Guild Wars 2

TL;DR: 600 tokens every week for a predetermined dungeon, cycles every week until all 8 dungeons have had their week. Full set of armor + at least one weapon after 24 weeks and only three full runs of a specific dungeon.

You need 1380 tokens to get dungeon armor. And throw in a weapon or two as well, you’ll quickly get to 1800. It’s understandable that ArenaNet doesn’t want us to get armor in a week (as some have already managed to do through CoF speedruns).

So how do we keep dungeon running fun, challenging, varied, rewarding, remove grind and make sure we don’t get the armors too fast?

Here’s an idea.

1. First of all, change nothing to the base system. That’s right. If you’re “hardcore” and wish to get armor/weapons as fast as possible, you’ll have to grind through 50~60 complete runs. Obviously, you shouldn’t have to do this, but you can.

2. Every week, you’ll have the opportunity for every character on your account to earn 600 tokens for a specific predetermined dungeon (an AC week, a CM week, etc.). 200 tokens for every path. Once. Meaning: once you’ve done that path, it goes back to ~30 tokens a path.

In other words: we have 8 dungeons. Every dungeon will be cycled through, in order, week after week. In 24 weeks time, you’ll have had the opportunity to collect 1800 tokens for every single dungeon by doing each dungeon exactly three times fully, meaning every path three times.

An example:

I want CM armor. I have no CM tokens. This week is CM week (last week was AC week). This means that this week, by doing each of the three CM paths once, I can earn 600 CM tokens (200 for each path). If I do CM more than that, I revert to the old system, at 30 tokens a path.

So the CM week is over, I now have 600 CM tokens. For another shot at 600 CM tokens, I’ll have to wait 8 weeks (a full cycle). In the meantime, I can keep doing CM (for ~30 tokens a path), or I can just do the other dungeons, in their weekly featured order to also get 600 tokens for those.

End result:

“Hardcore” grinding players can get the armor in less than 8 weeks, by doing 50~60 runs.

Slightly less “hardcore” players can get the armor within 8 or 16 weeks (their favourite dungeon will have cycled at least once or twice), by getting the 600 or 1200 tokens for the dungeon of their choice and grinding for the remaining tokens.

“Casual” players can get the armor within 24 weeks (when their favourite dungeon has cycled three times), by getting 1800 tokens.

Viracer.9436:

I’ll +1 this as a possible solution.

+1 Similar to what i proposed here: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/How-to-fix-Dungeons-A-lesson-in-game-design-for-ANET/

Oh, you mean more of what’s been done already? A weekly lock out for gear, or tokens to get gear? A “must do” chore list to get gear, or tokens to get gear. Yeah, no thanks. The dailies and monthies for achievements for doing what I want to do and nothing more is as close as I ever want my list of “chores” to come to that play style.

Or they could just realize they made a mistake with the dungeon path and roll CoF back to what it was and make the other dungeons get in line of speed and difficulty.

Efaicia.3672:

Oh, you mean more of what’s been done already? A weekly lock out for gear, or tokens to get gear? A “must do” chore list to get gear, or tokens to get gear. Yeah, no thanks. The dailies and monthies for achievements for doing what I want to do and nothing more is as close as I ever want my list of “chores” to come to that play style.

Dailies and monthlies are not required at all, nor are any repeats of dungeons unless you want specific looking gear.

I like the idea in regards to mixing it up. I think 600 is way too much though, and the presentation doesn’t fit.

My idea is more like a story:

You get mail from a rich man from the wealthier section of Divinity’s Reach this week. He exclaims his daughter ran away to CM and hasn’t been heard from. Find her, and you’ll be handsomely rewarded.

The daughter is then dynamically placed in one of the three explorable paths, specific to your party. That means – yes – the daughter will be in any of the three per party, and as long as the party stays together (promoting togetherness, patience, and time, yay!), you’ll eventually find her if you can do the paths. This will effectively separate those who care from those who don’t. Not only that, the daughter will have to be ‘escorted’ to the end of the dungeon – she’ll either be able to die and be ressed or just be invulnerable and say fun lines throughout her time travelling with you (she’s obviously 16 and rebellious).

