Guild Wars 2

Ran AC with a guild member today who got 30 tokens then 15 tokens for 2 different paths, but this was the first time he’d run any dungeons.

You guys implemented a system that works against good people that can do dungeons fast, AND that fails to show us the feedback of what is going on. This is terrible in my opinion.

Here is a great suggestion: When you choose a path, it will show you how many tokens you’ll get from it. At least people make an informed decision and know what is going on.

Also, since we have no dungeon finder tool, instead of just finding a group for Honor of the waves, I have to find a group for Honor of the waves: Path x. Is this what is going on now?

Did you just make it HARDER to find groups?

I really love guild wars 2 but content, gameplay and usability are not going hand to hand.

Same here, did not run dungeons for a while

Did TA Explore mode,3 different paths (Each path took us about 40 mins)
Run 1 → 60 Tokens
Run 2, path 2 → 45 Tokens
Run 3, path 3 → 30 Tokens

2 Hours later, decided to run HOTW with another group but went through a different path since I did one 30+ hours ago.
Run → 30 Tokens

Diminishing returns affect all dungeons regardless of paths and run frequency( even those I ran a few days apart )?

Yes, it’s global (not meant to take into account days of distance)

So I did CM Asura path (first time today) and got 30 tokens, everyone else got 60. Then we did the Butler path (again first time for that route today) then i got SIX tokens to my parties 60 each.
How common is this bug?

Very
Tomorrow should work properly

I now care less for the token problem and now I longed for the flame strike on the forum if Anet fail to fix it. I hope it never happen though lol.

In regards to nelopp.6140 I hope your ready for “The Players Strike Back” when Anets next “genius anti-exploit” system they implement fails while screwing fair play gamers over (lets not mention Anet staffs contradicting statements as to why their program is broken). If they’re lucky all they’ll get are posts, at worst they will pretty much slash their final lifeline. After back to back programming flops it’s no wonder people are going to play pandas (shivers). Still I hope a revolution comes and this entire ordeal gets settled fast before Anet becomes the next “Dreamcast”.

I just got 2 tokens for run. Really this is so wrong and not just that , they wont even consider to give us who had bugged gain any repay. No comment really.

If you’re bugged, there’s no reason to play for rewards. I’m currently just playing to train myself and get better at the CM paths, while trying to break even on repairs.

Really do hope for the patch to fix the reward bug tomorrow. Otherwise, I will be… disappointed.

Players are being competent and clearing our dungeons (with easy boss fights) too fast… better punish them for it!

Maybe add some other mechanics other than large HP pools?

They still haven’t rewarded me back the other 54 shards of Zaitan from Arah when I got 6 from my first run there, that’s 1/10th of the reward I should’ve received! Maybe I should have only paid 6 dollars for this 60 dollar game?

bump,

any news if we will be reimbursed the tokens we have lost? I believe I am owed about 155 for CoF but I have lost count now.

Its pretty random if you get the bug. I did AC explorer all 3 paths today with the same group, and they hadn’t run it before (we were all new to it). I got 60 on each path, as well as 1 other. The other 3 got like 45, 30, 15. I later ran CoE explorer path 2 afterwards, and got 60 as well, and another guy who had never done path 2 only got 15.

I guess i’m lucky? I have the non-stacking bug though, my old AC tokens don’t stack with my new ones which is mildly annoying.

Forget a refund. It’s your fault if you kept playing a bugged reward system, when a dev invited the community to just stop and wait a fix.

I ONLY get 15 tokens for AC explorer run every time. Thank you for wasting my time, I will not login until this problem is fixed.

What you should pray , is something else:
if your token counter is resetted, next hours, when patch goes live.
Because well, if you kept attempting to play dungeons during the bugged DR, and last run was 8 tokens ( as much you deserved 60), feel free to expect 2 tokens (the next tier after 8 tokens , over-running a dungeon), on your first run post-patch.
I guess this will be the kind of report i will read next hours.. or not..
Don’t forget what devs said: the system will take into accounts your past runs pre-patch (was said when the bugged DR was live) and the dungeon counter is kept.

Any eta on patch? It’s monday already.

The silly thing is i get ALWAYS the number of tokens as in that pattern: 45, 30, 15, 5, 10, 10. Haven’t tried 7th time.

So for the record, yesterday was the first time I’ve ever done HoW explorable. I got 15 tokens for finishing the butcher path, 6 tokens for finishing whatever the underwater path was called, and then called it quits because it’s just not worth the effort.

