(edited by Kitsumeo.8754)
[Suggestion] Raid modes
As a non-raider, I’m not sure I agree with the need to add in story specific mode.The raids are specifically designed to be harder content and to make an alternative version takes something away from the originals and leaves less to aspire towards.
If it’s just the story players are concerned with, there are other, less resource intensive ways to achieve this and they’ve partly achieved this organically in the LS3 ep 1 content where you can talk to NPCs who basically sum up the story. They could also do a video recap showing the bosses being fought/killed with a narrative from an NPC you speak to.
If the raid stories were involved and intricate, I’d perhaps swing my opinion, but as I understand it, they are largely flavour enhancers and not even as in depth as dungeon stories are. To dedicate such time and resources to re-scale everything seems a lot of work for what appears to me, even as a non-raider, rather unnecessary.
Your explorable mode is interesting, but I feel would be better converted using the raid training area we have, where more options to set mechanics up could be added to help simulate certain scenarios. I am however open to having an explorable, but empty raid area just to have a look around or re-using the areas in future LS episodes for normal content if appropriate (that would prob need to be factored in the initial design though).
-1
This is a waste of development resources. The raids are not hard at all, basically 10 man dungeons.
One of my 30 accounts (Malediktus.9250).
Sometimes I just wish research fonction work in this forum. This subject was discussed quite à few time already, and nothing new will émerge here. There is almost no story in raids, and make several difficulty modes will be just a waste of dev ressources.
I think LWS3 episodes offer the perfect time to make raid maps part of the open world while still keeping raids active on them. Enter from the raid lobby and it takes you to the pre-LWS3 raid; enter from the map and it takes you post raid open world instance. All they would have to do is adjust content on the non-raid instance to reflect a time after the raids were done. Raiders would be happy and PvEers would be happy. The high level raid specific rewards would be only on the raid instances.
Sometimes I just wish research fonction work in this forum. This subject was discussed quite à few time already, and nothing new will émerge here. There is almost no story in raids, and make several difficulty modes will be just a waste of dev ressources.
+1
A big part of what makes them able to release the content they do on the schedule they have is because there are no raid modes. If they ever added any other modes, suddenly we’d no longer be getting a reasonable pace of content and that would be the new problem of the week. I firmly believe we do not need nor should they make easier / story / other modes for raids. One mode is perfect.
[VZ] Valor Zeal – Stormbluff Isle – Looking for steady, casual-friendly NA raiders!
The raids are not hard at all, basically 10 man dungeons.
There isn’t anything harder than get people to act as a coordinated team. The more people, the harder it is. Even more if you also need time and practice. Raids are hard as hell, because they involve 10 people.
“Only problem with the Engineer is
that it makes every other class in the game boring to play.”
Hawks
that it makes every other class in the game boring to play.”
Hawks
This does need to happen, but, yes, this topic has been raised a few times.
They need to focus on new fractals, new one mode raids, new open world maps, new elite especs to pick, new pvp/wvw maps.
Not waste resource on creating new problems / destroying a working content.
They need to focus on new fractals, new one mode raids, new open world maps, new elite especs to pick, new pvp/wvw maps.
Not waste resource on creating new problems / destroying a working content.
Were you saying the same before Raids were introduced? Do you consider them a waste of developer resources?
Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November
Remember, remember, 15th of November
They need to focus on new fractals, new one mode raids, new open world maps, new elite especs to pick, new pvp/wvw maps.
Not waste resource on creating new problems / destroying a working content.Were you saying the same before Raids were introduced? Do you consider them a waste of developer resources?
I dont consider any new content a waste of resource. Now reworking existing content is a waste.
For example if people started asking for a 10-man fractal mode for current fractals, with the current one being 5-man, this would be a waste.
There isn’t anything harder than get people to act as a coordinated team. The more people, the harder it is. Even more if you also need time and practice. Raids are hard as hell, because they involve 10 people.
10 people is super easy. 20-25 still isn’t difficult, unless you’re trying to do it in a dying game. At good old 40, there it becomes pretty nasty.
