Guild Wars 2

I am trying very hard to ignore achievement points but it is difficult. Its name implies that the number attached to this is the primary indicator of one’s progress and success as a gw2 player. The accumulation of these points has become (certainly in my own thinking – I got to 8500 points today whoopee-doo) a goal in and of itself. I am not trying to justify this attitude. It is quite silly really, but nevertheless I find myself religiously completing daily and monthly achievements. I have no interest in playing crab toss (or, indeed, any of the other so-called “activity” daily achievements), yet I complete the activity anyway, just for the single point I will get. Since the activities keep cycling around (for who knows how long), in a sense, there is no cap to the achievement points associated with these games – notwithstanding the caps related to specific achievement points granted for particular accomplishments, such as Crabgrabber etc.

The desire for APs causes one to play content that one would otherwise not play. This, in part, is why people get frustrated with Living World content. Since completing the latest Living World update will grant a relative spike in one’s APs, any Living World content that is not to one’s taste is going to get irritating really quickly, simply because one is in essence being “forced” to do content one does not enjoy. Not wanting to be a victim of my own competitive stupidity and vanity, I have deliberately avoided “Twilight Assault.” Dungeons (and any group content really) is not to my taste, but I don’t begrudge it those that get a kick out of that type of game-play.

So I started an Alt, an engineer (in fact I had eight level 80 characters, one for each profession, but I deleted one, to run an engineer again). I have been just slowly replaying the PvE content. While I was doing this, just clearing areas and following a slight variation in the personal story line, I was having fun. I hadn’t done this content properly in ages and there is something cool about trying new professions and playing with trait lines and build options. The thing is, fun as it is, you don’t make any money (relatively speaking) and you don’t get any achievement points either (I don’t see why though) . The game itself is offering quite scant incentive for me to replay this content. Actually, in terms of APs, my alts, for the most part (accepting maybe a few personal story lines and cultural armor) are a waste of time. I will get points for playing crab toss, over and over and over and over, yet for most of the basic content of the game there are no achievement points for even doing it once. So I guess I will keep doing the daily achievements over and over and over with my primary character (a human ranger), although I really want to be exploring the map with different races and different professions. The thing is, the way the game is designed atm, I get rewards for doing content I don’t particularly enjoy, and precious little for that which I do, and I guess that kind of irritates me! While it it true that I am not forced to play content I don’t like, not all content is equal. The developers have decreed that certain content warrants the name “achievement” while other content does not. Certain content gets called “achievement” if you do it over and over, while for other content it only counts once. In terms of the current structure of APs, this, in general, is a real downer for my alts. I basically wish that each character could contribute in its own right to APs. In the meantime, I am trying to pretend that APs don’t exist, just so I don’t get the feeling I am wasting my time with my alts.

Leveling alts can be good for dailies. Try that instead of worrying about what you lose in achievements. If chasing achievements isn’t fun then don’t do it. Simple.

Stooperdale.3560:

If chasing achievements isn’t fun then don’t do it. Simple.

The game is pretty much all about achievements. So this isn’t really an option.

Every 2 weeks a new tier of achivements are released. Dailies, monthlies, JPs, dungeons, WvW, ect, ect.
Everything you do on the game is tied to some sort of achievement.
So unless you’re suggesting people just stand in LA, there’s always an achievement chase.

I’m not sure this is a solution to your frustration, but there ARE a lot of achievements that are account-based and that you can use alts to “chip in” on if you want.

For my part, I don’t care at all how my AP count might stack up against other players, but I do like to sometimes work towards the achievment chests if I’m closing on the AP needed for one. I check out the “Achievements close to completion” (or whatever it’s called) list in the Achievements tab, and if I see anything like a slayer, renown heart, skill point, crafting, etc. Achievement that I’m close to completing, I will usually hop onto an alt and work towards it with them. That way I can work towards a reward AND earn some EXP for a leveling character at the same time.

I do the same thing WRT daily and monthly Achievements. If an alt of mine can make use of the EXP, I go ahead and do stuff like crafting, salvaging, MF, Karma spender, etc. deeds with them.

