sign of things to come… then it’s just all wrong.
The reflect did literally no damage… It just protected you and your mates from taking any damage, making that encounter way too easy.
.
0.o
no damage?
(edited by Ropechef.6192)
I never said they can’t undo. I’m saying people made that argument for Alphard. So for AC spider queen, people are making the argument that ArenaNet did it to stop stack, exploit, zerk, or whatever they think this change does. Now if ArenaNet changed it back to how it was before then everyone making the argument this was intended to stop stack and such were wrong. In the same light of how people talk about the Alphard change. These changes are undocumented so nobody knows what is or is not intended (on top of ArenaNet not saying anything about it). So at best you can only say if this change is good or bad and why. But that isn’t what you are doing, you are saying that x was changed because of y and ArenaNet intended to do this because of a,b,c reasons. That flow of logic doesn’t make sense.
That is
A) ANet being not good in analysing and stopping stacking by its core and
B) The people being stubborn and claiming a lot of things which are flawed and not elaborated.
I don’t feel it was reasonable at all.
It’s not reasonable if you think about reflects being useless most the time now.
It is however reasonable if you want to fix cheesy play enabled by such reflects.
The reflect did literally no damage… It just protected you and your mates from taking any damage, making that encounter way too easy.
.0.o
no damage?
Yes, I’ve seen that each AoE of malrona deals 14k damage to her. I’ve also seen bearbows dealing 35k damage while under the effect of her poison.
@CuRtoKy.8576: I’m gonna have to call you out on your statement of LoSing. True the Devs made it possible to herd nearly every mob in the game into tight locations, which is why players use it in almost every encounter in the game. However, the word “intended” carries a lot more weight then you seem to realize. Do you really think that one day during development the Devs had a meeting where they decided, “You know, we’ve made all sorts of movement skills in this game, leaps, dashes, launches. I don’t know what we were thinking by making all these. Psha. Let’s make the Apex of skill in PvE be standing in corners, trying to remain as immobile as possible. Who cares if renders; blowouts, cripples, pushes, immobilize, fear and chill, useless and possibly detrimental”
I’m not saying don’t LoS, or Stack or Zerk. If you find a way to beat the hardest boss in the game in 3 seconds with a simple reflect, go ahead and do it. There’s teamwork in it, and there’s play. Not so much for spectacle, but w/e. Go ahead and use it till you can’t anymore.
What I’m saying is I see the word “intended” thrown around a lot in these threads and I don’t think that it’s an appropriate use of the word. Intended suggests it was their primary aim, as if they want all players to aspire to it. Imo, a better word would be “sanctioned”, or “allowed”, but “intended” doesn’t sit well with me.
PvE isn’t the only thing that matters. LoS as a mechanic exist across all game play and is used quite often in WvW and PvP. Now if the concern is LoS in PvE then you can simply just remove all forms of LoS in PvE if you really want to.
Your example doesn’t work because the Devs created the game for all game types and LoS is a strategy that is employed. Now if they feel that is bad like I said then they can simply just remove any form of LoS in PvE and just make it an open field fight. If that doesn’t happen then of course some form of LoS is ok. Even for recent stuff there are still LoS spots (the new fractal, TA Aetherblade Path). They had the opportunity but there is still LoS.
I don’t feel it was reasonable at all.
It’s not reasonable if you think about reflects being useless most the time now.
It is however reasonable if you want to fix cheesy play enabled by such reflects.
Cheesy play huh? So it’s reasonable if I share your opinion that using things as intended is cheesy? Ok…
Lets remove everything that has situational uses. Anything that when used correctly is beneficial. Lets just be left with damage moves and dodges, that’s it!
Cheesy play huh? So it’s reasonable if I share your opinion that using things as intended is cheesy? Ok…
So you say using one skill to block all or atleast a huge protion of the damage a boss is able to do is not cheesy? Ok…
Lets remove everything that has situational uses. Anything that when used correctly is beneficial. Lets just be left with damage moves and dodges, that’s it!
Don’t say that too loud. ANet might listen to you.
