Guild Wars 2

Excuse cannot be used any more.

Now that there are achievement reward chests. It’s a form of progression and is required for increase in account wide stats.

MightyMicah.7451:

Achievments are optional. You don’t need it.

there are no account wide stats that make you better than anyone else who doesn’t have those stats.
also the achievement you get are mostly from playing the game (i got most of my slayer achievement just exploring and leveling and do the personal story), there are some that make you do different things than hack and slash, but they can be done as a time sink relaxing way.

Amadan.9451:

there are no account wide stats that make you better than anyone else who doesn’t have those stats.

Yes they do actually. They make you richer easier. That’s self explanatory.

1% of gold find, when you find copper and silver takes years to make you richer, also you can buy a gilded infusion for your amulet and be more effective

edit: even though you have 4% if that stat it’s still just fluff and you are whining about something that is no life changer…

Azure Prower.8701:

Amadan.9451:

there are no account wide stats that make you better than anyone else who doesn’t have those stats.

Yes they do actually. They make you richer easier. That’s self explanatory.

But you don’t need them. Need is a very strong word, bro.

Azure Prower.8701:

Amadan.9451:

there are no account wide stats that make you better than anyone else who doesn’t have those stats.

Yes they do actually. They make you richer easier. That’s self explanatory.

Lol so 4 extra copper per silver is making you super right… right…

The numbers seem fairly minimal so I don’t see it as a huge deal. I’m more excited for the unique weapon/armor skins personally. I could be somewhat bias in this though as I already have 10k+ achievement points.

Sure the achievements increase your XP karma gold and magic find. It gives you some Laurels. But that does not make it so that you can win. Not only that there are other means in the game for increasing those stats with better success.

In addition to that the amount of work required to get the chests for a new player make this a non-topic. We are only talking about this because we are getting one chest every day. This just will not be happening for the average player base in the future.

Having gold =/= winning. Having gold means I can buy stuff. Doesn’t mean I’m suddenly stronger than you in tPvP.

Sil.4560:

You don’t need to play GW2 at all. I find this manner of thinking tiresome.

But if you’re already playing Guild Wars 2 you’re not locked out of content by anything being offered.

Who makes more money a guy with a 1% buff that plays a couple of times a week, or a guy who runs dungeons every day? It’s just a non-issue trying to be made into an issue.

There are always some people who feel I must have the best stats possible an if I do not then somehow I can’t play the game.

I’ve played baseball. I was never going to have the best stats. But I still played and enjoyed myself.

It’s just not that big a deal.

I’m not sure if you’re trying to debate me, lol. I never gave my stance, just stated that talking in terms of “need” is rather pointless in a video game, overall.

I’m fine with the rewards. I think getting so many points for HoM achievements is stupid since it’s not rewarding players for deeds in GW2, but rather a completely different game, but that’s another matter entirely.

Sil.4560:

I’m not sure if you’re trying to debate me, lol. I never gave my stance, just stated that talking in terms of “need” is rather pointless in a video game, overall.

I’m fine with the rewards. I think getting so many points for HoM achievements is stupid since it’s not rewarding players for deeds in GW2, but rather a completely different game, but that’s another matter entirely.

Over the course of time 500 points in this game is really nothing. It seems like a lot, but it’s really not that much. The longer the game goes, the less it will mean. And I still don’t think they should count toward the leaderboards.

Vayne.8563:

Sil.4560:

You don’t need to play GW2 at all. I find this manner of thinking tiresome.

But if you’re already playing Guild Wars 2 you’re not locked out of content by anything being offered.

Who makes more money a guy with a 1% buff that plays a couple of times a week, or a guy who runs dungeons every day? It’s just a non-issue trying to be made into an issue.

There are always some people who feel I must have the best stats possible an if I do not then somehow I can’t play the game.

I’ve played baseball. I was never going to have the best stats. But I still played and enjoyed myself.

It’s just not that big a deal.

I’ll agree that the little permanent boost stats don’t really mean much in the long run.