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There is no loyalty without betrayal. -Ann Smiley
There is no loyalty without betrayal. -Ann Smiley
How about…no?
I don’t know with what are you comparing, but believe me, it is hard. If it is easy for you, I simply take my hat off and applause you. But it is still near impossible for any common player without a good pre-existent group and lots of time.
How much time do you require to oganize a succesful raid? How do you communicate with them? What do you do to keep them disciplined and alert? Where do you find your teammates? Can you do it with pugs?
“Only problem with the Engineer is
that it makes every other class in the game boring to play.”
Hawks
that it makes every other class in the game boring to play.”
Hawks
Story Mode would of necessity offer little reward, thus having little to no replay value and being a waste of dev resources. The effort to make an explorable version of the raid might be better spent on new fractals. Detaching devs from non-raid content to make tiered raids while keeping a reasonable raid release schedule would of necessity negatively impact the production of non-raid content.
I’ve seen this request before. What I have not seen is sufficient weight of demand to justify either: diverting resources from existing production or from production of other content.
No need to. We have ember bay, bloodstone fen, the current events, hot zones and the fractals for a more casual type of content. Just a few hours back, I was in DS waiting for the meta event. As I randomly killed a few mobs an anomaly appeared just next to me and so I unlocked the achievement to cure myself from these appearances. That is awesome and that is the main attraction of the game to me. And this type of things are possible because raids are not the focus of GW2….Wasting more resources for existing raids is definitely not the way to go. Just my 2c
-1
This is a waste of development resources. The raids are not hard at all, basically 10 man dungeons.
Oh please get over yourself, Raids aren’t a breeze. They are not comparable to a 10 man dungeon. They actually have mechanics to learn and even once you learn them, if you mess up it could cause you a group wipe, where messing up in a dungeon could cause you to go down 50% health….
I do agree it would be a waste of resources, it would take away from Anet releasing Raids as frequent. Raids should be what they are…. raids…..
One difficulty for all.
Easiest way to balance it. No need for any changes to raids, what needs to change is the player base who for whatever reason has a phobia of them, but seemingly wants all the rewards without actually doing them.
-1
This is a waste of development resources. The raids are not hard at all, basically 10 man dungeons.
I do agree with you but you sound like my cousin. As soon as he completed VG, raids were suddenly the easiest thing ever.
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-1
This is a waste of development resources. The raids are not hard at all, basically 10 man dungeons.
I just started raiding and I feel this statement is spot on. Maybe a hard difficulty in which the raid bosses are at thier last stage throughout the fight.
Whoa guys the raids aren’t hard after most of us have had them on farm for the better part of a year and a solid meta has been nailed down that trivialises many of the fights!
Who would have thought.
-1
This is a waste of development resources. The raids are not hard at all, basically 10 man dungeons.
I do agree with you but you sound like my cousin. As soon as he completed VG, raids were suddenly the easiest thing ever.
Not the easiest thing ever, but difficulty I would expect from a well designed dungeon.
One of my 30 accounts (Malediktus.9250).
Oh hey look it’s this thread again
Pretty sure there’s one on the first or second page right now
No, bad idea, eats too many resources, they’re working on making t4 fractals the stepping stone to raids etc. etc. etc. we had all this
I’d be cool with the option to open a cleared raid where no achievement progress can be gained though (so that people can explore and read the stuff lying around) so that you don’t have to find someone who’s cleared
There is a reason this topic keeps getting reposted in various forums (and then all moved to this one) – all by different people.
This is something people want – and it just makes sense.
Oh please get over yourself, Raids aren’t a breeze. They are not comparable to a 10 man dungeon.
Yes, they are and… yes, they are.
6 out of 9 (VG, Gorse, Sloth, Trio, Escort & KC) bosses are super easy for pugs nowadays and the other 3 are only more tricky but also easy doable in pugs if you know what you are doing. Referring to the statement that raids were developed for organized groups in the first place and now being cleared by pugs is definitely a sign of a not so hard difficulty.
Took me 3 runs of the dungeon to get the bug.
Adding even one more mode to raids drastically increases the effort required to maintain and add raids. Raids are intended to be the most difficult content in the game, so let’s leave them that niche — let’s not try to shoehorn them into being something for everyone.
