(edited by jul.7602)
Soft cap on stats?
There is a hardcap on precision (100% chance) and DR on Power.
Power does always have DR. If you add 100 power to 916 Power (base), thats about 11% damage increase. If you add 100 power to 3000 power, it’s just a 3% increase.
I can’t answer any questions on toughness and vitality because those stats are purely useless in dungeons.
Possibly informative example: if a skill did 200 damage when you had 1000 power, adding 100 power would make it do 220 damage (10% increase, +20 damage). The same skill would do 600 damage at 3000 power: adding 100 power to that would make it do 620 damage. (3.33% increase, +20 damage) In both cases adding 100 power added the same amount of damage dealt to a target with constant armor.
Mixing insults with your post is like pooping in a salad.
It’s pretty obvious, and nobody’s impressed.
It’s pretty obvious, and nobody’s impressed.
Power does always have DR. If you add 100 power to 916 Power (base), thats about 11% damage increase. If you add 100 power to 3000 power, it’s just a 3% increase.
That’s not diminishing returns. 100 power is 100 power regardless of how much you previously have. Diminishing returns would be to reduce all bonus power by, say, 50% beyond the 3000 mark, so that at 2900 power 100 more would bring you to 3000, and 100 more than that would only bring you to 3050. What it is is a decrease in relative value – but diminishing returns it is not.
Still it’s a decrease in efficiency. Once you’re at about 3000 power you better increase your precision instead of power.
Power does always have DR. If you add 100 power to 916 Power (base), thats about 11% damage increase. If you add 100 power to 3000 power, it’s just a 3% increase.
That’s not diminishing returns. 100 power is 100 power regardless of how much you previously have. Diminishing returns would be to reduce all bonus power by, say, 50% beyond the 3000 mark, so that at 2900 power 100 more would bring you to 3000, and 100 more than that would only bring you to 3050. What it is is a decrease in relative value – but diminishing returns it is not.
It’s diminishing marginal returns. When getting an extra X power means 3% more and in toughness it would be 8% more, there’s a diminishing return on your stat investment.
Power does always have DR. If you add 100 power to 916 Power (base), thats about 11% damage increase. If you add 100 power to 3000 power, it’s just a 3% increase.
That’s not diminishing returns. 100 power is 100 power regardless of how much you previously have. Diminishing returns would be to reduce all bonus power by, say, 50% beyond the 3000 mark, so that at 2900 power 100 more would bring you to 3000, and 100 more than that would only bring you to 3050. What it is is a decrease in relative value – but diminishing returns it is not.
Truth.
Here’s the formula for damage.
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Damage
As you see, there is no special clause stating any reduced effect at a higher number. Dub just thinks he’s getting DR because he’s thinking about a % change from a previous value to an increased value at a higher power value instead of the flat damage increase, which WILL REMAIN THE SAME.
Example.
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Greatsword_Swing
Say your warrior hits 500 damage with his greatsword swing. According to the wiki, your tooltip uses a value of 2600 toughness at level 80 to show you your damage with the skill. A level 80 exotic greatsword has an average weapon damage of 1047.5. 1047.5/2600 = 40%. The power coefficient for this attack is 0.7. 0.7 × 0.4 = 0.28.
That means, for warrior GS first swing, each point of power will always add a flat 0.28 points of damage (no %damage modifier, enemy toughness 2600). If you currently hit for 500 and add 100 power, you’ll hit 528. If you hit for 1000 and add 100 power, you’ll hit 1028. 100 power will always translate to 28 more damage. The effect will LOOK like less at the higher damage range because 28 is a smaller percent of 1000 than it is of 500, but that does not change the fact that 28 is 28.
There are no diminishing returns for stats. It is linear. There is no magic line in the code that says to decrease the effectiveness of a stat once you hit an arbitrary breakpoint.
Edit
Power does always have DR. If you add 100 power to 916 Power (base), thats about 11% damage increase. If you add 100 power to 3000 power, it’s just a 3% increase.
That’s not diminishing returns. 100 power is 100 power regardless of how much you previously have. Diminishing returns would be to reduce all bonus power by, say, 50% beyond the 3000 mark, so that at 2900 power 100 more would bring you to 3000, and 100 more than that would only bring you to 3050. What it is is a decrease in relative value – but diminishing returns it is not.