But what if the main thing you enjoy about MMOs are the skins? What if the stats don’t matter? If you don’t do achievements, you don’t get the nice looking skins. You might say that you’re locked out from getting them. Sure, I don’t NEED the skins, but as Sil said, we don’t NEED to play the game either.

I’ve never understood all the “you don’t NEED it” arguments either. What am I missing?

Villious.8530:

I’ll agree that the little permanent boost stats don’t really mean much in the long run.

But what if the main thing you enjoy about MMOs are the skins?

Then you gotta work for them. Like how I can’t have Arah armor for my Necro unless I run Arah explorable a bunch of times.

It might be nice for PvPers to have some way of getting the skins without having to head over to PvE for a while, though.

Blaine Tog.8304:

Villious.8530:

I’ll agree that the little permanent boost stats don’t really mean much in the long run.

But what if the main thing you enjoy about MMOs are the skins?

Then you gotta work for them. Like how I can’t have Arah armor for my Necro unless I run Arah explorable a bunch of times.

It might be nice for PvPers to have some way of getting the skins without having to head over to PvE for a while, though.

I agree that you must work for them. I was commenting on the “you don’t need it” argument.

People miss the point when talking about “it’s optional” or “It’s needed.”

Despite people’s attempt to simplify this issue, it isn’t black and white. Different things have different degrees of “optional.” The option of playing the game, obviously, is quite significant (You don’t NEED to play the game), as is the option of equipping exotic armor (You don’t NEED to wear armor).

But then you have achievements. Not getting one achievement for that gives you 15/500 to 1G is still an insignificant amount. Thus it falls under the threshold of “optional” for most.

If you want to define any meager form of progression as “needed,” however, do you feel PvP is “needed” for you? WvW? Do you feel compelled to do Giant Slayer? Get Shield Mastery? Get all 90 pieces of cultural armor? They all reward achievement points, do you feel forced to do them? Where do you exactly draw the line then?

Do you play other video games? Do the have scores? Do you like it when you get a good score in another game?

What makes this any different?

When I hear people saying " ap doesn’t matter," it sounds more like " I suck at the game, so I will make statements to minimize the validity of scoring to make my insecure self look less vulnerable than I really am."

FCS! It’s a game and has a score, like almost every other game that exists! Either buck up or get off the ride so the other kids can get their turn!

Ping, Pac Man, Donkey Kong, Space Invaders, etc etc.

The best thing ANet could do is shut down this forum so the complainers would either leave or spend more time playing than pouting,

Allisa Wonderland.8192:

When I hear people saying " ap doesn’t matter," it sounds more like " I suck at the game, so I will make statements to minimize the validity of scoring to make my insecure self look less vulnerable than I really am."

I agree with most of your post, but this part seems a bit off. The reality of the matter is that one does not need to be good at the game in order to have a high AP score. One merely needs to be willing to spend a bunch of time grinding.

Villious.8530:

Vayne.8563:

Sil.4560:

You don’t need to play GW2 at all. I find this manner of thinking tiresome.

But if you’re already playing Guild Wars 2 you’re not locked out of content by anything being offered.

Who makes more money a guy with a 1% buff that plays a couple of times a week, or a guy who runs dungeons every day? It’s just a non-issue trying to be made into an issue.

There are always some people who feel I must have the best stats possible an if I do not then somehow I can’t play the game.

I’ve played baseball. I was never going to have the best stats. But I still played and enjoyed myself.

It’s just not that big a deal.

I’ll agree that the little permanent boost stats don’t really mean much in the long run.

But what if the main thing you enjoy about MMOs are the skins? What if the stats don’t matter? If you don’t do achievements, you don’t get the nice looking skins. You might say that you’re locked out from getting them. Sure, I don’t NEED the skins, but as Sil said, we don’t NEED to play the game either.

I’ve never understood all the “you don’t NEED it” arguments either. What am I missing?

Well finally someone said it.

