Guild Wars 2

Pinch.4273:

Yep, Jade Maw is a gating mechanism.

Fun fact: Jade Maw 50 hits for 1172% of your health every second.

That’s with no agony resist, right?

So basically the only way to progress beyond 40 is to use revival orbs on Jade Maw…

You can do 40-49 fine with the gear available. Agony there is 72% a tick with no resist. With 25 resist, it’s down to around 40-something (I haven’t tested this one extensively, but I know I can take 3 hits).

The funny thing is, even the 50 Fractals bosses’ agony hits for 72% per second. It didn’t go up at all. Jade Maw, however, kills your entire party in 2 seconds flat.

50 is a brick wall, you’re not supposed to get past it (I realize there are questionable methods to get past it).

KyleQuest.4639:

For skill, how do you evade the legendary imbued shaman? That’s the hardest one in all of Fractals to me.

Doding like 9 of 10 of his agony attacks except I have to care about larvas – then I often forget to watch the boss.
He’s turning to you and shoots a fast fire arrow that will give the agony. If ranged (900+ at least) its easy to evade. Not sure if its possible to evade in close combat beside the fact he has 2 different 1hit melee abilities (at least for my thief they are 1hit)

Almost every agony hit is possible to dodge. Only exception should be jade.
Not sure yet about this ice ele (the easier version of the dredge), couldn’t recognize his animation for agony yet. Even dredge is possible to perfect dodge but you need a double roll because its a 3hit wave attacks and every hit of it can give you agony beside the damage of the wave itself.

Back to topic:
Yep, high HP builds are harder to play against bosses as a full dps build and even a waste of dps imo. But for the whole rest of a run those tanky builds (at least 1 or 2 in the party) CAN be usefull.
Currently im fine with my full berserk thief at 20+ (~15.5k hp with 30 points in vit and wvw bonus). I probably even got one of the best self heals that is possible with my current build.
Signet of Malice + buff food (no, nothing with magic find like a lot of ppl use..) + traits

cluster bomb:
1 hit up to 5 enemys – 500 hp by signet, 800 (average) by food, 240 by trait for only 3 iniative (or whatever its called in eng :p) = 1540 hp heal just by an attack
if exploded it gets up to 1500+2400(average) + 240 = ~4k heal
pistol whip:
9 hits up to 3 enemys – 2700 by signet, 4400 by food (average again) 450 by trait = ~7.5k heal … can spam this 4-5 times in a row while evading within the skill..
unload (for bosses):
8 fast hits single target: 800 + 1300+400 = 2.5k heal

+sigill of blood for extra heal chance..

If i would compare that to a full tanky build i would loose like 50% of my healing power due to low crit rate.. yep, fair or not decide yourself :p
Agony? With some resistance and a few mobs to attack just sth to laugh at.
Sure, if you are able to dodge, then dodge – but if I still got hit, just spam some more skills and I’m full again.
Heals of party members benefit me better as well – lower hp pool = less agony dmg, “more” heal of other ppl.
And if its getting critical e.g. at shaman – dagger storm heals like 20-30k hp within 8s with enough mobs :p

btw
just read by Pinch that agony is 72% at 40+
So whats at 30?
Currently what i learned/calculated:
10-19: ~11% (6% with 5 res and like 1% with 15 res)
20-29: ~27% (14% with 10 res? 11% with 15 res?)
30-39: ??? .. if i’d have to guess its like 47%
40-49: ~72% (40 with 25 res) .. would have expected 36% with 20 res and like 31% or 32% with 25 res

Reminds me a bit of the armor/res system of d3. First 50% reduction are easy obtainable by a few points but then you will need a lot more – exponential growth probably.

Like I’ve said before, Agony should do a flat amount of damage. People that don’t have vitality can still heal up just as fast and have agony resistance negate the amount of damage. It is really that simple. You shouldn’t be punished twice for having vitality though – e.g. lower dps and extra damage taken.

