Guild Wars 2

Ashen.2907:

I am not opposed to the idea of rewarding those content creators that do so much to support the game. The amount of work that I am sure goes into the Dulfy site is awe inspiring to me.

Give them gems. Name NPCs, locations, monsters, weapons, etc after them. Give them a free legendary of their choice. Give them each one of each legendary. Something seems appropriate to me. But…

The sort of, “reward,” mentioned in this thread rewards them at the cost of other paying customers. I consider that poor service and an unethical business practice.

Nobody is suggesting that ANet is pleased with or encouraged this. ANet simply didn’t expect they needed to hide away the details because a partner (or their friends) would take advantage of that information. Just like how ANet didn’t expect players would intentionally fail a sub event of a meta to take advantage of a quick respawn timer to farm.

Astralporing.1957:

Behellagh.1468:

As for why ANet doesn’t hire them straight up, cause they are still considered unbiased news sites.

That’s even more reason to consider insider trading a bad thing (at least from our point of view). Because as long as this advantage exists and some of the content creators do profit from it, those sources cannot be considered unbiased. How can we believe they are acting in good faith, when they have a tangible advantage attached to how pleased Anet is with them?

Remember I’m playing devil’s advocate here.

Behellagh.1468:

Ashen.2907:

I am not opposed to the idea of rewarding those content creators that do so much to support the game. The amount of work that I am sure goes into the Dulfy site is awe inspiring to me.

Give them gems. Name NPCs, locations, monsters, weapons, etc after them. Give them a free legendary of their choice. Give them each one of each legendary. Something seems appropriate to me. But…

The sort of, “reward,” mentioned in this thread rewards them at the cost of other paying customers. I consider that poor service and an unethical business practice.

Nobody is suggesting that ANet is pleased with or encouraged this. ANet simply didn’t expect they needed to hide away the details because a partner (or their friends) would take advantage of that information. Just like how ANet didn’t expect players would intentionally fail a sub event of a meta to take advantage of a quick respawn timer to farm.

I didn’t make it clear, and so apologize, but I do not assume that Anet is permitting this intentionally. I should have said that, “IF,” they are choosing to reward one group at the expense of other paying customers it would be poor service, etc.

Ashen.2907:

Behellagh.1468:

Ashen.2907:

I am not opposed to the idea of rewarding those content creators that do so much to support the game. The amount of work that I am sure goes into the Dulfy site is awe inspiring to me.

Give them gems. Name NPCs, locations, monsters, weapons, etc after them. Give them a free legendary of their choice. Give them each one of each legendary. Something seems appropriate to me. But…

The sort of, “reward,” mentioned in this thread rewards them at the cost of other paying customers. I consider that poor service and an unethical business practice.

Nobody is suggesting that ANet is pleased with or encouraged this. ANet simply didn’t expect they needed to hide away the details because a partner (or their friends) would take advantage of that information. Just like how ANet didn’t expect players would intentionally fail a sub event of a meta to take advantage of a quick respawn timer to farm.

I didn’t make it clear, and so apologize, but I do not assume that Anet is permitting this intentionally. I should have said that, “IF,” they are choosing to reward one group at the expense of other paying customers it would be poor service, etc.

And I hat to nitpick the point but who was hurt? This isn’t robbing Peter to pay Paul as the effect of the change would happen regardless to when the info is released or to whom. Peter was getting robbed regardless. It’s actually a case who got the chance to avoid getting hurt and if they had the means, profit off of it.

While the idea of publishing the patch notes for all to see sounds ideal, in reality there is still only a small subset of the player population would be in a position where they could avoid the negative repercuptions and thus profit from it. Everyone else will still be just as hurt

Behellagh.1468:

And what is ANet doing other than using them as a means to connect with the player base better?

By ignoring the situation they’re sending out the message that there are different rules for different players – that if you’re chummy with Anet you can play using a different set of rules (and one that’s not even clearly defined).
That’s not “connecting with the playerbase”. That’s the exact opposite.

Behellagh.1468:

While the idea of publishing the patch notes for all to see sounds ideal, in reality there is still only a small subset of the player population would be in a position where they could avoid the negative repercuptions and thus profit from it.

It wouldn’t be a predefined subset of the playerbase, though (and the advantage would be much, much smaller).