I’m more or less in this category. I want skins. Really. not ALL skins but specific ones. I spent more than 40 minutes tweaking my toon’s looks. its not out of the norm for me, i always do such with any rpg that allows character customization anyways. I’m looking for a skin that will then complement the overall look i want. so what happens when said skin is gated thru achivements.?

My stance on this issue is that ANYTHING in a game can be optional. but as soon as you set a goal in the game, if there be but one way to achieve that goal then that means it is a necessity for the goal. thus, need. So i dont get why people need to tell others what they shud choose to aim for.

Villious.8530:

But what if the main thing you enjoy about MMOs are the skins? What if the stats don’t matter? If you don’t do achievements, you don’t get the nice looking skins. You might say that you’re locked out from getting them. Sure, I don’t NEED the skins, but as Sil said, we don’t NEED to play the game either.

The issue with your argument is that you are not saying what would you have designed instead.

Complaining that you need achievement points to unlock the Zenith skins is somewhat similar to complaining that you need to do dungeons to get the dungeon skins, or to do all that to get a Legendary.

What would you suggest, instead? Making all skins available to everyone at the beginning of the game? This is not going to happen; since progression in GW2 is not as focused on stats as in other MMOs, the game has a system of progression based on skins which needs some kind of gate before giving skins. Plus, it’s likely that the Transmutation Stones are one of the most sold items in the Gem Store, so I don’t expect them to become useless any time soon.

With that out of the way, all we can do is improve how we get those skins. Using my examples above, I actually don’t like the need to do dungeons to unlock the dungeon skins, or all that grind for a Legendary. I believe we should have more than one way to unlock a skin, AS LONG AS THAT DOES NOT INCLUDE MAKING IT TRADEABLE IN THE TP (many and long reasons for that, which I won’t go in detail here).

Achievement points are perfect for that.

Do you want to just explore the world? You will get a bunch of achievement points. Would you rather just play dungeons? You will get a lot of achievement points for that. Would you rather focus on the personal storyline? Achievement points there, too. Other than relatively few achievement points for sPvP and WvW, achievement points reward near everything in the game.

That’s why I think the argument of “I want skins and I don’t want to get achievement points” is weak. What do you want to do to get those skins? Other than mindless farming gold, everything else will give you achievement points. This system is actually the best way to get skins in the game, considering the freedom it gives players.

Villious.8530:

Vayne.8563:

Sil.4560:

You don’t need to play GW2 at all. I find this manner of thinking tiresome.

But if you’re already playing Guild Wars 2 you’re not locked out of content by anything being offered.

Who makes more money a guy with a 1% buff that plays a couple of times a week, or a guy who runs dungeons every day? It’s just a non-issue trying to be made into an issue.

There are always some people who feel I must have the best stats possible an if I do not then somehow I can’t play the game.

I’ve played baseball. I was never going to have the best stats. But I still played and enjoyed myself.

It’s just not that big a deal.

I’ll agree that the little permanent boost stats don’t really mean much in the long run.

But what if the main thing you enjoy about MMOs are the skins? What if the stats don’t matter? If you don’t do achievements, you don’t get the nice looking skins. You might say that you’re locked out from getting them. Sure, I don’t NEED the skins, but as Sil said, we don’t NEED to play the game either.

I’ve never understood all the “you don’t NEED it” arguments either. What am I missing?

You don’t need it NOW. You’ll eventually get those skins just doing dailies if that’s what you want. It’s all about how FAST you need it, not whether you’ll get it. It’s not that hard to get achievement points for skins. So yes, play the way you want, and don’t let shinies dictate how you play.

you really don’t have to play the game at all in order to not get achievement…

every content in this game can be considered gate according to these arguements, exotic are gated by money, traits are gated by levelling and money, ascended are gated by laurels and time, dungeon skins are gated by tokens, maps are gated by level ecc ecc.
but no, you people have to bash the free gift we are having because you can’t really be happy with anything

Villious.8530:

I’ll agree that the little permanent boost stats don’t really mean much in the long run.