In a game where there are no tank, healer and dps classes, why were variations in base health put in, exactly?

Goloith.6349:

Like I’ve said before, Agony should do a flat amount of damage. People that don’t have vitality can still heal up[…]

Doesnt work that way as well.

Thiefs+Mages got like 11k base hp, guardian about the same iirc
ranger got ~15k
warrior got what? 20k or 22kk? sth like that
necros go their.. what is it called again? death shroud? works as well against agony i think
no idea about other classes base hp but there are way to many differences to make it fair for EVERY class.
Not to mention the survival/rescue abilities of the classes.

Guard/engi/mesmer/mage got an absolut invul skill even to dots (not sure if they still can be applied on them while they are in that form or if they continue to tick)
rangers got only there pet (and if traited with sigill) but doesnt work for dots.
thiefs got stealth which doesnt prevent from any dmg
necro as already mentioned, nothing else though
warrior similar to ranger just without a pet that would be needed

IndigoSundown.5419:

In a game where there are no tank, healer and dps classes, why were variations in base health put in, exactly?

Thats what the game was advertised with but still there are classes that cant take one of the roles. while almost every class can dps rather good (some got more burst, some more continues dmg) not everyone can take the role of a tank or healer.

Omg, thanks for the post above!

Tell you whats a simple fix, just have Agony do a % damage of your intial/base HP (not buffed by stats). That way regardless of what Profession/Class you are you won’t be singled out. Then on top of that, vitality builds won’t be punished either!

Shini.7542:

necros go their.. what is it called again? death shroud? works as well against agony i think

Just pointing out that agony destroys a necro in death shroud, 100% life force down in like 1 or 2 tics so definitely not good.

Goloith.6349:

Omg, thanks for the post above!

Tell you whats a simple fix, just have Agony do a % damage of your intial/base HP (not buffed by stats). That way regardless of what Profession/Class you are you won’t be singled out. Then on top of that, vitality builds won’t be punished either!

Great idea.

Anyone have anything to add or some concerns with basing Agony damage on Profession base HP vs Total HP? Agony with base HP wouldn’t punish anyone.

Agony with base HP would just be a flat damage amount that goes up with difficulty, meaning that vitality is now a way to mitigate it. That would make vitality better, rather than making healing power better the way it is now. I don’t see a difference, really, and I prefer it the way it is so that it affects everyone equally, since base HP is quite different between professions.

I think the real issue is the lack of gear choices, where you can’t get certain combos without vitality, or certain combos with healing power.

Patrikan Habaton.2548:

Milennin.4825:

It’s a fail concept anyway. It doesn’t belong in a game that is supposed to be about player skill.

if you have skill you don’t need agony resistance and you won’t get it. soo actually agony resistance and the concept of agony actually punishes those who don’t have the skill because they need the resistance to go on

You can get to level 20 with agony gear but from there on out having agony resistence is a must, try doing the dredge map with the dredge machine boss and his undodgeable agony attack or jade maw with no resistence at level 20 and higher.

Thanks for the feedback on the Legendary Shaman. I’ll try to look closer next time. With all the fireballs and that odd zoomed out camera angle, he’s just a spec on the screen. I never noticed him turning at all

RMStrooper.7291:

Patrikan Habaton.2548:

Milennin.4825:

It’s a fail concept anyway. It doesn’t belong in a game that is supposed to be about player skill.

if you have skill you don’t need agony resistance and you won’t get it. soo actually agony resistance and the concept of agony actually punishes those who don’t have the skill because they need the resistance to go on

You can get to level 20 with agony gear but from there on out having agony resistence is a must, try doing the dredge map with the dredge machine boss and his undodgeable agony attack or jade maw with no resistence at level 20 and higher.

Dredge boss has one of the easier Agony attacks to avoid. When you see the boss gain stability, double dodge pronto.

Goloith.6349:

Omg, thanks for the post above!