(edited by HHR LostProphet.4801)
Cheesy play huh? So it’s reasonable if I share your opinion that using things as intended is cheesy? Ok…
So you say using one skill to block all or atleast a huge protion of the damage a boss is able to do is not cheesy? Ok…
Lets remove everything that has situational uses. Anything that when used correctly is beneficial. Lets just be left with damage moves and dodges, that’s it!
Don’t say that too loud. ANet might listen to you.
When I dodge, I press a single button and negate all the damage I should’ve taken. Better fix that.
Cheesy play huh? So it’s reasonable if I share your opinion that using things as intended is cheesy? Ok…
So you say using one skill to block all or atleast a huge protion of the damage a boss is able to do is not cheesy? Ok…
Lets remove everything that has situational uses. Anything that when used correctly is beneficial. Lets just be left with damage moves and dodges, that’s it!
Don’t say that too loud. ANet might listen to you.
No more cheesy than FGSing into a corner, or setting up Icebows. Or using evade attacks to avoid having to dodge. or using the environment to duck away from attacks. Or ranging, especially from safe spots. Or Stealth
And, honestly I don’t care, if they want to push it into a mundane boring game so be it, i’ll move on to Wildstar to get a better version of that and they’ll be stuck with a less popular game /shrug.
There are 3 things GW2 has better than Wildstar IMO.
Diversity of skills, including some of these abilities that when used correctly in the right situation are extremely powerful. Those skills/abilities are what substitutes for the Trinity, they create a want for good group composition, without them it’d be war + ele + maybe ranger.
Then the other two is basically just graphics and a truer sense of the fantasy genre. Wildstar is cartoony and much sillier.
When I dodge, I press a single button and negate all the damage I should’ve taken. Better fix that.
Can you please stop giving such silly answers?
One singel reflect can negate all damage for several seconds for your whole team.
Your dodge just negates damage for you for one second. It does furthermore not negate dots and AoEs.
When I dodge, I press a single button and negate all the damage I should’ve taken. Better fix that.
Can you please stop giving such silly answers?
One singel reflect can negate all damage for several seconds for your whole team.
Your dodge just negates damage for you for one second. It does furthermore not negate dots and AoEs.
Let me give you a better one then.
The only point I agree on is the sometimes ridiculous reflect damage which should be limited imo.
Not every class has access to reflects and they’re not useful at every boss, only on certain ones. Out of those, not every can be reflected for those ridiculous amounts of damage.
Yes, reflects are powerful if used correctly, but that’s because they’re situational.
They’re better off giving the boss new melee or non-projectile attacks instead of nerfing reflects.
Btw, I want to see a reflect which stops DoTs from ticking and aoes from damaging me.
dodging is kiting…
Stupidity just went to a whole new level.
Snow Crows [SC]
When I dodge, I press a single button and negate all the damage I should’ve taken. Better fix that.
Can you please stop giving such silly answers?
One singel reflect can negate all damage for several seconds for your whole team.
Your dodge just negates damage for you for one second. It does furthermore not negate dots and AoEs.
One single reflect can negate 1 attack from malrona, just 1.
1 Aegis can negate 1 lupi’s kick/swipe, or 1 single hit attack from many bosses that can be devastating.
NERF AEGIS PLS
But seriously, he has a point. Anet wants to devolve this game into some typical mmo.
kiting = damagemitigation
dodging = damagemitigation
aegis = damagemitigation
?
aegis = kiting?
Seems like flawed logic to me.
Genevieve Talbot [NP] – Noble Phantasm on Stormbluff Isle
When I dodge, I press a single button and negate all the damage I should’ve taken. Better fix that.
Can you please stop giving such silly answers?
One singel reflect can negate all damage for several seconds for your whole team.
Your dodge just negates damage for you for one second. It does furthermore not negate dots and AoEs.Let me give you a better one then.
The only point I agree on is the sometimes ridiculous reflect damage which should be limited imo.
Not every class has access to reflects and they’re not useful at every boss, only on certain ones. Out of those, not every can be reflected for those ridiculous amounts of damage.
Yes, reflects are powerful if used correctly, but that’s because they’re situational.
They’re better off giving the boss new melee or non-projectile attacks instead of nerfing reflects.