This way, people who “grind” out the three dungeons really feel like it’s worth it, and gives a large incentive. It will keep the idea of dynamic alive, avoid the “The daughter is in THIS path of CM, go there!” since it’s random per party, and allow people to mix it up. Because the daughter would most likely be near the end, at the end, or hidden within a random spot, it would also exclude the idea of “I’ve checked every spot the daughter spawns at, next path!”

Again, the amount of tokens can’t be too much, but enough to be worth it. 200 maybe? That’s still generous since you’d get the 25-30 as well.

Added a TL;DR at the top.

Skyrant Kangaroomouse.7458:

Viracer.9436:

I’ll +1 this as a possible solution.

+1 Similar to what i proposed here: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/How-to-fix-Dungeons-A-lesson-in-game-design-for-ANET/

Thanks, Skyrant, I also like your solution.

Efaicia.3672:

Oh, you mean more of what’s been done already? A weekly lock out for gear, or tokens to get gear? A “must do” chore list to get gear, or tokens to get gear. Yeah, no thanks. The dailies and monthies for achievements for doing what I want to do and nothing more is as close as I ever want my list of “chores” to come to that play style.

Sadly, yes.

I can’t think of a better system that doesn’t have grind. Apparently neither do ArenaNet’s game designers, and they’re being paid for it.

Mordikay.8476:

Or they could just realize they made a mistake with the dungeon path and roll CoF back to what it was and make the other dungeons get in line of speed and difficulty.

That wouldn’t remove the need to grind 50~60 dungeon runs.

I’m okay with having to wait 6 months to get my armor. I’m not okay with having to grind for it.

6 months for a set of armor and weapon? no thanks.

Daboris.6730:

Efaicia.3672:

Oh, you mean more of what’s been done already? A weekly lock out for gear, or tokens to get gear? A “must do” chore list to get gear, or tokens to get gear. Yeah, no thanks. The dailies and monthies for achievements for doing what I want to do and nothing more is as close as I ever want my list of “chores” to come to that play style.

Dailies and monthlies are not required at all, nor are any repeats of dungeons unless you want specific looking gear.

I like the idea in regards to mixing it up. I think 600 is way too much though, and the presentation doesn’t fit.

My idea is more like a story:

You get mail from a rich man from the wealthier section of Divinity’s Reach this week. He exclaims his daughter ran away to CM and hasn’t been heard from. Find her, and you’ll be handsomely rewarded.

The daughter is then dynamically placed in one of the three explorable paths, specific to your party. That means – yes – the daughter will be in any of the three per party, and as long as the party stays together (promoting togetherness, patience, and time, yay!), you’ll eventually find her if you can do the paths. This will effectively separate those who care from those who don’t. Not only that, the daughter will have to be ‘escorted’ to the end of the dungeon – she’ll either be able to die and be ressed or just be invulnerable and say fun lines throughout her time travelling with you (she’s obviously 16 and rebellious).

This way, people who “grind” out the three dungeons really feel like it’s worth it, and gives a large incentive. It will keep the idea of dynamic alive, avoid the “The daughter is in THIS path of CM, go there!” since it’s random per party, and allow people to mix it up. Because the daughter would most likely be near the end, at the end, or hidden within a random spot, it would also exclude the idea of “I’ve checked every spot the daughter spawns at, next path!”

Again, the amount of tokens can’t be too much, but enough to be worth it. 200 maybe? That’s still generous since you’d get the 25-30 as well.

If you haven’t put this in the suggestion forums yet do so, because I would love this being in there!!

@OP idea seems good, but 600 is way to much… Maybe 300? Or something like that?

Probably the best solution I’ve read about so far.

