Guild Wars 2

Quick question regarding thief. I usually see I think d/d or s/p is there anything wrong wiith d/p for dungeons? Its the set I’m most comfortable with.

D/P burns more a lot initiative when trying to stealth compared to D/D, as well as having lower DPS due to longer skill use times. It’s handy for skipping though.

D/d gives more dmg for short fights.
S/P gives better utility – interrupts and blinds for long fights or where defiant removal is needed.

D/P – is not as effective – as it does not carry highest DPS or interrupts for long fights.
It’s use is a niche and for some very specific fights.
P/P is pretty unloved due to low sustained DPS (conditions are weak) or removal of interrupts

You are welcome to PHIW (Play How I Want) – but don’t expect any Meta team serious about dungeons to run D/P all the way.

As thief I am constantly swapping which weapon sets I am using and combinations.
I would suggest that you master all the weapon combinations available to your profession – then work out why each boss should be what type of weapons needed for a smooth optimal encounter.

S/D is really good in Mai Trin’s fractal and to some extend, Cliffside boss. Totally noobie friendly and awesome.

If it’s what you’re comfortable with, go for it.

The advantages of d/p:
- lots of gap closers (heartseeker and shadow shot)
- Stealth combo for backstabs (black powder + heartseeker + backstab)
- Interrupts
- blinds
- good autoattack for single/duo target.

The disadvantages:
- d/d will have higher DPS with cheaper (initiative-wise) stealthing for backstabs
- s/p will cleave better
- s/p will let you facetank most things with Pistol Whip.

If you’re most comfortable with d/p, go for it. It’s a nice compromise of damage and utility. But do yourself a favor and get used to s/p as well — it really is a handy combo for clearing trash or trivializing some bosses (cough belka).

but cloak and dagger vs black powder cost the same initiative to stealth. Only difference is I throw a heartseeker but its not like the damage is wasted for that 3 ini.

I see the advantages of s/p. but not seeing d/d unless I’m missing something.

It costs 9 initiative to enter stealth using D/P compared to 6 with D/D, and let’s not forget that Cloak and Dagger hits harder than Heartseeker above 25% and applies vulnerability too.

Lindbur.2537:

It costs 9 initiative to enter stealth using D/P compared to 6 with D/D, and let’s not forget that Cloak and Dagger hits harder than Heartseeker above 25% and applies vulnerability too.

Does it? I was looking the other day just at the tool tips and it looked like the same damage above 50% and after 50% HS gains. I’m not surprised if the tooltip is wrong just saying confirmation that it is would be cool

To the OP.

To play your thief well you should be jumping between S/P, D/D and D/P depending on the fight. If there is nothing special and all you need is damage D/D. Need the cleave/evades S/P. Need the interrupt and blinds while still maximizing DPS against a target or two, D/P. I’m changing my weapons between almost every encounter. And skips I’ll generally run X/P + Shortbow… and actually Shortbow doesn’t leave my secondary much.

If the wiki’s power coefficients are correct, Cloak and Dagger pulls ahead when the mob is above 25% HP. Heartseeker below 50% has the same power coefficient as Cloak and Dagger, but Cloak and Dagger has a higher base hit. It wins out only slightly in damage, but applies 3 vuln and stealth, all for 6 initiative.

You do more dmg when your initiatives are higher than 6.

Iris Ng.9845:

You do more dmg when your initiatives are higher than 6.

That’s a trait, but yeah, using D/P to stealth causes you to drop below that threshold and lose the 10% modifier.

So long story short: d/p is fine unless you’re minmaxing or need cleave/evades :-)

I think I might start going d/p on Arah p1 ooze. When we did it last night I was throwing down smoke screen before heartseekering back in on bounce 6.

Felt good man.

Black powder would be handy, since I’m HS’ing anyway….God I love playing thief xD

dlonie.6547:

So long story short: d/p is fine unless you’re minmaxing or need cleave/evades :-)

I think I might start going d/p on Arah p1 ooze. When we did it last night I was throwing down smoke screen before heartseekering back in on bounce 6.

Felt good man.

Black powder would be handy, since I’m HS’ing anyway….God I love playing thief xD

I saw that

And exactly on the min/max thing. Like for instance there, if you used black powder you’d be dropping below your initiative threshold and lower DPS.

BTW thaddeus just posted a trick on that I hadn’t seen before. THrow a Shadow Trap back at the NPC so when the ooze dies you can SR, pick up the orb, shadow trap and turn it in without having to run all slow like.

Jerus.4350:

dlonie.6547:

I think I might start going d/p on Arah p1 ooze. When we did it last night I was throwing down smoke screen before heartseekering back in on bounce 6.

