Guild Wars 2

and said we could expect new legendarys as well as a way to craft/build precursor weapons later on in 2013. It took them about 3 yrs before we finally got what we were promised and on top of that, we only got 4 new Legendarys as the rest were put on hold (in other words it’s basically cancelled) despite the fact we, the players, bought it with our own money.

So what does this say about Anet as a company? Do you consider them to be fraudulent and deceiving? Because that is what I think of when someone says ArenaNet. I don’t really care for Legendarys all that much, but what I do care about is if a company makes a promise, they better deliver on that promise. If I buy something that was clearly advertised by a company, and that company not only does not deliver with the item but doesn’t even give me my money back, I consider it fraudulent and deceiving. And its really not just the Legendarys but everything else that Anet has promised but have failed to deliver. I haven’t bought anything with real money since HoT came out and I don’t think I ever will.

But on a lighter note, atleast I’ll still play your game, you’re just never going to get my money ever again

As they didn’t ‘promise’, and later that year, or early the next year (I don’t remember the timeline now, it’s been so long) announced that precursor/legendary crafting was being overhauled, and they were starting over, I don’t think they have to ‘deliver’.

If you don’t want to support the studio, or keep up with the game, that’s your perogative. As long as you enjoy what you are playing, that’s all that matters.

Good luck.

Shovel Face.4512:

But on a lighter note, atleast I’ll still play your game, you’re just never going to get my money ever again

about sums up how I feel

Shovel Face.4512:

and said we could expect new legendarys as well as a way to craft/build precursor weapons later on in 2013. It took them about 3 yrs before we finally got what we were promised and on top of that, we only got 4 new Legendarys as the rest were put on hold (in other words it’s basically cancelled) despite the fact we, the players, bought it with our own money.

So what does this say about Anet as a company? Do you consider them to be fraudulent and deceiving? Because that is what I think of when someone says ArenaNet. I don’t really care for Legendarys all that much, but what I do care about is if a company makes a promise, they better deliver on that promise. If I buy something that was clearly advertised by a company, and that company not only does not deliver with the item but doesn’t even give me my money back, I consider it fraudulent and deceiving. And its really not just the Legendarys but everything else that Anet has promised but have failed to deliver. I haven’t bought anything with real money since HoT came out and I don’t think I ever will.

But on a lighter note, atleast I’ll still play your game, you’re just never going to get my money ever again

the gaming community needs more people like you

if a developer carried on with tunnel vision and only ever built what they discussed at some point in the past then their ability to react to present customer needs would be nil. Strangely the people that complain still play the very same product they have played for the last 3 years including the content that was made instead of those 3 year old legendaries that were discussed. Still for some it seems a good excuse to declare they will no longer support the game in the future (why?) and yet they will still play it which means actually they still enjoy same content. The modern take take take never be happy with what you have people are delightful.

vesica tempestas.1563:

if a developer carried on with tunnel vision and only ever built what they discussed at some point in the past then their ability to react to present customer needs would be nil.

I don’t suspect most of the average gamers understands how this is exactly what kills a business. That’s why it’s so sad to see threads like this.

Unfortunately, the joke is on the OP, because having a fraction of customers that don’t give Anet money for whatever is already part of their business model. Yeah, you really fooled them dude :/

vesica tempestas.1563:

if a developer carried on with tunnel vision and only ever built what they discussed at some point in the past then their ability to react to present customer needs would be nil. Strangely the people that complain still play the very same product they have played for the last 3 years including the content that was made instead of those 3 year old legendaries that were discussed. Still for some it seems a good excuse to declare they will no longer support the game in the future (why?) and yet they will still play it which means actually they still enjoy same content. The modern take take take never be happy with what you have people are delightful.

Are you being contrary just for the heck of it? I don’t seem to quite understand what your point is with this post. If you’re saying that “it’s ok for a company to go back on its statements, not deliver to what customers paid for and we should just settle” then it’s people like you I dislike the most.

Obtena.7952:

vesica tempestas.1563:

if a developer carried on with tunnel vision and only ever built what they discussed at some point in the past then their ability to react to present customer needs would be nil.

I don’t suspect most of the average gamers understands how this is exactly what kills a business. That’s why it’s so sad to see threads like this.