I say this as someone who hasn’t finished a full raid wing.
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”
Raids are intended to be the most difficult content in the game
Are you sure? Some people seem to disagree:
The raids are not hard at all, basically 10 man dungeons.
I find it funny that i see those two arguments used (often even by the same people) interchangeably, depending on what the poster wants to prove.
Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November
Remember, remember, 15th of November
Raids are intended to be the most difficult content in the game
Are you sure? Some people seem to disagree:
The raids are not hard at all, basically 10 man dungeons.
I find it funny that i see those two arguments used (often even by the same people) interchangeably, depending on what the poster wants to prove.
Now if both statements were anything like mutually exclusive. Hint: they aren’t.
Warning! This post may contain traces of irony, sarcasm and peanuts.
There is no loyalty without betrayal. -Ann Smiley
There is no loyalty without betrayal. -Ann Smiley
Raids are intended to be the most difficult content in the game
Are you sure? Some people seem to disagree:
The raids are not hard at all, basically 10 man dungeons.
I find it funny that i see those two arguments used (often even by the same people) interchangeably, depending on what the poster wants to prove.
The “most difficult content in the game” can be 10-man dungeons, can it not?
Would you want to slow down open world content if it needed to be balanced and designed for 3 different difficulty levels? My guess is no.
Replace “raid” with “open world” in your suggestion and tell me how you feel.
We only ask that raids receive fair treatment, and not be delayed for players it’s not designed for.
Edit: Also, sorry to be harsh on OP, but OP gives a wish list, without diagnosing any problem with the status quo
(edited by Absurdo.8309)
There is a reason this topic keeps getting reposted in various forums (and then all moved to this one) – all by different people.
This is something people want – and it just makes sense.
People have repetitively asked for less time-gates, less gold farm, less effort for earning Legendaries in this game since launch.
Doesn’t make it a good or sensible idea.
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Putting Perspective on Zerg Sizes since 2012. Common Suffixes for 40+ include ~Zilla and ~Train
“Seriously, just dodge.”
Putting Perspective on Zerg Sizes since 2012. Common Suffixes for 40+ include ~Zilla and ~Train
“Seriously, just dodge.”
There is a reason this topic keeps getting reposted in various forums (and then all moved to this one) – all by different people.
This is something people want – and it just makes sense.
If people that love raids started creating post “We love raids” we would have much more of that then this, but you know there are people that like to repost to beat a dead horse.
(edited by OnizukaBR.8537)
Would you want to slow down open world content if it needed to be balanced and designed for 3 different difficulty levels? My guess is no.
How many people complained about HoT map difficulty? Imagine in the next expansion we’ll have 3-4 versions of the same map! For all skill levels! When you join a map you pick your difficulty level so the map is as easy as you want it to be!
The “most difficult content in the game” can be 10-man dungeons, can it not?
If it’s “most difficult content in the game”, it cannot really be of dungeon level difficulty. If it’s difficult, it cannot be “not hard at all” (or even, “so easy that anyone could do it”, by citing another of often used arguments).
Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November
Remember, remember, 15th of November
All what they were trying to say is:
Raids are the most difficult PvE content in GW2. Nothing is harder than raids but in the end they are not very hard. Especially not after being available since several months to a year. That’s all.
Or do you know any PvE content that is harder than raids? Because I don’t. They are the most difficult PvE thing in this game but it’s not a difficulty you can’t overcome easily nowadays.
Took me 3 runs of the dungeon to get the bug.
(edited by Vinceman.4572)
There is a reason this topic keeps getting reposted in various forums (and then all moved to this one) – all by different people.
This is something people want – and it just makes sense.
Just because people want something doesn’t make it a good idea. Fortunately, the raid team is savvy enough to know better.
[VZ] Valor Zeal – Stormbluff Isle – Looking for steady, casual-friendly NA raiders!
All what they were trying to say is:
Raids are the most difficult PvE content in GW2. Nothing is harder than raids but in the end they are not very hard. Especially not after being available since several months to a year. That’s all.
