Guild Wars 2

I’ve done this quite a few times. I always ask before we even start the dungeon and often contribute the most to the dungeon besides the last minutes of the last boss fight. I’ve never been kicked for it though I don’t doubt the day will come where some kitten will do it.

After 3 80s it’s just a pain in the kitten to level alts through normal gameplay, DEs/hearts are so boring also and I’m not spending 40-80g in crafting for fast leveling, when I could be earning gold/tokens/items while leveling!

@ ComeandSee
Without mentioning the asking part in your process explaination, your post probably isn’t reading quite how you expected it to.

Vox Hollow.2736:

@ ComeandSee
Without mentioning the asking part in your process explaination, your post probably isn’t reading quite how you expected it to.

Not really understanding what you’re trying to ask me, but no — I never asked the groups and haven’t had a single complaint (ever) or been kicked.

I’ve had many people do this in groups I’ve been in. It doesn’t bother me in the slightest. I think the only time it would bug me would be in situations like the final boss on CoF path 2. You kinda need all five members for that one. But otherwise, I don’t care. I’d probably do this myself if my load times weren’t excessively long. To be honest, though, I find it easier to level alts in WvW than in dungeons.

And like someone else said, I don’t think this would be near the “problem” it is if people didn’t kick you for being under 80, even if you’re a low level that is wearing the Dungeon Master title >_>

Leveling Alts is boring.. slow.. whatever.

So you find an easy way to get an Alt experience that that character did not earn.

I understand the player put in the effort, but that character did not earn that XP. You have found a loophole in the system where you can put forth the effort on your main character, only to have an Alt to reap the benefit.

This is not how the system was intended, and you can call it what you like, manipulating the system in this manner for your benefit whether it affects anyone else or not is exploiting.

I honestly don’t have a big problem with people doing it, just don’t sit there and try to fool yourselves. Just because leveling Alts is slow, boring, tedious doesn’t give you a pass.

@ComeandSee

You don’t think anything is an exploit LOL

DeathPanel.8362:

he was immediately kicked, and that’s after he asked.

Moral of the story: he shouldn’t have asked…?

There is a very simple way to “fix” this:

Give tokens and experience after each boss (as a reward for defeating that boss – with a requirement of having done >5% of total damage, which I believe is already in place), instead of giving a ton of XP at the end simply for being present when the last boss dies.

That way, if someone logs into a different character (or if the party kicks someone to invite a friend), that character only gets the rewards that correspond to the last boss (i.e., the one he actually killed).

And before someone brings up the silly argument that “that would just make people farm the first boss”, remember that:

a) The game already has a diminishing returns system, so killing the same boss 5 times would give significantly less rewards than killing 5 different bosses.

b) The first boss in most dungeons is harder than the last one.

c) If everyone in the party prefers to do the same boss 5 times instead of 5 different bosses, why shouldn’t they be allowed? This is a game, not a job; if they enjoy repetition, let them have it.

I don’t know if anet considers this an exploit, but I don’t see anything wrong with it as long as you show courtesy and common sense – don’t switch to an alt that’s too low level to contribute to the fight at all(why on earth would you bring a level 10 to a level 75 dungeon?), don’t switch early in the fight and sit around at the entrance of the dungeon while the rest of your group 4-mans the final boss, don’t leave your group hanging on harder fights(you won’t even notice the difference between a level 35 and a level 80 on a brain-dead easy boss like Ghost Eater, but switching on Subject Alpha could be problematic), etc.

Dungeon switching is my primary method of leveling. Hearts and dynamic events are mind-numbingly boring, crafting is expensive, and WvW isn’t always an option, so this is pretty much the only way for me to level my alts that doesn’t make me want to bang my head against a wall.

I pull my weight on my 80 for 99% of the run and then switch to my lowbie at the last minute to claim my reward. It’s better than doing the entire dungeon on a non-80 and being utterly useless to my group.

@ ComeandSee

Oh. I just didn’t believe you’d meant it the way it sounded.

God forbid we don’t have at least 2 people watching the party menu like a hawk at all times, least somebody get the idea kicking back in a lawnchair and sipping a martini while other people are working unawares is not only acceptable but encouraged.

You know, doing a bad thing is still a bad thing, even if you don’t get caught.

Vox Hollow.2736:

@ ComeandSee

Oh. I just didn’t believe you’d meant it the way it sounded.