Unfortunately, the joke is on the OP, because having a fraction of customers that don’t give Anet money for whatever is already part of their business model. Yeah, you really fooled them dude :/

Uhm ok?

look up ‘agile development’, that will help you understand ^^

… and while you’re at it “opportunity cost”, “return on investment”

and that ^^

vesica tempestas.1563:

look up ‘agile development’, that will help you understand ^^

Lol ok?

I don’t think that changes the fact Anet has lost a lot of its players and that the few players that are still around won’t be supporting the company. But people like you can go ahead and conform to Anets unacceptable ways.

The Legendary promises back in 2013? Yeah, they said all that and more back then. But at the end of that blog they added the sentence “As always, the content above is subject to change as we test and iterate on these systems.”

Those provisional promises made back then weren’t anything anyone paid any money for and they can be counted as hype. Nice if it comes through. But if it doesn’t, it doesn’t.

Looking Ahead. Gw2 in 2013

Obtena.7952:

… and while you’re at it “opportunity cost”, “return on investment”

Ahh I see, you’re one of those kinds of people.

You’re more concerned with the company making money and would rather receive the short end of the stick…which is odd considering people usually act in their own self interest.

Yes, I’m one of those kind of people: The “not ignorant”. The saddest part about threads like this is that you don’t even realize the benefit that Anet cancelling this failed development track has to our community. This isn’t about making money; it’s about business decisions that keep this game going and bring us more value for the money we give them.

If you cared to educate yourself a little bit with the topics we gave you, you would be better off for it.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

The Legendary promises back in 2013? Yeah, they said all that and more back then. But at the end of that blog they added the sentence “As always, the content above is subject to change as we test and iterate on these systems.”

Those provisional promises made back then weren’t anything anyone paid any money for and they can be counted as hype. Nice if it comes through. But if it doesn’t, it doesn’t.

Looking Ahead. Gw2 in 2013

I understand, it’s just very unprofessional of them to do that.

Obtena.7952:

Yes, I’m one of those kind of people: The “not ignorant” breed. The saddest part about threads like this is that you don’t even realize the benefit that Anet cancelling this failed development track has to our community. This isn’t about making money; it’s about business decisions that keep this game going and bring us more value for the money we give them.

But then you’re just defending an incompetent company that seems way in over their heads.

Shovel Face.4512:

Obtena.7952:

Yes, I’m one of those kind of people: The “not ignorant” breed. The saddest part about threads like this is that you don’t even realize the benefit that Anet cancelling this failed development track has to our community. This isn’t about making money; it’s about business decisions that keep this game going and bring us more value for the money we give them.

But then you’re just defending an incompetent company that seems way in over their heads.

You’re right … I do, because I like the game and what it offers me for entertainment value. As long as it delivers that to me, I will support it. I’m also not completely unreasonable; Legendary development was a mistake … and Anet did the right thing and stopped it instead of pretending to deliver a failure. For me, that shows honesty and consideration for the customer. Maybe you have different values and disagree, but I can appreciate that; I will give my money to a company that acknowledges and fixes its mistakes.

BTW, how hypocritical for you to say that … you still play this game by your own admission? Therefore, you are also ‘defending’ this company and supporting the game they make as well. Who is this joke on again?

Obtena.7952:

Yes, I’m one of those kind of people: The “not ignorant”. The saddest part about threads like this is that you don’t even realize the benefit that Anet cancelling this failed development track has to our community. This isn’t about making money; it’s about business decisions that keep this game going and bring us more value for the money we give them.

If you cared to educate yourself a little bit with the topics we gave you, you would be better off for it.

Ah, I see, the not ignorant are happy with not getting what they actually paid for when they bought the expansion. I’ll be counted among the ignorant gladly then.

SpeedFiend.4521:

Obtena.7952:

Yes, I’m one of those kind of people: The “not ignorant”. The saddest part about threads like this is that you don’t even realize the benefit that Anet cancelling this failed development track has to our community. This isn’t about making money; it’s about business decisions that keep this game going and bring us more value for the money we give them.

If you cared to educate yourself a little bit with the topics we gave you, you would be better off for it.

Ah, I see, the not ignorant are happy with not getting what they actually paid for when they bought the expansion. I’ll be counted among the ignorant gladly then.

I got all I paid for and more … the games offers me more entertainment value than I ever expected to get for the money I have put into it, including the expansion, EVEN with Legendary development being on hold indefinitely.

Again … check out the topics, you might just start to understand how what you are saying makes little sense.