Honestly, I’m pretty sure Anet is against insider information getting abused. My argument is simply this: Why get mad when it benefits those who do favors for Anet? If there are some who feel that this isn’t “competitive” since they’re shut out from getting information, why don’t they become content providers too? If they get popular, Anet could grant them interviews, invites to Anet HQ in Seattle, and even access to test servers.

Well, I dont mind that much. Didnt support Anet with more money since they false advertised HoT with new legendarys etc. Instead bombing the gemstore with skins over skins every week. I`m just upset for the people buying gold for gems or getting gold out of lions chests. Playerbase vs. Partners. As company I would choose the playerbase thought and maybe have an open dialogue with them, instead of being all quiet.

Astralporing.1957:

Behellagh.1468:

And what is ANet doing other than using them as a means to connect with the player base better?

By ignoring the situation they’re sending out the message that there are different rules for different players – that if you’re chummy with Anet you can play using a different set of rules (and one that’s not even clearly defined).
That’s not “connecting with the playerbase”. That’s the exact opposite.

I read that question as “What is ANet doing by pre-releasing patch notes and allow test server access to their partners?” rather than what they are doing about the the obvious use of “inside information” by someone(s).

But way earlier I said this will be treated like any other situation where “punishment” is doled out, which is they won’t comment on it. Unless of course the “punished” make a public fuss about it on here or Reddit then they will bludgeon them with proof. But giving previews to partners isn’t going to change, it on paper at least, is a fine idea.

They don’t have to be transparent about any changes about what is given to partners. The problem is, as someone else already acknowledge, that you can’t prevent leaks. So we are still going to see blips on the TP and people will still blame leaks on partners even if ANet sanitize the TP info from partners. So if ANet announce changes a blip still happens, which it will, people will say ANet lied and didn’t do anything at all.

So which is worse? Have some loose faith in the company because they are being quiet or loose faith because the company said they did something and then be accused of lying?

Arenanet needs to open the test environment to all players and release pre-patch info before updating the test environment and the live servers. This would level the playing field as much as possible. There is no perfect system because of the human element but it is possible to push the bar closer.

Arenanet shouldn’t be picking winners in game or for third party sites. We all know that only a few sites are getting that information. Isn’t Arenanet giving select sites third party information exactly insider information. It is giving specially selected people insider business information so that they can profit off of it before anyone else can. Third party sites getting that information get to profit in game and out of game because of it. I mean who is really going to go to another site if there is one that always has the information up patch day. Even if you have the better site most people will go to the one that has the info posted first.

Its interesting to see that certain items are already vanishing in large amounts on the trading post. Bay leaves and vials of enchanted water are already being bought up in large amounts and reddit is speculating on if this is the sign, this time around, of some people with fore-knowledge of recipes in the fire isles content.

Similarly, there are reports of those useless slaying sigils (eg plus ten percent damage vs dredge) being snapped up.

It could be speculation, but a heck of a lot of bay leaves are moving – tens of thousands of them and that’s a lot of effort for a mere hunch.

chronometria.3708:

Its interesting to see that certain items are already vanishing in large amounts on the trading post. Bay leaves and vials of enchanted water are already being bought up in large amounts and reddit is speculating on if this is the sign, this time around, of some people with fore-knowledge of recipes in the fire isles content.

Similarly, there are reports of those useless slaying sigils (eg plus ten percent damage vs dredge) being snapped up.

It could be speculation, but a heck of a lot of bay leaves are moving – tens of thousands of them and that’s a lot of effort for a mere hunch.

Can guarantee you that a lot of those purchases are being made by trolls looking to deliberately derail the thread on reddit.

edit: case and point. If you look at Bay Leaves on the TP, the price has gone up drastically, as one might expect with a case of “insider trading”, however if you look closer at the buy orders, it is clear as day that the prices are being artificially inflated.

So then this happened:

Update: https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/52evcg/tp_watch_for_next_ls_episode/

This reads to me as “ANet isn’t going to police or respond to the claims and admitting of insider trading, so the community will have to do it, itself.”

Kudos to the folks taking that thread seriously, and trying to do something about this.

Honestly, i’m just at a loss as to why there hasn’t been any response or updates from ANet. Ah well, i shall remain updating this thread until they lock it or respond. Until that time, if you need any proof or otherwise, of what is going on here, just read the previous 4 pages.

slamfunction.7462:

Honestly, i’m just at a loss as to why there hasn’t been any response or updates from ANet.

