Guild Wars 2

Heya guys,

I’m hoping this post gets read by the developers of this game as well as my fellow players.

Ok, I love Guild Wars 2. As soon as I saw it in beta I knew the developers were really pouring so much into this game. There are so many great features that we just haven’t seen anywhere else. They have also tried to break us free of the insane gear grind WoW has brainwashed us with, they even attempted to try a game outside the trinity.

The game world itself is beautiful, sublime and crammed with unique places to find. Having the ability to dive into the stunning water is just the icing on the cake. Massive server vs server areas with a fully working siege model, interesting classes that look amazing and so much more. On top of all this, free to play! In short I thought all our MMO wishes had been granted.

So here we are months on from launch now and all around me people are leaving Guild Wars 2. So what gives?

Have ArenaNet dropped the ball? Well no, not really. On top of an already huge game we’ve been given an almost unbelievable amount of content. Lost shore, Halloween, Christmas were three big ones all with themes, items, activities and all designed with such detail and scale it seems insane this stuff isn’t permanent. Also we’ve had Fractals, Superbox and now the living story (which is finally starting to get going finally). We’ve also seen so many other fixes and improvements such a culling fix and so much more. I think AN have really kept to their promise and then some.

I think the problem is two fold. First up what I thought was a massive plus now turns out to be a problem in the long term – free to play. As a guild officer we’ve struggled to keep our members interested in the game and over the last month less and less log in. As a big PvP guild we are in contact with many other guilds and this pattern is being seen across the board, this worries me as ArenaNet don’t seem to be acknowledging this. The recent price drop makes me wonder if they are just keeping their poker face up, which is fair enough. If I’m honest I’m not really sure what they should do.

(part 2)

The second big problem is progression, or lack there of. AN should be congratulated for trying so hard to break us free of gear grind, a situation where players play the same dungeon over and over and over again for a 0.05% chance of a piece of gear. It’s such a waste of time and when you stand back its actually really sad. Turns out, most players still want this reward system. There’s no denying it, Guild Wars 2 is painfully lacking in high level content that an entire guild can take part in, up until guild missions it been WvsW. I love guild missions, they are awesome and add so much.. but it’s not raiding.. MMO players want raiding, it’s that simple. Raiding that is hard to beat, that rewards players with nice items, this then adds a necessity for players to be in a guild. I remember players desperately fighting to get raid spot in WoW because they knew only the best guilds would get them through the high end dungeons.

On a side note I saw Shatterer killed in 40 seconds yesterday, it’s so easy to kill now. Oh how I would love it if one day all the farmers turned up for their quick win and it landed and wiped the floor with them. These epic bosses need to have their difficulty really looked because in the context of a challenge they are devoid of any.

Lastly I’d just like to mention WvsW. Initially I was bowled over by its scale and brilliance but now I’m seeing the big flaw. Nothing counts for anything, every victory can be undone within minutes. For some (me) the sheer joy of the fight is the fun part but is gutting to see all your wins undone by the time you log back on. I think we really need some new objectives that make players want to fight for them. Imagine an objective that gave you 20% off items on the gem store..

Ok so if you’ve not gone blind yet then stick with me I’m almost done. While many players have already moved on from Guild Wars 2 I suspect many like me still remain. We love to just be in the game world and admire it for what it is. For me this is what AN need to focus on.

- adding more player controlled content like player housing (take a look at what Wildstar is doing, housing that has an actual use)
- guild housing that acts as your own Guild vs Guild arena
- a new skill system where you gain skills from bosses you beat. You make these encounters very difficult and in turn give guilds a reason to exist again. We need to be able to offer our members more than a TS server and some good music
- give players something to play for (I know your already doing this in many ways) like big objectives in WvsW
- make content tougher to beat
- a dungeon finder! I have never understood why this isn’t in the game. Having to spam LA is not a worthwhile interaction I’ll miss

I posting this not because I’m unhappy with Guild Wars 2, but I can see the problems it’s facing and I want this game to be a success.

Thanks for reading my post.

PvP is quite different from PvE. I think SPvP is probably the least popular part of the game for a number of reasons.

