Guild Wars 2

With the talk of nerfing ‘zerker, there are a lot of angry people who invested a lot of time into the grind for Ascended kit. Since this is a grind-focused game, their concerns are very valid and it’s easy to understand why emotions are running high.

If any adjustment to gear is made, ANet needs to allow the stats on gear to be customizable on demand. The beauty of GW1 was that I could adjust my stats in any town. This will allow players to customize their kit more easily.

Benefits:
1. Increased build variety – there will be less fear to experiment with nonstandard builds.
2. Less resistance in the community to adjustments to stat effectiveness. This will allow Anet to fine-tune stat balance without fear.
3. No fear of players demanding refunds for skins bought for now-obsolete berserker gear.

Cons:
1. Lower grind. As you no longer have to maintain multiple sets of gear, the amount of grind per player is lessened.

I cannot understand why this has not been implemented already. Players will play more and there will be a more rewarding play experience for everyone.

I agree, having to get a full set of armor and skin you like for each equipment stat is too much. Ascended equipment should have this ability and infusions need to be reworked as well, allowing the replacement and upgrading of them to be more flexible.

An equally important QoL issue is legendary weapons. Why aren’t they account bound yet? Players have been requesting this for a long time.

More to last:

The current GW2 model is very similar to a Saturday Morning cartoon – you log on, see the story, and move on. Because of the inflexibility with gearing, most players are discouraged from attempting any sort of grind.

I personally refuse to spend time working toward Ascended gear because it’s just not worth it. I’ll need one set to do dungeons, one set to do WvW, and another set if I want to try out a different build. This makes me less willing to play beyond logging on to see my Saturday morning cartoon.

Increasing gear flexibility will go a long way in creating more staying-power for this year+ old game. At the end of the day – there is absolutely no reason not to, and everyone will benefit immensely.

I think you have a faulty memory when it comes to GW1.

In order to change and maximize (which is the case here, since everything would still be fully doable with Exotics or even Rares) you needed to buy a complete new set of runes and so on, and quite a few of those were quite expensive.

As for the change itself:

While the idea is good it is quite likely that it will be implemented with the Legendary gear, just like how you can change stats on the weapons now.
Adding that to another tier would remove more or less the only special things about Legendaries, which is most likely not a good thing.

Lordkrall – maybe you have a faulty memory.
Legendaries are meant to be cosmetic only – a grand achievement with no gameplay benefit. They are already going to be Account bound instead of the normal character bound.

There’s no reason squelch a good idea just to keep Legendaries different. The fact that legendaries can already do this is proof that it is easy to implement. There is no reason not to extend this to all items for the reasons listed ahead.

And this is a very good thing.

Psykotik.2691:

Lordkrall – maybe you have a faulty memory.
Legendaries are meant to be cosmetic only – a grand achievement with no gameplay benefit. They are already going to be Account bound instead of the normal character bound.

There’s no reason squelch a good idea just to keep Legendaries different. The fact that legendaries can already do this is proof that it is easy to implement. There is no reason not to extend this to all items for the reasons listed ahead.

And this is a very good thing.

Oh, but I don’t find it a good idea. And I used an argument to why it wasn’t a good idea.
You might not agree with it, but it is still an argument none-the-less.

I don’t think anyone have ever claimed that it is not easy to implement. But if we do think a bit farther about it, the idea itself is quite stupid (in my opinion).

If you could get any stats on any weapon-sets (why should only Ascended have the ability after all? Why not Exotic? Why not Rare? And so on, if one set (outside of Legendary which are special cases) get it, why should not all?) people would simply craft the cheapest one and then have access to all others as well. Which would most likely hurt crafting and the market quite a bit.

I never said anything about ascended only. Changing stats on all gear on demand would be a great idea.

Why should Berserker’s be more expensive than Cleric’s? This adjustment will also harmonize the TP and bring material costs more in line with one another. The effect it will have on crafting is that it will increase the cost of level but decrease the cost of creating items. Really, this adjustment will be minor (look at the price spread between totems and blood and average the two for instance).