This needs to be fixed ASAP.

so, are we gonna be reimbursed for the tokens we got screwed out of?

waited nearly 3 days after being so frusterated that it would never give me above 30 “usually 15” per run…and no i dont speed run..not even sure how people are doing 10 minute runs sounds like an exploit…but anyway. i come back and FINALLY it gives me 45 on a run…after not running any for nearly 3 days. Is this 60? no…but atleast its a little more. Still frusterated that my group i usually play with 3 of us are still getting 60 every run and passed up me and the other guy in my normal dungeon running group who is bugged (hes never seen above 15). So would be nice if the points i was supposed to get would be given to me…as i did nothing wrong except decide to log in and play.

A/C path 2: 6 tokens (1hr) (week or more since last run)

Arah path 1: 15 tokens (3hrs) (week since last run)

HoW path 1: 1 token (45 mins) (First time inside)

Forget a refund.

Have sent a support ticket in game but so far no response.

Cleared CoE third path explorable for the very first time on my character, got 1 miserable token.

Hoping for a refund, this game is too great to be marred by these bugs.

I thought it was meant to be fixed today? Still bugged.

Wait a few hours more. 6:24 am server time, give time, they are waking up

I’m always playing dungeons with my brother. We are not clearing it in 10 or even 20 minutes, it’s usually around 1 hour per dungeon. Every day, my first dungeon run givekitten0 tokens, next 45 (even if it’s different path or even different dungeon), another 30 etc. My brother ALWAYS gets 60 tokens.
I have been farming COF before the patch, but it was before people started exploiting. My fastest COF run took around 25 minutes (not sure if it counts as a speed clear or not, but we haven’t skipped anything).
Now I have to wait around 3 hours every next path of the dungeon to get full reward!
It’s not fair, when exploiters have their sets already and fair players are punished for doing dungeons in normal way, clearing all mobs like it should be done.

It’s like red and black. Some guys put money on red, and wow, it’s red, and you put money on black thinking it was going to change lol.
Accordingly to the DR timer yes, you’re speedfarming, it’s 30 minutes minimum.

On GW1 we had 90% of the playerbase using 55monks farming uw and fow, billion ectos, and gold weapons. Did anet banned his entire playerbase? nope.

If you look around you how many flaming armors are walking, you will realize half or more of your server should be a desert.
One thing is the karma weapon exploit where a strict number of guys thinking to be smart abused of it, something else is a dungeon armor gained with some speedfarm.
After all, their feedback helped to make us enjoy, today, a fixed game.

For the Christ sake fix your kitten system.
We went with a friend to make complete AC (all 3 explorable paths). We went with lower level characters (1x lvl 80, rest above 40). We took a friend with us WHO HAVE NEVER BEEN IN ANY DUNGEON BEFORE. We didn’t speed clear cause all the runs took longer than an hour (with lower levels it’s not as easy as with 80s).
Our friend got 1st run – 45 tokens, 2nd run – 30 tokens, 3 rd run – 20 tokens.
Will you finally admitt your system is broken or should we stop doing dungeons at all not to hit this so called ‘anti speedclear’ block?

Right now ANet is acting like the NCS in Aion (it was not a compliment). What has happened to EU Aion playerbase everyone who was there knows.
I was wating 5 years for this game cause I love the world of Tyria.
If you make mistakes – admitt it – it’s called having a ‘guts’ you know?

And FYI going to Twilight with full lvl 80 team and killing everything takes about 25-35 minutes but I wouldn’t call it speedclear. What we should do? Sit before boss chamber for 30 minutes?
You seem to have strange definition for both speedclear and exploit (I will never understand how ppl who killed everything in the path can be called exploiters).

Guen.3180:

Will you finally admitt your system is broken or should we stop doing dungeons at all not to hit this so called ‘anti speedclear’ block?

They admitted to that quite some time ago. They stand by their system in general but they admit that it can currently bug out, for which they apologize.

Now, should they switch it off while they fix it? Good question. It would put an end to undeserved reduced rewards. But on the other hand, many players would immediately start speedrunning every free second of their lives so they have at least one – if not more – sets of armor complete when the diminishing returns are fixed and reintroduced. You thought there were lots of CoF-clad 80s in Lion’s Arch, Orr or WvW? Imagine those places two days after they suspend diminishing returns.

Remember – if they lift the DR-system, everyone and their brother will expect diminishing returns to be switched on again, and to be switched on again soon. Thus, everyone would understand that they have to speedfarm now. And every exploit and trick imaginable would be used to maximise the number of tokens farmed in the few precious days before the system’s on again. Don’t tell me it wouldn’t happen.