Tell you whats a simple fix, just have Agony do a % damage of your intial/base HP (not buffed by stats). That way regardless of what Profession/Class you are you won’t be singled out. Then on top of that, vitality builds won’t be punished either!

Actually I believe that would end up favouring Vitality builds.

Why does agony punish vitality builds? Because everything should have its downside. Toughness is weak vs conditions while seemingly makes you a bigger target to hostile critters, and Healing Power has long suffered from horrible scaling.

Irrespective of agony, vitality builds suffer because of the fixed rather than percentage based #6 heal ability. Of course, some classes have additional means to heal as well.

This was demonstrated by simple math in previous posts, and highlights an obvious fundamental flaw in the game.

Actually take a deeper look at this. Why should vitality builds that are giving up damage be singled out and punished twice. This is like -2 (low DMG, high inc DMG) +1 (Extra life) = 0. The math simply does not add up. Cutting agony to base stats equalizes all armor. The math is now -1 (low DMG) +1 (extra life)= 0. That math equals out.

Compare to Rampagers
+1 (high damage) -1 (low HP or tough) = 0. Every other set of armor has its perks set to net equality.

Why should vitality builds be better? Their not, they need to be equal. Do the math. Glass cannon or tank they should equal in the end.

toothless.1429:

Irrespective of agony, vitality builds suffer because of the fixed rather than percentage based #6 heal ability. Of course, some classes have additional means to heal as well.

This was demonstrated by simple math in previous posts, and highlights an obvious fundamental flaw in the game.

This is how raw HP vs. defense works in most games, though. Raw HP provides spike/DoT protection, whereas defense (armor derived from toughness in GW2) provides more constant mitigation and acts as a multiplier for heal effectiveness.

There aren’t many MMOs I can think of where going high-HP low-mitigation was a good idea unless there were lots of mitigation-ignoring attacks.

That, and high HP does not innately lower the effectiveness of heals. When taking flat damage compared to a low HP player, you are not any worse off for heals. It is only when you couple both high HP and percent-HP damage sources (the only one of which is Agony) that healing effectiveness is hurt.

Random question here, I noticed that one agony inflicting attack is a projectile, can these be reflected to inflict agony on the boss? Or are they immune to this?

Miyu.8137:

BadHealer.3608:

ATMAvatar.5749:

Out of curiosity, what do you guys propose as an alternative?

I’m sure the immediate reaction is to have agony do a static amount of damage, but the problem with that is it disproportionately harms those with low HP.

And what is wrong with that? As opposite as harming those with high HP? Everywhere else, if you got hit with 5k damage and have only 4k life you are dead. And the one with 20k life would just laugh and heal himself.

But you do realize that different professions got different amount of base hp? Why should professions with low base hp be punished for something they can’t even change.

Last time I did check even those profession could use vitality to increase their life. At the moment Agony is encouraging person to have a glass canon build (all in offence/damage) with healing and punish that ones that put something in defence/vitality.

Tulisin.6945:

toothless.1429:

Irrespective of agony, vitality builds suffer because of the fixed rather than percentage based #6 heal ability. Of course, some classes have additional means to heal as well.

This was demonstrated by simple math in previous posts, and highlights an obvious fundamental flaw in the game.

This is how raw HP vs. defense works in most games, though. Raw HP provides spike/DoT protection, whereas defense (armor derived from toughness in GW2) provides more constant mitigation and acts as a multiplier for heal effectiveness.

There aren’t many MMOs I can think of where going high-HP low-mitigation was a good idea unless there were lots of mitigation-ignoring attacks.

My thoughts exactly. Lets not even talk about agony but stacking HP without any mitigation means you take more damages than someone stacking mitigation and no HP and guess what, the high mitigation setup is always easier to get back to full health.
Vitality without mitigation has always been lacking in the healing department.
The problem with agony is that toughness won’t help you mitigate the damages either, condition removal neither, you need agony resistance or increased healing power.