But what if the main thing you enjoy about MMOs are the skins? What if the stats don’t matter? If you don’t do achievements, you don’t get the nice looking skins. You might say that you’re locked out from getting them. Sure, I don’t NEED the skins, but as Sil said, we don’t NEED to play the game either.

I’ve never understood all the “you don’t NEED it” arguments either. What am I missing?

that means that you simply don’t need to be the guy that hit 10K achievement points first. These chests are a permanent addition. Even if you only started playing today over time you’ll get all of those achievement reward chests. There will probably be more achievement reward chests by that point, but it’s just a thing to kind of look forward to, because sooner or later you are going to get them
People saying that you NEED to earn achievement points… If you don’t want to do all those jumping puzzles and all those exploration achievements – you don’t NEED to do anything. If you do 1 out of 5 dailies a day you’re still getting an achievement point and you’re still moving forwards.

generalraccoon.3857:

My stance on this issue is that ANYTHING in a game can be optional. but as soon as you set a goal in the game, if there be but one way to achieve that goal then that means it is a necessity for the goal. thus, need. So i dont get why people need to tell others what they shud choose to aim for.

But by this logic, you should be complaining about all the dungeon skins too. You can’t get Arah or HoTW (or any other dungeon) armor skins without running those dungeons multiple times. It’s exactly the same thing.
Well not really, for dungeon armors you can get it only by running dungeons, and with achievements you can basically play any part of the game that you like and still progress towards the Zenith skins (since you need only 1k of achievements).

Villious.8530:

I’ll agree that the little permanent boost stats don’t really mean much in the long run.

But what if the main thing you enjoy about MMOs are the skins? What if the stats don’t matter? If you don’t do achievements, you don’t get the nice looking skins. You might say that you’re locked out from getting them. Sure, I don’t NEED the skins, but as Sil said, we don’t NEED to play the game either.

I’ve never understood all the “you don’t NEED it” arguments either. What am I missing?

You dont NEED it… you will not physically kittening die if you don’t get them… they aren’t kittening oxygen they aren’t kittening water or food or shelter… you don’t NEED them… People are just acting like babies about this and its ridiculous.. If you logged on once a week for the entire month for a few hours each time and thats it, if you know what you’re doing then you should have an EASY 500 achievement points from the monthly (which is always easily knocked out in 4-5 days) a few dailies and 2 living story events… they make achievement points so ridiculously easy to get in 4-6 months anyone that plays regularly and has been playing for a while should easily have 10k achievement points… It’s getting ridiculous that they finally introduce something as good as rewarding people for their effort FINALLY and people have to find another reason to complain just because they can’t have something immediately or they weren’t as dedicated as some of the other players who log on ritualistically and grind out each and every new achievement (not me, im not even at 5k points right now)…

TL;DR… basically the game isn’t socialist even though they are GIVING these skins away for nothing (just it may take a couple months to get them all)… not everyone is going to be equal to everyone else especially when some people don’t have the time or necessarily the will to play as much or as hard as other people… stop the kittening because sitting on here complaining isn’t going to get you more achievement points it’s just going to get you further behind.

It’s sad how the word ’’Achievement’’ has downgraded so much since gaming.

Achievement is an achievement, what is the point of the achievement if you want ArenaNet to nerf it so you can gain it.

It’s like, having Usain Bolt running 100 meters in 10 seconds, and then some random guy says that they should nerf the course to 50 meters for him, but he wants to beat the world record too, and get the achievement for it.

Villious.8530:

I’ve never understood all the “you don’t NEED it” arguments either. What am I missing?

It’s an argument people fall back on when they run out of any reasonable ones.

Vayne.8563:

Over the course of time 500 points in this game is really nothing. It seems like a lot, but it’s really not that much. The longer the game goes, the less it will mean. And I still don’t think they should count toward the leaderboards.

Whether they’re meaningful or not…that’s a matter on its own. For me it’s the principle of getting “achievement” points for deeds performed in another game.

