Guild Wars 2

Almost everything that i hate is adressed in this post. Thank you very much for this, and thank you very much for telling your plans ahead, now, i’m pretty sure i’ll keep playing for a long while.

These look to be a fantastic round of changes. I hope that other rough bits of HoT can be patched up like this, too.

Malediktus.9250:

If you nerf their toughness, please increase their power scaling. When I did Mai Trin on lvl 100 it felt like she was doing less damage than on the old lvl 50. On lvl 100 she should one hit low health classes!

Disagree, guardians are already squishy enough with their 11k hp. Don’t need to be one shotted on top of that and since base hp is dictated by class this will lead to some classes not being used at all and discriminated against.

The one to Rule.2593:

Malediktus.9250:

If you nerf their toughness, please increase their power scaling. When I did Mai Trin on lvl 100 it felt like she was doing less damage than on the old lvl 50. On lvl 100 she should one hit low health classes!

Disagree, guardians are already squishy enough with their 11k hp. Don’t need to be one shotted on top of that and since base hp is dictated by class this will lead to some classes not being used at all and discriminated against.

But there is no difficulty to fractals at the moment. They are only a time sink with the health and tougness sponges.

Î dont want all fractal dailies fixed, this could result in run snowblind/cliffside 9 times. I think a better solution would be to change the “run any 3 daily” into a “run 3 in a row (ie. 1-3 or 12-15) daily”. It should be allowed to do them all one by one, out of order, as long as you finished 3 dailies which are in a row you should get the daily.
In combination with the fixed daily fractal it would force players to run different islands if they only want to run 3 per tier. At the same time it would still allow players a little bit of choice, if the fixed is 10, you could run 8-10, 9-11 or 10-12.
This would also mean less relogging to la and allowing (not forcing) groups to stay together a little longer.
Of course i also think they should add a 76-100 tier with both dailies and add a fixed run for 51-75 so we end up with 8 dailies (4 run any 3 in a row and 4 fixed ones).

The one to Rule.2593:

Malediktus.9250:

If you nerf their toughness, please increase their power scaling. When I did Mai Trin on lvl 100 it felt like she was doing less damage than on the old lvl 50. On lvl 100 she should one hit low health classes!

Disagree, guardians are already squishy enough with their 11k hp. Don’t need to be one shotted on top of that and since base hp is dictated by class this will lead to some classes not being used at all and discriminated against.

…???

Before HoT-Fractals, it was exactly like this. Basically everyone besides Necs and Wars (if they were lucky and at full HP) were oneshots by most hard-hitting attacks if there were no buffs/debuffs up, no class was discriminated because of their HP-pool.

Or, let me say this differently: If you keep dying, it would be a learn to play-issue and not an issue of your class.

Please add a 76-100 Daily (combined with a 51-75)

I also want the Drop rate of the Tonic/Golden skins be slightly increased for fotm daily 76-100.

Salv Ascended: This is stupid, 100% stupid low drop rates, increase them now.

when will this go live?

I assume health scaling stays though. Which is good. It might need toning down a bit though.

Butter.3024:

when will this go live?

Only indication they gave is December

This round of updates will address the loot and the hp-sponge issue, which is a step in the right direction.

The other things that need to be addressed that are currently unanswered:

1. Fractal leaderboard
2. Fractal weapon collection bug
3. +10 AR item bug
4. Major exploits that were supposed to be fixed are not
5. Damage scaling reduced by about 75% – even if mobs on high levels have less armor, they’re still hitting for lower than pre-HoT which means there is still little risk and still no challenge
6. Whether or not the tonic is still in the game
7. Price of salvaging ascended gear should be the loss of the gear itself, not 1 gold in addition
8. Uninspired instabilities

For once, I just want there to be an actual chance of failure in this game. I miss that. Party wipe should kick the group from the instance and party wipes should happen more often. As it stands there is no risk at all for virtually any groups (and I pug.)

Butter.3024:

when will this go live?

A message from John Corpening and John Smith:

Hello All,

Since the launch of Heart of Thorns the Team has been monitoring feedback regarding the changes to Fractals. We’ve noticed several issues with fractal balance and rewards that are especially prominent above Fractal Level 50, and the team is working on some adjustments that we are planning to ship in December. We wanted to give you an overview of what’s coming.