First, only one game mode is boring over the long haul. The lack of meaningful (I hate using that word) tournaments and standings are something PvPers really want, and various other odds and ends that make the game hard to stay with.

I think PVe is faring better over all to PvP and I think WvW is probably doing okay too (not sure how it compares over all though).

I think once Anet annouces some real PvP tournaments, with a cash prize, suddenly you’ll see interest. And I think that’s coming. First they had to get the observer mode going which is really good.

Then they put in the competitive aspects and it should come back to life.

First up what I thought was a massive plus now turns out to be a problem in the long term – free to play. As a big PvP guild we are in contact with many other guilds and this pattern is being seen across the board, this worries me as ArenaNet don’t seem to be acknowledging this.

Wait, you’re actually saying that the lack of a subscription fee is bad? How many people do you think bought the game exactly because it had no subscription fee? How many games have recently been released with a sub fee that later had to go without one in an attempt to salvage their dying games?
One of the biggest things that turn non-WoW people off from MMORPGs is subscription fees. That and the fact that the alternative is often an F2P game where content is truly gated unless you paid or the high-level play is “pay-to-win”.
Heck, I’ll personally say that I would have never bought Guild Wars 2 if it had a subscription fee.

The second big problem is progression, or lack there of. AN should be congratulated for trying so hard to break us free of gear grind, a situation where players play the same dungeon over and over and over again for a 0.05% chance of a piece of gear. Turns out, most players still want this reward system.

Now you’re just making a massive generalization. Just because you have a guild, that could be considered large, that seems to want it, does not mean that the same is true for everyone. Heck, have you ever considered how many players there are that are part of smaller guilds? People that have no guilds? You don’t get to hear their voice by talking to people within guilds.

There’s no denying it, Guild Wars 2 is painfully lacking in high level content that an entire guild can take part in, up until guild missions it been WvsW. I love guild missions, they are awesome and add so much.. but it’s not raiding. MMO players want raiding, it’s that simple.

Look at the kittenstorm that Fractals of the Mists was. When it was first introduced as the only means to get Ascended gear, people wrote hundreds, thousands of posts literally telling ANet to go kitten themselves. Now ask yourself, what would it take for a similar dungeon to work for your guild. Would you really think that a big guild would be satisfied with a difficult dungeon offering nothing but skins? Would you really think that those people wouldn’t rather have it drop something like Ascended armor or weapons, which doesn’t exist in the game yet? Would you think that the people not into the dungeon grinding thing would be happy with that?
Honestly, if they added content that pretty much required you to be in a guild, you can bet your behind that tons of people would rage. We already have people complaining about how smaller guilds cannot do missions.

Lastly I’d just like to mention WvsW. Initially I was bowled over by its scale and brilliance but now I’m seeing the big flaw. Nothing counts for anything, every victory can be undone within minutes. I think we really need some new objectives that make players want to fight for them. Imagine an objective that gave you 20% off items on the gem store..

Ok, now you’re just kidding yourself. 20% off on gem store stuff? That would just result in everyone farming the crap out of that one objective, doing nothing else all day. I am pretty sure that there are better ways to improve WvW than adding ridiculous rewards.

- a new skill system where you gain skills from bosses you beat. You make these encounters very difficult and in turn give guilds a reason to exist again. We need to be able to offer our members more than a TS server and some good music
- give players something to play for (I know your already doing this in many ways) like big objectives in WvsW
- make content tougher to beat

As for skills that you can get from bosses, that’s going to provide some issues. Firstly, it’ll be a nightmare to balance, which is exactly why ANet made Guild Wars 2 in the first place. Secondly, it’ll give a ridiculous advantage for anyone who is in an organized guild. As someone who’s not a guild-type person, I would be pretty kitten kitten ed if they made it so that you’d have to join a guild to partake in missions that give you powerful or beautiful new skills.
As for difficult content, that has many, many issues. For one, most people do not want difficult content. Look at how many people are running CoF P1 for money and compare those numbers to how many are running some of the more difficult dungeons. For two, difficult content is difficult to provide. You have to make the content ridiculously difficult or you will simply run into the issue of people completing the content way too early. And again, that leads to most people never playing that content. And making content for a tiny portion of your playerbase is kinda a dumb idea.

http://www.arena.net/

At the bottom of the page is a list of job placements they want filled. Good luck with your application.

