Every party that runs CoE or AC alwyas stacks on bosses.
For some reason, stacking removes or nullifies some skills that certain bosses have.
Subjetc Alpha, a true exemple of hard boss, became a walk in a park when we realized that pushing him against a wall and stacking on him makes his attacks negligible.
That only adds to the “zerker” wave on gearm after all, you barely take any dmg that way and can simply dish out as much dmg as possible.
there should not be skill bugs / lags / delays … looking at you warrior offhand sword blocks that you don’t know if it activated or not so you just press over the button again and get pawned … or mesmer distortion or warrior shield block not blocking and all…
and should not have spell chains from mobs that can’t be dodged when they are on you (yeap, looking at you Alpha aoe + circle cones that come right after the other you don’t even have time to dodge again) especially in a game where dodging is available
If they did learn, then I hope they do both of these at the same time.
You’ll still be able to trivialize most of the content anyway. Alpha hurts barely in his first circle of the cone thingy as zerk anyway. it takes like 5 of them to down a warrior zerk.
Every party that runs CoE or AC alwyas stacks on bosses.
For some reason, stacking removes or nullifies some skills that certain bosses have.
Subjetc Alpha, a true exemple of hard boss, became a walk in a park when we realized that pushing him against a wall and stacking on him makes his attacks negligible.
That only adds to the “zerker” wave on gearm after all, you barely take any dmg that way and can simply dish out as much dmg as possible.
This needs to be adressed.
Actually you’re wrong on all accounts, except for the fact that yes, stacking does nullify some attacks, but your point that it’s letting people run zerk and that they otherwise would not run zerk if stacking wasn’t possible is ridiculous. People were already full meleeing him in zerk before the trend to disable melee assist and stacking inside him became a thing and they either took some of the damage or dodged it (the earth spike attack). He doesn’t live nearly long enough for the spike attack to cause wipes.
Calling him an example of a “hard boss” is a stretch. He has a very predictable attack pattern. Also in path 2 he doesn’t have the spike attack and his other two attacks are not nullified by it, so technically stacking inside doesn’t serve any purpose in that path.
Basically if they removed stacking it’d just make the fight a tad bit slower. Alpha is technically already trivialized by intended game mechanics like the undead tendril that lets you rally when you get downed. You can’t use them while stacking btw most of the time (cause of LoS or downing inside of him will prevent you from hitting tendrils) so you might not have had the opportunity to see that you can in fact come back instantly to the fight after a down on him. “Hard” boss indeed.
- “No tears, please. It’s a waste of good suffering.”
I thought stacking on Alpha was basically what the game designers wanted you to figure out when it came to beating it.
If everyone spreads out and ranges you tend to get punished because the farther away you are the more damage it seems to do. Look at it’s AOE ring patters they are smaller the closer you are to Alpha.
All they would have to do is give it a skill to bomb everyone in a 240 radius to stop the stacking but they didn’t.
I am talking about Alpha in P1 its attacks seem different in P2
I also consider stacking at certain bosses an intended tactic- there are bosses where ranged is prefered (or atleast the range is a lot easier) and there are bosses like Alpha, which force you to go melee range for tactical advantage.
Some people here are confused about mechanics. There are two things that can be meant by stacking, one is just the whole group being in melee very close together, the other in the case of alpha really means stacking inside of him, which is kind of an exploit to avoid his frontal cone attack. That wasn’t really intended by the developers, and is likely something they overlooked because they provide options like disabling melee attack assist but didn’t test what happens when you use these options to your advantage.
This isn’t intended and it’s unrelated to the simple act of being a melee group. Just the result of the incredible lack of testing in this game.
- “No tears, please. It’s a waste of good suffering.”
Can’t stack Lyssa Priest…
Can’t stack the Iron Forgeman
You wouldn’t WANNA stack the Destroyer if he used Firy blast more often….
And you definitely don’t stack Champion Jesters…
Anet already solved this, they just weren’t consistent.
You wouldn’t WANNA stack the Destroyer if he used Firy blast more often….
Actually you’d still very much stack dps in there. This attack can be either dodged or blocked by aegis, and the only reason people get hit is because it’s incredibly rare and unexpected. This boss can be constantly interrupted by the way. Groups with 1 mes / 4 war use mesmer interrupts instead of guard aegis to prevent the tooth attack for example. Making him use the Firy blast more often would only make us take one more interrupt or make the guardian use his elite to refresh aegis for a third one.
The problem with this fight is that he doesn’t have enough HP to make his mechanic matter in any way, shape or form. As long as you have abilities like interrupts and aegis out of cooldown for the fight there is literally nothing that should stop you from non-stop constant dps without even having to care or dodge.
