Guild Wars 2

As anyone reading these forums will know, the hot topic is diminishing returns and the negative impact it is supposedly having on the game.

I was not convinced, having not witnessed any of it for myself in game, so I decided to do a little experiment.

Before I begin, I want to point out two things, I DO have photos/screenshots of every event, but this is not the best place to upload them. Once I find somewhere, if anyone is interested in viewing them for validation please let me know and I will link you (somehow )

The other part I should mention is this test, and the results, can only stand for my level (Human Guardian, lvl 59), and only in the one area I played.

THE IDEA

Run the same dynamic events again and again, with three challenges,

firstly the number of different events has to be kept to a minimum, so that I would be doing the same ones again and again
secondly, speed – I have to do these events as fast as possible and move onto the next event as soon as possible.
Third, the variation of enemies must be kept to a minimum, that is so I could keep killing the same type over and over to see if it effected drops.

THE PRACTICE

I managed to run 13 events in just over 1 hour. Of these 13, six where unique, the other seven runs where duplicates. I managed to run 3 events, 3 times each, and one event I managed to run it 4 times.

THE DATA (with Rewards)

Defend the Southern Beach 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Hold Swampwatch (silver) 4511 xp 233 k 1s 15c
Defend Shorewatch 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Kill the Risen Shark 5033 xp 270 k 1s 30c
Reclaim the Southern Beach 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Hold Swampwatch (2nd) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Defend Shorewatch (2nd) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Sink the Ash Horizon 5033 xp 270 k 1s 33c
Defend the Southern Beach (2nd) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Hold Swampwatch (3rd) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Defend Shorewatch (3rd) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Defend the Southern Beach (3rd) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Defend Shorwatch (4th) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c

THE RESULTS

Events – as we can see, even though I duplicated these events and ran them in just over one hour. The reward in terms of EXP, KARMA, and COIN, where identical each time I ran it.

Drops – I killed predominantly Risen (several variations of). I did NOT monitor drops 100% (ie didn’t write them down), but I didn’t notice much change. In fact the very LAST combat I took part in, the Risen I killed dropped a Green item.

CONCLUSION

While this test only covers one area, repeated, in just over one hour of gameplay, we can see that there are no negative penalties applied to running the same event up to 4 times.
I cant prove it, but I will say that what stands true here probably stands true in every other zone.
And what stands true for my level (59) probably stands true for level 58 and level 60.

I am willing to take that a step further and say it probably stands true for all areas and levels 1-79, and maybe level 80’s are different.

If any level 80 wants to try a similar experiment and post their results then please do. Either way I intend to do this experiment again once I am level 80 and post my own results.

He’s a witch, burn him!

Tradewind.6913:

He’s a witch, burn him!

I lol’d.

Good post, Xericor. Thanks for running this little experiment. It won’t shut a lot of the complainers up, because most whiners don’t care about those silly things called “facts”, but maybe it’ll put some of the more reasonable minds at ease.

Not likin’ how this is great thread is getting pushed down by ignorance regarding this exact same subject. It seems that the complainers would rather stay locked in their own delusions instead of learn some cold hard truths.

I played for 3-4 hours last night, probably did a good 15-20 events. Some of which, most particularly camp defense, were repeated 2-3 times. This is in Malchor’s Leap, at level 80. Killed nothing but Risen the entire time. Due to spawn density in some areas, I killed a LOT of Risen of the same kind in a tiny area during some stretches.

Zero diminishing returns noted.

Hasn’t this already been covered though? I thought the random incidences of diminishing returns was due to a bug? Or did I misread that?

Seriously? So all of those people are ragequitting over a rumor? That would be hilarious.

@SpectacularYak

Robert Hrouda said it was bugged. Not sure to what extent it’s fixed.

Ok, so how come it happened to me yesterday then, in one zone and only while I was exploring?

Am I bugged? I really dont get it

Seeing as I experienced this while farming for mats for my armour, it is not a rumor.