Olba.5376:

First up what I thought was a massive plus now turns out to be a problem in the long term – free to play. As a big PvP guild we are in contact with many other guilds and this pattern is being seen across the board, this worries me as ArenaNet don’t seem to be acknowledging this.

Wait, you’re actually saying that the lack of a subscription fee is bad? How many people do you think bought the game exactly because it had no subscription fee? How many games have recently been released with a sub fee that later had to go without one in an attempt to salvage their dying games?
One of the biggest things that turn non-WoW people off from MMORPGs is subscription fees. That and the fact that the alternative is often an F2P game where content is truly gated unless you paid or the high-level play is “pay-to-win”.
Heck, I’ll personally say that I would have never bought Guild Wars 2 if it had a subscription fee.

The second big problem is progression, or lack there of. AN should be congratulated for trying so hard to break us free of gear grind, a situation where players play the same dungeon over and over and over again for a 0.05% chance of a piece of gear. Turns out, most players still want this reward system.

Now you’re just making a massive generalization. Just because you have a guild, that could be considered large, that seems to want it, does not mean that the same is true for everyone. Heck, have you ever considered how many players there are that are part of smaller guilds? People that have no guilds? You don’t get to hear their voice by talking to people within guilds.

There’s no denying it, Guild Wars 2 is painfully lacking in high level content that an entire guild can take part in, up until guild missions it been WvsW. I love guild missions, they are awesome and add so much.. but it’s not raiding. MMO players want raiding, it’s that simple.

Look at the kittenstorm that Fractals of the Mists was. When it was first introduced as the only means to get Ascended gear, people wrote hundreds, thousands of posts literally telling ANet to go kitten themselves. Now ask yourself, what would it take for a similar dungeon to work for your guild. Would you really think that a big guild would be satisfied with a difficult dungeon offering nothing but skins? Would you really think that those people wouldn’t rather have it drop something like Ascended armor or weapons, which doesn’t exist in the game yet? Would you think that the people not into the dungeon grinding thing would be happy with that?
Honestly, if they added content that pretty much required you to be in a guild, you can bet your behind that tons of people would rage. We already have people complaining about how smaller guilds cannot do missions.

Lastly I’d just like to mention WvsW. Initially I was bowled over by its scale and brilliance but now I’m seeing the big flaw. Nothing counts for anything, every victory can be undone within minutes. I think we really need some new objectives that make players want to fight for them. Imagine an objective that gave you 20% off items on the gem store..

Ok, now you’re just kidding yourself. 20% off on gem store stuff? That would just result in everyone farming the crap out of that one objective, doing nothing else all day. I am pretty sure that there are better ways to improve WvW than adding ridiculous rewards.

- a new skill system where you gain skills from bosses you beat. You make these encounters very difficult and in turn give guilds a reason to exist again. We need to be able to offer our members more than a TS server and some good music
- give players something to play for (I know your already doing this in many ways) like big objectives in WvsW
- make content tougher to beat

As for skills that you can get from bosses, that’s going to provide some issues. Firstly, it’ll be a nightmare to balance, which is exactly why ANet made Guild Wars 2 in the first place. Secondly, it’ll give a ridiculous advantage for anyone who is in an organized guild. As someone who’s not a guild-type person, I would be pretty kitten kitten ed if they made it so that you’d have to join a guild to partake in missions that give you powerful or beautiful new skills.
As for difficult content, that has many, many issues. For one, most people do not want difficult content. Look at how many people are running CoF P1 for money and compare those numbers to how many are running some of the more difficult dungeons. For two, difficult content is difficult to provide. You have to make the content ridiculously difficult or you will simply run into the issue of people completing the content way too early. And again, that leads to most people never playing that content. And making content for a tiny portion of your playerbase is kinda a dumb idea.

