Guild Wars 2

I’ve been doing my gathering routes recently and seen the same group of reapers parked with a full minion army in the same spot for many hours at a time. They’re often there when I go to bed and there when I log on the next day.

All the while their minions are killing the dredge that spawn, keeping them in combat and generating loot for their pact commander perk to auto-loot.

This type of ‘exploit’ has existed before with AI but has needed some form of botting-looting system, now that anet has facilitated this type of farm is it still against the ToS?

If you believe it to against the ToS, how should I go about reporting these players? Surely accruing loot and wealth whilst not at your computer isn’t allowed?

There was a thread like this and anet stated its not against tos

If they’re circumventing the auto-kick system then yes it is. If you’re talking about those pesky AFK farmers in Dredgehaunt Cliffs I report them every time I pass them myself.

Those would indeed be the farmers I’m talking about! I don’t know whether reporting them will reflect badly upon my account, especially if it really isn’t against the ToS.

It just feels rather cheap to me and definitely not something Anet intended to happen with the introduction of the auto-loot system. Maybe the auto-loot system should be disabled after prolonged periods of non-character-interaction. The distinction between in and out of combat for long enough simply isn’t good enough.

Unless it becomes an epidemic I find it hard to care about that stuff.
If it does become an epidemic then the devs will squish it.

So I just ignore that stuff and get on with playing the game.

As Anet said, no its not against the rules. Falsely reporting people though is a bannable offense the last time I checked.

penelopehannibal.8947:

…. If you’re talking about those pesky AFK farmers in Dredgehaunt Cliffs….

Ive seen about 5 in total necromancers in that zones afk farming. most of them were farming dredges in one of their camps togeather (most likely for the bags) but one of them was also farming what appears to be vargs or whatever those hellhounds are called.

I assume they also pumped out their auto loot pact commander mastery to be able to pull it off.

Vukorep.3081:

penelopehannibal.8947:

…. If you’re talking about those pesky AFK farmers in Dredgehaunt Cliffs….

Ive seen about 5 in total necromancers in that zones afk farming. most of them were farming dredges in one of their camps togeather (most likely for the bags) but one of them was also farming what appears to be vargs or whatever those hellhounds are called.

I assume they also pumped out their auto loot pact commander mastery to be able to pull it off.

I used to see between 5-8 of them at the southern part. There aren’t as many lately, usually 2-3 these days. There’s even been the odd moment where there aren’t any at all! Whether this is due to GM intervention or not I can’t say, but it suggests to me that reporting works.

It deadset must be something like 1 – 2g an hour though. Good for them, lmao.

Rangers are just as bad. Frostgorge is full of them. No attempt to hide at all, and at it for hours.

set heal to auto-attack, bristleback, pact commander = profit.

I cannot believe they allow this.

I report them. It is obviously unattended gameplay, but I won’t be surprised if I get sanctioned for doing it.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

I report them. It is obviously unattended gameplay, but I won’t be surprised if I get sanctioned for doing it.

You probably won’t. I think the GMs are smart enough to understand why you’re actually reporting them, compared to say, actively seeking to report someone you don’t like just because you don’t like them to try and get them banned (Which is what I think that message in red is really about).

I report the necro AFK farmers nearly every day, and I’ve still not been banned for it (that’s not a green light saying – ‘go ahead, make false claims’ by the way!). Some of them probably aren’t circumventing the auto-kick system, and some are. How am I meant to tell the difference, other than waiting around for an hour before I report? I think the GMs already understand this, and probably get a list of reports to the same ‘player’ from various different other players anyway.

Too long, didn’t read? I think the GMs understand our concerns and can tell the difference between us and a troll reporter.

So yeah, I think you’ll be safe.

Diminishing returns kicks in after awhile ……. so after a time not much is gotten from the mobs

It all boils down to this:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Ranger-Pet-Botting/page/3#post6093187

And this:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Ranger-Pet-Botting/page/3#post6093187

The player inactivity timer could be revisited if afk-farming gets too bad.

Anchoku.8142:

The player inactivity timer could be revisited if afk-farming gets too bad.

The player inactivity timer never went away. Some of these AFK farmers are circumventing it through auto-attacking a signet or healing skill to get around it, meaning they can get loot (no matter how little or how much it is) whilst they sleep.

As usual, ANet used their ability to answer a question as obscurely as possible. What he said is vaguely worded, but the last post I read as saying it’s not ok.

Michael Henninger.7451:

EphemeralWallaby.7643:

Tl;dr intentional mechanics that allow pet kills to give experience and loot =/= permission to afk farm.

This is absolutely correct.

If your pets are doing the killing and your mastery is doing the looting; you’re okay as far as GMs are concerned. This does not mean design can’t/won’t/should/shouldn’t update the system as it works today.