They aren’t in the habit of responding to witch-hunts or throwing their partners to the mob for minor NDA violations. They handle that stuff quietly and internally.

Expecting otherwise is naive and continuing to stomp and moan about it is petulant.

slamfunction.7462:

As i’ve stated previously, and as i believe currently, i simply want to see the release of market-affecting information provided to ALL players at the same time, instead of the info being given to the promoters first, and then 2-4 weeks later, the rest of the playerbase.

Where did that timeframe come from? Did you just make that up to make your point?
If Anet had content ready to be played by those fansites, they wouldnt wait 2 to 4 weeks to release it to the public.
They might get it a couple of days before official release but not weeks before.

Ensign.2189:

slamfunction.7462:

Honestly, i’m just at a loss as to why there hasn’t been any response or updates from ANet.

They aren’t in the habit of responding to witch-hunts or throwing their partners to the mob for minor NDA violations. They handle that stuff quietly and internally.

Expecting otherwise is naive and continuing to stomp and moan about it is petulant.

“Minor NDA violations”? What?! A violation is a violation and should have serious legal consequences for the culprit. It’s a criminal offense. And we have no confirmation whatsoever that they have ever handled anything quietly and internally.

Sirlath.1672:

Ensign.2189:

slamfunction.7462:

Honestly, i’m just at a loss as to why there hasn’t been any response or updates from ANet.

They aren’t in the habit of responding to witch-hunts or throwing their partners to the mob for minor NDA violations. They handle that stuff quietly and internally.

Expecting otherwise is naive and continuing to stomp and moan about it is petulant.

“Minor NDA violations”? What?! A violation is a violation and should have serious legal consequences for the culprit. It’s a criminal offense. And we have no confirmation whatsoever that they have ever handled anything quietly and internally.

It’s a contractual offense, making it a civil matter, not criminal. It’s entirely up to ANet to decide what merits “serious” consequences and what doesn’t.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Sirlath.1672:

Ensign.2189:

slamfunction.7462:

Honestly, i’m just at a loss as to why there hasn’t been any response or updates from ANet.

They aren’t in the habit of responding to witch-hunts or throwing their partners to the mob for minor NDA violations. They handle that stuff quietly and internally.

Expecting otherwise is naive and continuing to stomp and moan about it is petulant.

“Minor NDA violations”? What?! A violation is a violation and should have serious legal consequences for the culprit. It’s a criminal offense. And we have no confirmation whatsoever that they have ever handled anything quietly and internally.

It’s a contractual offense, making it a civil matter, not criminal. It’s entirely up to ANet to decide what merits “serious” consequences and what doesn’t.

It actually varies from state to state. In some states it is a criminal offense.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

It’s a contractual offense, making it a civil matter, not criminal. It’s entirely up to ANet to decide what merits “serious” consequences and what doesn’t.

Strictly speaking it would be up to a civil court to determine damages. I imagine it would be very difficult for A.Net to demonstrate losses (and would be hard to demonstrate losses even for some of the relatively major NDA breaches), and thus to get anything in a civil suit.

Terminating the arrangement is really the only play they have.

Sirlath.1672:

It actually varies from state to state. In some states it is a criminal offense.

There are 0 states where breach of contract is a criminal offense.

This thread is extremely demanding and unrealistic. The news sites are promoting the game. You can’t assume everyone who got “insider information” is abusing it, as every company has serious systems in place for that. You can’t even realistically prove any of them are, because you have now way of knowing.

And Anet has no way of knowing either. Which I don’t think you understand. If one of these supposed “insider traders” exists and they’re beta testing the next area. How would Anet ever find out? Especially if they have two or more accounts.

So what I’m ultimately trying to say is you’re trying to hurt the game and it’s player’s more then you’re trying to help it.

You can say hiding the new items, and not giving the news sites information first will fix it, but it won’t. It will, however, invite unnecessary problems if Anet has to do more work that causes bugs, because beta testers aren’t actually using the items that are coming. Then news sites are potentially giving the wrong impression and speculations because of the sterilized worlds. Which is a very bad thing when you’re trying to get new players.

So since raising the prices on players in the Trading Post also isn’t supported by Anet, what you’re asking for is ridiculous. It honestly sucks that people are exploiting, but your suggestions assume the worst of players with information, and that’s not right.