For me the implementation of AP rewards was a big big mistake. I will not cry about it and I must simply accept it if most people likes this change. But my opinion stands. Making AP as form of “currency” for shiny things is downgrading for the achievements concept itself. Achievements should be a goal and a reward on their own. Not everyone will care about them but that is fine.

Right now I see more and more people starting to farm them just becouse "omg Zenith/title/gold). Keg Toss is full of people begging to give them daily achievement so they can leave in one minute becouse “they hate Keg Toss”. In recent few days I seen more level 1-5 people in PvP matches than ever before (which I guess is a good thing since it brings more people to sPvP but I have a strange feeling that large amount of those people “hate” PvP but now “must” do it becouse it gives them AP for shiny things). It’s all sad to watch to be honest.

While I generally love GW2 and I left WoW long ago, in case of achievements WoW done it much better I think. Namely becouse of:
- no temporary achievements (well some are, but they sit in their own category and give 0 AP for completion, if any achievement is not obtainable anymore, it looses its point value)
- no daily/monthly achievements limited to 24h/30d
- some actuall skill based achievements which are really hard to get (but are not temporary so people dont whine if they cant do it outright).
- achievement rewards only tied to certain thematic achievements and not to farming them all

Azure Prower.8701:

Amadan.9451:

there are no account wide stats that make you better than anyone else who doesn’t have those stats.

Yes they do actually. They make you richer easier. That’s self explanatory.

Since when does a few gold a day make you rich?

Since learning to save it.

I hate to burst your bubble, but 2% magic/gold find won’t really make any difference.

Besides, the achievment point system is broken already. Daily / monthly shouldn’t give any AP. Same with HoM.

All I see is a lot of people pointing out how flawed the APs are. And they are. They should have been properly assessed BEFORE they integrated the new reward system, because now they are committed to there flawed APs.

Ive only seen one person thus far complain about the rewards associated with it. Im sure seeing a lot of people jump to conclusions that people are complaining about rewards. As far as I can see, 99.99% of people with a gripe about what Anet has done couldn’t care less about the rewards and are only dissatisfied with Anet not rethinking the APs.

Vertical progression is a fairly straightforward and well-known element in game design. Almost everyone familiar with the MMO is familiar with the concept. It is introduced in games as it gives an illusion of character progression and it provides an incentive to play regularly. While most people understand that this incentive is really an offer that you can’t refuse, we have in our community a number who don’t understand vertical progression.

Why is it non-optional? Well, VP can be described by an integer series 1,2,3,4…,n where each number represents an increase in the power level of the game. Remember, it’s vertical (the power level increases) and it’s progression (it continues to increase over time). Most arguments here occur around whether the difference between 1 and 2 represents an increase that affects the game or the experience of people at power level 1 or power level 2. That, of course, is a bit of a red herring. It doesn’t make any real difference. Vertical progression doesn’t progress by stopping. It will continue over time.

Knowing this, you know intuitively that if you don’t perform those actions necessary to progress along the power curve, there will necessarily come a time when you can’t play the game. Again, it’s irrelevant whether that’s at 4 or at 8—the time will come and if you want to play the game over time you must follow the power curve.

Because AP awards laurels they are an extension of the daily/monthly mechanism for keeping up with the stat inflation and, of course, it describes a mandatory process for those who wish to play the game long-term. Remember, VP is, by definition, a non-optional incentive to play and that’s why game developers implement it. That said, it is an optional element in game design in that it is not necessary in an MMO and many of us were hoping to have been done with it with GW2. I don’t post threads on the subject, but still can’t resist correcting misinformation about VP when it arises.

Raine, I agree with your post 100%.

Which is why I am very-very glad ANET added the AP system. Given that they have already gone down the vertical progression path with the garbage Ascended gear they added last November, any and every addition to this game that minimizes the damage already done is welcome by me. By adding the AP system, people now have other methods of obtaining laurels to get the ascended trinkets.

