Guild Wars 2

Never in the history of ever have I ever found myself being happy that a ranger is in my party.

I know they said no tank, no heal etc etc… but my god whats the point of rangers? Warriors have shout/banners, Gaurdians are almost a prereq for higher end fractals, Mesmers bring utility, Eles have combo fields and Rangers bring…. an irritating pet that prolongs Jade Maw and cant be stowed.

I would love to make a ranger but I cant find a good PVE reason to make one….

Someone please inspire me to make a Ranger because I really loved Rangers in Gw1 and now I’m conflicted =(

Frost spirit and spotter are reason enough. I hate having pug rangers in a group but if people know how to play them then they are valuable.

Adam.4103:

but if people know how to play them then they are valuable.

Unfortunately, finding such a ranger is almost like finding a needle in a haystack.

Every profession that is not warrior or guardian receives hate from some pugs. It can be annoying to have a gs camping mesmer when the group is stacking to kill mobs, a shortbow thief and so on. But rangers are more bullied because of the “bearbow” jokes.

Rangers have high hp pool making then very tanky almost like warriors with medium armor, they have one reflection skill with 25 secs cooldown, they have a healing skill that makes a water field and cures conditions on allies on each pulse (so if you are using a warhon you can blast it to get even more heals for your allies),

The problem is that the only melee weapon they have with good dps makes then rooted in place and doesnt cleave much because of that, and in this game where one of the best things from the gameplay is being able to run while shooting/casting/swinging a sword that makes it really a pain to get used to, to make things worse the sword auto atack also has a jump, which can be annoying if you are near an edge or you need to stay in one place (like those braziers in cof p1).

Without the sword auto atack issues ranger would be an awesome class to play.

Casmurro.9046:

Every profession that is not warrior or guardian receives hate from some pugs. It can be annoying to have a gs camping mesmer when the group is stacking to kill mobs, a shortbow thief and so on. But rangers are more bullied because of the “bearbow” jokes.

And what caused those bearbow jokes? The incredibly high number of longbow-camping, bear-using, knockbacking noobs that play this class. In my experience, the typical ranger-PUG is worse than everything else.

I usually go S/W and switch between GS and LB depending on the situation. Once you become so familiar with the ranger its actually a fun class to play. Most ppl hate rangers since rangers are exceptionally hard to learn to play.I’m a believer of skill not a believer of classes, i’m so familiar with my ranger that i rarely die in PvE (and even in WvW) unless I’m being surround by 5+ Vet Mobs or Sheer amounts of AoE. Its very hard to die in PvE situations as the ranger pet heal on down function is pretty OP. Also I believe it is possible to stow the pet as long as you put it flee mode.

skyhawk.5149:

I usually go S/W and switch between GS and LB depending on the situation. Once you become so familiar with the ranger its actually a fun class to play. Most ppl hate rangers since rangers are exceptionally hard to learn to play.I’m a believer of skill not a believer of classes, i’m so familiar with my ranger that i rarely die in PvE (and even in WvW) unless I’m being surround by 5+ Vet Mobs or Sheer amounts of AoE. Its very hard to die in PvE situations as the ranger pet heal on down function is pretty OP. Also I believe it is possible to stow the pet as long as you put it flee mode.

No the reason I hate most rangers is because they don’t even try to play better. Camping longbow at 1500 range is inexcusable in any situation.

skyhawk.5149:

I usually go S/W and switch between GS and LB depending on the situation. Once you become so familiar with the ranger its actually a fun class to play. Most ppl hate rangers since rangers are exceptionally hard to learn to play.I’m a believer of skill not a believer of classes, i’m so familiar with my ranger that i rarely die in PvE (and even in WvW) unless I’m being surround by 5+ Vet Mobs or Sheer amounts of AoE. Its very hard to die in PvE situations as the ranger pet heal on down function is pretty OP. Also I believe it is possible to stow the pet as long as you put it flee mode.

If i remember correctly you can’t perma-stow the pets, even if they are on peaceful mode, once you get hit by a mob the pet automatically pops up. So in the TA f/u final boss for example the pet was a problem since it can’t dodge the atacks that make more spiders spawn.