Nevets Crimsonwing.5271:

3. +10 AR item bug

The potion doesn’t stack with other sources of Agony Resistance (any agony resistance at all)

Its Josh.2860:

Nevets Crimsonwing.5271:

3. +10 AR item bug

The potion doesn’t stack with other sources of Agony Resistance (any agony resistance at all)

I know, I read it. Is it intentional? Is it just meant for beginners?

Gaile Gray.6029:

We wanted to give you an overview of what’s coming.

Balance

Ascended Drop Rates

Mastery Experience

Gold

So does this mean:
(A) We will get no variety in Instabilities and continue with less mechanics than pre HoT? What happened to the promised “no reflect” instability that was promised to take place of Ill and Chill?
(B) We won’t get any changes toward the huge gear and relic grind that is plaguing fractals? It currently takes 7x armor + 6x trinkets + 6x weapons +7 agony infusions, or 2850 relics to buy a full set of +7, that is after getting full ascended, for each character—isn’t that too much? Wouldn’t a +5 costing 50 and a +7 costing 50 extra be overkill? Currently you make less relics doing every level from 1 to 100 than you would from doing 1-50 preHoT, and you have doubled the relic requirement. Isn’t that an oversight?
© Are we not including any new mechanics for a single fractal? Mai Trin at 100 is exactly the same mechanics as Mai Trin at 25? Other than fixing stack spots and exploits, there hasn’t been any new mechanics introduced even at higher levels. The content is getting stale, and HoT was the best time to freshen it up with the huge change.
(D) Are we not getting compensated for running harder fractals? We can run three molten duo fractals in the same time it takes to do one cliffside, yet we don’t get any extra chests or rewards for doing cliffside. Currently because Swamp, Molten Duo, Maw, etc. give just as good loot as other fractals (aka the rest anywhere from 2 to 5 times as long as give slightly better loot, an extra champ bag or two at best) because the rest give trash loot.
(E) There is not even a single new fractal you can introduce? What happened to the Abaddon fractal? I thought that was built already?
(F) When are you going to introduce swapping the level while in the Observatory so we don’t have to leave and come back in just to change the levels?

Seriously where does everyone keep hearing that the Abaddon fractal was already built? I thought they said they would NEVER build it because we voted for Kiel instead.

Malediktus.9250:

If you nerf their toughness, please increase their power scaling. When I did Mai Trin on lvl 100 it felt like she was doing less damage than on the old lvl 50. On lvl 100 she should one hit low health classes!

Totally agree on this one. I feel most fights are just LONG now, but not challenging. #wetnoodlefight :P

Faux.1937:

Please add a 76-100 Daily (combined with a 51-75)

Also agree on this one, this is a very important point imo.

I want to hint to this thread over here, you may want to read the the OP

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Fractals-need-to-change/first#post5756288

And so, fractal encryption box prices increased by 150%… Too bad I wasn’t able to access GW when I read about this ;-;

Also, for Christ’s sake, why do the Devs take questions over on Reddit and not their own forums?

A good quick fix of some issues, but there still needs to be a lot more done. Nevets does a good quick summery of the main remaining issues.

Still waiting the day, when you remove Agony all together. This mechanic only adds up to grind for agony resistance and there are only minor difficulty related pros. Not having enough AR for higher levels is hardly defined as difficult content.

peter.2738:

Still waiting the day, when you remove Agony all together. This mechanic only adds up to grind for agony resistance and there are only minor difficulty related pros. Not having enough AR for higher levels is hardly defined as difficult content.

I don’t see the issue with AR. It’s a way to progress through fractals, but it is for the most part not a requirement. I’d like to see the guaranteed boss room Agony gone though.

Remember when Anet says “we will increase drops and loot”, they will actually nerf it even more.

But is this going to be like the BL chest key “increase”? Where its increased from 0.00005% chance to 0.00007% chance? >.<

Nevets Crimsonwing.5271:

Also, for Christ’s sake, why do the Devs take questions over on Reddit and not their own forums?

B.c forums rules are so stronk that All is Vain!

A step in the right direction. Now please fix the currently broken Fractal Weapons skins collection. I have multiple skins in the bank that are not being counted.

docMed.7692:

Gaile Gray.6029:

A message from John Corpening and John Smith:

We’ve noticed some changes to ascended drop rates that are below what we were expecting.

See, this is what I don’t get about your development team. Why are ascended drop rates below what the developers (you!) expected? You developed the content, you programmed the rates, why would they be different than what you put in or anything other than what you 100% intended? Did someone on their own simply have complete control over fractal rates with no oversight? This design concept seems to run rampant among your developers and is most apparent when reviewing material storage, boxes that open into more boxes, zone-specific keys, etc. (it seems like your internal teams do not communicate changes well with each other, which is a poor reflection on management).