Considering the same healing power, toughness is weak against big hits and conditions, vitality is weak versus agony and sustain damages cause you won’t manage to get back to full health easily.

So if you run a low hp/toughness/glass canon build, you won’t suffer as much from agony and doesn’t necessarily need lots of agony resistances against most bosses. If you run a vitality build, you will need this agony resistance or better healing. But anyway for Jade maw, at some lvl, every setup will need agony resistance cause even if you heal through it, it lasts for so long that you’re gonna get down and maybe die regardless of your setup.

Why should toughness builds be more punished than vitality ones when agony can’t be removed? It makes no sense either.

Having agony inflicting fixed damages would defeat the whole purpose of having agony resistance stat because you would just need HP. Same as if agony could be cleansed.

High HP isn’t really solution in long fights. Unless you can heal it up it just provides a buffer.

Lord Aargadon.4135:

Random question here, I noticed that one agony inflicting attack is a projectile, can these be reflected to inflict agony on the boss? Or are they immune to this?

Can be reflect and they are not immune to it. However I have no idew how many dmg they’ll suffer from it.

Um, get resist gear noob? you can get a back for like… 50 ectos and 250 mats.

Shini.7542:

Lord Aargadon.4135:

Random question here, I noticed that one agony inflicting attack is a projectile, can these be reflected to inflict agony on the boss? Or are they immune to this?

Can be reflect and they are not immune to it. However I have no idew how many dmg they’ll suffer from it.

Well certainly not what the agony dmg is supposed to do… otherwise you’d cleave almost all the health off a boss.

Bruno Sardine.2907:

Shini.7542:

Lord Aargadon.4135:

Random question here, I noticed that one agony inflicting attack is a projectile, can these be reflected to inflict agony on the boss? Or are they immune to this?

Can be reflect and they are not immune to it. However I have no idew how many dmg they’ll suffer from it.

Well certainly not what the agony dmg is supposed to do… otherwise you’d cleave almost all the health off a boss.

The most obvious experience I can think of is the Legendary Shaman. His fire bolts can be easily reflected and I am pretty sure I remembered seeing the agony debuff on the boss. As for agony actually working on the boss, no I don’t think so. I would definitely notice if his HP was going down in percentages per tick lol.

Thing with Eles though, to get enough high heal, you need the 30 in water traits which is 300 more vit? Yet, how much does that affect ele’s ability to stay alive when more HP = faster death? Armor options would obviously be rare/exotic power/prec/tough or power/prec/ cond or power/tough/cond or clerics gear for more heals.

Zogyark.4597:

Um, get resist gear noob? you can get a back for like… 50 ectos and 250 mats.

I am not wasting any mats I need for my legendary on agony resist.
Besides the 50 ecto 250t6 mat one wont even give agony resist. You will have to upgrade it with another 250 ectos + 100 t6 mats totaling at 300e 350 t6 mats. Plus relicts or mats for infusion.

Sabyne.6329:

Tulisin.6945:

toothless.1429:

Irrespective of agony, vitality builds suffer because of the fixed rather than percentage based #6 heal ability. Of course, some classes have additional means to heal as well.

This was demonstrated by simple math in previous posts, and highlights an obvious fundamental flaw in the game.

This is how raw HP vs. defense works in most games, though. Raw HP provides spike/DoT protection, whereas defense (armor derived from toughness in GW2) provides more constant mitigation and acts as a multiplier for heal effectiveness.

There aren’t many MMOs I can think of where going high-HP low-mitigation was a good idea unless there were lots of mitigation-ignoring attacks.

My thoughts exactly. Lets not even talk about agony but stacking HP without any mitigation means you take more damages than someone stacking mitigation and no HP and guess what, the high mitigation setup is always easier to get back to full health.
Vitality without mitigation has always been lacking in the healing department.
The problem with agony is that toughness won’t help you mitigate the damages either, condition removal neither, you need agony resistance or increased healing power.