Or do you know any PvE content that is harder than raids? Because I don’t. They are the most difficult PvE thing in this game but it’s not a difficulty you can’t overcome easily nowadays.
Yes, because by now there’s tons of guides and pelnty of people who know what to do.
I’m not gonna say that raids in this game are brutally difficult from the get-go because they definitely are not, but if you don’t have them on farm they do pose a nice challenge for a squad, even more so one that is not experienced with the raid. In the case of dungeons or fractals you’d scrape by for the most part, even when not knowing the content.
Raids are intended to be the most difficult content in the game
Are you sure? Some people seem to disagree:
Yes, I’m sure that raids are intended to be the most difficult content in the game because folks from ANet keep saying that they are.
The fact that some people find them too difficult and some find them not difficult enough doesn’t change ANet’s intent.
The raids are not hard at all, basically 10 man dungeons.
I find it funny that i see those two arguments used (often even by the same people) interchangeably, depending on what the poster wants to prove.
In this case, you aren’t seeing the same people posting “those two arguments interchangeably” — you are seeing two different people comment on two different aspects of the same content.
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”
In this case, you aren’t seeing the same people posting “those two arguments interchangeably” — you are seeing two different people comment on two different aspects of the same content.
In this case, maybe…
Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November
Remember, remember, 15th of November
In this case, you aren’t seeing the same people posting “those two arguments interchangeably” — you are seeing two different people comment on two different aspects of the same content.
In this case, maybe…
Find an example where someone has contradicted themself or find another point to argue, preferably one that involves an idea that can stand on its own.
There’s no “maybe” in this case, not in the least. The quotes you took the time to copy don’t prove what you claim. There are two different posters commenting about two different things. Even if it were the same person posting twice, the two quotes do not contradict each other, since they comment on different aspects of raiding.
And I don’t see how you argue that either statement is incorrect: the first is about ANet’s intent, which is well-documented, so you’d have to find a quote from ANet that says that they didn’t intend raids to be among the game’s most challenging content. The second quote describes the opinions of some players as to the actual difficulty, specifically that they don’t think it’s that hard. Since it’s the stated opinion of some players, I don’t understand how you can claim that it’s untrue.
There are decent reasons to criticize the concept of raids being added to GW2 and about the specific implementation. Be nice if you would spend some time discussing that, instead of making up claims against the posters who happen to disagree.
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”
i wanna has story mode too
Eh Not sure about a “story mode”
But I do feel like multiple difficulty lvls would be nice.
- Easy mode: Easier versions of what we have right now (10 man still) for people new to raids or casual people who want to see the story of the raids. (Shouldn’t give raid rewards.)
- Normal mode: what we have right now
- Hard mode: exactly what it sounds like, higher scaled difficulty, maybe add a mechanic to it if possible. (With improved rewards.)
Diffirent difficulties for diffirent people. Ofc, the higher the difficulty, the better the rewards should be.
We already have multiple difficulty. A-net did a perfect job with it without removing all the epicness from raids like you guys want.
Wing 3 – Scort is easy mode ( really easy fight no enrange mechanic ), KC is medium ( just dps on burning phase matter ), and xera is hard mode.
So instead of crying about easy mode, go there do scort on wing 3, if you are not doing it then you just dont want to raid at all so stop asking for stupid things like multiple difficulty on raids.
Eh Not sure about a “story mode”
But I do feel like multiple difficulty lvls would be nice.
- Easy mode: Easier versions of what we have right now (10 man still) for people new to raids or casual people who want to see the story of the raids. (Shouldn’t give raid rewards.)
- Normal mode: what we have right now
- Hard mode: exactly what it sounds like, higher scaled difficulty, maybe add a mechanic to it if possible. (With improved rewards.)
Diffirent difficulties for diffirent people. Ofc, the higher the difficulty, the better the rewards should be.
I think this is the ideal model they will eventually shoot for – regardless of what the lower tier is called. And I do think a harder mode is needed almost as much as the easier mode. It really becomes an issue of dev resources or implementing a system that makes this more organically possible.
And agreed – rewards should be based on the effort needed.