Adam.4103:

skyhawk.5149:

I usually go S/W and switch between GS and LB depending on the situation. Once you become so familiar with the ranger its actually a fun class to play. Most ppl hate rangers since rangers are exceptionally hard to learn to play.I’m a believer of skill not a believer of classes, i’m so familiar with my ranger that i rarely die in PvE (and even in WvW) unless I’m being surround by 5+ Vet Mobs or Sheer amounts of AoE. Its very hard to die in PvE situations as the ranger pet heal on down function is pretty OP. Also I believe it is possible to stow the pet as long as you put it flee mode.

No the reason I hate most rangers is because they don’t even try to play better. Camping longbow at 1500 range is inexcusable in any situation.

Actrually it is excusable when you do TA. When I did TA F/U a while back my group consisted of 3rangers. We all sat at 1.5k range and pretty much soloed the boss. Our war and guard just provided additional boons and that was about it. Also even if the pet does pop up it won’t go running to atk a mob if you have it on peaceful mode.

frost spirit and spotter are amazing buffs... but in all the PUGs I have done I’ve only seen such rangers ~2 or so times.

Rangers are good for frost spirit and spotter, the fact that the average ranger is bad is due to pugs just being terrible in general, there’s a scrub archetype for every single class in the game, examples being gs mesmers, mace/shield cleric guards, shout heal warriors and so forth, so it’s not just a ranger issue.

AFAIK, JP might be the only person who likes the sword leap on auto.

I refuse to play ranger if I have to wait 1-2 seconds to dodge. That completely destroys the gameplay.

Not to mention dumb as rock pet AI system and the inability of the devs to even try to fix it.

Taku.6352:

Not to mention dumb as rock pet AI system and the inability of the devs to even try to fix it.

Agreed. I could deal with that pet AI though. It’s just the darn root on the sword auto attack. I still can’t believe somebody thinks that’s a good idea.

JMar.3254:

Taku.6352:

Not to mention dumb as rock pet AI system and the inability of the devs to even try to fix it.

Agreed. I could deal with that pet AI though. It’s just the darn root on the sword auto attack. I still can’t believe somebody thinks that’s a good idea.

I think PvPers do, probably cause it’s a hella useful (or annoying ) feature when your target is running around kiting your hits like a crazy bunny.

And we all know where Anet runs the balancing.

So, i fear that auto won’t be changed anytime soon, if it will be changed at all.

colesy.8490:

Rangers are good for frost spirit and spotter, the fact that the average ranger is bad is due to pugs just being terrible in general, there’s a scrub archetype for every single class in the game, examples being gs mesmers, mace/shield cleric guards, shout heal warriors and so forth, so it’s not just a ranger issue.

Shout Heal warriors and Mace Shield Gaurdians are utility builds that actually work…. u can hardly call them scrub builds.

Just make a warrior and name him “Ranger” and use the longbow on weapon swap .

Obsidyth.1798:

colesy.8490:

Rangers are good for frost spirit and spotter, the fact that the average ranger is bad is due to pugs just being terrible in general, there’s a scrub archetype for every single class in the game, examples being gs mesmers, mace/shield cleric guards, shout heal warriors and so forth, so it’s not just a ranger issue.

Shout Heal warriors and Mace Shield Gaurdians are utility builds that actually work…. u can hardly call them scrub builds.

rofl, they are trash builds that don’t work and are nothing more than a burden on the team. they are the epitome of scrub builds.

Obsidyth.1798:

colesy.8490:

Rangers are good for frost spirit and spotter, the fact that the average ranger is bad is due to pugs just being terrible in general, there’s a scrub archetype for every single class in the game, examples being gs mesmers, mace/shield cleric guards, shout heal warriors and so forth, so it’s not just a ranger issue.

Shout Heal warriors and Mace Shield Gaurdians are utility builds that actually work…. u can hardly call them scrub builds.

Define “work”

Rangers are a slight change of their sword auto attack away from being the second most popular and important dungeon class.

Nike Porphyrogenita.8137:

Rangers are a slight change of their sword auto attack away from being the second most popular and important dungeon class.

I don’t really know if you’re being sarcastic or not, but I do feel this way. Maybe not “important” but I would definitely play mine way more (anything is more than storage toon)

Sadly…

Main-hand sword
I just want to clarify for good that main hand sword is currently working as intended. All movement skills cannot be interrupted by dodging and this is currently intentional. It has a very specific play style, and I would like it to remain. I understand that rangers want a one handed melee option that is more mobile, but that will have to wait, as I know there are a mix of players who also like how this weapon plays and I do not want to take away one of the more unique playstyles that we have and replace it with something that is fairly common.