Tibago.8276:

Its name implies that the number attached to this is the primary indicator of one’s progress and success as a gw2 player.
~snip~
In the meantime, I am trying to pretend that APs don’t exist, just so I don’t get the feeling I am wasting my time with my alts.

Its a matter of perspective. What its name implies and what it actually means are very different. As you say, the lust for AP’s drives people to the LS.
All the AP indicates is the players ability to zerg thru most LS content or how to press F to hunt items down during most Living Stories or can breeze through some of the easier ones to get. While some people attach some kind of player ability to the number, there’s also alot of players who attach zero meaning to it since it really indicates nothing.

And as for wasting time with alts because of lack of AP’s……..again thats a matter of perspective. Farming LS and grinding for AP’s is a waste to someone like me when fun could be had levelling new characters and exploring and making new friends.

Its all open to player perspective.
As for your scenario, what Celestial suggests is probably the best route to go if you want AP’s on alts.

I appreciate all your comments. My point is not that I want to use alts to do daily and monthly achievements. My alts are there to play the basic content and develop like I did my first character. If I am doing dailies then I will rip through them in half an hour with my primary character. What I don’t understand is why I can complete the entire game for a second time with a brand new character (different race and profession), which requires a whole new skill set, and not get a single credit of achievement for it, because I am doing it a second time. And yet I will get credit for playing crab toss (or whatever) for the 15th time!!

Tibago.8276:

I appreciate all your comments. My point is not that I want to use alts to do daily and monthly achievements. My alts are there to play the basic content and develop like I did my first character. If I am doing dailies then I will rip through them in half an hour with my primary character. What I don’t understand is why I can complete the entire game for a second time with a brand new character (different race and profession), which requires a whole new skill set, and not get a single credit of achievement for it, because I am doing it a second time. And yet I will get credit for playing crab toss (or whatever) for the 15th time!!

What I was getting at is that you CAN get AP with a fresh character. You can complete slayer deeds. You can complete weapon kill deeds (especially true if playing with a new class with access to different weaps). You can complete Personal Story deeds (especially with a new race/background). You can complete Renown Heart, Skill Point, and Exploration deeds (the first one you actually NEED at least two characters to complete). Doing all of the racial armor deeds REQUIRES you to have a toon of every race leveled to 80. AFAIK, you can work towards many of the PvP and WvW achievements with multiple characters.

Yes, once you get to where you’ve killed 1,000 grawl, you don’t get credit for killing any more. Yes, once you complete a JP ONCE, you don’t get AP for doing it again (unless it’s for a daily/monthly). But it would take quite a while to complete so many achievements to the point where ALL of your alts are locked out of getting any more outside of the repeatables.

Skan.5301:

Stooperdale.3560:

If chasing achievements isn’t fun then don’t do it. Simple.

The game is pretty much all about achievements. So this isn’t really an option.

Every 2 weeks a new tier of achivements are released. Dailies, monthlies, JPs, dungeons, WvW, ect, ect.
Everything you do on the game is tied to some sort of achievement.
So unless you’re suggesting people just stand in LA, there’s always an achievement chase.

I don’t do anything in the game related to achievements unless it gets me something I need(like dailies for laurels). In fact, I go out of my way to not do achievements. I think it’s the part of my educated brain that cries out in horror at the possibility of being a labrat to mindless, meaningless tasks.

Obsidian.1328:

Skan.5301:

Stooperdale.3560:

If chasing achievements isn’t fun then don’t do it. Simple.

The game is pretty much all about achievements. So this isn’t really an option.

Every 2 weeks a new tier of achivements are released. Dailies, monthlies, JPs, dungeons, WvW, ect, ect.
Everything you do on the game is tied to some sort of achievement.
So unless you’re suggesting people just stand in LA, there’s always an achievement chase.

I don’t do anything in the game related to achievements unless it gets me something I need(like dailies for laurels). In fact, I go out of my way to not do achievements. I think it’s the part of my educated brain that cries out in horror at the possibility of being a labrat to mindless, meaningless tasks.