- “No tears, please. It’s a waste of good suffering.”
I’m pretty sure it’s working as intended. For example, the spider boss does in ac doesn’t use her poison aoe if everyone is in melee range. It’s not an exploit to utilize that fact and if they didn’t want people utilizing it then why put it in the game?
I’m pretty sure it’s working as intended. For example, the spider boss does in ac doesn’t use her poison aoe if everyone is in melee range. It’s not an exploit to utilize that fact and if they didn’t want people utilizing it then why put it in the game?
She doesn’t use poison on people that don’t move. If you’re in melee but still moving even a bit you’ll make her use it.
The spider queen example is not an exploit, though, but alpha’s clearly is. They just didn’t predict people to stick inside alpha’s character model and that disabling “melee attack assist” would become so popular. If you play with the default settings the game won’t allow you to stack into alpha without taking damage. His attack is a frontal cone and the developers, lacking imagination, never envisioned that the players would abuse a quality of life feature, an option in the game settings, to completely render the attack useless by not being in range. If you think you were supposed to be inside anything you’re wrong. The very idea that it was intended for you to stay “inside” the spot where the boss’s body is and not take an attack that was absolutely meant to hit people in melee range who don’t dodge is wishful thinking. It doesn’t even make any sense for us to be able to stay “inside” a boss body to begin with.
- “No tears, please. It’s a waste of good suffering.”
I think that several games have had fights where it was designed for you to fight inside the model of the boss for some raids. While I think it is cheesy, I cannot call it an exploit.
The game and real world work differently ( yay dragons and fireballs.) The dissonance this creates in our minds is a part of the fun of playing in them.
I have to disagree with you on this, unless it is a boss that actually stops attacking totally. Otherwise, it is a strategy that players should be free to use.
The problem is, their is no evolving meta in the dungeons/fractals in this game becuase Anet continues to ignore them. Along with the fact that their are very few skill choices.
If you made dungeons the best money in the game you would be surprised how fast things would change, from builds, to how a path was run to professions used. All zerker would not be the way to go when all was said and done.
“If you want to get rid of “zerk” you have to make content
hard enough to make them cry, not just rivers but oceans."
Making him use the Firy blast more often would only make us take one more interrupt or make the guardian use his elite to refresh aegis for a third one.
Well yeah you guys sure…
but you’re totally overselling the average PuG’ers mastery of interrupt timing
I’m pretty sure it’s working as intended. For example, the spider boss does in ac doesn’t use her poison aoe if everyone is in melee range. It’s not an exploit to utilize that fact and if they didn’t want people utilizing it then why put it in the game?
She doesn’t use poison on people that don’t move. If you’re in melee but still moving even a bit you’ll make her use it.
—
Nah, it’s just range based. Try solo her once and stay still at high range or keep moving at melee range (or just watch any solo video).
I guess I should’ve paid more attention sometimes as to what people are doing during this fight because I’ve seen her summon poison in supposedly melee groups. I’ll start paying more attention and get the votekick ready.
- “No tears, please. It’s a waste of good suffering.”
I have to disagree with you on this, unless it is a boss that actually stops attacking totally. Otherwise, it is a strategy that players should be free to use.
The problem is, their is no evolving meta in the dungeons/fractals in this game becuase Anet continues to ignore them. Along with the fact that their are very few skill choices.
If you made dungeons the best money in the game you would be surprised how fast things would change, from builds, to how a path was run to professions used. All zerker would not be the way to go when all was said and done.
I really don’t see why people would start running dungeons inefficiently if we made more money doing them. Dungeons are actually good form of income/time spent because of zerker gear.
I’ve started trying stacking inside more and more bosses to see what else I can avoid. So far I’ve got Legendary Fimbul from HotW p3, stacking inside him lets you completely avoid his cone AoE knock back, not that anyone runs that dungeon anyway. And the avoiding the triple knock back projectile chain that Champion Giants do, like that event that’s always up in the middle of Diessa Plateau.
As for a fix? Make bosses include themselves in their hit boxes, like Alpha’s Teeth of Mordremoth first AoE starts inside his green target circle.
it’s only natural players will go for the path of least resistance where possible.
especially in a game where almost every boss is nothing but a damage sponge and because it’s so boring you may aswell get through it as fast as possible.
Not sure where this is coming from in this thread.
Casual players play games and have fun. They can still learn/teach strategy and follow/lead along with playing well with others.
Bad players are the ones that can’t learn or adapt to changing situations.
This came from the typical “I am a casual player, I ain’t got time to learn or practice stuff for a game” attitude we see when we try tell people certain encounters are not as ridiculous as they think.
And yes, we do have lot’s of cross thread references here.