Thanks,

Jon

Taku.6352:

Sadly…

Main-hand sword
I just want to clarify for good that main hand sword is currently working as intended. All movement skills cannot be interrupted by dodging and this is currently intentional. It has a very specific play style, and I would like it to remain. I understand that rangers want a one handed melee option that is more mobile, but that will have to wait, as I know there are a mix of players who also like how this weapon plays and I do not want to take away one of the more unique playstyles that we have and replace it with something that is fairly common.

Thanks,

Jon

Yeah, that sucks. Well, they should at least give to rangers the option to use dagger main hand, that would be awesome to use against bosses that use too much 1 shot aoe atacks.

Obsidyth.1798:

colesy.8490:

Rangers are good for frost spirit and spotter, the fact that the average ranger is bad is due to pugs just being terrible in general, there’s a scrub archetype for every single class in the game, examples being gs mesmers, mace/shield cleric guards, shout heal warriors and so forth, so it’s not just a ranger issue.

Shout Heal warriors and Mace Shield Gaurdians are utility builds that actually work…. u can hardly call them scrub builds.

They work about as well as your average bearbow ranger. If heals were ever required for content, an experienced group would just use water fields and blast finishers, and if you assume a group composition of ele, guardian and warriors, that’s ele blasts, guardian hammer 2, focus 5 and warrior warhorn 5 for a massive burst heal. Shout heals and regen are just plain bad though since it means using low dps weapons, gear and most likely a terrible build giving up damage modifiers like AH builds since that’s the mentality of mace/shield cleric bads.

guanlongwucaii.3162:

Obsidyth.1798:

colesy.8490:

Rangers are good for frost spirit and spotter, the fact that the average ranger is bad is due to pugs just being terrible in general, there’s a scrub archetype for every single class in the game, examples being gs mesmers, mace/shield cleric guards, shout heal warriors and so forth, so it’s not just a ranger issue.

Shout Heal warriors and Mace Shield Gaurdians are utility builds that actually work…. u can hardly call them scrub builds.

rofl, they are trash builds that don’t work and are nothing more than a burden on the team. they are the epitome of scrub builds.

A burden? So a build that provides mobile buffs, heals and condition removal with runes of soldier is bad on warriors and it makes the team weaker? As opposed to a highly selifsh zerker build that nearly every man and his dog has?

Also a heavily supportive gaurdian with mace shield allows for teams to facecheck certain bosses… u can’t just kitten on any build that has any form of supportive tendencies just because damage is sacrificed.

I prefer balanced builds to be honest but I run dungeons with puggs and the extra heals and utility help things go smoothly.

You see, pugs hate rangers calling then useless but they think AH clerics guardians are awesome. I remember back in the day when shout heal with soldiers warriors used to be the meta, a fight against Kholer would last for almost 10 minutes if the group didn’t wipe.

colesy.8490:

Obsidyth.1798:

colesy.8490:

Rangers are good for frost spirit and spotter, the fact that the average ranger is bad is due to pugs just being terrible in general, there’s a scrub archetype for every single class in the game, examples being gs mesmers, mace/shield cleric guards, shout heal warriors and so forth, so it’s not just a ranger issue.

Shout Heal warriors and Mace Shield Gaurdians are utility builds that actually work…. u can hardly call them scrub builds.

They work about as well as your average bearbow ranger. If heals were ever required for content, an experienced group would just use water fields and blast finishers, and if you assume a group composition of ele, guardian and warriors, that’s ele blasts, guardian hammer 2, focus 5 and warrior warhorn 5 for a massive burst heal. Shout heals and regen are just plain bad though since it means using low dps weapons, gear and most likely a terrible build giving up damage modifiers like AH builds since that’s the mentality of mace/shield cleric bads.

Thats the key word…. an “experienced” group. Which you can’t rely on with pugs.
Pretty much every dungeon can be zerked if ppl know how to dodge… so blasting through water fields is not even required in normal dungeons. In higher end fractals it starts coming into play but theres no pve content atm that REALLY needs any combo finishers..