Considering the same healing power, toughness is weak against big hits and conditions, vitality is weak versus agony and sustain damages cause you won’t manage to get back to full health easily.

So if you run a low hp/toughness/glass canon build, you won’t suffer as much from agony and doesn’t necessarily need lots of agony resistances against most bosses. If you run a vitality build, you will need this agony resistance or better healing. But anyway for Jade maw, at some lvl, every setup will need agony resistance cause even if you heal through it, it lasts for so long that you’re gonna get down and maybe die regardless of your setup.

Why should toughness builds be more punished than vitality ones when agony can’t be removed? It makes no sense either.

Having agony inflicting fixed damages would defeat the whole purpose of having agony resistance stat because you would just need HP. Same as if agony could be cleansed.

Have you ever heard of EVE Online? SOAK tanks have had their place right along-side mitigation in most games.

In all honesty toughness is not getting the shaft, its mitigating non-agony damage the boss and its pets are doing just like vitality builds are soaking up non-agony damage the boss and its pets are doing. If you have agony do % of the base stats it equals out. You will be able to heal up just fine and your mitigation will protect you. So if you lose 40% of your health (without any vitality) to agony with toughness you will have 60% left, where vitality will lose 40% the base HP leaving total HP above 60%, but keep in mind 80% hp w/o mitigation will keep you alive just as long with 60% hp with mitigation. Just because vitality builds will have more % hp left than toughness builds does not mean the player will stay alive any longer.

Goloith.6349:

Sabyne.6329:

Tulisin.6945:

toothless.1429:

Irrespective of agony, vitality builds suffer because of the fixed rather than percentage based #6 heal ability. Of course, some classes have additional means to heal as well.

This was demonstrated by simple math in previous posts, and highlights an obvious fundamental flaw in the game.

This is how raw HP vs. defense works in most games, though. Raw HP provides spike/DoT protection, whereas defense (armor derived from toughness in GW2) provides more constant mitigation and acts as a multiplier for heal effectiveness.

There aren’t many MMOs I can think of where going high-HP low-mitigation was a good idea unless there were lots of mitigation-ignoring attacks.

My thoughts exactly. Lets not even talk about agony but stacking HP without any mitigation means you take more damages than someone stacking mitigation and no HP and guess what, the high mitigation setup is always easier to get back to full health.
Vitality without mitigation has always been lacking in the healing department.
The problem with agony is that toughness won’t help you mitigate the damages either, condition removal neither, you need agony resistance or increased healing power.

Considering the same healing power, toughness is weak against big hits and conditions, vitality is weak versus agony and sustain damages cause you won’t manage to get back to full health easily.

So if you run a low hp/toughness/glass canon build, you won’t suffer as much from agony and doesn’t necessarily need lots of agony resistances against most bosses. If you run a vitality build, you will need this agony resistance or better healing. But anyway for Jade maw, at some lvl, every setup will need agony resistance cause even if you heal through it, it lasts for so long that you’re gonna get down and maybe die regardless of your setup.

Why should toughness builds be more punished than vitality ones when agony can’t be removed? It makes no sense either.

Having agony inflicting fixed damages would defeat the whole purpose of having agony resistance stat because you would just need HP. Same as if agony could be cleansed.

Have you ever heard of EVE Online? SOAK tanks have had their place right along-side mitigation in most games.

In all honesty toughness is not getting the shaft, its mitigating non-agony damage the boss and its pets are doing just like vitality builds are soaking up non-agony damage the boss and its pets are doing. If you have agony do % of the base stats it equals out. You will be able to heal up just fine and your mitigation will protect you. So if you lose 40% of your health (without any vitality) to agony with toughness you will have 60% left, where vitality will lose 40% the base HP leaving total HP above 60%, but keep in mind 80% hp w/o mitigation will keep you alive just as long with 60% hp with mitigation. Just because vitality builds will have more % hp left than toughness builds does not mean the player will stay alive any longer.