Lastly it costs time and money to fix any problem in a company, no matter how small it seems. Since there will be absolutely no change to the price curve for these items, how can you say putting people on this is a good idea?

MoarChaos.8320:

This thread is extremely demanding and unrealistic. The news sites are promoting the game. You can’t assume everyone who got “insider information” is abusing it, as every company has serious systems in place for that. You can’t even realistically prove any of them are, because you have now way of knowing.

No, not necessarily everyone but some of them, even a confession here telling how “we (content creators) do it and you just have to accept it”. Pretty good way to knowing.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/51cgty/stabilizing_matrices_and_insider_trading/

https://ceddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/50bw0q/why_insider_trading_isnt_a_bad_thing/

Also people are not asking information to be blocked from the special people, but that the information (patch notes) would be release to everyone at the same time.

slamfunction.7462:

EphemeralWallaby.7643:

OP, I think you need to reread the definition of Insider Trading. Your accusation has nothing to do with the company manipulating RL stocks and securities using insider knowledge.

As much as players might want them to be, weapon/armor skins aren’t stocks.

While you’re rereading Insider Trading, I strongly urge you look up the term Libel.

~EW

Yeah…see, thats where things get to the point of ‘it just doesn’t matter’. Because it is a game, or form of entertainment, the same ethics and laws that govern a real world economy don’t apply. Thats what you are saying. And most likely, John, nor Anet, will do anything about this. So, it obligation or question of economic “fairness” resides with the community.

I’m saying that since real money is being used in THIS economy, it does matter. It matters alot. Since your basic player is being manipulated by a corporate entity.

Take it as you will.

you are never required to spend real money on the game, people who do know the risks if you’re trading for items, your item can be devalued a day later for some unadequately explored reason, I remember I got commander tag and endless halloween tonic when they were about $50 each, now endless halloween tonic is 1g at best and at some point ctags dropped to about $10 before the 300g patch iirc.

Xbon.9086:

slamfunction.7462:

EphemeralWallaby.7643:

OP, I think you need to reread the definition of Insider Trading. Your accusation has nothing to do with the company manipulating RL stocks and securities using insider knowledge.

As much as players might want them to be, weapon/armor skins aren’t stocks.

While you’re rereading Insider Trading, I strongly urge you look up the term Libel.

~EW

Yeah…see, thats where things get to the point of ‘it just doesn’t matter’. Because it is a game, or form of entertainment, the same ethics and laws that govern a real world economy don’t apply. Thats what you are saying. And most likely, John, nor Anet, will do anything about this. So, it obligation or question of economic “fairness” resides with the community.

I’m saying that since real money is being used in THIS economy, it does matter. It matters alot. Since your basic player is being manipulated by a corporate entity.

Take it as you will.

you are never required to spend real money on the game, people who do know the risks if you’re trading for items, your item can be devalued a day later for some unadequately explored reason, I remember I got commander tag and endless halloween tonic when they were about $50 each, now endless halloween tonic is 1g at best and at some point ctags dropped to about $10 before the 300g patch iirc.

I hate to break it to you, but you aren’t required to spend money on stock in the real world either.

As a compromise to this thread, maybe Anet could pay content providers a monthly stipend of 5k Gems and ban the use of information for personal TP gains. That would end the anger about insider information, and allow content providers to still benefit for helping Anet market this game.

LAST Update (hopefully!): https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/53plre/rising_flames_devs_here_ask_us_anything/d7v4uu6

“Here’s an update on insider trading. Since July we removed some alpha testers and an influencer who abused their early access to content to generate profit for themselves or others.

We have a small, dedicated group of core alpha testers who help us test Living World episodes. They’re overwhelmingly trustworthy. But we recognize that it only takes one abusive alpha tester to make it all feel very unfair to those players who aren’t in the alpha test program. We’ve been ramping up other forms of testing, including internal testing and Live beta testing of WvW updates. But we’re not going to undermine our ability to put out great content releases. Content is still our top priority.

Today’s release has new uses for 16 existing items. We tracked their prices and were ready to hold the release, even this morning, to change recipes if any of the 16 experienced a price spike prior to launch. None did.

Mo"

THIS, is what i was looking for. Some update. Some news. Some SOMETHING!

I’d criticize the time it took for the reply, but hey, this is above and beyond, better than nothing. THANKS MO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

To the moderators: Thread can be closed. Issue has been resolved. Please note: We will be watching…