Obtena.7952:

Shovel Face.4512:

Obtena.7952:

Yes, I’m one of those kind of people: The “not ignorant” breed. The saddest part about threads like this is that you don’t even realize the benefit that Anet cancelling this failed development track has to our community. This isn’t about making money; it’s about business decisions that keep this game going and bring us more value for the money we give them.

But then you’re just defending an incompetent company that seems way in over their heads.

You’re right … I do, because I like the game and what it offers me for entertainment value. As long as it delivers that to me, I will support it.

BTW, how hypocritical for you to say that … you still play this game by your own admission? Therefore, you are also ‘defending’ this company and supporting the game they make as well. Who is this joke on again?

I will not lie, Anet did make a fun game. However that does make it ok for them to get away with the stuff I’ve listed. Btw, I’m not supporting it if I’m not buying gems.

Shovel Face.4512:

Obtena.7952:

Shovel Face.4512:

Obtena.7952:

Yes, I’m one of those kind of people: The “not ignorant” breed. The saddest part about threads like this is that you don’t even realize the benefit that Anet cancelling this failed development track has to our community. This isn’t about making money; it’s about business decisions that keep this game going and bring us more value for the money we give them.

But then you’re just defending an incompetent company that seems way in over their heads.

You’re right … I do, because I like the game and what it offers me for entertainment value. As long as it delivers that to me, I will support it.

BTW, how hypocritical for you to say that … you still play this game by your own admission? Therefore, you are also ‘defending’ this company and supporting the game they make as well. Who is this joke on again?

I will not lie, Anet did make a fun game. However that does make it ok for them to get away with the stuff I’ve listed. Btw, I’m not supporting it if I’m not buying gems.

One of their metrics they use for a successful game is how many people log in every day.

Because they realize that not everyone is able to afford to buy gems.

So in their mind, you’re just one of the supporters who can’t afford to buy gems.

Shovel Face.4512:

Obtena.7952:

Shovel Face.4512:

Obtena.7952:

Yes, I’m one of those kind of people: The “not ignorant” breed. The saddest part about threads like this is that you don’t even realize the benefit that Anet cancelling this failed development track has to our community. This isn’t about making money; it’s about business decisions that keep this game going and bring us more value for the money we give them.

But then you’re just defending an incompetent company that seems way in over their heads.

You’re right … I do, because I like the game and what it offers me for entertainment value. As long as it delivers that to me, I will support it.

BTW, how hypocritical for you to say that … you still play this game by your own admission? Therefore, you are also ‘defending’ this company and supporting the game they make as well. Who is this joke on again?

I will not lie, Anet did make a fun game. However that does make it ok for them to get away with the stuff I’ve listed. Btw, I’m not supporting it if I’m not buying gems.

They didn’t ‘get away’ with anything; there are consequences to the decisions they have made. The only unfortunate thing is that players like you don’t understand how this was a necessary and, in the long term, hopefully beneficial decision.

Again, you are still supporting the game because Anet’s business model takes people like you into account. In addition, your presence in the game and interactions you have with the people you play with, sell mats to the TP, contribute to group events, etc… yup … you’re supporting the game whether you like it or not … #staysalty

There is a large difference between “promise” and “plan”.

Shovel Face.4512:

and said we could expect new legendarys as well as a way to craft/build precursor weapons later on in 2013. It took them about 3 yrs before we finally got what we were promised and on top of that, we only got 4 new Legendarys as the rest were put on hold (in other words it’s basically cancelled) despite the fact we, the players, bought it with our own money.

So what does this say about Anet as a company? Do you consider them to be fraudulent and deceiving? Because that is what I think of when someone says ArenaNet. I don’t really care for Legendarys all that much, but what I do care about is if a company makes a promise, they better deliver on that promise.

But they did. Even with your own statement, they did. Granted, it took a minute, and not the amount you were hoping for, but signed, sealed, and delivered.

That said, nine months of content drought and a dwindling population trumps legendaries. But, even so, that doesn’t mean legendaries are gone forever.

It would be silly to say so given the nature of MMOs.

My mom promised my brother all the ice cream he could eat if he’d be brave before getting his tonsils out. He never got the ice cream. The White Knights in my family point out he did get “all he could eat” — it was just he couldn’t eat anything at all. The family critics said don’t parse the words, clearly he was promised ice cream in bulk.

Regardless, my brother got over it.

I don’t really care if ANet promised something or shared their plans. Talk is cheap; it doesn’t matter to me what they said or say or are going to say. I’m only interested in what they actually deliver. As long as the game is fun for me and has fun stuff to do, I’ll keep playing and pay for expansions.