And this here is what everyone needs to do. Sadly that is not the case and the result is what we get out of the LS defenders. Because after doing a certian amount of achievements, you get rewarded with a box in the lower right that, apparently, has all the fruits of your labour in it.

I understand exactly where you’re coming from with all of this as I’ve thought the same thing before.

Then I asked myself, “Has anyone ever asked me what my AP was?” “Does anyone actually care?” Sure you may have people in your guild that you become competitive with, but outside of that, who really cares what your AP is? Many of the best players that I play with have under 5000AP, and that has never changed my view on their skills as players, and certainly if I PUG with someone I have no idea what their AP is so it’s not like you can discriminate against them.

So then why does it matter?

Thanks Celestial. I appreciate the points you are making and they are valid. In that regard, though, I have pretty much gotten all the points I can – although I haven’t killed a thousand plants or a thousand giants Certainly I have done all the personal story lines that can grant points. But again, taking Slayer as an example, if I want to grind out a thousand trolls, I don’t need an alt for that. In fact, I will probably go with the character that can get the job done the fastest, which is going to be my character with the best stats. But again, I am not particularly complaining about that. My bugbear, is that if I just play the game with an alt, because I enjoy the most fundamental element that makes gw2 what it is (the explorable map and story), then the game does not recognize this as being of merit according to its own scoring system. Rather, I will get credit for playing peripheral and incidental parts of the game that are not essential to its basic existence. So, of my 8500 points, 3063 come from dailies. This just shows a lot of dumb patience on my part with regard to endless repetition. I don’t mind this. It is perfectly fine to have dailies. However, my hero tab (showing personal story points) has maybe 300 points available altogether (something like that). That the dailies occasionally have a personal story component is not the point. There is a horrible imbalance with regard to what does and what does not grant points. So like Obsidian said above, I am either a lab-rat following the points wherever they lead, or I abandon the whole pursuit. Since I enjoy playing my alts (that is playing the actual game itself and not chasing the odd point here or there that I don’t have yet), that leaves me with the latter option, but it does leave a kind of bitter taste.

Gee, I almost exclusively do dailies on the characters I am leveling up. I don’t really understand why you don’t want to use this great opportunity for bonus XP (and Achievement points). Each to their own, I guess. =)

I wish they did reward for doing 100% on all the maps each time you do it on an alt. Maybe it would pull more people into the maps doing area completions on alts. To keep people from farming low level areas it could wait till you ding 100% total and get your star before you get the AP rewards.

I agree with you, and I say more. I think achiev points at this moments it`s ridiculous pointless.

And I feel tired to do that, I really want to do more things in the game, but this competition isn’t funny, I still doing that because I put focus on my mind.

At the moment I have 11150 points.

883 Mixistrike.7840 11147 Sanctum of Rall

There is about 18 points per day to do daily. It is INSANE.
18×30 = 540 points per month. I think they should give you a chance to get 5 options to do 5 points playing whatever you want, wxw or pve stuffs, or dungeons or pvp.

I become a hardcore player because I need to stay in game doing all daily, because I want to be competitive on leaderboard . Some days I spend about 4h to complete all daily.

So, I really enjoy if they change this things, but if they don’t I’ll keep doing that, because achiev points is the hard endurence content ever.

PS: Sorry about my english, isn’t my main language!!!!

Achievements are designed to be a psychologically compelling factor, so that’s exactly what they do.

I would say the use of achievements in any form is unethical in game design.

Just stop playing it. I used to do PvP dailies every day for points and I stopped. I’m much happier for it. Nor do I do the WvW achievements.

I genuinely enjoy the minigames and play them all, though I’m happiest when Sanctum Sprint and Southsun survival are up. I can play many games in a row of both of them, long after I have my daily.

But I don’t do the dailies I don’t enjoy. Achievement points aren’t a race, unless you care about the leaderboards.

Otherwise, what’s the difference if you get the next chest in a week, or two weeks?

That’s the point guys, everyone wants to be competitive and everyone want to enjoy the game too, so why don’t remove all extra points and keep the varieties(choices)?

and If you think…
“oh..if you remove this points, how someone can be the top100, or top10?”
Put hard content, then those who are motivated can do achievs that will be hard do complete, But I hate the idea that we need to do all daily every day.

