Guild Wars 2

Okay so i was looking at forums and at the game to see what was going on with thieves not being accepted in raids due to said low dps so i went in ( i cleared first boss with pugs) and :

Enjoy the screenshot !

Note : This can happen once every 48 seconds but still…

What ability are you using there?

UnbentMars.9126:

What ability are you using there?

Pistol whip. It’s a big number because it’s a cumulative of every swipe that attack deals. It looks impressive, but that’s because it takes so long to complete the full animation.

This is pretty much the same thing that warriors did when the game came out. They posted screenshots of hundred blades saying “WOW LOOK AT MY DPS!”, but as impressive as one single number looks, it really means nothing for actual dps.

No assassins signet for the ending half. RIP. Redo required. Or below 50% HP. Me no like. : P

And no offense showing a high hitting skill isn’t going to show anything. The thing is, thief damage is alright, but it doesn’t really provide much other than that.

You are missing the point here. Thief damage is high, that is correct. But he offers nothing for the rest of the group. Thief is a selfish class as it stands now.

And Vale Guardian is doable with exotic gear, so any class may be accepted here. I’d like to see how you do as a thief on Gorseval. With all your single target damage skills.

Sigh. Daredevil is the highest damage option in the game on goreseval. If you have the ps berserker providing might and a herald for fury, daredevil staff is strictly speaking the highest damage class to bring to the fight. Dodge staff 2 and auto chain is incredibly potent. Vault for mobility and evade as needed.

Urosh Uchiha.9732:

You are missing the point here. Thief damage is high, that is correct. But he offers nothing for the rest of the group. Thief is a selfish class as it stands now.

And Vale Guardian is doable with exotic gear, so any class may be accepted here. I’d like to see how you do as a thief on Gorseval. With all your single target damage skills.

It doesn’t change the fact that a lot of group did all 3 bosses with thiefs. I killed the Vale Guardian with 2 of thems. Excluding them just because they are thiefs won’t help you finish the raid tbh. But hey, pug have all the rights in the world to exclude whoever they want.

I am sure one can actually finish the raid with a couple of thieves. Many spots are just filled with full damage builds (not including condition damage focused ones).
Thieves can spam short bow blasts on fields for “support” even or do some other plays.

You need to consider how people think about raids first, though:
-People want to finish content they haven’t mastered yet
-They want to finish it well and they don’t want to take chances
-They much rather expect the worst of you and instead invite someone with easier or just more support while having equal damage
-They will always prefer groups which won’t need them to communicate or have as much team work
-They will use what is “supposed” to be needed if they aren’t sure themselves
-They will exclude those who are “supposed” to be useless
-Etc.

Just think how it used to be with dungeons if you find this strange:
-People didn’t take a blast group if they could have a PS warrior
-They didn’t take an engineer for stealth if there was thief to take
-They would have never attempted a run without a Frost Bow
-Etc.
Raids lead to the same mentality times ten.

That should answer the “why” question.

Thief is not bad, its just not optimal.

Henry.5713:

I am sure one can actually finish the raid with a couple of thieves. Many spots are just filled with full damage builds (not including condition damage focused ones).
Thieves can spam short bow blasts on fields for “support” even or do some other plays.

You need to consider how people think about raids first, though:
-People want to finish content they haven’t mastered yet
-They want to finish it well and they don’t want to take chances
-They much rather expect the worst of you and instead invite someone with easier or just more support while having equal damage
-They will always prefer groups which won’t need them to communicate or have as much team work
-They will use what is “supposed” to be needed if they aren’t sure themselves
-They will exclude those who are “supposed” to be useless
-Etc.

Just think how it used to be with dungeons if you find this strange:
-People didn’t take a blast group if they could have a PS warrior
-They didn’t take an engineer for stealth if there was thief to take
-They would have never attempted a run without a Frost Bow
-Etc.
Raids lead to the same mentality times ten.

That should answer the “why” question.

That would be true if we knew what is best or not yet. Which we don’t. People heard rumours or saw a couple of video, or worth go check metabattle raid section (facepalm) and think they have an idea of what is good or bad. Why thief would be less efficient for the first fight as the 2 last spots for dps than other profession?

I would understand that you don’t want a thief when you don’t have your PS Warrior, 2 Herald for buff, your chronomancer, druid, condi engineer or tank. But once those sport are filled there is still 1-2 spot to fill and there is very reason to exclude a thief for those spot just because it’s a thief.

Thaddeus.4891:

Henry.5713:

I am sure one can actually finish the raid with a couple of thieves. Many spots are just filled with full damage builds (not including condition damage focused ones).
Thieves can spam short bow blasts on fields for “support” even or do some other plays.

You need to consider how people think about raids first, though:
-People want to finish content they haven’t mastered yet
-They want to finish it well and they don’t want to take chances
-They much rather expect the worst of you and instead invite someone with easier or just more support while having equal damage
-They will always prefer groups which won’t need them to communicate or have as much team work
-They will use what is “supposed” to be needed if they aren’t sure themselves
-They will exclude those who are “supposed” to be useless
-Etc.

Just think how it used to be with dungeons if you find this strange:
-People didn’t take a blast group if they could have a PS warrior
-They didn’t take an engineer for stealth if there was thief to take
-They would have never attempted a run without a Frost Bow
-Etc.
Raids lead to the same mentality times ten.

That should answer the “why” question.