This has been happening right throughout the games existence. There’s also the fact that it was players alerting them to the issue not them ‘noticing it’.

I wish they could at least adress WvW rewards in a similar way, but as an also long time Fractal runner, these changes are awesome indeed. (here’s hoping ascended boxes drop at nearly the same rate as pre-change haha)

I think this is an excellent list for the first iteration. All I am asking is not to stop at this and keep close look, iterating as necessary. I am also sure that the majority of FDR (ha) community will appreciate more communication on the discussion board.

Zania.8461:

I think this is an excellent list for the first iteration. All I am asking is not to stop at this and keep close look, iterating as necessary. I am also sure that the majority of FDR (ha) community will appreciate more communication on the discussion board.

Isnt that kinda the point of the word Iterate?

Skady.5916:

I don’t see how changes listed by Gaile gonna promote playerbase to run anything but swamp/duo/maw. Even if you add 75-100 daily, people will run 77-80-90 and will be done with it. We need a daily “Do lvl 94 fractal” to get it to work.

No one will do that fractal as a daily, they would simply skip the day. It’s not worth the effort.

Is there a problem with mist essence drops? i never seem to get any even though my magic find isn’t that bad.

Faux.1937:

Zania.8461:

I think this is an excellent list for the first iteration. All I am asking is not to stop at this and keep close look, iterating as necessary. I am also sure that the majority of FDR (ha) community will appreciate more communication on the discussion board.

Isnt that kinda the point of the word Iterate?

It is! I am merely worried that the iteration cycles will become too slow. And stating that (at least I) would appreciate more communication so we know where in the iteration cycle they are.

Thank you for addressing the toughness scaling, but as some others have mentioned it’s important the power scaling is restored. Half the issue making high level fractals boring is the bosses pose no threat. It will be nice to be able to get through fights quicker, but it would be nicer have some challenge back in fractals.

While fixing the rewards in fractals… Could you please fix the myst trail effect on the golden weapons? Please…

These are great changes, but you know what would be even better? NEW Fractals!

What about awarding AP for daily fractals so that i don’t have to do the normal dailies?

most of these are great changes, however the change with stabilizing matrices sounds like it will make a salvage kit worth more than ascended rings making people just merch all of their ascended rings again (its already like this for ascended back-pieces.)

the toughness change is good, but needs to be replaced with scaling power, or more instabilities or something so that the challenge goes up the higher the scale.

these changes also fail to address people just doing all swamps for the daily. currently scale 100 and 56 have about the same reward, that needs fixed. I would like a separate daily for 76-100 than the 51-75, as well as making all the dailies be recommended to prevent just doing swamps.

Rather than increasing the rewards for the 76-100 I would like it that loot rewards remain the same, only make getting the daily complete require 2 islands instead of 3 as the higher scales take more time to complete than the lower scales.

As many others have said, please add a 71+ daily to give people reasons to actually run higher levels.
Everything else looks great and can’t wait

Nevets Crimsonwing.5271:

This round of updates will address the loot and the hp-sponge issue, which is a step in the right direction.

The other things that need to be addressed that are currently unanswered:

1. Fractal leaderboard
2. Fractal weapon collection bug
3. +10 AR item bug
4. Major exploits that were supposed to be fixed are not
5. Damage scaling reduced by about 75% – even if mobs on high levels have less armor, they’re still hitting for lower than pre-HoT which means there is still little risk and still no challenge
6. Whether or not the tonic is still in the game
7. Price of salvaging ascended gear should be the loss of the gear itself, not 1 gold in addition
8. Uninspired instabilities

For once, I just want there to be an actual chance of failure in this game. I miss that. Party wipe should kick the group from the instance and party wipes should happen more often. As it stands there is no risk at all for virtually any groups (and I pug.)

On #7, there kinda has to be a cost beyond losing the item, because of the relative cheapness of ascended trinkets, especially for older vets sitting on mountains of laurels and guild commendations. Rings are obviously very commonplace, but even accessories and amulets are much, much cheaper to acquire for the sake of salvaging than weapons and armor, even as their salvage table and Dark Energy salvage rate reflects this.

Opt.3714:

1g cost of an Ascended Salvage kit.