It’s the OP’s right to hold a grudge and not to spend their hard-earned (or easily accumulated) RL money on GW2 because of it. Personally, I find it’s more fun to ignore ANet and play. Life’s too short to worry about what Colin said 3 years ago or what Mike O’Brien will say next week.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

My mom promised my brother all the ice cream he could eat if he’d be brave before getting his tonsils out. He never got the ice cream. The White Knights in my family point out he did get “all he could eat” — it was just he couldn’t eat anything at all. The family critics said don’t parse the words, clearly he was promised ice cream in bulk.

Regardless, my brother got over it.

I don’t really care if ANet promised something or shared their plans. Talk is cheap; it doesn’t matter to me what they said or say or are going to say. I’m only interested in what they actually deliver. As long as the game is fun for me and has fun stuff to do, I’ll keep playing and pay for expansions.

It’s the OP’s right to hold a grudge and not to spend their hard-earned (or easily accumulated) RL money on GW2 because of it. Personally, I find it’s more fun to ignore ANet and play. Life’s too short to worry about what Colin said 3 years ago or what Mike O’Brien will say next week.

+1 and QFT. My thoughts precisely. Thank you for this.

It’s good to praise a game for the things it does right but it’s also good to acknowledge the shortcomings so that it can hopefully improve in the future. The OP’s points are very valid and just because you don’t agree with them it doesn’t make them incorrect.

They did in fact promise not only new legendary weapons but legendary armor in 2013.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/looking-ahead-guild-wars-2-in-2013/

We aren’t quite ready to go into all the details here, but what I can say is you will see a specific way to build precursor items on your way to a legendary. On top of this, you’ll also see new legendary weapons and new types of legendary gear in 2013. Building your precursor will require a large amount of the new crafting material rewards listed above, 500 in crafting, and likely a combination of other items earned for completing more specific content in the game.

That’s in their official news…then they scrapped that as we all know to overhaul their system. And then new legendaries and armor were put behind a paywall, aka HoT. Not necessarily a bad thing but maybe a bit disappointing to all of us that were waiting for so long. Keep in mind that these were a pretty big selling point for HoT.

Then HoT was announced and we were initially promised a full new set of legendaries with HoT’s launch. Then as it got closer to release, we were told it would just be 16, then just 4 initially with small batches throughout the upcoming year until all were released. Then we got something like below which could be interpreted as they will be released eventually…

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/hot-new-legendary-weapons/

It takes a lot of work to craft these legendary journeys for release, so rather than take the time to develop the full set before releasing any of them, we will be releasing new legendary weapons in small groups at regular intervals until the full set of sixteen has been added to the game.

And then finally they were “postponed indefinitely”…aka they probably won’t see the light of day.

My biggest issue with all of you stating that scrapping legendary weapons saved the game and helped move it forward is that the legendary weapon team only consisted of 6 people, yes 6. So if these 6 people are carrying the weight of the other hundreds of employees then fire the useless ones and get other people who will actually work.

They couldn’t have left that team of 6 on the legendary team? What about pulling the 70+ working on the new expansion? Or any other of the plethora of employees at Anet. How do you guys fail to see this? If 6 employees were that crucial to the development of the current game then don’t you think Anet’s prioritizes are out of wack?

Just in case you think I was making those numbers up…from Mike himself.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Legendary-weapons-6/first

Last year we talked about plans to gradually build out a second set of legendary weapons through live content updates. That’s a big responsibility. We have a team of six developers working on that, who could work on it for years to come.

vesica tempestas.1563:

Shovel Face.4512:

But on a lighter note, atleast I’ll still play your game, you’re just never going to get my money ever again

the gaming community needs more people like you

They can have as many as they want, there’s more than enough of them hanging out in these forums.

Roquen.5406:

It’s good to praise a game for the things it does right but it’s also good to acknowledge the shortcomings so that it can hopefully improve in the future. The OP’s points are very valid and just because you don’t agree with them it doesn’t make them incorrect.

They did in fact promise not only new legendary weapons but legendary armor in 2013.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/looking-ahead-guild-wars-2-in-2013/

We aren’t quite ready to go into all the details here, but what I can say is you will see a specific way to build precursor items on your way to a legendary. On top of this, you’ll also see new legendary weapons and new types of legendary gear in 2013. Building your precursor will require a large amount of the new crafting material rewards listed above, 500 in crafting, and likely a combination of other items earned for completing more specific content in the game.