I agree with Obsdyth . Those zerkers are ruining the party, they could heal with a balanced cleric build but they are so selfish and think only about dmg . Obsdyth , dont listen to what those elitists say , make a ranger and suport your party with the brown bear for diffuclt bosses and use a mix of dire set too help with conditions and a cleric accessories to support with heals . Berserker is extremly bad , no heals and boom party wipes . If I was you I would just kick them immediatly , they will slow down the party with a selfish bersernoob build.

^ Thats true, a brown bear can tank much more than a shout heal warrior, and pets can have self regeneration when traited ^^

You really should make a ranger Obsidyth.

a t s e.9614:

I agree with Obsdyth . Those zerkers are ruining the party, they could heal with a balanced cleric build but they are so selfish and think only about dmg . Obsdyth , dont listen to what those elitists say , make a ranger and suport your party with the brown bear for diffuclt bosses and use a mix of dire set too help with conditions and a cleric accessories to support with heals . Berserker is extremly bad , no heals and boom party wipes . If I was you I would just kick them immediatly , they will slow down the party with a selfish bersernoob build.

Go on…

Obsidyth.1798:

guanlongwucaii.3162:

Obsidyth.1798:

colesy.8490:

Rangers are good for frost spirit and spotter, the fact that the average ranger is bad is due to pugs just being terrible in general, there’s a scrub archetype for every single class in the game, examples being gs mesmers, mace/shield cleric guards, shout heal warriors and so forth, so it’s not just a ranger issue.

Shout Heal warriors and Mace Shield Gaurdians are utility builds that actually work…. u can hardly call them scrub builds.

rofl, they are trash builds that don’t work and are nothing more than a burden on the team. they are the epitome of scrub builds.

A burden? So a build that provides mobile buffs, heals and condition removal with runes of soldier is bad on warriors and it makes the team weaker? As opposed to a highly selifsh zerker build that nearly every man and his dog has?

Yes. “Yes” is the correct answer to all your questions. Do you want a longer explanation, or is ‘yes’ good enough?

im a ranger running SB and GS with knights armor and zerk trinkets. i have lb if i ever need 1 but honestly its the WORST weapon we have imo. i use cats for crit damage since they die i seconds might as well get another 5k damage done while i can. im more a tanky build and grab a lot of the aggro on most occasions. i do hate the fact that rangers get blasted so much but at the same time im glad its not my build thats getting thrashed. ive ran every dungeon and lvl 28 fractals with little to no problems so far. and personally i drop faster on my guardian than i do my ranger.

The Spotter-Spirit build is really strong, and has so many dodges it’s absurd. It has nothing to do with the class, it’s all the players themselves.;

I can kind of get why you don’t see too much Frost Spirit.
Spirits got alot of love recently from cooldown reductions to health upgrades and that brought down their skill floor considerably, but the practice of using them does work best when you have fore knowledge of the fights and going down nature magic to get more dps is super unintuitive. It’s way more accessible than before, but, still not exactly newbie friendly stuff, there.

Spotter however, is easy sauce to access build-wise and easy to use effectively. (almost brainless, frankly). I can’t imagine why people don’t use Spotter.

A ranger joined my AC pub this morning. He had Spotter, S/W + S/A, a Stalker and a Red Moa, and was wearing Berserker gear. Some dude gave him crap for being a ranger, so what did I do? I thanked him for being a GOOD ranger, and kicked the dude who flamed him based on his class.

Seriously, Rangers are great when played right. I’d bring a good player using one every time. You can thank Brazil and Nike and the good guys of [DnT] for shedding some light on that with hard numerical evidence and solid play videos.

Vox Hollow.2736:

Spotter however, is easy sauce to access build-wise and easy to use effectively. (almost brainless, frankly). I can’t imagine why people don’t use Spotter.

Because I need Piercing Arrows and Eagle Eye to accompany me and my pet bear obvs!

I do love the recent improvements to spirits though, makes it much easier to maintain Frost Spirit.

constant fury and +5-6 might + the (until december) good survivability (the more you stay alive, the more you can support) aren’t good enough for you?

k.

rangers lack in DPS a bit, tho.

Obsidyth.1798:

guanlongwucaii.3162:

Obsidyth.1798:

colesy.8490:

Rangers are good for frost spirit and spotter, the fact that the average ranger is bad is due to pugs just being terrible in general, there’s a scrub archetype for every single class in the game, examples being gs mesmers, mace/shield cleric guards, shout heal warriors and so forth, so it’s not just a ranger issue.