Oh, you know, I, uhm, I completely forgot about that…

I got so excited when I got 75 matrices so i could convert the rest i got into keys (I was just really focussed on that because i sold 2 bank tabs full of ascended rings to vendors half a year ago), that I forgot basic math skills.

profanity

Nevets Crimsonwing.5271:

This round of updates will address the loot and the hp-sponge issue, which is a step in the right direction.

The other things that need to be addressed that are currently unanswered:

1. Fractal leaderboard
2. Fractal weapon collection bug
3. +10 AR item bug
4. Major exploits that were supposed to be fixed are not
5. Damage scaling reduced by about 75% – even if mobs on high levels have less armor, they’re still hitting for lower than pre-HoT which means there is still little risk and still no challenge
6. Whether or not the tonic is still in the game
7. Price of salvaging ascended gear should be the loss of the gear itself, not 1 gold in addition
8. Uninspired instabilities

Pretty much this. Except for number 7, it should still have a cost like all salvage kits, but not quite so ridiculous.

Is anything being done to the “No pain, no gain” Instability? That one makes 40-50 very unfun.

docMed.7692:

Gaile Gray.6029:

A message from John Corpening and John Smith:

We’ve noticed some changes to ascended drop rates that are below what we were expecting.

See, this is what I don’t get about your development team. Why are ascended drop rates below what the developers (you!) expected? You developed the content, you programmed the rates, why would they be different than what you put in or anything other than what you 100% intended? Did someone on their own simply have complete control over fractal rates with no oversight? This design concept seems to run rampant among your developers and is most apparent when reviewing material storage, boxes that open into more boxes, zone-specific keys, etc. (it seems like your internal teams do not communicate changes well with each other, which is a poor reflection on management).

It’s deliberate and intentional obfuscation.

Unless they are using some system cooked up by the Mad King himself, drop rates are finite numbers that exist in the system as variables which they have complete control over. Making it sound like there was some result that was “Unexpected” is nothing but smoke and mirrors. The drop rates are what they set them to be. There was no “mistake” in the changes made. They took off and nuked it from orbit, and now want us to believe it was an “oopsies” moment.

Is this change coming this Tuesday?

Quon Star.4678:

Is this change coming this Tuesday?

It specifically states december.

Just to check are u guys aware that some of the fractal mislocks make certain fractals really hard to do.
Personally I found the urban battle ground where enemies give conditions and the arrow crates literally rain conditions on players and the asura fractal(sorry i forgot the name) with the lasers.
The instant a laser goes through a person its like 12 stacks of agony. I even got 22 stacks once. Surely this cant be right.
Also pls reduce the duration of fear and imbo on the fractals that give conditions when enemies hits a player.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Ascended Drop Rates

Mastery Experience

Gold

I am very happy you decided to post on these forums. The changes sound positive, but the fact is they are 2 months too late. I want to point out how big a blunder this was, and how important it is to avoid it in the future.

Everyone wants ascended for raids, exp for their masteries, and gold for their guild upgrades etc. So many people looked to fractals, and then left because of this mistake. This was an amazing opportunity for you to bring a LOT of new players into fractals, and you blew it. Will you ever get such an opportunity again? Who knows.

Raids are coming out this week, people will think of raids as the main way to get ascended drops, they may have already forgotten fractals.

Central tyria mastery exp has already been grinded out in cof. If fractals had been rewarding, a lot of players would have tried them out. But now they are done grinding those masteries.

Many dungeon runners were grinding out a ton of gold for legendaries/guild halls/etc. With dungeons nerfed, they looked to fractals, and then walked away to other more profitable options. Their halls upgraded, and there weapons built, they have no reason to come back.

TLDR: First impression matter, and you threw this one away. Please don’t do it again. I want to see fractals succeed, and part of that is drawing in the population.

Gaile Gray.6029:

A message from John Corpening and John Smith:

We’ve noticed some changes to ascended drop rates that are below what we were expecting.

I’m utterly perplexed by the usage of the words, “noticed” and “expecting”. Is the drop rate not simply a fixed value that one of the developers was instructed to enter? That’s not something you would “notice” later, or something that should generate unexpected results.

Please help us to understand. At the moment I just feel like the usage of this language is an attempt to deflect fault for what was a very poorly received change.

That is a great start! Thank you for the update.

Could you kindly walk over to the WvW team and tell them to get off their kitten butts and post an update on their plans to fix WvW since the game mode and community are hemorrhaging players and going the way of old Ascalon!?