Guild Wars 2

This is an idea that was floating around in my head, since i was replaying some older RPGs.

One of the complains about the dungeons is that they are only for 5 player at a time.
This is a problem for greater Guilds or groups of friends who would like to do this content.
If it is not 5 or 10 people, some will always be left out or have to resort to PUGs.

I was remembering back to GW1, where there was a part in Factions, which required two groups to work together to get to the end.
Later there were two engame contents that required 12 people to finish.
Both were instances where the usual size of people (8) was extended for a better experience.

The guild missions so far are a good effort, but since they are open world, they can be to easy after a while and it missing some random factor.

So here is my idea (harkening back to old rpgs etc. )

The Three Way Dungeon
- A dungeon for three groups
- Each group starts at a different point.
- Groups can set off events in other paths
- The paths might meet, the player see each other, but they are not able to meet directly.
- Getting to the end does not require all groups to finish. However, the more finish, the more loot is at the end + an extra boss.
- It is a cooperative race, without being a race

Each group starts at the same time.
As they progress their path they will face events they have to overcome. While these will allow them to progress, they will also influence the other paths.
In the end all groups finaly meet in a room after a little bossfight on their own.
Depending on how many groups are in the dungeon and get to the end in a certain amount of time, you will face a different boss and obtain a different amount of loot.

Why three groups?
Usually we see a split group which helps the other to get to the end. This can accomplished by two allready. However since there should be a “random” factor in it, as the groups are able to influence each other in a positive and negative manner, this would be able to enhance that factor.

Why no direct interaction between the players?
Not all groups proceed through the dungeon at the same time. They do not know where the other group is, aside from the mapchat, if they desire.
However being able to see the other group by running around, maybe seeing them on the other side of big room, with no way over, gives you the assurance that you are not alone. maybe youa re even able to help them with an event by using a lever to put down some water if they fight a fire based enemy.
however you are still on your own.

Not enough groups?
You will be able to finish the dungeon with one group. If not all three paths are filled you will still be able to get to the end.
However if you want to earn the max amount of loot and fight the real form of the final boss, you have to have all three group there to pull a lever.

*What about waiting?
If one group is a lot faster then the others, they would theoretical have to wait.
However to counter that, there could be the ability for the frist group to shut down the hindrances for the other groups so they are able to get to the end easier.
Downside is that they might loose some event loot on the way, but are still able to help at the end.

This would make the whole thing also a bit of an race. to see who can get the most of the whole experience.

Again, this is only a basic idea. One i am willing to extend with more propper examples.
I am not going with a theme or design, but only with the basic idea for what i would think would be a fun and revarding experience for bigger and smaller groups.

If something like this was allready posted, then be free to ignore it.

Great idea, but the scaling needs to be perfect.
Say you cant make up that third group and only 2 groups can go. The two groups should be able to get full reward(like if they had 3 groups). This will minimize waiting and not having to resort to getting a pug group. It is this very problem that goes on with current boss fights(Teq, Wurm, Marionette). Relying on a pug group is very risky.

Would like to see a dungeon shaped like the mission in GW Factions where two parties take different paths to the center.

Chewablesleeptablet.3185:

Great idea, but the scaling needs to be perfect.
Say you cant make up that third group and only 2 groups can go. The two groups should be able to get full reward(like if they had 3 groups). This will minimize waiting and not having to resort to getting a pug group. It is this very problem that goes on with current boss fights(Teq, Wurm, Marionette). Relying on a pug group is very risky.

Lets look at it like this:
- Every group who joins the dungeon gets reward like in every other dungeon (roughly)
- You do not need the other groups. They are optional.
- Just having other groups adds to the reward, however it also forces you to fight a difficulter fight at the end.
- it is a win vs reward thing here.

If there was no other group taking the different paths, then you are still have the same reward as if you would do any other dungeon (specific loot, currency, your daily gold, etc. )

Lets rate it:

positive:
- you can experience the dungeon in a single group
- you do not need all three paths full
- you still get the regular loot you would get in another dungeon
- You still get most of the fights

Negative:
- You do not get the “extra” loot
- You do not fight the “extra” hard Boss.