So to recap, EW said intentional mechanics are not permission to afk farm and MH said that that statement was correct.

Then he goes on to muddy the water to say pets killing and auto looting is ok, which isn’t the same as afk farming just that those mechanisms are themselves part of the game.

penelopehannibal.8947:

Anchoku.8142:

The player inactivity timer could be revisited if afk-farming gets too bad.

The player inactivity timer never went away. Some of these AFK farmers are circumventing it through auto-attacking a signet or healing skill to get around it, meaning they can get loot (no matter how little or how much it is) whilst they sleep.

If you read the DEV quotes that I linked, you will see that yes, that is what the players are doing and it is an intended ability because of Auto loot and the current pet mechanics. That doesn’t mean it can’t and won’t change.

As long as they don’t use third party programs then they are not breaking the TOS.

rebellion.2473:

There was a thread like this and anet stated its not against tos

That’s not what the developer said. They said it is intended that the mechanic could allow people to gain rewards without the player being active all the time.

However, it remains true that if people abuse that mechanic, ANet can (and will) go punish folks — it’s never ok to play AFK; it’s just not a big deal if you step away to reheat your beverage (or dispose of it).

For the OP: just report the individuals using the in-game /report tool or take a screenshot and report via the support ticket system. In the end, it’s up to ANet to decide; we don’t have to be sure if it’s against the rules or not. Someone at ANet gets paid to investigate.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

So to recap, EW said intentional mechanics are not permission to afk farm and MH said that that statement was correct.

Then he goes on to muddy the water to say pets killing and auto looting is ok, which isn’t the same as afk farming just that those mechanisms are themselves part of the game.

Exactly this.

There’s a difference between permissible gaining loot from being AFK, for example, to answer the door because the postman has arrived. If you’re just genuinely AFK, the game will kick you out after 60 minutes.

Then there’s people using the game mechanics, adding up toughness, Alt+Right Clicking a heal skill, setting traits to prolong minion life etc. All these on their own are not against the rules. But to put them altogether and then park your character in a situation where you know you’re going to gain advantage whilst not at your keyboard for eight hours, this is not ok.

Even though the dev quotes are foggy at best, I am still reporting such users.

Syllvir.4176:

If you read the DEV quotes that I linked, you will see that yes, that is what the players are doing and it is an intended ability because of Auto loot and the current pet mechanics. That doesn’t mean it can’t and won’t change.

As long as they don’t use third party programs then they are not breaking the TOS.

I was there in the thread at the time, replying to at least one of the dev quotes that you quoted. My interpretation of the dev quotes are the same as Just a flesh wound’s.

I don’t bother because I used to, and I saw no results from doing so. It literally became a waste of my play time to do ArenaNet’s job for them. They know where the trouble issues are, they can monitor their policy with their paid staff.

Now only if they changed AFK rules to ignore auto-attack…

Which will not happen. Unless something more sinister comes out in the future with ingame functions.

Maybe arenanet could spawn “reapers” from time to time (once afk timer triggers). This “reaper” is an invincible monster that has weak attacks at first, but gradually becomes stronger over time, so you have to move away from that spot, else you die. XD Maybe Grenth is not dead after all, one of his generals is doing rounds in Tyria. XD

Just a flesh wound.3589:

As usual, ANet used their ability to answer a question as obscurely as possible. What he said is vaguely worded, but the last post I read as saying it’s not ok.

Michael Henninger.7451:

EphemeralWallaby.7643:

Tl;dr intentional mechanics that allow pet kills to give experience and loot =/= permission to afk farm.

This is absolutely correct.

If your pets are doing the killing and your mastery is doing the looting; you’re okay as far as GMs are concerned. This does not mean design can’t/won’t/should/shouldn’t update the system as it works today.

So to recap, EW said intentional mechanics are not permission to afk farm and MH said that that statement was correct.

Then he goes on to muddy the water to say pets killing and auto looting is ok, which isn’t the same as afk farming just that those mechanisms are themselves part of the game.

Actual AFK farming requires 3rd party programs. This is not OK as it breaches the TOS.

This is not what is being discussed. I think everyone in this thread knows that using 3rd party things that interact with the game is against the TOS. What we are discussing here is the use of ingame mechanics to farm loot in a particular spot with no user input. This is ok as taken directly from the devs mouth:

“pets are doing the killing and your mastery is doing the looting; you’re okay”

It literally couldn’t be more clear that his behavior is ok. I guess there may be a language barrier or something make it more difficult, but the devs said it is ok, therefore it is ok.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

…snip…

This is ok as taken directly from the devs mouth:

“pets are doing the killing and your mastery is doing the looting; you’re okay”

It literally couldn’t be more clear that his behavior is ok. I guess there may be a language barrier or something make it more difficult, but the devs said it is ok, therefore it is ok.