That’s in their official news…then they scrapped that as we all know to overhaul their system. And then new legendaries and armor were put behind a paywall, aka HoT. Not necessarily a bad thing but maybe a bit disappointing to all of us that were waiting for so long. Keep in mind that these were a pretty big selling point for HoT.

Then HoT was announced and we were initially promised a full new set of legendaries with HoT’s launch. Then as it got closer to release, we were told it would just be 16, then just 4 initially with small batches throughout the upcoming year until all were released. Then we got something like below which could be interpreted as they will be released eventually…

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/hot-new-legendary-weapons/

It takes a lot of work to craft these legendary journeys for release, so rather than take the time to develop the full set before releasing any of them, we will be releasing new legendary weapons in small groups at regular intervals until the full set of sixteen has been added to the game.

And then finally they were “postponed indefinitely”…aka they probably won’t see the light of day.

My biggest issue with all of you stating that scrapping legendary weapons saved the game and helped move it forward is that the legendary weapon team only consisted of 6 people, yes 6. So if these 6 people are carrying the weight of the other hundreds of employees then fire the useless ones and get other people who will actually work.

They couldn’t have left that team of 6 on the legendary team? What about pulling the 70+ working on the new expansion? Or any other of the plethora of employees at Anet. How do you guys fail to see this? If 6 employees were that crucial to the development of the current game then don’t you think Anet’s prioritizes are out of wack?

Just in case you think I was making those numbers up…from Mike himself.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Legendary-weapons-6/first

Last year we talked about plans to gradually build out a second set of legendary weapons through live content updates. That’s a big responsibility. We have a team of six developers working on that, who could work on it for years to come.

As i said, this is to do with professional industry recognized development practices , developing software where you build everything you ever said you would is not how you develop fast moving customer facing products, and as has been said before, the OP could look up Agile development if he genuinely want to understand why Anet does this. but ofc he doesn’t really want to understand why, he just wants to complain about a thing he has in his ahead as some kind of ‘promise’ like a child throwing a tantrum with their parent – im not paying he says dramatically while he continues to play!

Shovel Face.4512:

Obtena.7952:

Shovel Face.4512:

Obtena.7952:

Yes, I’m one of those kind of people: The “not ignorant” breed. The saddest part about threads like this is that you don’t even realize the benefit that Anet cancelling this failed development track has to our community. This isn’t about making money; it’s about business decisions that keep this game going and bring us more value for the money we give them.

But then you’re just defending an incompetent company that seems way in over their heads.

You’re right … I do, because I like the game and what it offers me for entertainment value. As long as it delivers that to me, I will support it.

BTW, how hypocritical for you to say that … you still play this game by your own admission? Therefore, you are also ‘defending’ this company and supporting the game they make as well. Who is this joke on again?

I will not lie, Anet did make a fun game. However that does make it ok for them to get away with the stuff I’ve listed. Btw, I’m not supporting it if I’m not buying gems.

what they ‘got away with’ is making a fun game that you play after 3 years (as you say). You benefited from their evaluation of opportunity cost and their development philosophy and practices, your just incapable of seeing it or willing to learn, e.g Agile would explain to you why they make some decisions, but rather than read the 1 of the million articles that popup in a google search you stick your fingers in your ears and saying ‘lol ok?’ – should have said ‘nananana im not listening’ for better effect surely?

vesica tempestas.1563:

-cropped-

As i said, this is to do with professional industry recognized development practices , developing software where you build everything you ever said you would is not how you develop fast moving customer facing products, and as has been said before, the OP could look up Agile development if he genuinely want to understand why Anet does this. but ofc he doesn’t really want to understand why, he just wants to complain about a thing he has in his ahead as some kind of ‘promise’ like a child throwing a tantrum with their parent – im not paying he says dramatically while he continues to play!

You seem to have glossed over the majority of my post. He is upset because he paid for something which was essentially never released. I can see how that is frustrating, it also shows he cares to an extent…He enjoys the game and he wants Anet to do better, there is nothing wrong with that.

Also stating he’s not paying anymore is not dramatic. He feels he enjoys what content there is but because of the direction Anet has moved in, he chooses not to give them anymore money for the time being.

