Guild Wars 2

It’s pretty clear right now that damage rules in dungeons. Excluding a small number of paths and maybe higher level fractals, it’s all about killing fast.

This is in part due to the lack of tank/healer/dps roles. I think the original vision, or how it sounded before the game was released, was that everyone would be responsible for their own safety, and everyone would have the tools to do it. Currently, all damage parties rip through almost everything with ease and no one needs to be responsible for survivability when everyone can do enough damage.

A simple method to change this is to make aggro more predictable and reliable. Bosses should fixate on characters rather than being schizophrenic the way most bosses are now. Bosses should fixate on characters with some degree of randomness, and stay on them for a period of time before moving on to another character. This will put the support role in focus as situational awareness will let you put on a critical protection or heal.

This will also discourage everyone from being full zerk, as there will be serious risks. If the boss decides to go for you, you’ll likely not have enough dodges to deal with a sustained onslaught and your party won’t have the defensive support to keep you up. Currently, you just need to dodge key attacks and you’ll be fine.

Not every boss should be changed in this way, but a lot of the bosses that are essentially jokes at the moment may become challenging to zerker parties.

Sorry but no…

What you are describing is going back to the old tank/dps/heal/support roles and thats a step back. If you want to change things up in Dungeons then I would suggest making bossed more smarter, things like avoiding stacks of people/use environment to cause issues for ranged etc.

However it should be paired with clearly signalled moves so clever players can try to avoid (thinking of Mossmans stupid aggro and oneshot mechanics).

aeneq.1760:

Sorry but no…

What you are describing is going back to the old tank/dps/heal/support roles and thats a step back.

Were they really?

Redfeather.6401:

aeneq.1760:

Sorry but no…

What you are describing is going back to the old tank/dps/heal/support roles and thats a step back.

Were they really?

Not really IMHO even tabletop, and story book fantasy use it. I’m pretty sure our modern military even has a tank/healer/dps system

Half the problems with PvE in this game stem from no one needing anyone else and everyone being 100% self sufficient in all arenas of PvE.

Lokki.1092:

Redfeather.6401:

aeneq.1760:

Sorry but no…

What you are describing is going back to the old tank/dps/heal/support roles and thats a step back.

Were they really?

Not really IMHO even tabletop, and story book fantasy use it. I’m pretty sure our modern military even has a tank/healer/dps system

Half the problems with PvE in this game stem from no one needing anyone else and everyone being 100% self sufficient in all arenas of PvE.

Think You misunderstood me, ANet has explicitly stated that the design of GW is not around whats called the holy trinity (tank/healer/dps). Now you can argue that such a clearly defined role division promotes strategy etc etc etc but the fact is that the whole community is split in this discussion and ANet has taken its side…

Therefore in the context of GW it would be a step back.

Also from my personal aspect the trinity is kinda silly, hey im an uberboss but ill stand here slamming my head against a wall while 40 other characters keep pinching me in the back

I have nothing against the current design, however stupid bosses promotes exploitation that in turn favors specific builds/strategies. Things like reflection that bosses ignore altho it takes 50% of their life etc etc.

And I have no idea where you get the notion that modern armies uses a trinity approach. Healer/Dps maybe could be argued for a small part of the military but thats debatable.

Lokki.1092:

Redfeather.6401:

aeneq.1760:

Sorry but no…

What you are describing is going back to the old tank/dps/heal/support roles and thats a step back.

Were they really?

Not really IMHO even tabletop, and story book fantasy use it. I’m pretty sure our modern military even has a tank/healer/dps system

Half the problems with PvE in this game stem from no one needing anyone else and everyone being 100% self sufficient in all arenas of PvE.

Which military in the world trains soldiers to stand still and let the enemy shoot at them?

aeneq.1760:

Think You misunderstood me, ANet has explicitly stated that the design of GW is not around whats called the holy trinity (tank/healer/dps). Now you can argue that such a clearly defined role division promotes strategy etc etc etc but the fact is that the whole community is split in this discussion and ANet has taken its side…

Therefore in the context of GW it would be a step back.

Also from my personal aspect the trinity is kinda silly, hey im an uberboss but ill stand here slamming my head against a wall while 40 other characters keep pinching me in the back

I have nothing against the current design, however stupid bosses promotes exploitation that in turn favors specific builds/strategies. Things like reflection that bosses ignore altho it takes 50% of their life etc etc.