Maybe we should think about it and try to find a solution.

One thing is certain, it’s annoying the way it is!!!

Astral Projections.7320:

I wish they did reward for doing 100% on all the maps each time you do it on an alt. Maybe it would pull more people into the maps doing area completions on alts. To keep people from farming low level areas it could wait till you ding 100% total and get your star before you get the AP rewards.

This

Mixistrike.7840:

I agree with you, and I say more. I think achiev points at this moments it`s ridiculous pointless.

And I feel tired to do that, I really want to do more things in the game, but this competition isn’t funny, I still doing that because I put focus on my mind.

At the moment I have 11150 points.

883 Mixistrike.7840 11147 Sanctum of Rall

There is about 18 points per day to do daily. It is INSANE.
18×30 = 540 points per month. I think they should give you a chance to get 5 options to do 5 points playing whatever you want, wxw or pve stuffs, or dungeons or pvp.

I become a hardcore player because I need to stay in game doing all daily, because I want to be competitive on leaderboard . Some days I spend about 4h to complete all daily.

So, I really enjoy if they change this things, but if they don’t I’ll keep doing that, because achiev points is the hard endurence content ever.

PS: Sorry about my english, isn’t my main language!!!!

Unfortunately, this as well

Draco.2806:

Achievements are designed to be a psychologically compelling factor, so that’s exactly what they do.

I would say the use of achievements in any form is unethical in game design.

Probably this

Mixistrike.7840:

That’s the point guys, everyone wants to be competitive and everyone want to enjoy the game too, so why don’t remove all extra points and keep the varieties(choices)?

and If you think…
“oh..if you remove this points, how someone can be the top100, or top10?”
Put hard content, then those who are motivated can do achievs that will be hard do complete, But I hate the idea that we need to do all daily every day.

Maybe we should think about it and try to find a solution.

One thing is certain, it’s annoying the way it is!!!

and this

I get what you are saying OP because I noticed this too.

I love playing the actual content in the game and I am leveling 2 alts at the moment and having a blast.
I have also been sitting at just short of 5000AP’s for a month because playing the core game nets no AP unless you specifically use work arounds that are mentioned in this thread.

I don’t particularly care about AP’s- heck I can’t even be bothered to do dailies unless they complete themselves.

I have wondered though why the reward system in general is skewed toward repeating the same things over and over and not towards supporting actaul game play as the game was built.
Not sure what could be done about it unless the reward and AP system gets a rework.
how?
NO idea- maybe put champs on random timers- reward more for completing DE’s and perhaps give AP for completing a DE chain?

The LS rewards an insane amount of AP for basically doing nothing- don’t get me wrong, some of it is fun and I think people will probably always do the LS if that particular patch appeals to them.

I don’t think it is quite necessary to reward this much compared to the rest of the game

I agree with the OP.

This game is elitest. You build, upgrade and desire to make the best possible character. I take it there are those that don’t care, but that is not how this game is designed to operate. Also, this is the nature of people, we are like this, we strive to be better and want others to see it (even if we ourselves don’t care what others look like). So, achievement points are one of the ways this game is used to drive our elistism.

The stuff I enjoy doing, just playing and exploring in my own time, doesn’t give me AP’s on the same level as Living Story. I don’t like crab toss, keg brawl, SAB (I loath this), etc, and being forced to team up for dungeons. If it was not for the daily, I certainly wouldn’t do it… and I can bet most others wouldn’t either. I have always been a believer that if you didn’t attach AP’s to jumping puzzles, then most people wouldn’t do them.

I am NOT saying this content that I dislike should be removed from the game. There are those that do enjoy it. Though why is the content which is core to the game that was advertised before GW2 was released, not given that many AP’s? Just exploring with different characters, and playing various events should give substantial AP’s.

Anyway, I am burnt out, 13 characters, 8200 AP’s, and 1900+ hours later, I am tired of playing stuff I don’t want to. So two days ago I quit, Living story (as it is now), good riddance. This really is a great game, but it just is not doing it for me anymore, so, no hard feelings, I am moving on.