To be honest, everything points towards Anet having learned its lesson in trying to please the WoW teenagers with stat-progression gear, and a return to their roots as the skilled-based horizontal progression game GW2 was marketed as for years.

But they are optional. They’re called achievements. Not entitlements.

Mad yet? I’ll toss another one. “This is only a game”

Now to be fair, I scoffed at the idea myself, but once again this level of hyperbole isn’t working.

I’m largely opposed to excessive vertical progression. I thought ascended gear is terrible and should have never been introduced. Periodically introducing a new gear tier that increases stats from last tier by 8% is going to get out of control in a few years. This is obvious, and a reasonable fear, especially if you have to grind heavily for it. Stuff like ascended earrings, of which cost more than amulets and rings despite giving a smaller benefits is also entirely unreasonable. Requiring 250 t6 mats is also just a grind for infusions. Now those aren’t necessary, but the intent of silly grinding is there.

However, my main fear is that stuff like ascended armor would obsolete current runes and gear setups. I find that to be disastrous and a huge QOL problem if we have to gear from the ground up. The AP here sidesteps the issue

But what do achievements really get you? Skins? Boosters that last an hour? Oh no, I used an exp booster and it made me gain a level 20 minutes faster. And you gain achievement points by default by playing the game almost. If you miss a few points here and there, someone gets there 5% faster than you. And what is 25% more MF? It is not 25% better drops. With an MF laurel, it’s only 16% more. With MF Food, it’s 12% more. With MF gear, the difference is so trivial it doesn’t matter. And MF doesn’t affect chests. Then again most of you people that think the MF boost matters to the degree of it being gamebreaking are probably so bad at math and at this game that you bring MF gear to speedruns. And of course, 10% boost to bad players are still bad players!

Sorry, if you told me people would be 30-40% more effective in battle, I’d care, but telling me they’d earn 27 more gold every 200 hours isn’t.

Point is, the point where progression is important is when it gate locks you out of new content or leads to a slippery slope in which you are at risk of not being able to play any new content at all in the future. Anything else is pure entitlement whining and requires roundabout and convoluted thoughts to prove you are being disenfranchised. You are not entitled to BIS or max stats. The only place that exists is fractals (which was made solely to contain grindbugs), which can be largely ignored. Unless you’re complaining about people having more magical find and gold find in wvw, lol. Sure that helps!

Man, I can imagine some of you playing Super Mario Bros.

“The warp zone is mandatory. If I don’t use it, I won’t finish the game as fast as other people. This is bad design!”
“Why should I have to hit the block to get a mushroom so I can take 2 hits! I should be starting with it!”
“Grinding for lives isn’t fun!”

The only reasonable demands:

-To make is to place a cap on these things, or at least if they loop to provide only skins and no more boosts.
-To introduce actually difficult challenges as achievements and not just “do this boring task 10 million times”. The problem currently with achievements is not that they are hard to gain, but because they involve very trivial tasks that don’t really reflect skill or tenacity.
- Be more generous with deadlines. Don’t give people only a month to do them. I didn’t even bother with SSC at all because of this.

Either greatly dilutes the possibility of “grind”

Villious.8530:

Vayne.8563:

Sil.4560:

You don’t need to play GW2 at all. I find this manner of thinking tiresome.

But if you’re already playing Guild Wars 2 you’re not locked out of content by anything being offered.

Who makes more money a guy with a 1% buff that plays a couple of times a week, or a guy who runs dungeons every day? It’s just a non-issue trying to be made into an issue.

There are always some people who feel I must have the best stats possible an if I do not then somehow I can’t play the game.

I’ve played baseball. I was never going to have the best stats. But I still played and enjoyed myself.

It’s just not that big a deal.

I’ll agree that the little permanent boost stats don’t really mean much in the long run.

But what if the main thing you enjoy about MMOs are the skins? What if the stats don’t matter? If you don’t do achievements, you don’t get the nice looking skins. You might say that you’re locked out from getting them. Sure, I don’t NEED the skins, but as Sil said, we don’t NEED to play the game either.