It’s diminishing marginal returns. When getting an extra X power means 3% more and in toughness it would be 8% more, there’s a diminishing return on your stat investment.
Power does always have DR. If you add 100 power to 916 Power (base), thats about 11% damage increase. If you add 100 power to 3000 power, it’s just a 3% increase.
That’s not diminishing returns. 100 power is 100 power regardless of how much you previously have. Diminishing returns would be to reduce all bonus power by, say, 50% beyond the 3000 mark, so that at 2900 power 100 more would bring you to 3000, and 100 more than that would only bring you to 3050. What it is is a decrease in relative value – but diminishing returns it is not.
It’s diminishing marginal returns. When getting an extra X power means 3% more and in toughness it would be 8% more, there’s a diminishing return on your stat investment.
Wrong.
If you get diminishing returns with power, that would mean there would be a greater DPS benefit to adding 100 power to a low power warrior than to a high power warrior. THAT IS NOT THE CASE. As I stated in my example, adding 100 power in either case would add an additional 28 damage per swing. The increase in output is not decreased because you gave the extra 28 damage to one over another. It nets you the same flat party dps increase whether you make the warrior that already hits hard hit harder, or a warrior who hits like a wet noodle hit like a less wet noodle. They both hit harder for the same amount.
Here’s the wiki for DR.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diminishing_returns
Damage is not constrained by physical limitation like the amount of land you have for your crops or the space in your building for your workers.
(edited by Xhyros.1340)
Xhyros is the hero this game deserves, but not the hero this game needs.
Thanks for explaining all that, though. I got in an argument with a friend earlier, I’ll link him this so I can rub it in and tell him “I told you so”.
#LoveArrows2013, never forget.
Still it’s a decrease in efficiency. Once you’re at about 3000 power you better increase your precision instead of power.
^
Power does always have DR. If you add 100 power to 916 Power (base), thats about 11% damage increase. If you add 100 power to 3000 power, it’s just a 3% increase.
That’s not diminishing returns. 100 power is 100 power regardless of how much you previously have. Diminishing returns would be to reduce all bonus power by, say, 50% beyond the 3000 mark, so that at 2900 power 100 more would bring you to 3000, and 100 more than that would only bring you to 3050. What it is is a decrease in relative value – but diminishing returns it is not.
It’s diminishing marginal returns. When getting an extra X power means 3% more and in toughness it would be 8% more, there’s a diminishing return on your stat investment.
Power does always have DR. If you add 100 power to 916 Power (base), thats about 11% damage increase. If you add 100 power to 3000 power, it’s just a 3% increase.
That’s not diminishing returns. 100 power is 100 power regardless of how much you previously have. Diminishing returns would be to reduce all bonus power by, say, 50% beyond the 3000 mark, so that at 2900 power 100 more would bring you to 3000, and 100 more than that would only bring you to 3050. What it is is a decrease in relative value – but diminishing returns it is not.
It’s diminishing marginal returns. When getting an extra X power means 3% more and in toughness it would be 8% more, there’s a diminishing return on your stat investment.
Wrong.
If you get diminishing returns with power, that would mean there would be a greater DPS benefit to adding 100 power to a low power warrior than to a high power warrior. THAT IS NOT THE CASE. As I stated in my example, adding 100 power in either case would add an additional 28 damage per swing. The increase in output is not decreased because you gave the extra 28 damage to one over another. It nets you the same flat party dps increase whether you make the warrior that already hits hard hit harder, or a warrior who hits like a wet noodle hit like a less wet noodle. They both hit harder for the same amount.
Here’s the wiki for DR.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diminishing_returns
Damage is not constrained by physical limitation like the amount of land you have for your crops or the space in your building for your workers.
Despite quoting me twice you clearly just refused to read what i said…
Still it’s a decrease in efficiency. Once you’re at about 3000 power you better increase your precision instead of power.
^
That’s still not diminishing returns on Power. Adding more power is just as effective as it was before – only now taking a second option besides power is more effective at maximizing damage. Really, it’s accelerating returns (I don’t know the actual term there) on precision and critical damage – namely, in terms of damage, precision becomes worth more the more power and critical damage you have. There’s a similar pattern for critical damage.