Btw, I want to see a reflect which stops DoTs from ticking and aoes from damaging me.
There are multiple bosses which can be rendered useless by using reflects. AC P2 endboss is one example, malrona another. Or triple golems in SE P1. Or Kholer in AC. Or the turrets at the endboss of TA up.
DoTs inflicting- or AoE creating projectiles get reflected aswell as any other projectile does.
@CuRtoKy.8576: I’m gonna have to call you out on your statement of LoSing. True the Devs made it possible to herd nearly every mob in the game into tight locations, which is why players use it in almost every encounter in the game. However, the word “intended” carries a lot more weight then you seem to realize. Do you really think that one day during development the Devs had a meeting where they decided, “You know, we’ve made all sorts of movement skills in this game, leaps, dashes, launches. I don’t know what we were thinking by making all these. Psha. Let’s make the Apex of skill in PvE be standing in corners, trying to remain as immobile as possible. Who cares if renders; blowouts, cripples, pushes, immobilize, fear and chill, useless and possibly detrimental”
I’m not saying don’t LoS, or Stack or Zerk. If you find a way to beat the hardest boss in the game in 3 seconds with a simple reflect, go ahead and do it. There’s teamwork in it, and there’s play. Not so much for spectacle, but w/e. Go ahead and use it till you can’t anymore.
What I’m saying is I see the word “intended” thrown around a lot in these threads and I don’t think that it’s an appropriate use of the word. Intended suggests it was their primary aim, as if they want all players to aspire to it. Imo, a better word would be “sanctioned”, or “allowed”, but “intended” doesn’t sit well with me.PvE isn’t the only thing that matters. LoS as a mechanic exist across all game play and is used quite often in WvW and PvP. Now if the concern is LoS in PvE then you can simply just remove all forms of LoS in PvE if you really want to.
Your example doesn’t work because the Devs created the game for all game types and LoS is a strategy that is employed. Now if they feel that is bad like I said then they can simply just remove any form of LoS in PvE and just make it an open field fight. If that doesn’t happen then of course some form of LoS is ok. Even for recent stuff there are still LoS spots (the new fractal, TA Aetherblade Path). They had the opportunity but there is still LoS.
I’m not saying LoS should be removed by any means. It should be as integral here as it it is in any FPS game, but it should also have all the weaknesses it has in an FPS. I believe my example is still valid as the fact that almost all the mobs in the game fall for the exact same strategy reeks of lack of attention. It either means they’ve underestimated the playerbase or it has been put on the backburner to focus on other more popular modes of play. Either way, in my eyes there has been an oversight.
Registered Altaholic
Part-time Kittenposter
Part-time Kittenposter
(edited by Dual.8953)
When I dodge, I press a single button and negate all the damage I should’ve taken. Better fix that.
Can you please stop giving such silly answers?
One singel reflect can negate all damage for several seconds for your whole team.
Your dodge just negates damage for you for one second. It does furthermore not negate dots and AoEs.Let me give you a better one then.
The only point I agree on is the sometimes ridiculous reflect damage which should be limited imo.
Not every class has access to reflects and they’re not useful at every boss, only on certain ones. Out of those, not every can be reflected for those ridiculous amounts of damage.
Yes, reflects are powerful if used correctly, but that’s because they’re situational.
They’re better off giving the boss new melee or non-projectile attacks instead of nerfing reflects.
Btw, I want to see a reflect which stops DoTs from ticking and aoes from damaging me.There are multiple bosses which can be rendered useless by using reflects. AC P2 endboss is one example, malrona another. Or triple golems in SE P1. Or Kholer in AC. Or the turrets at the endboss of TA up.
DoTs inflicting- or AoE creating projectiles get reflected aswell as any other projectile does.
In your infinite wisdom of what is intended and not. Where exactly are theses abilities to be used that isn’t cheesy? Or is their entire existence wrong?
Not all of the golems are rendered useless, only the fire one.
Also, so what? Still no need to nerf reflects themselves, but instead they should simply start giving the bosses more and/or better attacks so that they keep being dangerous even if you reflect them. They’re a pushover, with or without reflects.