SOAK tanking requires a large enough of a health pool to overcome the lack of mitigation / viable healing (and this is substantially larger) and be applied against a set amount of incomming damage allowing that particular player to last longer than an ally who is not set to soak.
- or –
the applicable heals have to scale by % as opposed to set numbers.

Without one of these 2, you have a character that still dies quickly and just simply can’t keep up with heals since the incomming damage is % based and in GW2 heals are a set amount. With +Heal Power being mostly irrelivant, it means Vitality (soak) tanking isn’t viable when a debuff is based on % health in damage.

Below is a fictitious and exaggerated example to better explain the principal

Incomming damage from enemy is irrelevant because it is equal for both. For this example, we will only consider the debuff damage because it is variable based on %.

Beginning Health / Information
Health Pool 1: 20,000
Health Pool 2: 10,000
Incomming Damage from Debuff: 25% every 5 seconds
Heal: 5k every 10 seconds

Tick 1
Health Pool 1: 15,000
Health Pool 2: 7,500

Tick 2
Health Pool 1: 10,000
Health Pool 2: 5,000

Both heal
Health Pool 1: 15,000
Health Pool 2: 10,000

Tick 3
Health Pool 1: 10,000
Health Pool 2: 7,500

Tick 4
Health Pool 1: 5,000
Health Pool 2: 5,000

Both heal
Health Pool 1: 10,000
Health Pool 2: 10,000

Tick 5
Health Pool 1: 5,000
Health Pool 2: 7,500

Tick 6
Health Pool 1: 0 (DEAD)
Health Pool 2: 5000

I hope this better explains the concern the OP is expressing.

Goloith.6349:

Have you ever heard of EVE Online? SOAK tanks have had their place right along-side mitigation in most games.

Ignoring the fact that EVE is an exception to the rule: soak tanking in EVE is either used to give you enough time to escape a fight you don’t really want to be in (EHP stacking on capitals and other stuff), or to bait an enemy into sticking around long enough for reinforcements to arrive. Even in one of the only games you actually see them in, they’re a really poor solution to taking damage over any length of time, especially if someone is burning cap to repair you.

Shini.7542:

Thats what the game was advertised with but still there are classes that cant take one of the roles. while almost every class can dps rather good (some got more burst, some more continues dmg) not everyone can take the role of a tank or healer.

True, classes are slowly coming back. But noone here seems talking about a particular infusion, who guess, make a big difference about the thread’s topic: soothing infusion

Nethril.7413:

SOAK tanking requires a large enough of a health pool to overcome the lack of mitigation / viable healing (and this is substantially larger) and be applied against a set amount of incomming damage allowing that particular player to last longer than an ally who is not set to soak.
- or –
the applicable heals have to scale by % as opposed to set numbers.

Without one of these 2, you have a character that still dies quickly and just simply can’t keep up with heals since the incomming damage is % based and in GW2 heals are a set amount. With +Heal Power being mostly irrelivant, it means Vitality (soak) tanking isn’t viable when a debuff is based on % health in damage.

Below is a fictitious and exaggerated example to better explain the principal

Incomming damage from enemy is irrelevant because it is equal for both. For this example, we will only consider the debuff damage because it is variable based on %.

Beginning Health / Information
Health Pool 1: 20,000
Health Pool 2: 10,000
Incomming Damage from Debuff: 25% every 5 seconds
Heal: 5k every 10 seconds

Tick 1
Health Pool 1: 15,000
Health Pool 2: 7,500

Tick 2
Health Pool 1: 10,000
Health Pool 2: 5,000

Both heal
Health Pool 1: 15,000
Health Pool 2: 10,000

Tick 3
Health Pool 1: 10,000
Health Pool 2: 7,500

Tick 4
Health Pool 1: 5,000
Health Pool 2: 5,000

Both heal
Health Pool 1: 10,000
Health Pool 2: 10,000

Tick 5
Health Pool 1: 5,000
Health Pool 2: 7,500

Tick 6
Health Pool 1: 0 (DEAD)
Health Pool 2: 5000

I hope this better explains the concern the OP is expressing.[/quote]

RIGHT ON THE MONEY!