Also, what many who come here to complain forget is, that the DR-system is cross dungeon. It’s a combination of various parameters that leads to diminished returns. You run that path for the fourth time tonight? Diminishing returns. You speed clear many different paths back-to-back? Diminishing returns.

So, to all who say “I never did that path before and only got 45”: That’s intended, if you cleared many other dungeons recently. To say “I never did this path before” is not giving us the whole picture, because the DR-system is looking at more than just that one path. Again, they’ve admitted that the system is currently bugged.

So, much as I agree that legitimate players are innocently being caught in the crossfire and much as I feel for all of them, I guess I’d do the same as ArenaNet does, I’d keep DR in the game.

Having said all that, I, too, think that it’s taking quite some time to fix this and I wish they had logs showing who cleared what when so they could retroactively calculate how many tokens everyone should have received and to award them accordingly.

EDIT: Also, I’d like to know when the system is supposed to kick in.

DR they said. XD

Joking apart I think ANet is thinking the wrong way :

- You’re forcing people to play the game the way YOU want it to be played. That’s just not how it works.
- Instead of cutting into people’s fun, try to be inventive
- Don’t punish good players. They should feel rewarded for their efforts (not only with stupid skins)

We can clear one path of TA in like 30min killing EVERYTHING, and you call that “exploit” ?
If your dungeons aren’t interresting/challenging enough, blame yourself, not the players.

Punishing people cuz they’re good is the worst thing you could do and that actually makes the game worse and worse.

And finally : It’s been a month since the game was released and i feel like i have nothing to do anymore, again, skins can’t be an end in itself.

Yesterday I did some Honor of the Wave exploration in the afternoon. Fine, we all 3 got 60 tokens for this run. Then we stopped playing for the rest of the afternoon.
Later, in the evening, we decided to for a CoF Explo : fine, everybody got 60 tokens.
Yet, after that, we decided to go for a Caudecus Manor, which took over an hour (about an hour and a half), which was the first for the 3 of us. And … SURPRISE ! Nobody got the same amount :
Friend 1, War : 60 tokens
Friend 2, Necro : 15 tokens
Myself, Mesmer : 45 tokens

Seriously ? I could MAYBE understand some bugs while accomplishing the different paths of a same dungeon but after different dungeons ? WTF ?
To me, Diminishing Returns have no longer their place in the game, now that we only get tokens at the end. At least, not on the tokens.
Maybe just if only one path is repeated again and again, yeah I would agree but, seriously, that’s it.
No penalty to players playing as they are encouraged to do.

Concernign that the famous speed clear in CoF is impossible cause ppl can’t get in the dungeon (everyone finds themselves in other instance than rest of team) I’m not sure what to think.
I know they admitted the system ‘bugges sometimes’ but it’s rather all the time than sometimes.
My point was to say someone in ANet has taken a wrong turn in the starategy thinking cause some paths can’t be called speedclears, they are done properly and still hit the ‘speedclear limit’. I do not claim it’s doable with a PUG group but I play with guildmates using Team Speak and we have our tactics for different routes.
Why the hell should we be punished for thinking about tactics and mastering it? Is running into mobs and dieing 100 times a proper tactic according to ANet?

One more thing ANet should consider after thinking about the SC guilds in GW1. Lots of them were doing it to achieve the shortest possible time. They were proud when they made a better time than others. Me and friends were doing SC also. Not for farming but to see what will be the best time we can achieve.
Concerning this facts we can assume there will be people who will find hitting the shortes possible time fun but if they will not be rewarded at all they will not do it.
This DR should be reconsidered and clear for all the players.

I do not say anti-farming system is totally wrong but should be more reasonable (and properly working).
For the 5 years of waiting we have heard ‘When it’s done’. Guess what it’s NOT DONE.

Just adding for documentation purposes.

Last Night – TA Explorable Forward, Up. First path in several days.

Received – I got 30 Blooms, 1 Team Member 45, everyone else 60.

Im surprised and disapointed Anet rather punish a lot of honest players for the sake of , maybe, catching a few exploiters.

I have not been directly affected by this but it sucks having 6 friends online and still have to pug 1-2 players because the ones being directly affected don’t want to run instances.

If your system is flawed, if you already stated its bugged perma-DRing some people, REMOVE THE SYSTEM UNTIL ITS WORKING. Do you really rather punish your loyal/honest players for the sake of a few getting faster badges?

I really don’t understand the winning scenario here. You implemented a system who’s sole purpose is to grief good players by forcing them to run slower. This system does nothing for exploits.