They can reflect DoT and AoE-projectiles, right. But if you have them on you/below them, reflects can’t do anything about them either.
Kiting: Staying out of range of your opponent so that their attacks would automatically fail. This usually causes them to attempt to move into range to use their attacks while you simultaneously move out of range of it. While kiting can be considered dodging, not all dodging can be considered kiting.
Dodging: Placing yourself in a position where an opponents attack will miss you. Note that this doesn’t mean that you move out of range. The opponent may still be able to make follow up attacks on you and you might still be hit by said follow up attacks.
Genevieve Talbot [NP] – Noble Phantasm on Stormbluff Isle
When I dodge, I press a single button and negate all the damage I should’ve taken. Better fix that.
Can you please stop giving such silly answers?
One singel reflect can negate all damage for several seconds for your whole team.
Your dodge just negates damage for you for one second. It does furthermore not negate dots and AoEs.Let me give you a better one then.
The only point I agree on is the sometimes ridiculous reflect damage which should be limited imo.
Not every class has access to reflects and they’re not useful at every boss, only on certain ones. Out of those, not every can be reflected for those ridiculous amounts of damage.
Yes, reflects are powerful if used correctly, but that’s because they’re situational.
They’re better off giving the boss new melee or non-projectile attacks instead of nerfing reflects.
Btw, I want to see a reflect which stops DoTs from ticking and aoes from damaging me.There are multiple bosses which can be rendered useless by using reflects. AC P2 endboss is one example, malrona another. Or triple golems in SE P1. Or Kholer in AC. Or the turrets at the endboss of TA up.
DoTs inflicting- or AoE creating projectiles get reflected aswell as any other projectile does.In your infinite wisdom of what is intended and not. Where exactly are theses abilities to be used that isn’t cheesy? Or is their entire existence wrong?
It’s just ANet’s fault that there are bosses who can be completely countered by reflects and they try to fix that.
At the end of the day, yes — tweeking Malrona was ok. How they did it was not.
The problem was that the poison buff + reflect was definitely OP.
But unreflectable projectiles are a bullkitten mechanic. All of them.
They could have removed the damage buff, made reflect damage sane, anything else. Instead, they broke the reflect mechanic.
Reeks of lazy design, they just took the easy way out.
When I dodge, I press a single button and negate all the damage I should’ve taken. Better fix that.
Can you please stop giving such silly answers?
One singel reflect can negate all damage for several seconds for your whole team.
Your dodge just negates damage for you for one second. It does furthermore not negate dots and AoEs.Let me give you a better one then.
The only point I agree on is the sometimes ridiculous reflect damage which should be limited imo.
Not every class has access to reflects and they’re not useful at every boss, only on certain ones. Out of those, not every can be reflected for those ridiculous amounts of damage.
Yes, reflects are powerful if used correctly, but that’s because they’re situational.
They’re better off giving the boss new melee or non-projectile attacks instead of nerfing reflects.
Btw, I want to see a reflect which stops DoTs from ticking and aoes from damaging me.There are multiple bosses which can be rendered useless by using reflects. AC P2 endboss is one example, malrona another. Or triple golems in SE P1. Or Kholer in AC. Or the turrets at the endboss of TA up.
DoTs inflicting- or AoE creating projectiles get reflected aswell as any other projectile does.In your infinite wisdom of what is intended and not. Where exactly are theses abilities to be used that isn’t cheesy? Or is their entire existence wrong?
It’s just ANet’s fault that there are bosses who can be completely countered by reflects and they try to fix that.
That doesn’t answer the question at all.
In your infinite wisdom of what is intended and not. Where exactly are theses abilities to be used that isn’t cheesy? Or is their entire existence wrong?
It’s just ANet’s fault that there are bosses who can be completely countered by reflects and they try to fix that.
That doesn’t answer the question at all.
Do you really think that ANet’s vision of how bosses are meant to be fought by stacking ontop of the boss, dropping reflects like mad and smashing 111111111?
No, it was not! They fixed it by making reflects useless. You can deal with it or you leave, I don’t kittening care.
Is making reflects useless the best way to counter stacking? No, not by far.
Does it work? Yes it does. Deal with it.