Don’t let this post die

I’m kind of bummed that since achievement points are across the board whatever I pick between radiant and hellfire is account set, meaning while radiant looks awesome on my warrior, my mesmer/ele and other classes have no way to get hellfire unless I got into 10k+ with achievement points. That in my opinion really forces you to pick 1 level 80, where as having account bound tokens, etc all help you to achieve more for alts this is completely the opposite.

Actually if you don’t have at least 4 alts (one of each race) and level at least 3 of them to about level 40 then you’re missing out on almost an entire category of achievements – the ones for doing the personal story. Each race and each Order has their own achievements and since you can only choose one path per character you have to make alts to get them.

Also I really feel like a lot of this comes down to your personal attitude. Yes the achievements are built into the game, but that doesn’t mean you have to do them any more than you have to get all the armor and weapon sets from all the dungeons, even though you could argue that the game is intended to be about cosmetic, horizontal progression and the only thing you’re guaranteed to get from dungeons is tokens for weapons and armor, therefore they are the only reason to do the dungeon. (Which is obviously not true, I’m just saying to my mind that’s the equivalent of saying I get achievements for playing content therefore I have to get the achievements, therefore I must do everything whether I want to or not.)

Nothing bad will happen if you stop chasing achievement points. No one else will even care. If you’re having fun doing something else then that’s great, go and do it.

I’m all with ya, OP.

This isn’t a video game. It’s an ego-stroking (via gear grinds & achievements), money grubbing (RNG casino), delusional masquerade that happens to be the very antithesis of “fun”.

Danikat.8537:

Actually if you don’t have at least 4 alts (one of each race) and level at least 3 of them to about level 40 then you’re missing out on almost an entire category of achievements – the ones for doing the personal story. Each race and each Order has their own achievements and since you can only choose one path per character you have to make alts to get them.

Also I really feel like a lot of this comes down to your personal attitude. Yes the achievements are built into the game, but that doesn’t mean you have to do them any more than you have to get all the armor and weapon sets from all the dungeons, even though you could argue that the game is intended to be about cosmetic, horizontal progression and the only thing you’re guaranteed to get from dungeons is tokens for weapons and armor, therefore they are the only reason to do the dungeon. (Which is obviously not true, I’m just saying to my mind that’s the equivalent of saying I get achievements for playing content therefore I have to get the achievements, therefore I must do everything whether I want to or not.)

Nothing bad will happen if you stop chasing achievement points. No one else will even care. If you’re having fun doing something else then that’s great, go and do it.

The APs you get with regard to personal story required by alts is tiny and I accomplished that ages ago (as I said I have 8 level 80 characters – though I deleted one to start an engineer). My point is a simple one – there are virtually NO APs available for just playing the core game with an alt and APs are the method that the game itself uses to indicate to players what they have achieved (generally). I perceive APs as being a manipulative tool that ArenaNet uses to influence players to engage in specific content.

To say “nothing bad will happen if you stop chasing achievement points” is like saying nothing bad will happen if you lose a football match. Having said that, and I need to emphasize this, I have stopped chasing APs. So I deliberately avoid completing dailies, I avoid LS content (unless it is directly to my taste), just to get my mind into the place where I don’t care how many APs I am getting. Why do I do this? Because I want to get myself back into the place where I am enjoying gw2. The alternative is to continue chasing points (but that is going to make me quit the game altogether).

Tibago.8276:

To say “nothing bad will happen if you stop chasing achievement points” is like saying nothing bad will happen if you lose a football match.

Except people publicly see you lose a football match, whereas no one knows what your AP is and whether you have 1k, 5k, 10k, 15k, etc….

I mean seriously, it’s not like your AP is posted next to your name…

I have 9k AP at this point, and none of my characters wear the Radiant Armor I chose. So how will anyone ever know I have 9k AP!!!? They won’t. When I hit 10k, I’m not even going to wear the title, because WHO CARES….