What the system does now:

1. Force people to track their start-end time (sometimes with pics) to make sure we’re doing as told
2. Check at the end who got what. Looks like an AA meeting “My Name is Gynxz and I got 45 marks”
3. Make people that got punished by a flawed system write an angry post in the forums.

What the system doesn’t Do

1. Handle legit exploits. The same CoF path that brought all this talk about exploits is STILL being exploited. I never new of an exploit until this system came. Now I know about 3 just for path 2. I don’t like them, I don’t use them… but I know them.

Fixating on TIME is the wrong approach. Yes, exploiters usually look for ways to make it easier/faster but that’s not the common denominator that should be addressed. Its like saying “Terrorists use GAS stations so lets shut them all down”. What about the 100’s of people getting punished for doing it right?

If the system is not working, shut it down.

What insulting posts by dev’s.

My friends have literally gotten any where from 5-45 tokens haveing not run Cof or AC in day’s.

So your diminishing returns now goes a week long? How come I get 60 every day then?

How incredibly insulting this Robert guy is. He obviously has no idea what he’s talking about.

Horrible PR.

You think as a 36 year old 4 year degree eductated man that I don’t see a bug when I see it? Incredibly insulting.

It’s totally random who gets screwed on the tokens. I get 60 every day from each wing and 2 of my friends consitently get less than 60 even though they pve less than me.

They’re going to stop running dungeons altogether soon if this

BUG IS NOT FIXED

Hi, I too am suffering from this bug and I’m just wondering if there is an ETA on this patch as of yet?
For me the problem differs per instance.
For example: In TA I will get 45 per path and it’ll diminish after each repetition of the path. In SE I will only get 30 per path, and it’ll again diminish after each repetition of the same path. However in HotW I will get 45 for one path but even if I change paths my reward will still degradate as if it were the same path. I haven’t had the chance to check out Arrah or CoE because everytime I do the opening events always seem to be bugged (Underworld server). Infact CoE has been bugged for days on end now.
I’m avoiding AC at all costs as, from what I’ve gathered, that seems to be the worst with people sometimes only walking out with one from what I’ve heard =/

Really enjoying the game though. Far exceeding my expectations, and they were that this was the game I was created to play ;D
Just wandering if there’s an update about the status of this fix? Keep up the good work. =)

Ran my first ever explorable dungeon earlier today (AC), so obviously I have never initiated a diminishing returns timer. I had no real idea how many tokens I was supposed to get, so I asked a friend at the end what the average was. She was already upset that her count was bugged at a far lower twenty than the sixty she was expecting for her first run. I one-upped her however when I revealed I had only gotten six.
I probably won’t make it a habit of chaining dungeons until all of this nonsense is fixed, but for those of you keeping at it, stay strong.

How long till the patch?

I’m just going to throw my name into the mix of people victim of “Diminished Returns” I don’t know exactly how the mechanic works, but before the update I actually hadn’t done much dungeon running, though before that I was one to avidly do “CoF Magg Speedruns” because no matter what group I joined, thats the only path anyone ever wanted to do (and still is usually.)

So 2 days ago, after a few days of not even touching a dungeon (or much of the game in general) I join a random group and run through the dungeon, only to get 30 tokens on completion for the first run, I shrug it off since it’s still not bad, and the second run I only get 5 tokens, annoyed with that I thank the group for their time and quit dungeon running for the day.

Late Yesterday, after exploring the world for a bit and finding a roadblock on a bugged skill point, I figure I will run the dungeon again as I’m close to getting a new bit of armour. Yet again after running through the dungeon my reward is 30 tokens.

So, not once since the update have I ever seen anything more than 30 tokens, and I wouldn’t be bothered with this so much if it weren’t for the fact that all other runs after that result in 5 tokens, speed run or not 5 tokens is a joke.

Anyway thats my experience from it.

I know that it’s easy to talk one another into a rage, so I’d like to offer a different perspective.

Noone in either of the two guilds I’m a member of has ever been struck with undeserved diminishing returns.

I assume that it’s not entirely random but to a certain degree also triggered by playstyle. I’m a working man, if I’m lucky I to play get 3 or 4 hours a night. Also, being rather old by gaming standarts, I’ve become more of a “casual” player. My days of hardcore prograssion raiding are past. I try to have fun and as such, I do various different things every night. For example a jumping puzzle I havn’t done before, a story quest with my wife and then a dungeon, maybe.

Since I don’t run explorables back to back, I havn’t memorized every boss and every pull and so I’m regularly taking over an hour rather than under 30 minutes to clear an explorable.