I’ve never understood all the “you don’t NEED it” arguments either. What am I missing?

The “you don’t NEED it” argument is often used in context when someone is trying to explain how something is being forced upon them to stay relevant/competitive/equal to the players doing it. This is rarely the truth in my experience with the GW2 forums. It also feels like it is in reference to achievement points. The only thing in this game required to stay equal is BiS gear. One could make the argument that achievement boxes —> laurels —> ascended gear —> must do achievements to stay equal. But it’s a pretty poor argument considering the other way to get laurels and ascended gear.

Hence the “you don’t NEED it” argument popping up yet again.

This is for me, and at least others I play with, the idea behind this argument. The you don’t need to play this game is a kinda silly way to use it, but it is valid nonetheless on things like this or “Anet is forcing me to go to EB JP”.

Ision.3207:

Raine, I agree with your post 100%.

Which is why I am very-very glad ANET added the AP system. Given that they have already gone down the vertical progression path with the garbage Ascended gear they added last November, any and every addition to this game that minimizes the damage already don, is welcome by me. By adding the AP system, people now have other methods of obtaining laurels to get the ascended trinkets.

Yes, and I have said elsewhere that I am very happy with the AP system introduced and feel it is a major step in the right direction in terms of reward in the game. My motivation is not to complain about AP or Anet for that matter; I simply wanted to correct the misconception that VP is in any way optional for those wishing to play the game long-term.

Raine.1394:

Ision.3207:

Raine, I agree with your post 100%.

Which is why I am very-very glad ANET added the AP system. Given that they have already gone down the vertical progression path with the garbage Ascended gear they added last November, any and every addition to this game that minimizes the damage already don, is welcome by me. By adding the AP system, people now have other methods of obtaining laurels to get the ascended trinkets.

Yes, and I have said elsewhere that I am very happy with the AP system introduced and feel it is a major step in the right direction in terms of reward in the game. My motivation is not to complain about AP or Anet for that matter; I simply wanted to correct the misconception that VP is in any way optional for those wishing to play the game long-term.

Agreed.

Sorin.4310:

Villious.8530:

Vayne.8563:

Sil.4560:

You don’t need to play GW2 at all. I find this manner of thinking tiresome.

But if you’re already playing Guild Wars 2 you’re not locked out of content by anything being offered.

Who makes more money a guy with a 1% buff that plays a couple of times a week, or a guy who runs dungeons every day? It’s just a non-issue trying to be made into an issue.

There are always some people who feel I must have the best stats possible an if I do not then somehow I can’t play the game.

I’ve played baseball. I was never going to have the best stats. But I still played and enjoyed myself.

It’s just not that big a deal.

I’ll agree that the little permanent boost stats don’t really mean much in the long run.

But what if the main thing you enjoy about MMOs are the skins? What if the stats don’t matter? If you don’t do achievements, you don’t get the nice looking skins. You might say that you’re locked out from getting them. Sure, I don’t NEED the skins, but as Sil said, we don’t NEED to play the game either.

I’ve never understood all the “you don’t NEED it” arguments either. What am I missing?

The “you don’t NEED it” argument is often used in context when someone is trying to explain how something is being forced upon them to stay relevant/competitive/equal to the players doing it. This is rarely the truth in my experience with the GW2 forums. It also feels like it is in reference to achievement points. The only thing in this game required to stay equal is BiS gear. One could make the argument that achievement boxes —> laurels --> ascended gear —> must do achievements to stay equal. But it’s a pretty poor argument considering the other way to get laurels and ascended gear.

Hence the “you don’t NEED it” argument popping up yet again.

This is for me, and at least others I play with, the idea behind this argument. The you don’t need to play this game is a kinda silly way to use it, but it is valid nonetheless on things like this or “Anet is forcing me to go to EB JP”.

And indeed this is something I cannot comprehend.