I think more people should stick to these types of principles and to stop accepting everything as is. Remember this is a 2 way business model. Anet provides us with a product and in return we pay them for said product – we both need each other. The OP simply feels that at this point in time the product is no longer worth paying for. /shrug

And has has been repeated a million times now, there is opportunity costs involved with every decision in life, the FACT is he gets pleasure from the game, he finds it fun , and that means the overall effect of all decisions Anet have made including old discussions about weapons skins has been good. So what exactly is he complaining about – he plays a game he finds fun after years of content, and now he doesn’t want to pay he says, now after 4 years?

Thats not to say Anet do things wrong, they do, but that’s not really his point.

My annoyance is actually this entitled culture thing, they want everything they think of in their head whenever they think about it, and ignorantly and deliberately ignore the underlying reasons or benefits they get from decisions – its easier to complain right?

this horse is almost as dead as a split pve/pvp balance or the working mac client

vesica tempestas.1563:

And has has been repeated a million times now, there is opportunity costs involved with every decision in life, the FACT is he gets pleasure from the game, he finds it fun , and that means the overall effect of all decisions Anet have made including old discussions about weapons skins has been good. So what exactly is he complaining about – he plays a game he finds fun after years of content, and now he doesn’t want to pay he says, now after 4 years?

Thats not to say Anet do things wrong, they do, but that’s not really his point.

My annoyance is actually this entitled culture thing, they want everything they think of in their head whenever they think about it, and ignorantly and deliberately ignore the underlying reasons or benefits they get from decisions – its easier to complain right?

I think you are missing the point entirely…it’s not about entitlement at all. Anet promised these things in their reports/blogs/news/etc…and then the reneged on them. It’s as simple as that. They used HoT legendary weapons and armor as a selling point – to push sales up and then they didn’t follow through with it. The weapons in question are just one example of them doing that.

Yes the game is still fun, yes there are still other things to do but what does this mean for the future of the game. You say that “agile development” dictates that you need to constantly adapt your processes. How does pulling one of your smallest teams from working on their project to help the game but not pulling from those working on your NEXT expansion, when your CURRENT one needs a lot of help, make more sense? How is that not flawed? Please elaborate for me because you seem to understand this far better than I do.

What is stopping Anet from doing this again when their next expansion hits? What if they promise, x, y and z and only deliver on x? Could x still be fun? Of course it can but what about the other selling points?

Anet has had a habit of starting things and “laying the groundwork” over and over and over and then scrapping the idea entirely. People don’t want this to happen (well at least I don’t).

Imagine if your beloved Living Story was “scrapped” to work on WvW or some other aspect of the game you didn’t care for. There would be hell to pay and people would be in an uproar. Why is this any different than that? Because you don’t specifically care for that content?

“promised”

I really do think that people on the forums are using this term more loosely than ArenaNet actually do.

vesica tempestas.1563:

And has has been repeated a million times now, there is opportunity costs involved with every decision in life, the FACT is he gets pleasure from the game, he finds it fun , and that means the overall effect of all decisions Anet have made including old discussions about weapons skins has been good. So what exactly is he complaining about – he plays a game he finds fun after years of content, and now he doesn’t want to pay he says, now after 4 years?

Thats not to say Anet do things wrong, they do, but that’s not really his point.

My annoyance is actually this entitled culture thing, they want everything they think of in their head whenever they think about it, and ignorantly and deliberately ignore the underlying reasons or benefits they get from decisions – its easier to complain right?

Dude what are you rambling on about? Ok, we understand your loyalty to ArenaNet but not everyone is like you. In case you missed the point of this entire thread (which you clearly most surely did) I merely wanted to know what you guys think of ArenaNet as a company based on their decisions over the past couple of years. I stated what I felt about Arena Net and then you go on about the implications of Anets decisions. Yes, we all know Anet, at the end of the day, is trying to make money because what company isn’t.

And where are you getting this idea of entitlement? I’m beginning to think you’re just being contrary or a troll. I pay for content, I expect said content. Company tells me to expect something, I expect. Nothing about that screams entitlement to me.

This is all about the OP rationalizing to us why they are still here heckling from the cheap seats.

If the devs ever do reactivate legendary weapon development I’m sure the OP will still use the “broken promise” of 2013 as a reason to still not support the company.

As a software developer there are times when a feature initially looks easy and limit in scope turns out to be neither. Scope meaning needing to drag devs in from other aspects of the project to work on the parts that affect their areas. And when you are talking about game software, the whole question of “is this fun/enjoyable” can torpedo the prototype, which is what is likely happened in 2013. I do give them points for giving us precursor crafting for HoT.