No ZG, you are wrong in this. That is what was cleared up in that follow-up post that JaFW quoted.

Just because you are mechanically capable of doing something, doesn’t mean it’s not against ANet Policy to actually do it. That is the point: “pets are doing the killing and your mastery is doing the looting; you’re okay” is referring only to the mechanics of the game during active play, not the behavior of going AFK to exploit those mechanics.

~EW

edited for clarity, sorry.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

As usual, ANet used their ability to answer a question as obscurely as possible. What he said is vaguely worded, but the last post I read as saying it’s not ok.

Michael Henninger.7451:

EphemeralWallaby.7643:

Tl;dr intentional mechanics that allow pet kills to give experience and loot =/= permission to afk farm.

This is absolutely correct.

If your pets are doing the killing and your mastery is doing the looting; you’re okay as far as GMs are concerned. This does not mean design can’t/won’t/should/shouldn’t update the system as it works today.

So to recap, EW said intentional mechanics are not permission to afk farm and MH said that that statement was correct.

Then he goes on to muddy the water to say pets killing and auto looting is ok, which isn’t the same as afk farming just that those mechanisms are themselves part of the game.

Actual AFK farming requires 3rd party programs. This is not OK as it breaches the TOS.

This is not what is being discussed. I think everyone in this thread knows that using 3rd party things that interact with the game is against the TOS. What we are discussing here is the use of ingame mechanics to farm loot in a particular spot with no user input. This is ok as taken directly from the devs mouth:

“pets are doing the killing and your mastery is doing the looting; you’re okay”

It literally couldn’t be more clear that his behavior is ok. I guess there may be a language barrier or something make it more difficult, but the devs said it is ok, therefore it is ok.

You actually deleted the quote Just a flesh wound was showing that MH was replying to, so in case people read your post instead of Just a flesh wounds, here it is:

Michael Henninger.7451:

EphemeralWallaby.7643:

Tl;dr intentional mechanics that allow pet kills to give experience and loot =/= permission to afk farm.

This is absolutely correct.

If your pets are doing the killing and your mastery is doing the looting; you’re okay as far as GMs are concerned. This does not mean design can’t/won’t/should/shouldn’t update the system as it works today.

AFK Farming is more than just pet killing + Auto Looting. It’s the circumventing of the auto-boot system too. And we know we’re not talking about 3rd party programmes.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

As usual, ANet used their ability to answer a question as obscurely as possible. What he said is vaguely worded, but the last post I read as saying it’s not ok.

Michael Henninger.7451:

EphemeralWallaby.7643:

Tl;dr intentional mechanics that allow pet kills to give experience and loot =/= permission to afk farm.

This is absolutely correct.

If your pets are doing the killing and your mastery is doing the looting; you’re okay as far as GMs are concerned. This does not mean design can’t/won’t/should/shouldn’t update the system as it works today.

So to recap, EW said intentional mechanics are not permission to afk farm and MH said that that statement was correct.

Then he goes on to muddy the water to say pets killing and auto looting is ok, which isn’t the same as afk farming just that those mechanisms are themselves part of the game.

Actual AFK farming requires 3rd party programs. This is not OK as it breaches the TOS.

This is not what is being discussed. I think everyone in this thread knows that using 3rd party things that interact with the game is against the TOS. What we are discussing here is the use of ingame mechanics to farm loot in a particular spot with no user input. This is ok as taken directly from the devs mouth:

“pets are doing the killing and your mastery is doing the looting; you’re okay”

It literally couldn’t be more clear that his behavior is ok. I guess there may be a language barrier or something make it more difficult, but the devs said it is ok, therefore it is ok.

MH said that if your pet kills something and you auto loot while playing, then that’s ok but that it’s not ok to use these mechanism to afk farm.

EW
Tl;dr intentional mechanics that allow pet kills to give experience and loot =/= permission to afk farm.

MH
This is absolutely correct.

If your pets are doing the killing and your mastery is doing the looting; you’re okay as far as GMs are concerned. This does not mean design can’t/won’t/should/shouldn’t update the system as it works today.

The first part was to say afking to do it is not something allowable. The second part was to say it happening while actively playing is not a problem.

I suggest that Anet updates their ToS to include not just 3rd party programs but anything that automates gameplay. There are also images of the message players receive when banned that includes the phrase “extended unattended play” which I don’t recall seeing in the ToS either.

Anything that automates game play to the point where you are able to not actually play the game as-intended (example: you can walk away from it) is considered a breach of the User Agreement.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/players/Has-there-ever-been-an-official-response-on-what-is-considered-botting/first#post204144