How can one expect to stay competitive when they don’t want to do anything about it? Something does something you didn’t, and thus they have some kind of advantage. That’s just how everything works. And secondly, what are we staying competitive about that?

PvP was rightfully separated from progression. WvW is more about coverage.

And yes, I’d agree the only thing needed is BIS gear. Any complaints lodged in that direction are reasonable complaints, because they can be crippling if too many new gear tiers were introduce.

I wouldn’t say these complaints about AP are unwarranted. On a matter of pure principle, this is grinding towards a type of vertical progression. It’s just that it really can’t lock anyone out of content, thus the logical leap to it being disruptive gameplay is far more longwinded.

If they do introduce actual permanent combat stat boosts, I will complain about that.

knives.6345:

MightyMicah.7451:

Achievments are optional. You don’t need it.

Ballistic.4531:

generalraccoon.3857:

My stance on this issue is that ANYTHING in a game can be optional. but as soon as you set a goal in the game, if there be but one way to achieve that goal then that means it is a necessity for the goal. thus, need. So i dont get why people need to tell others what they shud choose to aim for.

But by this logic, you should be complaining about all the dungeon skins too. You can’t get Arah or HoTW (or any other dungeon) armor skins without running those dungeons multiple times. It’s exactly the same thing.
Well not really, for dungeon armors you can get it only by running dungeons, and with achievements you can basically play any part of the game that you like and still progress towards the Zenith skins (since you need only 1k of achievements).

My bad, i’m sorry, my mistake for not adding additional input.

You are quite right if it were just that. Anyhow what i am unhappy over is if said skin is gated in such a way AND is temporary, as is contents from living story. Specifically for skins like the karka backpiece thing. thus making said achievements needed if u want the specific thing.

As for dungeon skins, i dont really have much issue because a) its permanent and b) i like running almost all dungeons (CoF3, TA f/f being the few i dont look forward to, but the rest ill go anytime a bazzillion times over)

The new endgame is now Achievement Points, what else you going do with multiple level 80 characters.

I have 7k achievement points. I missed around 2 months of laurels and sometime don’t even do the daily pve (and rarely more than the 5 required).

Just play the game and you’ll get your AP one day.

Considering that they are now offering GEMS as rewards for achievement points, I think the the “You don’t have to do achievement points” arguement goes right down the drain. Gems=real money so achievement points now = money. And when the majority of achievement points stem from sometimes challenging, very temporary content, it’s limiting the majority of people who have a job/life from getting points. Also, when these people do have time to sit down and play, and they have the choice of either leisurely playing the game the way they want to, or grinding the temporary content for points before it all goes :POOF!: , you can bet that with the rewards, they are going to go for the points. Except that they will never get the chance to play the “original game”, because once they finish grinding those points, two weeks later, :POOF!: New living story content/achievements and the cycle begins once again. How is that playing the game the way you want to play it? Who in their right mind is going to turn down free gems?

ThunderBadger.3049:

Considering that they are now offering GEMS as rewards for achievement points, I think the the “You don’t have to do achievement points” arguement goes right down the drain. Gems=real money so achievement points now = money.

1. You can’t exchange gems to real money
2. You can get to the 10K point by just doing the dailies and getting there 5 achievement points at a time
3. Gems is a reward for time spent. Achievement points are rewards. You don’t need rewards if you just want to enjoy the game and you should not get the rewards if you’re unprepared to spend a lot of time in the game. In other words my point is – achievements is something you earn and not something that you get for entering the game.

See this is why hyperbole ruins your points.

lol 400 gems. That’s not even enough for a name change, much less makes them mandatory.

In the time it takes you to reach 10,000 achievement points, 400 gems is an extremely insignificant amount relatively speaking unless you’re like playing the game without a keyboard or something. If you want to complain, try the 30 gold. Though by my estimates, these achievement gold rewards are really just reimbursing you spending all this time on this crap. It’s probably better just to run Cof ad nauseum.

I don’t even have 4k AP myself, and I don’t really see myself being made “mandatory” to grind out any achievements.