Felt good man.

I saw that

And exactly on the min/max thing. Like for instance there, if you used black powder you’d be dropping below your initiative threshold and lower DPS.

Hmm, I usually keep 3 points in trickery for extra initiative, and if I time it right, I might be able to stay above the threshold (15 – 6 – 3 = 6), though this would be a perfect spot to take revealed training instead of the trickery …hmm….

Or, I may be able to pop BP immediately after dodging and restore some initiative by the next HS, but still proc the combo, getting back above 6 in time for BS. Either way, I hate trying to CnD there, because I usually can’t finish off a complete AA chain before it’s time to dodge again :/

BTW thaddeus just posted a trick on that I hadn’t seen before. THrow a Shadow Trap back at the NPC so when the ooze dies you can SR, pick up the orb, shadow trap and turn it in without having to run all slow like.

O.o I’mma have to try that.

It’s sorta funny, my guild (including myself here) is terribad at Arah p1 now. We’ve had to lowman dungeons for so long due to lack of interest that we never had enough people to do tar. Now that we’ve got full parties again, we seem to path every freakin’ mob to us on every skip, lol. Our p4 runs are smoother than our p1s xD

Thanks for the replies. I got another dagger and it was an easy transition. Will grab a sword next. Already getting used to switching around weapons and builds depending on what I’m doing (I came mainly from wvw hence the d-p.)

Mightybird.6034:

(I came mainly from wvw hence the d-p.)

I usually feel like I got dp’d when I WvW.

Jerus.4350:

Does it? I was looking the other day just at the tool tips and it looked like the same damage above 50% and after 50% HS gains. I’m not surprised if the tooltip is wrong just saying confirmation that it is would be cool

CnD dmg is different in PvE and PvP. In PvP it have a coefficient of 1, in PvE its 1.5.

HS at 50%+ have a coefficient of 1, 50-25% its 1.5 like the CnD and its 2 at less than 25%. So its always better dps with a CnD unless for the last burst or when you drop a smokescreen and HS to stealh with half the cost in initiative when the target is at less than 50% hp.

dlonie.6547:

It’s sorta funny, my guild (including myself here) is terribad at Arah p1 now. We’ve had to lowman dungeons for so long due to lack of interest that we never had enough people to do tar. Now that we’ve got full parties again, we seem to path every freakin’ mob to us on every skip, lol. Our p4 runs are smoother than our p1s xD

Do you let mobs come at you when you are stealth before running? Because mobs know you are there and are walking slowly toward you, if you just keep running they gonna follow you. Not a problem if you keep running, but if you stop like at a boss, they gonna be a pain in the kitten . You just need to SR where they are, lets them come to you and when they stop moving, then you start running. They won’t follow you anymore.

You can clearly see it at 5min in that video (the first one I could find)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLHcJeEmsX8

Maybe that’s the problem.

Thaddeus.4891:

dlonie.6547:

It’s sorta funny, my guild (including myself here) is terribad at Arah p1 now. We’ve had to lowman dungeons for so long due to lack of interest that we never had enough people to do tar. Now that we’ve got full parties again, we seem to path every freakin’ mob to us on every skip, lol. Our p4 runs are smoother than our p1s xD

Do you let mobs come at you when you are stealth before running? Because mobs know you are there and are walking slowly toward you, if you just keep running they gonna follow you. Not a problem if you keep running, but if you stop like at a boss, they gonna be a pain in the kitten . You just need to SR where they are, lets them come to you and when they stop moving, then you start running. They won’t follow you anymore.

You can clearly see it at 5min in that video (the first one I could find)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLHcJeEmsX8

Maybe that’s the problem.

That’s part of it. I tend to not notice this happening, or start getting antsy about stealth running out because of waiting. Jerus pointed out the oozes at the first skip when we were running the other day, so I’ll be keeping a closer eye on them in the future.

We also seem to keep pulling the mobs after ooze into the ooze room while getting ready to stealth — I don’t remember that happening before, but it happens a lot lately.

I should probably just stop being lazy and actually put three points into Shadow Arts for the skips to give a little breathing room for letting mobs catch up

dlonie.6547:

We also seem to keep pulling the mobs after ooze into the ooze room while getting ready to stealth — I don’t remember that happening before, but it happens a lot lately.

That happen when you get too close of them and wait before stealth. Usually it happen either if you try to get rid of a turret there or if you wait at the stealth spot for ppl to be ready. You should regroup in the middle of teh ooze’s room and when everybody is ready go foward and stealth immediatly.