If you insist on only supporting companies who were able to bring to completion every single concept they ever announced you’d not have many options.

I’m fairly certain that would include absolutely no games developers. Except maybe tiny indie companies working on their very first game who lack the resources to announce anything they’re doing anywhere the majority of people will hear about it.

Yeah ok this thread is pointless now. Good bye

Roquen.5406:

vesica tempestas.1563:

And has has been repeated a million times now, there is opportunity costs involved with every decision in life, the FACT is he gets pleasure from the game, he finds it fun , and that means the overall effect of all decisions Anet have made including old discussions about weapons skins has been good. So what exactly is he complaining about – he plays a game he finds fun after years of content, and now he doesn’t want to pay he says, now after 4 years?

Thats not to say Anet do things wrong, they do, but that’s not really his point.

My annoyance is actually this entitled culture thing, they want everything they think of in their head whenever they think about it, and ignorantly and deliberately ignore the underlying reasons or benefits they get from decisions – its easier to complain right?

I think you are missing the point entirely…it’s not about entitlement at all. Anet promised these things in their reports/blogs/news/etc…and then the reneged on them. It’s as simple as that. They used HoT legendary weapons and armor as a selling point – to push sales up and then they didn’t follow through with it. The weapons in question are just one example of them doing that.

Yes the game is still fun, yes there are still other things to do but what does this mean for the future of the game. You say that “agile development” dictates that you need to constantly adapt your processes. How does pulling one of your smallest teams from working on their project to help the game but not pulling from those working on your NEXT expansion, when your CURRENT one needs a lot of help, make more sense? How is that not flawed? Please elaborate for me because you seem to understand this far better than I do.

What is stopping Anet from doing this again when their next expansion hits? What if they promise, x, y and z and only deliver on x? Could x still be fun? Of course it can but what about the other selling points?

Anet has had a habit of starting things and “laying the groundwork” over and over and over and then scrapping the idea entirely. People don’t want this to happen (well at least I don’t).

Imagine if your beloved Living Story was “scrapped” to work on WvW or some other aspect of the game you didn’t care for. There would be hell to pay and people would be in an uproar. Why is this any different than that? Because you don’t specifically care for that content?

THANK YOU!!!!!

Shovel Face.4512:

vesica tempestas.1563:

And has has been repeated a million times now, there is opportunity costs involved with every decision in life, the FACT is he gets pleasure from the game, he finds it fun , and that means the overall effect of all decisions Anet have made including old discussions about weapons skins has been good. So what exactly is he complaining about – he plays a game he finds fun after years of content, and now he doesn’t want to pay he says, now after 4 years?

Thats not to say Anet do things wrong, they do, but that’s not really his point.

My annoyance is actually this entitled culture thing, they want everything they think of in their head whenever they think about it, and ignorantly and deliberately ignore the underlying reasons or benefits they get from decisions – its easier to complain right?

Dude what are you rambling on about? Ok, we understand your loyalty to ArenaNet but not everyone is like you. In case you missed the point of this entire thread (which you clearly most surely did) I merely wanted to know what you guys think of ArenaNet as a company based on their decisions over the past couple of years. I stated what I felt about Arena Net and then you go on about the implications of Anets decisions. Yes, we all know Anet, at the end of the day, is trying to make money because what company isn’t.

And where are you getting this idea of entitlement? I’m beginning to think you’re just being contrary or a troll. I pay for content, I expect said content. Company tells me to expect something, I expect. Nothing about that screams entitlement to me.

im not loyal to Anet, its a game thats all.

your choosing to ignore the facts, Anet decided not to implement those legendaries because they developed something else that provided more fun per buck. Content YOU ENJOY.

lets put it another way, imagine they had ‘promised’ that all new zones would be like HOT, then they realized this is not what customers want now, so they decide to build what customers want. And then someone comes along complaining that they want every zone like HOT because they promised – what do you think the right choice is?

You pay for a fun game, you get a fun game. (your words not mine) Ive told you why they made that decision, you just choose to ignore the ‘why’ because it suits your complaints.

vesica tempestas.1563:

Shovel Face.4512:

vesica tempestas.1563:

And has has been repeated a million times now, there is opportunity costs involved with every decision in life, the FACT is he gets pleasure from the game, he finds it fun , and that means the overall effect of all decisions Anet have made including old discussions about weapons skins has been good. So what exactly is he complaining about – he plays a game he finds fun after years of content, and now he doesn’t want to pay he says, now after 4 years?