Shout Heal warriors and Mace Shield Gaurdians are utility builds that actually work…. u can hardly call them scrub builds.

rofl, they are trash builds that don’t work and are nothing more than a burden on the team. they are the epitome of scrub builds.

A burden? So a build that provides mobile buffs, heals and condition removal with runes of soldier is bad on warriors and it makes the team weaker? As opposed to a highly selifsh zerker build that nearly every man and his dog has?

Also a heavily supportive gaurdian with mace shield allows for teams to facecheck certain bosses… u can’t just kitten on any build that has any form of supportive tendencies just because damage is sacrificed.

I prefer balanced builds to be honest but I run dungeons with puggs and the extra heals and utility help things go smoothly.

Oh boy this argument again, please tell me more about how epic your tanking skills are. I bet you don’t even have to dodge at Lupi, so jelly.
If dealing damage isn’t your thing then please don’t play Ranger, those unique damage boosters are the only reason to take one. And we really, really, don’t need more bearbows out there.

A well-played ranger can be as useful as a warrior in terms of offensive support in dungeons. The difference is that they have a higher skill curve to play effectively.

Taku.6352:

Sadly…

Main-hand sword
I just want to clarify for good that main hand sword is currently working as intended. All movement skills cannot be interrupted by dodging and this is currently intentional. It has a very specific play style, and I would like it to remain. I understand that rangers want a one handed melee option that is more mobile, but that will have to wait, as I know there are a mix of players who also like how this weapon plays and I do not want to take away one of the more unique playstyles that we have and replace it with something that is fairly common.

Thanks,

Jon

Regardless, it is an awesome weapon as-is, even without disabling auto-attack. It may not be a playstyle for 100% Rangers, but it still is a great melee weapon. In fact I am one of the players who likes sword the way it is-just annoying the few times it can take you off a ledge even while being careful.

Star Ace.5207:

Taku.6352:

Sadly…

Main-hand sword
I just want to clarify for good that main hand sword is currently working as intended. All movement skills cannot be interrupted by dodging and this is currently intentional. It has a very specific play style, and I would like it to remain. I understand that rangers want a one handed melee option that is more mobile, but that will have to wait, as I know there are a mix of players who also like how this weapon plays and I do not want to take away one of the more unique playstyles that we have and replace it with something that is fairly common.

Thanks,

Jon

Regardless, it is an awesome weapon as-is, even without disabling auto-attack. It may not be a playstyle for 100% Rangers, but it still is a great melee weapon. In fact I am one of the players who likes sword the way it is-just annoying the few times it can take you off a ledge even while being careful.

I play every class in GW2 (same as in most other MMOs / RPGs).

Ranger isn’t my favourite, and I think it could definitely use a few more support abilities (I mean different ones, to add versatility, not just buffing the ones they have), but it’s perfectly possible for a ranger to do (more than) his or her share in a dungeon or group event.

People who complain about rangers “not stacking” are kind of missing the point. The design problem there is that GW2’s combat system is flawed, and (unrealistically) benefits players who just stand in a corner blindly spamming their abilities. If boss AI / AoE mechanics were a bit more realistic, players would benefit from moving around and alternating ranged and melee attacks (as originally intended), and the ranger’s LB distance bonus wouldn’t be wasted. Anyway, rangers can use melee and short-range weapons too, so that’s not really an issue (I mean, it is an issue about bad encounter design, but not about rangers specifically).

The pet system definitely needs to be improved. It’s not just a matter of AI, it’s a matter of control as a whole (you can’t even prevent a pet from popping out if you take damage, this is just moronic in a game released in 2012), both for rangers and other classes (necromancer pets actually tend to cause more problems than ranger pets, because there is even less control over them).

I don’t find that people who play rangers are, on average, any worse than other classes. I have far more warriors in my block list than rangers, for example (but that’s probably just because there are more warriors as a whole). People who play a single class are nearly always bad players, because they don’t understand how their actions affect others, and people who play three classes or more are nearly always competent at all of them.

TL;DR: Give rangers more support abilities and more control over their pets, and fix boss encounters so that stacking and spamming isn’t so beneficial.

Meh, another one to add to the list of clueless souls…
THANKYOUSOMUCH OXXY that picture is awesome and expresses exactly how I feel about it <.<
Who the hell would like… nevermind.
I guess that if you’re tanky enough you don’t need to dodge when you want to, right??
AHAHAHAHA.