That would be true if we knew what is best or not yet. Which we don’t. People heard rumours or saw a couple of video, or worth go check metabattle raid section (facepalm) and think they have an idea of what is good or bad. Why thief would be less efficient for the first fight as the 2 last spots for dps than other profession?

I would understand that you don’t want a thief when you don’t have your PS Warrior, 2 Herald for buff, your chronomancer, druid, condi engineer or tank. But once those sport are filled there is still 1-2 spot to fill and there is very reason to exclude a thief for those spot just because it’s a thief.

Especially considering that, with all of those roles filled as you mentioned, Daredevil berserker staff thief running double signets is the “realistically and consistently achievable” highest damage role you could slot in the melee group.

Once people catch on they will be looking for Daredevils to fill those last slots instead of “lolweneemoreHeraldsItheyarebestdps.” Good ones who can maintain their Scholar buff (hint, Invigorating Precision is worth losing +250 Ferocity imo, one vault heals you for 1/3 of your health or more).

Now, I’ll admit it DOES take more effort and skill to dps on Daredevil so the chance of getting a crappy one is way higher, but its does deal enough damage over its competitors to be chosen significantly.

Does this daredevil build have one or more cc skills?

Swiftwynd.1685:

Sigh. Daredevil is the highest damage option in the game on goreseval. If you have the ps berserker providing might and a herald for fury, daredevil staff is strictly speaking the highest damage class to bring to the fight. Dodge staff 2 and auto chain is incredibly potent. Vault for mobility and evade as needed.

I can believe it in terms of power dps, but I doubt it would outperform condi warrior since the large hitbox is also a great benefit to that build.

Wahaha.7938:

Does this daredevil build have one or more cc skills?

Soft CC: weakness (Weaking Charge), immobilize every 20 secs below 50% mob HP (with Panic Strike, switched to revelead training for Gorseval thou due to the revelead debuff available)
Hard CC: 2 secs stun on 20 secs CD (Palm Strike), 2 secs daze + launch on 40 secs CD (Impact Strike + Uppercut)

There could be cripple and blind too, but they’re not in the dps rotation so I wouldn’t count them in.

Swiftwynd.1685:

Thaddeus.4891:

Henry.5713:

I am sure one can actually finish the raid with a couple of thieves. Many spots are just filled with full damage builds (not including condition damage focused ones).
Thieves can spam short bow blasts on fields for “support” even or do some other plays.

You need to consider how people think about raids first, though:
-People want to finish content they haven’t mastered yet
-They want to finish it well and they don’t want to take chances
-They much rather expect the worst of you and instead invite someone with easier or just more support while having equal damage
-They will always prefer groups which won’t need them to communicate or have as much team work
-They will use what is “supposed” to be needed if they aren’t sure themselves
-They will exclude those who are “supposed” to be useless
-Etc.

Just think how it used to be with dungeons if you find this strange:
-People didn’t take a blast group if they could have a PS warrior
-They didn’t take an engineer for stealth if there was thief to take
-They would have never attempted a run without a Frost Bow
-Etc.
Raids lead to the same mentality times ten.

That should answer the “why” question.

That would be true if we knew what is best or not yet. Which we don’t. People heard rumours or saw a couple of video, or worth go check metabattle raid section (facepalm) and think they have an idea of what is good or bad. Why thief would be less efficient for the first fight as the 2 last spots for dps than other profession?

I would understand that you don’t want a thief when you don’t have your PS Warrior, 2 Herald for buff, your chronomancer, druid, condi engineer or tank. But once those sport are filled there is still 1-2 spot to fill and there is very reason to exclude a thief for those spot just because it’s a thief.

Especially considering that, with all of those roles filled as you mentioned, Daredevil berserker staff thief running double signets is the “realistically and consistently achievable” highest damage role you could slot in the melee group.

Once people catch on they will be looking for Daredevils to fill those last slots instead of “lolweneemoreHeraldsItheyarebestdps.” Good ones who can maintain their Scholar buff (hint, Invigorating Precision is worth losing +250 Ferocity imo, one vault heals you for 1/3 of your health or more).

Now, I’ll admit it DOES take more effort and skill to dps on Daredevil so the chance of getting a crappy one is way higher, but its does deal enough damage over its competitors to be chosen significantly.

While it is very important to maintain Scholar buff (and Flawless Strike, AND Keen Observer) for that total of 10% damage, 7% crit damage, and 5% crit chance, you still shouldn’t ever drop No Quarter for Invigorating Precision.(unless you’re tanking, but that’s a whole different story) 250 ferocity is about 17% crit damage, which is a very large amount. Even without Invigorating Precision, it is definitely still possible to maintain your Scholars, considering how great of a heal Signet of Malice is, and how Weakening Charge procs it three times. Even if you’re only maintaining Scholars 30% of the time without Invig Prec, it’s still better than maintaining it 100% of the time with Invig Prec.

While people exaggerate how little utility Daredevils bring to the group, it is no secret that they do have less than other classes. Daredevil is there to provide top tier DPS – you better go all in and do as much as you can.

Stompy.1387:

250 ferocity is about 17% crit damage, which is a very large amount.

With proper gear and buffs, the ferocity from No Quarter will increase your damage output by around 6.4% – nothing to sneeze at certainly, but not something to get too excited about.

As pure dps, staff DD’s will probably have to complete with staff eles. Since Gorseval doesnt move much and has a big hitbox, ele will do considerably better. Maybe dd is good at the Sebatha fight?