Your complain is all about loot. However this is not the mainpoint of this concept.
It is about creating a interesting cooperative competative dungeon experience, while catering to bigger and smaller groups.

The other groups are not needed.
Them being there would just enhance the experience (or might tease you, by opening you doors, allowing you to do less events on the way, but that is another matter).

This is more about replayability, group play, raising the cooperation level, while still catering to different groups of people.

You can still do it with PUGs
If you want to be certain to “win”, then you have to take some effort to gather the right people together.
This is somethign that applies to every other content in the game.

On the other hand you are right indeed. it has to be balanced.
That goes for the whole dungeon, as well for the loot.

Unfortunately for us all, Arenanet would have to form a team to focus solely on this/these new dungeon(s). That won’t happen until they understand that nobody likes their living story content.

Kinda sounds like a raid

Maybe, but the current dungeon system does not allow for more then 5 people at a time and for someone who has more then four friends he wants to do stuff with something like that could be the way.

Here are my extended thoughts, with a graphic to visualise things:

Basic Idea
- There are three paths leading to a central chamber.
- Each of the Paths will feature the same amount of events, which allows all of them to get the same amount of reward.
- It is not required to have all three parties in the dungeon to get to the boss and the final chest
- While each party will not directly interact with each other, their presence influences the other parties process.
- Parties do not have to cooperate till the endboss, making it a little race to the finish if they decide to do so.
- Main goal is the end-chest.
- reward and dificulty at the end is based on the number of participants. Max loot and danger for full paths.
- The chances for single or multiple parties at the end (special loot) are the same

Graphic
(rough sketch)
- Each orange field represents an event zone, with the numbers indicating who is at the event (1.1 = Path 1, Event 1)
- Two numbers represent an event in which both parties can help/hinder the other party by finishing their event first.
- The Boss strenght and the acompanied loot is based on how many parties are in the map. There can be one scaling Boss, or one that changes depending on how many paths are cleared.

Example dungeon run
(szenarios depicted here are just an example. They are no fleshed out design)
- All groups start at the same time
- Group 1 reaches event 1.1 first and engages in a fight with a fire element.
- Group 2 reaches event 2.1 as well, is in a waterfilled glas-tunnel above them.
- Group 2 finishes the the fight first, causing it`s enemy to explode. This causes instabilities in the glass-tunnel and some water leaks down on event 1.1.
- Group 1 has now waterfields to draw the enemy in, cleanse the burning efect it aplies and debuff him. (help szenario)

- Group 3 in the meantime cleared their events 3.1 quickly and entered event 3.2. To proceed they have to choose one of two cages to fall down to create a bridge. Each cage holds an different enemy. They fight their choice and proceed.
- Group 1 just finishes event 1.2 but right as they are able to proceed the cage of 3.2 comes down, forcing them into a bonus event. (hindering event)

- Group 3 reaches event 3.3 first and defeats it. On the sides are cannons which fire on event 2.3. Since they can take the event with 4 people, they decide to give some coverfire to Group 2 who just arrives at event 2.3

- Even though they got held up by the cage, Group 1 reaches event 1.4 first and cleares it before the other two reach their 4th.
- They reach the final chamber and are faced with a decision: deactivating all remaining events so the others can proceed smoothly (loosing maybe a champ bag) or they wait for a bit. (Race insentive)
- Group 1 decides to ask on Mapchat which group wants to skip. Group 2 is allready in fight declines, while group 3 is willing to skip.

- All three groups are now at the final chamber.
- As all paths have been cleared they are faced with the final boss, who is balanced to take on 15 people.
- if only two (or one) groups would have been there, the boss would have been weaker or a completly different.
- After their win, all groups can open the chest and get an extra-reward, based on which version of the final Boss they defeated. Think amount of chains destroyed in the recent twistet marionette LS update

I hope this is able to convey my idea a bit better, then my initial post