Edit: Regarding the ‘diminishing marginal returns’ : a 10% boost at 3000 power is worth more DPS than a 10% boost at 1500 power.
Mixing insults with your post is like pooping in a salad.
It’s pretty obvious, and nobody’s impressed.
It’s pretty obvious, and nobody’s impressed.
(edited by Softspoken.2410)
Power does always have DR. If you add 100 power to 916 Power (base), thats about 11% damage increase. If you add 100 power to 3000 power, it’s just a 3% increase.
That’s not diminishing returns. 100 power is 100 power regardless of how much you previously have. Diminishing returns would be to reduce all bonus power by, say, 50% beyond the 3000 mark, so that at 2900 power 100 more would bring you to 3000, and 100 more than that would only bring you to 3050. What it is is a decrease in relative value – but diminishing returns it is not.
It’s diminishing marginal returns. When getting an extra X power means 3% more and in toughness it would be 8% more, there’s a diminishing return on your stat investment.
Power does always have DR. If you add 100 power to 916 Power (base), thats about 11% damage increase. If you add 100 power to 3000 power, it’s just a 3% increase.
That’s not diminishing returns. 100 power is 100 power regardless of how much you previously have. Diminishing returns would be to reduce all bonus power by, say, 50% beyond the 3000 mark, so that at 2900 power 100 more would bring you to 3000, and 100 more than that would only bring you to 3050. What it is is a decrease in relative value – but diminishing returns it is not.
It’s diminishing marginal returns. When getting an extra X power means 3% more and in toughness it would be 8% more, there’s a diminishing return on your stat investment.
Wrong.
If you get diminishing returns with power, that would mean there would be a greater DPS benefit to adding 100 power to a low power warrior than to a high power warrior. THAT IS NOT THE CASE. As I stated in my example, adding 100 power in either case would add an additional 28 damage per swing. The increase in output is not decreased because you gave the extra 28 damage to one over another. It nets you the same flat party dps increase whether you make the warrior that already hits hard hit harder, or a warrior who hits like a wet noodle hit like a less wet noodle. They both hit harder for the same amount.
Here’s the wiki for DR.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diminishing_returns
Damage is not constrained by physical limitation like the amount of land you have for your crops or the space in your building for your workers.
Despite quoting me twice you clearly just refused to read what i said…
I read it. You are confused. You’re looking at a percentage increase from a particular value and another percentage increase from another particular value. What I am saying is that those percentages don’t mean anything. You are arguing about the opportunity cost of increasing power at the cost of toughness which had nothing to do with the original question. You are off topic.
So much arguing for nothing.. All Dub and Player are saying is that is DR in efficiency, which is true. Adding 100 power to 3000 isn’t efficient. It’s the exact same flat damage increase, but marginally, it’s less, so it might be better spent elsewhere if possible.
Now, before you feel the need to quote me and write a wall of text about why I’m wrong, I’ll tell you now that I most likely won’t read it, and I honestly don’t care either.
Legion of Doom [LOD] – Death ’n Taxes [DnT]
“People wanting content where Berserker sucks should remember that it needs be so hard
that they will cry, not just a river, but a huge ocean.” – Wethospu
“People wanting content where Berserker sucks should remember that it needs be so hard
that they will cry, not just a river, but a huge ocean.” – Wethospu
So much arguing for nothing.. All Dub and Player are saying is that is DR in efficiency, which is true. Adding 100 power to 3000 isn’t efficient. It’s the exact same flat damage increase, but marginally, it’s less, so it might be better spent elsewhere if possible.
Now, before you feel the need to quote me and write a wall of text about why I’m wrong, I’ll tell you now that I most likely won’t read it, and I honestly don’t care either.
Moral of the story, use full zerker gear. If you need more survivability, mix in Knight/Valkyrie until you find your happy medium. There, done, no one can argue that.
Still it’s a decrease in efficiency. Once you’re at about 3000 power you better increase your precision instead of power.
There’s no such fancy rule as that. The only real rule of thumb is, if you have “really high” power and “really low” precision, better to raise precision than power. Beyond that, it really depends on how much of each stat you have, how much crit damage, what other on-crit effects, you get, etc.
Well, i’m taking full exotic berserker gear with reasonable builds into my considerations. The point where precision gets better than power is about 3000 power then.