Thats not to say Anet do things wrong, they do, but that’s not really his point.

My annoyance is actually this entitled culture thing, they want everything they think of in their head whenever they think about it, and ignorantly and deliberately ignore the underlying reasons or benefits they get from decisions – its easier to complain right?

Dude what are you rambling on about? Ok, we understand your loyalty to ArenaNet but not everyone is like you. In case you missed the point of this entire thread (which you clearly most surely did) I merely wanted to know what you guys think of ArenaNet as a company based on their decisions over the past couple of years. I stated what I felt about Arena Net and then you go on about the implications of Anets decisions. Yes, we all know Anet, at the end of the day, is trying to make money because what company isn’t.

And where are you getting this idea of entitlement? I’m beginning to think you’re just being contrary or a troll. I pay for content, I expect said content. Company tells me to expect something, I expect. Nothing about that screams entitlement to me.

im not loyal to Anet, its a game thats all.

your choosing to ignore the facts, Anet decided not to implement those legendaries ebecause they developed something else that provided more fun per buck.

lets put it another way, imagine they had ‘promised’ that all new zones would be like HOT, then they realized this is not what customers want now, so they decide to build what customers want. And then someone comes along complaining that they want every zone like HOT because they promised – what do you think the right choice is?

You pay for a fun game, you get a fun game. (your words not mine) Ive told you why they made that decision, you just choose to ignore the ‘why’ because it suits your complaints.

Roquen gave a really good response for you and I’ll leave it as that.

and more than a few developers have just told you in this thread why you why you did not get your ‘promise’ and that you got something else instead, but your comprehension skills are poor so i will leave it at that also.

tl dr i want free stuff and i want it now!

You guys can argue back and forth all night but the fast remains, HoT was marketed with a set of 16 new legendary weapons. The promise that was made in 2013 was sold to us in 2015.

Lets say for example you buy a brand a new car, it has 20 advertised features, you paid 50k for this car. When you go to pick this car up it turns out 5 of the features you paid for were cancelled indefinetly. You still had to pay 50k and got nothing in return for lost features.

You see it doesnt matter if you forgive Anet, The OP doesnt and neither do alot of people. It will affect sale of all types,when next expansion is announced people are going to have doubts if what they pay for is actually going to be delivered.

and what if that car company said, oh that new headlight we hoped to build will actually cost 50k more, and for that 50k we could give you the things that you are NOW asking for, a new eco friendly engine, etc etc. This is what opportunity cost is., this is what good development is. Bad development is saying – we promised you a heradlight – here it is, but unfortunately you cant get that new engine, we made you that headlight you really wanted 3 years ago! And so the company declines.

vesica tempestas.1563:

and what if that car company said, oh that new headlight we hoped to build will actually cost 50k more, and for that 50k we could give you the things that you are NOW asking for, a new eco friendly engine, etc etc. This is what opportunity cost is., this is what good development is. Bad development is saying – we promised you a heradlight – here it is, but unfortunately you cant get that new engine, we made you that headlight you really wanted 3 years ago! And so the company declines.

Your really missing the point arent you? If i payed for a feature, i want that feature.

Shovel Face.4512:

Roquen gave a really good response for you and I’ll leave it as that.

Except he didn’t give a good response. If you make a list of everything that was listed at the HoT announcement, the only thing they didn’t make fully good on was a full set of new legendary weapons. If wasn’t promising on x, y and z and delivering only on x; it’s promising a through m and while delivering everything else except partially delivering on h.

The only way any development team can avoid breaking any “promises” is by not saying anything or couching it in the most general terms possible (“we’re working on stuff that we think you will like”). It was likely the backlash from this 2013 post that caused ANet to go dark with future plans for as long as they did.

Dragon Masher.5749:

vesica tempestas.1563:

and what if that car company said, oh that new headlight we hoped to build will actually cost 50k more, and for that 50k we could give you the things that you are NOW asking for, a new eco friendly engine, etc etc. This is what opportunity cost is., this is what good development is. Bad development is saying – we promised you a heradlight – here it is, but unfortunately you cant get that new engine, we made you that headlight you really wanted 3 years ago! And so the company declines.

Your really missing the point arent you? If i payed for a feature, i want that feature.

that feature doesn’t exist, they made something else, and that something else he played. Get it?