As you can see, I’m never coming as much as anywhere near the limits at which diminishing returns kick in. So far, it doesn’t affect me.

None of my guildmates are doing more than two or three runs a night. The best run an explorable in under an hour, not under 30 minutes. They usually don’t go the same path twice a night (mostly because that would be boring). None of them has been struck with undeserved diminishing returns, either.

So, while the system is bugged and does dish out undeserved penalties and I’m not disputing this in any way, I have the feeling that your playstyle also affects your chances of being caught in the bug.

Don’t forget that the hundrets of thousands that enjoy the dungeons without any problem probably won’t come here. Most people I know hit the forum only when they have a problem. I guess that most players don’t even know about the problem with diminishing returns.

Guen.3180:

Concernign that the famous speed clear in CoF is impossible cause ppl can’t get in the dungeon (everyone finds themselves in other instance than rest of team) I’m not sure what to think.

That’s strange. So far, I’ve been able to get into any dungeon and so was the entire group. In fact, I never ended up in group that was split across various instances.

So, while this may also be a problem in some rare cases, I guess that saying that people “can’t get in the dungeon” or that “everyone finds themselves in other instance than rest of team” is a bit of an exaggeration.

phooka.4295

Don’t forget that the hundrets of thousands that enjoy the dungeons without any problem probably won’t come here. Most people I know hit the forum only when they have a problem. I guess that most players don’t even know about the problem with diminishing returns.

Yep.
And sadly, the only input devs get are the bad ones.

We ran AC once per day during the last week, and did 2 runs (different paths) on one day.
Two paths of CM the other day.
Finishing time per run in AC ~1 hr, and CM waaay longer because we were noobs there..:)

So it’s like +-10 different people from the same guild doing dungeons, and we all got 60 tokens per run every time.

So far I never received 60 tokens
Max was 45 and got this amount only twice.
I usually do one AC route each day.
Yesterday I got into good party and made for first time all 3 paths in one day – 45/30/15.

First run of CoF today, got 20. The other 3 got 60 and one guy got 15. I just want the 40 I missed out on.

In the past I got 60 on the first and 20 on the runs after.

Zytherion.8231:

First run of CoF today, got 20. The other 3 got 60 and one guy got 15. I just want the 40 I missed out on.

In the past I got 60 on the first and 20 on the runs after.

Did you run it yesterday? the dungeons reset at 5pm pacific time and that was only 5 minutes ago

For me everything is working correct again and I am really happy about that, because now I actually feel rewarded when doing a dungeon.

But just out of curiousity. Is there any chance we re getting back the tokens that we missed out on during the last week?

And for Zytherion: 20 is the amount you get if you already ran the path once that day so it would make sence you somehow did it after the reset the day before.

Jakar.3685:

For me everything is working correct again and I am really happy about that, because now I actually feel rewarded when doing a dungeon.

But just out of curiousity. Is there any chance we re getting back the tokens that we missed out on during the last week?

And for Zytherion: 20 is the amount you get if you already ran the path once that day so it would make sence you somehow did it after the reset the day before.

You will not get the tokens you missed out on.

Dungeons reset at 5pm pacific time daily.

So you run CoF path 2 at 10pm you will get 60 tokens. After this it doesn’t matter what dungeon or path you run you wall not get more than 20 tokens from CoF path 2 until after 5pm the following day

Kromica.2831:

Jakar.3685:

For me everything is working correct again and I am really happy about that, because now I actually feel rewarded when doing a dungeon.

But just out of curiousity. Is there any chance we re getting back the tokens that we missed out on during the last week?

And for Zytherion: 20 is the amount you get if you already ran the path once that day so it would make sence you somehow did it after the reset the day before.

You will not get the tokens you missed out on.

Dungeons reset at 5pm pacific time daily.

So you run CoF path 2 at 10pm you will get 60 tokens. After this it doesn’t matter what dungeon or path you run you wall not get more than 20 tokens from CoF path 2 until after 5pm the following day

And this assumption has a proof, or it’s your personal opinion? Because i highly doubt the DR reset triggers on server reset.

A friend of mine ran one of TA exp paths on the night from monday to tuedays ending around 4am (after the daily achievement reset, but before the patch update) for which he got bugged medals.

We ran it again today after the patch and he got 20 so. For the other paths which he had not done he got 60 like the rest of us. Not sure if they helps, but this is what I based my assumptions on.

Suggest your friend to stay far from TA until resetted. Seems i was right, who kept insisting to play dungeons with bugged DR, and received less token than expected, kept his lowered reward. I tried to warn you all to quit playing dungeons until fixed, now deal with it