God forbid we don’t have at least 2 people watching the party menu like a hawk at all times, least somebody get the idea kicking back in a lawnchair and sipping a martini while other people are working unawares is not only acceptable but encouraged.

You know, doing a bad thing is still a bad thing, even if you don’t get caught.

I think people just want to complain about nothing.

I stay on my 80 character and ride it out from the beginning to the very end ON MY LVL 80 until the boss is @ 15%~ HP and we’re talking AC, TA, and COF where the bosses are faceroll easy.

So I’m there for 19 minutes and 45 seconds and relog at the final 15 seconds. That is 98.75% of the dungeon. So you’re really telling me that you’ll make a big stink and kick me because of that? No — you don’t care. I’ve done this 20+ times and haven’t had a single complaint about relogging the final percentage of the boss, but I’ve seen people complain about people logging on their low lvl alts to do the final boss from beginning to end.

If I logged off before the fight and flipped out the lawn chair and made you guys do 100% of the work on the final boss while I’m afk than that is worthy of being kicked.

Vox Hollow.2736:

@ ComeandSee

Oh. I just didn’t believe you’d meant it the way it sounded.

God forbid we don’t have at least 2 people watching the party menu like a hawk at all times, least somebody get the idea kicking back in a lawnchair and sipping a martini while other people are working unawares is not only acceptable but encouraged.

You know, doing a bad thing is still a bad thing, even if you don’t get caught.

Yes, doing it in pugs without even asking is rude, but now you’re being pretentious. You do realise that if people do this, they will most likely do it when the boss has 5% HP left? Also, if they’ve been contributing with 100% effort for the entire run, allowing them to give the reward and otherwise useless exp to an alt at the very end seems justified to me. Why are you under the impression that the people that switch at the VERY LAST MINUTE haven’t been giving it their all? Perhaps you’ve been in terrible groups, but in a dedicated, experienced guild group that does dungeon runs regularly and could do it with 3 people if they wanted, one or two of the guildies switching to an alt with 5% HP to go is an absolute non-issue.

Perhaps you need to lower your nose a little, because right now you’re blinding yourself with absolutely ludicrous, uptight values that are simply not realistic. “kicking back in a lawnchair and sipping a martini while other people are working unawares” – give me a break.

I am not sure why this is a big deal if a person switches at 5% or even 10%, it isnt really going to make a difference unless the person that switched was carrying everyone else.

The OP said 80% I think, I would just stand there and watch the person that did this at 80% die and then kick them so they have to pay for repairs.

If your main character did 98.75% of the dungeon run and you switch to an alt to finish the last 1.25%, why in the world is that character entitled to 100% of the reward?

I’m not questioning the player putting in 100%, just that the Alt hasn’t ‘earned’ the reward and thus is exploiting the system for gain.

You’ve found a loophole which allows you to transfer your reward for completing the dungeon to your alt. Congrats.. but this is not working as intended.

@ Auesis
My comments do not apply in that situation, as I’ve painstakingly pointed out in the first page of this thread I am not interested in discussing powerlevelling. In case it wasn’t clear, I’m speaking specifically of the act of ninja leeching in pug settings. You can think my scorn for ninja leeching is pretentious if you want, all I can say is “I’m sorry you feel that way, but I don’t have any intentions of changing my opinion on that.”

@ ComeandSee

It’s unreasonable to expect other people to act as your moral compass.

During the fact, your attempts at consideration end up making immediate reaction difficult on a practical level. If they even know this is possible in the first place, it’s unreasonable to expect your teammates take their attention off playing to monitor you.

Even if you were caught after the fact, People aren’t going to naturally assume you’ve put the responsibility for your behavior in their hands. Why would they? It’s much more rational to assume somebody does something rude to be rude, not because they just don’t know any better. That’s like expecting somebody to say ‘flipping people off is rude’ everytime somebody gives them the bird on the offchance somebody didn’t know it was. They have no reason to believe you were looking for somebody to correct your behavior, and they have no responsibility to be the one to do it.

But at the end of the day. If you honestly believe nobody cares – then you honestly believe you have nothing to lose by asking. So why don’t you just Ask from now on?

Mad Rasputin.7809:

You are exploiting the system to get rewards/xp for a character who did not put in the necessary work/time to receive the rewards.