Why would you not find it a good idea to allow stats to be changed? Do you think it is more fun to be locked into a certain stat build for the lifetime of your character unless you want to regear?

More to last:
Games are about having fun.

Someone out there decided that players should get locked into a specific stat allocation. This is different from many other games because in this game, the stat allocation is to do the same thing.

Guild Wars 2 really only has one type of PVE character – DPS. Obviously, every character wants to be the best they can be. This is objectively optimizable by class. As a result, the developers have forced people to select “how” they want to do their damage and stay with it. They cannot change this unless they spend another year of grinding to get another set of Ascended gear.

Is this fair?
Not really. Other games have you lock in decisions but these decisions are more based on role than ‘how’ you accomplish role.

Is this fun?
Not really. If I want to change a little bit of precision for healing, I have to spend another year to gear up. This is really discouraging and causes a lot of frustration. It also causes everyone to gear as ’zerker because it is the most useful.

Will nerfing ’zerker change this?
Not really. There will always be a stat setting that is mechanically superior. This is because everyone is DPS in PVE always. If ’zerker is nerfed, a new stat combination will arise as the mechanically best. Everyone will take this and there will be equally no build diversity.

Will allowing gear to swap stats fix this:
Not really (see above). But it will allow players to experiment in PVE without feeling like they have wasted a year of their life.

Psykotik.2691:

I cannot understand why this has not been implemented already. Players will play more and there will be a more rewarding play experience for everyone.

If you can’t understand why, then you must have a rather complete solution to what that would do to crafting in mind already. Please share.

It wouldn’t affect crafting.

Most people only buy one set of armor anyway.

It will harmonize the prices of inputs, however. As a result crafters will no longer be able to level up buying cheap, undesireable mats. The adjustment to crafting prices will be modest, probably no more than 15%. If this is not desired, the drop rate for materials can easily be adjust upwards to eliminate any pricing adjustment.

@Psy Legendarys are long over due for account bound status anet needs to stop trying to rely on tranny stones/splitters sales and just do it. Add a sigil page ( this could even be a one time gem purchase per toon….) where you can equip a sigil to a weapon once and change it whenever you want, on top of that also the ability to swap between infusions for wvw and fractals it would be welcomed imo.
I’m sure most people would rather have 1 set of gear on their toon that can become anything rather than wasting countless inventory slots for multiple sets. Hell id even wear it if it looked like a fresh-spawn character armor set just for the functionality.

@Lord Gw1 had pretty much no investment to change your setups it was beyond easy to obtain anything you needed as you most likely never over-wrote your hp rune in the first place which was often the most expensive one to replace. How can you with 100% certainty say crafting will be impacted so heavily (proof please). (will people suddenly not buy food cause armor changes? What about mat demands for jewelry cooking 500 when that comes?) Most people i know who have already established 1 main buy subsequent gear through badges or dungeon tokens for alts not the tp. If they buy armor through the tp it was simply due to 500 crafting making exotics super cheap to salvage said armor for ecto+mats never to wear.

Psykotik.2691:

It wouldn’t affect crafting.

Really? It won’t call into question why the range of materials even exists? It won’t make Karka shells and Passion Fruit Flowers largely superfluous since you can just change anything to those stats? Quartz is now a vestigial relic of bygone days in your vision?

Most people only buy one set of armor anyway.

If the were true (and I really think you’re projecting your own experience here…), if people really only buy one set… then why do they need to swap stats? No one’s urge to experiment is strong enough to pay 10 whole gold?

It will harmonize the prices of inputs, however. As a result crafters will no longer be able to level up buying cheap, undesireable mats.

Ah, so the plan isn’t to ignore crafting, its to screw crafters. Got it. I’m guessing that anyone whose ever spent karma to buy recipes for more than one stat set is just out of luck too?

Yes, free swapping stats is sexy, but it’s also got consequences and many of them are just plain bad for the game. That’s why you CAN swap freely in SPvP and not in any other aspect of the game.

Any benefits for gameplay and longevity will more than outweigh any potential minus to crafting. But there won’t be any penalty to crafting.