Account.9832:

TL;DR: Give rangers more support abilities and more control over their pets, and fix boss encounters so that stacking and spamming isn’t so beneficial.

The thing is: Stacking has nothing to do with “spamming”.

Every class in this game works like this on PvE:

• Most of any DPS comes from spamming auto attacks
• #2~5 and utlities/elite slots are used to spike up their damage and/or provide utility

If stacking were not possible for whatever reason you can think of, this core gameplay wouldn’t change a bit and you’d still see “spamming” regardless. But please, note that what you call “spamming” is either bad play or not spamming at all. So… yeah i don’t agree with anything you’ve said aside from improvements on pets (tbh i’d be more than happy if my pets dodged with me somehow).

On the ranger topic, i really enjoy playing mine, it is pretty good to play something that works on an “if you screw your kitten up you’re dead” basis, so everytime i notice a tiny bit of improvement on my gameplay it feels rewarding. I’m yet to master how to keep my pets up at tazza though.

@Sade
You’re welcome.

Oxxy.7068:

So… yeah i don’t agree with anything you’ve said

If you don’t understand there’s a significant difference in skill requirement between standing still in a corner casting everything in the same spot, and having to move around, aim abilities, pay attention to what other party members are doing, and coordinating with them, then… I’m glad we disagree.

Account.9832:

Oxxy.7068:

So… yeah i don’t agree with anything you’ve said

If you don’t understand there’s a significant difference in skill requirement between standing still in a corner casting everything in the same spot, and having to move around, aim abilities, pay attention to what other party members are doing, and coordinating with them, then… I’m glad we disagree.

Guess you completely missed my point. Good god people are really awful at thinking.

Let me try it this way:
While stacking i’m paying attention to the following things:

• Bosses tells in order to aegis/wor/dodge
• My group’s condition/boons bar
• My group’s HP
• Cooldowns
• Any useful fields (i.e.: water, fire and in some cases dark)

If stacking didn’t exist, i’d still be paying attention to everything i’ve just said.
I know this insn’t your idea of epic_combat_1337 but that’s how it is.

Oxxy.7068:

stacking or not i’d be paying attention to the exact same things.

I guess you’re not familiar with the concept of “space” (spell aiming, using the room geometry to block spells, kiting, keeping track of the relative position of party members and effects visible on those party members – as opposed to icons in the UI – and so on).

And considering many boss fights are doable simply by everyone standing on the “right spot” and pressing random buttons, the fact that you’re “paying attention” to those things (none of which require any spatial awareness) isn’t even relevant. You don’t have to pay attention – that’s exactly the problem (or, to some people, the boon, because they wouldn’t be able to do it any other way).

Account.9832:

I guess you’re not familiar with the concept of “space” (spell aiming, relative position of party members, effects visible on your party mates – as opposed to icons in the UI – and so on).

Are you one of these weirdos who wants to play a completely different game instead of GW2?

Account.9832:

And considering many boss fights are doable simply by everyone standing on the “right spot” and pressing random buttons, the fact that you’re “paying attention” to those things isn’t even relevant.

I can’t remember a single fight that requires me to stack in a place to make it doable, and by stack i mean… really stack, not melee.

Account.9832:

You don’t have to pay attention – that’s exactly the problem (or, to some people, the boon, because they wouldn’t be able to do it any other way).

I never said i had to. Everyone in these forums knows that hard PvE content in this game is nothing but self imposed challenges.

Oxxy.7068:

Account.9832:

I guess you’re not familiar with the concept of “space” (spell aiming, relative position of party members, effects visible on your party mates – as opposed to icons in the UI – and so on).

Are you one of these weirdos who wants to play a completely different game instead of GW2?

I’m one of those weirdos (like Arena Net’s president, Mike O’Brien) who thinks you should play the game and not the interface.

Account.9832:

Oxxy.7068:

Account.9832:

I guess you’re not familiar with the concept of “space” (spell aiming, relative position of party members, effects visible on your party mates – as opposed to icons in the UI – and so on).

Are you one of these weirdos who wants to play a completely different game instead of GW2?

I’m one of those weirdos (like Arena Net’s president, Mike O’Brien) who thinks you should play the game and not the interface.

[Citation needed]