TL:DR I’m a player not a character, I should get to choose my rewards within reason.. Leveling the “Normal” way is boring after 2 or 3 characters, and no one will let you do dungeons unless you are level 80 already

Long version:

The problem is you are looking at it based on the character, not the Player.. I The Player put the work/time into doing the dungeon, and I should get to choose what one of my character’s gets the reward (Within reason).

Here is a personal example.. I have multiple lvl 80 characters, and I thought it would be fun, and worth the effort, to level my Mesmer up via dungeons. I can earn tokens for her, and not have to spend gold buying armor when she hits 80, just do runs of TA and CM for Rabid armor. I managed to get her to 55 through crafting, personal story, and a few AC runs.

Do you know how many CM/TA Runs I have managed to get, even tho my character is at/above the recommended level? Zero, Zilch, Nada.. Every group I join as my Mesmer has asked “Are you switching to an 80?” and when I say I was wanting to do it with this character they all say “Sorry, 80 only” and Kick me.. So, I have resolved to start asking to alt Switch on the last boss…

Because after getting to 80 the “normal” way 3 times, I don’t want to do it a 4th time… So, my choices are.. Level her up the “normal” boreing way.. or Look for groups that will allow me to “Alt Switch” at the last boss so she can level up, and I can earn tokens for the armor I want for her when she hits 80.

Rizalee.4593:

The problem is you are looking at it based on the character, not the Player.. I The Player put the work/time into doing the dungeon, and I should get to choose what one of my character’s gets the reward (Within reason).

I understand the PLAYER is putting in 100%. The game is just not designed for the player to get a ‘pile of xp to distribute as he/she sees fit’. It is designed to give XP/rewards to the character who did the content.

I’m certainly not questioning whether you or anyone else is contributing to the group 100%. I’m just saying the game isn’t designed for you to choose how to distribute XP across your characters. It is designed to reward the character that did the content and circumventing this is a type of exploit.

Just because you don’t want to or feel like leveling your remaining ALTs the traditional way doesn’t make this any less of a method of manipulating the system.

I believe most of the people that switch charas are people working on their alts. And many do this so they contribute more with their 80s or because groups are exclusionary of anything but 80s, which is a problem in and of itself.

Once you start working on your second/third/fourth alt, grinding through the same old maps just loses it’s appeal. And dungeon experience is a good way of levelling.

As for whether it is an exploit or not? I do not see why it is an exploit any more than picking up someone at the last minute for a boss. Someone comes in for little effort and reaps full rewards. The difference is that when we switch, at least as a player we put in full effort.

Also. please note that many people that do this bring alts that are still in the recommended level range for the dungeon. IE, they can still contribute to the final boss fight.

SynfulChaot.3169:

As for whether it is an exploit or not? I do not see why it is an exploit any more than picking up someone at the last minute for a boss. Someone comes in for little effort and reaps full rewards. The difference is that when we switch, at least as a player we put in full effort.

It seems to me this discussion is not quite what I thought it was….I was talking working our way to the last boss, of AC for example, on my Level 80 Warrior, then before we fight the last boss saying “Hey guys is it Ok if I switch to my lvl 55 Mesmer to kill the last boss?” The Level 55 Mesmer is the right level for the Dungeon, but has less survivability given how often people skip in that dungeon…

I find this no different that what SynfulChaot is points out above..

I’m not talking about switching at the last moment to get the reward, I am talking about switching before the last boss, and fully contributing to his defeat, in order to get the reward on a character that it is beneficial for..

are u aware how difficult it is for a lvl10 to get out to CoF?

i would give that player a LOT of credit for taking his guy out that far.

And i always do this for AC.
I go on my lvl80… up to last boss… swap.
A lot of people learned this is a great way to grind, and u get tears for future gear purchase on your new character. Hence killing 2 birds with one stone.

Is it an exploit?
I dont think so. Your still killing the last boss.

You can also tell people ur not happy with them swaping out if u dont like it.
They will typically go TY, and leave…
No one said u HAD to play with these guys.
Also i think its poliet to let the party know your swaping at Last Boss.
I always let my party know, and 99% of the time no one has a problem with it.
Infact 3 other guys swap with me, and the last boss becomes fun due to the fact were facing him in Green’s / Blues and its quite a challenge.

Solo it is difficult but with some friends it’s not that hard.

Naekuh.7925:

are u aware how difficult it is for a lvl10 to get out to CoF?

It’s actually not difficult at all.

I ran my Mesmer (and Thief) both up there when they were lvl 20-ish. Just stay on the road and you won’t aggro anything.