I suppose some inputs will now be redundant, but they wouldn’t be useless because the gear they make is still valid. The only thing it will do is harmonize the price of inputs.

“We will have multiple materials that are now redundant.”
-They are still useful, they would just no longer be distinct from one another.

“Crafters won’t be able to sell for profit.”
-The player demand for multiple sets of armour isn’t there anyway. This is not a point. Dungeon gear assures us of this. People tend to only want one type of gear, which is why EVERYONE is ’zerker.

“Crafting will be more expensive to level.”
-Perhaps slightly, or perhaps not at all. Regardless, tweaking to keep it within the desired range is incredibly easy. I could do it myself if I could adjust drop rates. Since GW2 has an economist on staff, I think his expertise could be utilized.

Crafting will never be a valid way to make a lot of money. Snowflakegate assured us of this.

Without adjustable stats on kit this game won’t be able to regain its former glory because players are hesitant to devote too much time to grinding away on a single set of gear that may be broken in a patch – like ’zerker is opt to do.

This really isn’t even a debate lol.

I sort of agree with both sides.

I think that there needs to be more stat swapping available than only legendaries.
The current Item system is unwieldy
Ascended attainment cost is extremely high in time and resources
Blocks cosmetics

However think it is not feasible to simply make every ascended multi stat to every stat automatically

I think they need to create a system whereby you can build toward unlocking various combinations, where the initial cost may be as high, but the subsequent costs are reduced (cost being time energy and resources)
lets say Item stats could be unlocked to your charachter

you buy berserker, and you bind it to your charachter; this unlocks power gear line, and specifically berserker stats
now you want a soldier, you get an item called “ascended way of the soldier” This will unlock soldier stats on an already unlocked power gear line.
lets say ascended way of the soldier uses 1/5 the empyreal/dragonite/bloodstone same skill points, 1 ascended base material (like damask mithrilium elonian leather etc), and 1 orichalcum imbued inscription.

This would also make ascended similar to legendaries, but with more short term goals you could build towards.

this still is gives ascended value, makes legendaries still valuable (they unlock everything easier)

allows people to still have the goals of gearing, but not the same wall they had to surpass for ascended.

I was always an advocate of swap statting – eh, stat swapping. It should not be free, though. Just add an option to unlock stats on ascended gear. This unlocking part can be implemented very creatively, be it crafting, a scavenger hunt or something else. I like phys’s suggestion as well.
Maybe even allow us to use fully unlocked ascended gear as a legendary precursor. This would basically solve two problems at once. I tried to think through this idea in another thread (link is in my signature).

Edit: Changed “ascended weapon” to “ascended gear”. This option should really be available for ascended trinkets and armor as well.

Psykotik.2691:

At the end of the day – there is absolutely no reason not to, and everyone will benefit immensely.

Only from a players perspective. From the monetization perspective, there is every reason to keep it as it is, because their wallet will benefit.

Psykotik.2691:

-The player demand for multiple sets of armour isn’t there anyway. This is not a point. Dungeon gear assures us of this. People tend to only want one type of gear, which is why EVERYONE is ’zerker.

So having the ability to switch stats would be completely pointless then, since in your mind no one would use it anyway?

lordkrall.7241:

Psykotik.2691:

-The player demand for multiple sets of armour isn’t there anyway. This is not a point. Dungeon gear assures us of this. People tend to only want one type of gear, which is why EVERYONE is ’zerker.

So having the ability to switch stats would be completely pointless then, since in your mind no one would use it anyway?

You sure like to nitpick topics on very small matters. You don’t agree with him leave it at that. Since you aren’t really contributing anything with posts like that you’re calling him out blatantly to try to promote your “view” which is against the forum rules. Zerker is the current pve meta, however maybe someday it won’t be what then? The entire player base should go re-grind multiple sets of already grindy gear in the hopes that the new builds aren’t deemed by anet to be overly-effective and nerfed just as much? Dungeons also aren’t the only part of the game what if people wish to theory-craft new builds in the future for wvw.
Options that enhance gameplay and game quality of life are never a bad thing, and will only promote the health of the game. Customers who are happy grinding things will still have plenty of grind ahead of them when full Legendary is an option.