… <— an extra ellipses

Draknar.5748:

Tibago.8276:

To say “nothing bad will happen if you stop chasing achievement points” is like saying nothing bad will happen if you lose a football match.

Except people publicly see you lose a football match, whereas no one knows what your AP is and whether you have 1k, 5k, 10k, 15k, etc….

I mean seriously, it’s not like your AP is posted next to your name…

I have 9k AP at this point, and none of my characters wear the Radiant Armor I chose. So how will anyone ever know I have 9k AP!!!? They won’t. When I hit 10k, I’m not even going to wear the title, because WHO CARES….

… <— an extra ellipses

I would debate whether winning and losing merely concerns us when it is visible to others, after all I can get a kick out of winning a game of solitaire. Who cares? Indeed. I perceive your comment to be a call for maturity about something that is, after all, trivial. Fair comment . . . for what it is worth, I am trying, but you know that stupid competitive spirit that dogs my footsteps does tend to get in the way

Tibago.8276:

To say “nothing bad will happen if you stop chasing achievement points” is like saying nothing bad will happen if you lose a football match.

I know almost nothing about sports. What does happen when you lose a football match?

Is this supposed to mean that it’s true it doesn’t have actual negative consequences, but you still feel bad about it? Or that actually there are consequences of some kind? Like moving down league tables or whatever? Or something else completely?

Tibago.8276:

Draknar.5748:

Tibago.8276:

To say “nothing bad will happen if you stop chasing achievement points” is like saying nothing bad will happen if you lose a football match.

Except people publicly see you lose a football match, whereas no one knows what your AP is and whether you have 1k, 5k, 10k, 15k, etc….

I mean seriously, it’s not like your AP is posted next to your name…

I have 9k AP at this point, and none of my characters wear the Radiant Armor I chose. So how will anyone ever know I have 9k AP!!!? They won’t. When I hit 10k, I’m not even going to wear the title, because WHO CARES….

… <— an extra ellipses

I would debate whether winning and losing merely concerns us when it is visible to others, after all I can get a kick out winning a game of solitaire. Who cares? Indeed. I perceive your comment to be a call for maturity about something that is, after all, trivial. Fair comment . . . for what it is worth, I am trying, but you know that stupid competitive spirit that dogs my footsteps does tend to get in the way

Trust me, I wouldn’t have 9k AP if I didn’t feel the competitive pressure, I can just never answer my own question as to why I feel that pressure, because no one besides the guildies I compete with know what my AP is (unless I wear the titles/armor— but I’ve never been the braggart type of guy).

That really has to be the only reason. If I wasn’t in a guild I bet I wouldn’t care in the slightest what my AP was.

But while I do feel the pressure and AP hunt, I don’t feel it is in any way a requirement in this game because of the reasons mentioned previously, and I certainly don’t think it has become the main focus of the game for me. Ever since they added the list that shows which achievements you are close to finishing I just check that every day and try to knock one out (when feasible), at the end of my playing session. I do the daily every day because they are easy and I finish them automatically while doing world exploration on my alts. PvP daily I just play in general and get the daily done quickly as well. That in addition to knocking out one of the almost finished achievements from that list keep me at a healthy AP pace without feeling like that’s all I’m doing.

If you are the type of person that absolutely must be the best, then that’s a personal character trait.

Danikat.8537:

Tibago.8276:

To say “nothing bad will happen if you stop chasing achievement points” is like saying nothing bad will happen if you lose a football match.

I know almost nothing about sports. What does happen when you lose a football match?

Is this supposed to mean that it’s true it doesn’t have actual negative consequences, but you still feel bad about it? Or that actually there are consequences of some kind? Like moving down league tables or whatever? Or something else completely?

I guess all I am saying is I prefer winning to losing, or if you like, achieving to not achieving. Again, I am not trying to justify my attitude, I am just trying to express how this particular aspect of the game makes me feel. I do acknowledge that I could well be expressing a minority opinion. Also, I have always seriously respected people who can both win and lose with grace, so yes, I don’t think your point is without validity.

“That really has to be the only reason. If I wasn’t in a guild I bet I wouldn’t care in the slightest what my AP was.”