Think of all the different stat variations on armor as teeter totters and then look at the ones with vitality. The ones with vitality is like a teeter totter that is broke with both sides down. There is Risk vs Reward in all builds. Less HP (Risk) and Higher DPS (Reward) Now think of vitality with Higher HP (Risk) and Lower DPS (Risk) with no reward. Tougness is still Lower DPS (Risk) and Higher Mitigation (Reward).

Also have you seen the 1600mm soak/rep tank Ishtar in Eve? When I played years ago it was unstoppable. Yes you couldn’t out rep the damage outright, but neither could you sustain the alpha-damage. What you could do is count on your soak tank and your repairer to sustain yourself just long enough. This applies to soak tanks in this game. That dodging gives you a chance to build a little HP back into your pool.

Dont forget toughness is also very weak, 1000 tougness is only like 30% less damage taken from physical attacks. On the other hand 1000 precision would raise your crit chance from 4% (what I have with full soldier build) to over 50%.
To make toughness on par with precision it would have to do more, but thats a different topic.

Malediktus.9250:

Dont forget toughness is also very weak, 1000 tougness is only like 30% less damage taken from physical attacks. On the other hand 1000 precision would raise your crit chance from 4% (what I have with full soldier build) to over 50%.

46 % more critical chance = 23 % extra damage~ at base crit damage. So toughness already wins that fight.

Tbh I really think stats are pretty balanced at the moment. The problem is that Agony is really throwing a wrench into things.

Goloith.6349:

Omg, thanks for the post above!

Tell you whats a simple fix, just have Agony do a % damage of your intial/base HP (not buffed by stats). That way regardless of what Profession/Class you are you won’t be singled out. Then on top of that, vitality builds won’t be punished either!

This is such a good idea that I’m going to do my part to make sure it repeatedly appears in the bit of the thread most people will read.

Yes, such a good idea for low HP classses. There is probably a reason why some classes have lower health pools.

Wethospu.6437:

Yes, such a good idea for low HP classses. There is probably a reason why some classes have lower health pools.

Hmm? If Im understanding it correctly his idea would punish high hitpoint and low hitpoint classes equally while at the same time allowing all classes to spec in vitality and have an advantage against agony from it. It would be be less punishment for high hp builds of all classes.

If classes are balanced then classes with higher base stats should more likely take damage (=tank). If Agony affects them “equally” and one class gets it more likely then it is not balanced.

Wethospu.6437:

If classes are balanced then classes with higher base stats should more likely take damage (=tank). If Agony affects them “equally” and one class gets it more likely then it is not balanced.

Isn’t that what he is suggesting? That people take a % of base class hp?

Milennin.4825:

It’s a fail concept anyway. It doesn’t belong in a game that is supposed to be about player skill.

For a game about player skill, it also waste the mechanic of Stamina as it is simply a party oriented ability and almost becomes useless in solo play.

And for a game with no tank or healer, the concept of Stamina should’ve been pinnacle, but instead it is almost a gimmick due to the uselessly slow regen rate.

The system seem to want player die equally with agony but the design is fail not to consider professions.

The agony punishes all player who high HP and low HP regenerate skill player. e.g. warrior with healing signet. Yes u may say your can change your build. But the other healing skill for warrior either not highest in HP return or HP return depend on adrenaline.

Webba.3071:

Wethospu.6437:

Yes, such a good idea for low HP classses. There is probably a reason why some classes have lower health pools.

Hmm? If Im understanding it correctly his idea would punish high hitpoint and low hitpoint classes equally while at the same time allowing all classes to spec in vitality and have an advantage against agony from it. It would be be less punishment for high hp builds of all classes.

Which doesn’t at all solve the issue of making Agony equal for everyone, it just makes vit-stacking the new “agony resistance”.