I always wondered why there is no daily/weekly/monthly incentive to do dungeons.

Lagg.3960:

Added a TL;DR at the top.

Skyrant Kangaroomouse.7458:

Viracer.9436:

I’ll +1 this as a possible solution.

+1 Similar to what i proposed here: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/How-to-fix-Dungeons-A-lesson-in-game-design-for-ANET/

Thanks, Skyrant, I also like your solution.

Efaicia.3672:

Oh, you mean more of what’s been done already? A weekly lock out for gear, or tokens to get gear? A “must do” chore list to get gear, or tokens to get gear. Yeah, no thanks. The dailies and monthies for achievements for doing what I want to do and nothing more is as close as I ever want my list of “chores” to come to that play style.

Sadly, yes.

I can’t think of a better system that doesn’t have grind. Apparently neither do ArenaNet’s game designers, and they’re being paid for it.

Mordikay.8476:

Or they could just realize they made a mistake with the dungeon path and roll CoF back to what it was and make the other dungeons get in line of speed and difficulty.

That wouldn’t remove the need to grind 50~60 dungeon runs.

I’m okay with having to wait 6 months to get my armor. I’m not okay with having to grind for it.

You might be ok with with it, but what about the other 95% of the player base? You could just do 1-2 dungeon runs a day the old way and then spend 6 month getting your set. But what about the rest of us that want it faster and was willing to do 20-30 runs a day and actually had fun with it?

Personally i’m not so mad about the sets as I already have complete CoF set. But they really messed up the dungeons overall and atm CoF was my main source of making money. I was going to continue running CoF even though i had the full set as I have thing to spend cash on, specially as a guild leader.

Anet should realize people were having fun doing exp that lasted 15-20 min and get the other dungeons in line of what CoF was instead of the other way around.

Personally i’ve gone over to just loggin in farming ore and doing Arah speedruns (which is in no way profitable)

Now dungeons are:

1. No money

2. Too timeconsuming

3. Not worth doing over just loggin in to play the market and farm ores to get an exotic gear.

Atm i’m fully exotic geared in every single slot cept my greatsword on my mesmer and Anet with this patch just removed like 80% of my insentive to login and do something on my lvl 80’s.

So hows about they just realize they make a mistake and players like you can stick to running dungeons once or twice a day and be happy with that, while leaving players that has more time to play and actually want to play have something to do and by that i mean something to do we find worth it which dungeons after the patch is NOT.

Thank you all for your reactions, both the positive and the negative.

I definitely don’t believe that this system is perfect or that the numbers are quite right, but the basis of the idea deserves to be pondered upon and refined by the infinitely more qualified people at ArenaNet.

Mordikay.8476:

Atm i’m fully exotic geared in every single slot cept my greatsword on my mesmer and Anet with this patch just removed like 80% of my insentive to login and do something on my lvl 80’s.

So hows about they just realize they make a mistake and players like you can stick to running dungeons once or twice a day and be happy with that, while leaving players that has more time to play and actually want to play have something to do and by that i mean something to do we find worth it which dungeons after the patch is NOT.

With a full-time job and a 6-month-old at home (which is basically a second full-time job), I can assure you that I envy the free time you have to commit to playing the game. I can do a dungeon once or twice a week, not once or twice a day. No feelings of resentment, though, I was in a similar situation with Guild Wars 1 as you are now with Guild Wars 2, so I can relate.

This is actually why I think that this system has its merits. What you don’t have, is patience to wait 6 months to get that armor. I do. What I don’t have, is time to grind all day long to get it within a week. You do. We both have one thing in common, though. We both have the skills and abilities to complete that dungeon. Hence, we should both be rewarded.

You will be rewarded through skill and grind, I will be rewarded through skill and patience.

And since I always like to end on a positive note: yes, I completely agree that you should be able to run dungeons several times a day if you so desire. If ArenaNet is making this impossible for you, something needs to change.