Way to go, give absolutely no constructive criticism…

KingClash.3186:

Way to go, give absolutely no constructive criticism…

Yeah and the OP made a kittenton of a post that pretty much reads that he wants a subscription fee and raids. Your point? Because I’ll tell you, if he has just kept to saying “I and my guild want raids and a subscription fee and here’s why”, I wouldn’t have minded. But he spouted on and on using generalizations that simply don’t hold nor make sense considering what we’ve seen of our general player base so far.

You have misunderstood my point. I am in favour of no subscription fees. I have been pleasantly surprised by how much we have been given in a game that doesn’t require a penny after the initial purchase.

We all know the subscription model is dead as a door nail and if fact companies like Turbine have found themselves making three times more money once they got free to play. What I am saying is that when your not paying £15 a month for a game you feel less under pressure to get your money’s worth and so this means players can take a few weeks off. This is great but for a guild leader it’s a nightmare as anyone here who’s done it know guild admin can be a hard job.

As for the 20% off, I’m just talking about motivation in games. At the moment players are finding there is no motivation to play WvsW, no motivation to do dungeons or even log on. When you dangle something players want you will see action. Guilds will become necessary and colaberation between guilds will take place.

If you read my post properly you will see I’m very happy with the game in its current form, I can live without raids or gear progression. I’m just trying to shout up (and hopefully someone at the top will hear) that this game is loosing players in droves and these are the things I think they need to address to stop this.

KingClash.3186:

Way to go, give absolutely no constructive criticism…

I do not entirely agree with what he said, neither am I with what the OP said, but he did provide us with good answer to every point he quoted. You’re just being sour.

Raids…

I am just now unsubbing on WoW…because the Blizz model for this game is “all PVE roads lead to the raid….otherwise you are wasting your time.”

If you create raids with all of the attendant rewards that minimize the rewards and pleasure from other PVE endeavors, then we have nothing more than WoW with good graphics. It seems to me (from my own peculiar perspective) that Anet has tried to adhere to the notion that players should be able to play to their own style and preferences and still earn meaningful rewards. Sure, there are rewards in dungeons, particularly the explorer mode, that are not available to us mere mortals. I don’t have a problem with players who do these kinds of things getting some rewards that I cannot have. I do have a problem, though, when you set up a gear progression/grind in which nothing of substance is available without being a truly hardcore raider/dungeon-runner.

In short…I am happy with the current design.

What has finally put me off this game are not the reasons you mentioned. It is the lack of teamplay. PvE is a faceroll. All you need to do is know when to dodge. WvW is zerg vs zerg, and nothing you do or don’t do makes an impact. sPvP is bland. And all the while, there is no real reason to play as a team. There is no need for communication, no need for a good leader.

I don’t care about the rewards. I don’t need rewards as long as I can feel I accomplished something difficult with my friends, as a coordinated team. As one. Gw2 is too much about “me”, and not about “the team”.
In GW1 (talking about GvG and early – before heroes – PvE) you needed a good team. You needed to synch your builds. To anticipate your teammates and your enemy. To know not only your character, but the characters of everyone around you. And when you won, you won as a team.

Teamwork creates bonds. Bonds will keep people ingame. There are no bonds that kept me in GW2. There is no need for teamwork. I don’t feel like a significant part in a group. You don’t need to coordinate to achieve something – anything.

sigh It’s a good game. It really is. The world is beautiful, the exploring is without compare. I cannot stand traditional questing anymore. I love being able to walk and cast and dodge. But the lack of teamwork has drained my interest of the game completely. Can’t even be bothered to check the temporary content anymore.

I’m still keeping track of new developments. Until then, it’s LoL for me.

I think its the nature of gaming these days. There is a certain market that literally devours content. They jump from game to game gobbling content and screaming for more and more on the respective forums.

On the other hand there people that spend years in a game….those 2 extremes balanced by those somewhere in the middle.

I’m not seeing this vast exit from the game. But most of my friends are the type to hang for several years in a game. Exiting temporarily for a bit to beta a new game or try one out, then coming back to the main game.

For me, GW2 is now the meter that I hold all new games up to. If they aren’t as good, I’ll come back here….as in the case of Neverwinter.