And I have no idea where you get the notion that modern armies uses a trinity approach. Healer/Dps maybe could be argued for a small part of the military but thats debatable.

Agreed in the context you put it in, it would be a step backwards. Though I’ve seen some games (SWTOR comes to mind) where the devs made up their mind that doing something XYZ way was the best and tried in futility to make it work, making the system more and more complex and ridiculous all because they didn’t want to do it like the other guys, only to finally cave too far too late in realization that they didn’t need to recreate the wheel.

I was happy to hear that there would be no trinity. though I thought they meant that there would be no forced roles. As in every class can play any roll at anytime. (they even said they had 3 rolls control, support, and dps) but instead it’s everyone is everything at the same time. They took a very well made and time tested system and turned it on it’s head, is there any wonder why it isn’t working perfectly? This doesn’t mean they are not onto something here but so far it is having a lot of problems and it’s easy to wonder if it’s time to throw in the towel and go back to the proven strategy or at least move that way.

As for the military thing… Smiley face was supposed to be an indication of joking.

I was just joking about the idea that the strategy of 1 group gets the attention of the enemy while another group flanks and kills isn’t something new or even outdated as a combat strategy. And the Idea of a group that is dedicated to healing the wounded combatants isn’t either. Tank/dps/healer

aeneq.1760:

Sorry but no…

What you are describing is going back to the old tank/dps/heal/support roles and thats a step back.

We already have that actually…. If you and everyone in your party only ever wears Berserker, then you’d never noticed it b/c the stats don’t effect Aggro as much as say…. a Guardian in a PVT using a Staff does (Bosses go crazy for that kitten, their Aggro algorithm just eats it up)

So yes, the AI already is capable of fixating and Lupicus especially will almost always do this. It’s actually part of almost every guide written about him, that he will divide aggro between 2 out of the 5 Players. When I’m my Full Cleric Guardian, he will usually focus me with the ShadowStep, light bolts cone, & Barf-Bubble. When on my “Shaman’s/Valk” Ranger he will usually focus me with his Heavy homing double bolt & the LifeTransfers.

.

The problem is that there’s really nothing that changing the AI would do when it comes to Berserker meta. Berserkers will just buy TruffleMeat Stew in bulk instead and just dodge more often until the Boss is dead in its usual record time. What really needs to happen is more Adds that cast good old Gw1 protection skills that combat pure physical pressure along with some of Shiro’s BS that also combated mindless DPS’ing. The Mobs should also have a lot more Boon Stripping. I hate that… everyone hates mobs that AOE steal all your boons (with a long telegraph though)… As a Prot-Monk, Chilblains was the BANE of my existence. But it needs to happen anyway. More bosses also need to gain stacks of “Enrage” when the DPS they’re taking breaches a certain threshold.

It’s heavy handed, but when it comes to the Zerker Fo Lyfe crew, numbers are all they listen to. Change the numbers?…Change their attitudes

aeneq.1760:

Lokki.1092:

Redfeather.6401:

aeneq.1760:

Sorry but no…

What you are describing is going back to the old tank/dps/heal/support roles and thats a step back.

Were they really?

Not really IMHO even tabletop, and story book fantasy use it. I’m pretty sure our modern military even has a tank/healer/dps system

Half the problems with PvE in this game stem from no one needing anyone else and everyone being 100% self sufficient in all arenas of PvE.

Think You misunderstood me, ANet has explicitly stated that the design of GW is not around whats called the holy trinity (tank/healer/dps). Now you can argue that such a clearly defined role division promotes strategy etc etc etc but the fact is that the whole community is split in this discussion and ANet has taken its side…

Therefore in the context of GW it would be a step back.

Also from my personal aspect the trinity is kinda silly, hey im an uberboss but ill stand here slamming my head against a wall while 40 other characters keep pinching me in the back

I have nothing against the current design, however stupid bosses promotes exploitation that in turn favors specific builds/strategies. Things like reflection that bosses ignore altho it takes 50% of their life etc etc.

And I have no idea where you get the notion that modern armies uses a trinity approach. Healer/Dps maybe could be argued for a small part of the military but thats debatable.

Nothing I said will bring back a tank and spank system. Notice, I suggested the aggro be RANDOM, but less spastic, meaning a boss has to stick on a guy for a period. It then becomes anyone’s responsibility to survive a sustained focus. It also gives a target for everyone else to support. This will add more skill as right now, support doesn’t require much skill, just spam aoe boons/cleanses. Brainless.