You read me too well. I quit my guild (about a week ago) to escape the AP race and now I have my own guild of precisely 2 members, and the other guy has quit the game altogether. So I am leading my guild in the AP chase. I feel so good about myself now. I pull further ahead everyday

I think there is something broken about the general treatment of alts. There is a haphazard approach between things that I, as a gamer, achieve, and things that my character’s achieve.

For example, why is it that slaying a skelk adds to the “skelk slayer achievement” for the account, but killing a guard in WvW only adds to my toons WXP. And saying achievements are for the account and XP is for the character isn’t a sufficient explaination, because that’s just a tautology

Dailies are by a laurels are by account, world boss reward chests are by account, but the items you get for doing that end up soul bound to a character.

As a final note, I don’t think the argument “they need to limit the amount of rares in the world” holds much water given the endless champ farm they’ve set up.
.

Most games have some type of achievements list, which reward points for getting them. I haven’t played many MMO’s extensively, but lets look at WoW for example. It has a long list of achievements, which wracks up achievement points; however, at the time I played those points meant absolutely bubcus, zilch, nada. It was just an ever building meaningless number. Yet, that list of achievements acted as a potential list of goals for some people. An “oh hey, let’s try this.” or “Hm, I haven’t done this, maybe it’d be fun” Something to look at and maybe give you a short or long term goal to shoot for.

GW2 started off the same way. The achievements have been there since before launch, and doing them simply wracked up a meaningless number. A lot of people could have cared less about them. Others, used them as they have in other games, as potential goals – cause it looked fun, cause they didn’t have anything else to do, cause they like to do everything, etc.

APs weren’t important until Anet opted to give us some rewards for them. A nicety, nothing more. People were already putting in the time because they wanted to, and Anet opted to give people a little something for that time and effort. It was at this point that the mentality changed to “omg I have to do this!” which isn’t necessarily true. Because there are now shinies attached to them, people have this false sense of importance in regards to achievements. Like you said OP, you feel like you “have to do them.” They are no more important now than they were at launch. Their meaning has not changed, instead, what has changed is how we view them. If anet removed the rewards for them, they would again become meaningless numbers and people would ignore them.

AP tells you nothing about a person, except maybe (big maybe) how much time they have to burn. Even the worst players can wrack up tons of AP points – dailies, monthlies, just simply having more time to beat their head stubbornly against the wall… While conversely, an excellent player that isn’t achievement driven and with far less playtime would have significantly less. Making the assumption that a lot of AP = good player is like assuming that a guardian + zerker gear automatically = good player. It’s not that easy folks.

Draco.2806:

Achievements are designed to be a psychologically compelling factor, so that’s exactly what they do.

I would say the use of achievements in any form is unethical in game design.

This.

I have more than once caught myself (usually running from pinata to pinata or the like) doing something that was absolutely no fun and finally said “why am I doing this”.

Challenging achievements are one thing (i.e. kill Boss X without doing Y), but mindless repetitive tasks are terrible abuses of psychology to try to keep people logged in. Or as I like to think – What would you doo ooo ooo for a progress bar?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNRiFBrX7Nk

Actually I’m not sure sometimes if I’ve been doing content to ‘see/do all content’ or to ‘gain as many achievement points as possible’. It’s probably a mixture of both though.

[quote Skan.5031]The game is pretty much all about achievements.[/quote] I have been going through the list to see what achievements I can still do. But I’ve only been doing ones that I feel like doing or worth while doing, such as the jumping puzzles. And then it’s the achievement in focus not the points, so I don’t agree with the quote. You can buy everything you need without AP except skins that aren’t really so nice and the other rewards aren’t that great neither. Without them I wouldn’t be at any disadvantage.

I don’t run after LS-content/achievements if I don’t feel like doing it, so I’ve quite a few parts out such as World 2,3 Box, recent LS-Dungeonpath, …

Leveling Alts helps to fill the mobslayer achievements and weapon-achievements at least. Also it makes buying the cultural outfits more worthwhile if you can wear them, doing the personal story etc. There are probably more alt-friendly achievements I can’t think of atm.