Even in PvE there are instances where Berserker is bad. Tequatl will just laugh at you if you bring Berserker gear to the fight, as he cannot be crit. This renders two out of three stats on you gear useless.

I don’t agree with free swap on ascended and below – stat swap should be earned, in some unlockable fashion., through crafting, mystic forge, gemstore or some sort of quest.

Cost should be cheap enough to make it practical, but expensive enough that it doesn’t write off all exotic gear.

However once a stat is unlocked, then you could have repeated access to it in the drop down list. So a high initial investment that pays off in the long run.

Ignavia.7420:

Even in PvE there are instances where Berserker is bad. Tequatl will just laugh at you if you bring Berserker gear to the fight, as he cannot be crit. This renders two out of three stats on you gear useless.

Thats why for that fight zerkers are defenders for the cannons Tanky Dps soldiers/sentinels/condis are up front though.

Psykotik.2691:

This really isn’t even a debate lol.

((Looks at the game, right now, on the Live servers))

You’re right. It’s not. Because it’s not happening now and whether you see it or not, there are strong gameplay reasons its not going to happen, either.

I can sit here and explain the whole width and breadth of those reasons over and over and its never going to penetrate that most powerful of player mantras: “But I want it.” Players ALWAYS want stuff that lets them sidesteps hours, days, and weeks of gameplay getting set up. I want infinite flame rams so I don’t have to stop and pick them up from time to time, but getting what I want isn’t a good thing for the game and I know that and I don’t expect them to change it just because it would improve my experience.

They know you want it. They knew that 5 years ago when it was on a whiteboard to have stat mixes at all. Back when chasing after multiple sets of gear was being built into the game.

Nike.2631:

Psykotik.2691:

This really isn’t even a debate lol.

((Looks at the game, right now, on the Live servers))

You’re right. It’s not. Because it’s not happening now and whether you see it or not, there are strong gameplay reasons its not going to happen, either.

I can sit here and explain the whole width and breadth of those reasons over and over and its never going to penetrate that most powerful of player mantras: “But I want it.” Players ALWAYS want stuff that lets them sidesteps hours, days, and weeks of gameplay getting set up. I want infinite flame rams so I don’t have to stop and pick them up from time to time, but getting what I want isn’t a good thing for the game and I know that and I don’t expect them to change it just because it would improve my experience.

They know you want it. They knew that 5 years ago when it was on a whiteboard to have stat mixes at all. Back when chasing after multiple sets of gear was being built into the game.

the current system is very bad on many levels.

managing stats through inventory, in the long term is a hassle, even with infinite slots, you would still have accidental selling/salvaging, and having to do all types of organization.
Cosmetics, well the addition of ascended revealed that when they create new gear teirs, the mess you up twice, not only do you need new gear, you need a new fine transmutation stone to convert it. If you want one look, across multiple gear sets, you are supposed to get the same look repeatedly? which is even harder to distinguish now when going through inventory to select it?

The balance team often talks of making new builds viable, and giving people options to play different, and swapping gear for the needs of what you are doing that day, but with the cost of Ascended, how feasible is it to try a new gear set? it takes roughly 1.5 months of concentrated grinding to get full ascended, and thats not for casual. A casual probably wont be able to earn the 14 gold a day or spend its equivalent time to make a damask cloth, and thats just 1 of the mats you would need to get everyday to complete it in 1.5 months.

Yes his version is simplistic, and unrealistic, but it is a reality that the aquisition of ascended combined with the gear and cosmetic systems in place are running counter to the overall game design.

IMO
game needs a seperate gear system/inventory (check FFXIV for a system that would fit even better into GW2 than it does in FFXIV

game needs appearance to be unlocks instead of one offs. You can see the failure of the current system with the round about methods they have to go to do things like HOM skins and achievement skins. Not to mention if you ever want to change your gear, but keep the look you earned in battle, you essentially have to destroy the other set it, or store it (14 pieces?) and get the same appearance item again

the path to ascended after the intial, needs to be much shorter. Its unreasonable with the current amount of resources it requires that people should have to do it again and again.