Eochaidh.4106:

Seriously? So all of those people are ragequitting over a rumor? That would be hilarious.

No, it’s not a rumor. What is amusing to me is that posts like these are trying to state that there is no penalty when ArenaNet has admitted that there is one and it is bugged.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Dungeon-Patch-9-17-UPDATE-9-20/first#post192818

There is more to the system than just repeating the same events 3 times one hour of one day while level 59.

The drops from events don`t seem to be nerfed. I see people exploiting bugged events all the time that are just farming for drops. What they did nerf the droprate of normal world mobs. An example would be to try and collect small teeth from skelk. You can kill a few and get some teeth and after a few minutes they just stop dropping anything alltogether for however long they are programmed to.

If you played from headstart and noticed how many mats you had accuired the first 2 weeks of the game to the current state, you would really notice the difference.

As one of the people who ran around screaming the sky is falling the moment word of diminishing returns was mentioned, I’ll be as happy if the OP is true as anyone else.

I suppose it is only bugged for dungeons.

I’ve hit the cap every day for the last 5 days. If you want to hit the cap you should aim for around 16 events per hour regardless of which ones they are.

I can also confirm it with the mob drops on the cannon part of the Lyssa event. Did it a few days ago, saw today that the event was up while I was farming mats for my daily achievement, went there and got almost no drops throughout the whole fixing the cannon part.

Went to next event, just tossed a few meteor showers into the mess before the event was done and already had more drops than at the cannon event.

Not to mention I haven’t gotten drops from Sparks in ages, because I killed them for a longer while after I got lucky with getting 2 lodestones in like 10 minutes and thought I might be able to get more.

I did a similar experiment for my level 12 Mesmer in queensdale last night, same result… no diminishing returns really noticed. I will say though, when I saw all the threads claiming that events were nerfed into the ground, it freaked me out.. thats why i did my little “test”.. gotta learn to have more faith in ANet.

Mea.5491:

Yeah, looks like the whole system is bugged. : / Also, I heard the lack of drops issue can be fixed by relogging (rumor) but I can’t test it because I always get normal loot.

That didn’t work for me.

After about thirty minutes of idling around chatting, mobs started dropping stuff again.

Dosvidaniya.3260:

Eochaidh.4106:

Seriously? So all of those people are ragequitting over a rumor? That would be hilarious.

No, it’s not a rumor. What is amusing to me is that posts like these are trying to state that there is no penalty when ArenaNet has admitted that there is one and it is bugged.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Dungeon-Patch-9-17-UPDATE-9-20/first#post192818

There is more to the system than just repeating the same events 3 times one hour of one day while level 59.

I did not mean that there are no restrictions. And I know it is bugged, I even posted here about that. The issue is to what extent such restrictions affect normal gameplay. Most people are raging over the assumption that playing for half an hour in Orr makes your rewards null.

Banewrath.5107:

The drops from events don`t seem to be nerfed. I see people exploiting bugged events all the time that are just farming for drops. What they did nerf the droprate of normal world mobs. An example would be to try and collect small teeth from skelk. You can kill a few and get some teeth and after a few minutes they just stop dropping anything alltogether for however long they are programmed to.

If you played from headstart and noticed how many mats you had accuired the first 2 weeks of the game to the current state, you would really notice the difference.

I played from headstart. I think I’m getting better drops now than I ever had before. Regardless, I’ve had enough to cap five disciplines already and I’m working on the others now. I’m just pacing myself due to bank space concerns.

Maybe the key is to move around and play the game rather than farming the snot out of one area. I dunno. Mebbe I’m nutz.

Thanks for checking th thread and the feedback folks.
I have the screenshots saved for all the events.

@ Dosvidaniya, you are right, but that is regarding Dungeons and speed clearing them

Like I mention I didnt check drops very closely. This was mainly to address a screenshot I saw on a different thread (the guy got like 1 karma or something for doing the event). The idea was to see if EXP, Karma, coin diminished at all based on speed and repeating.

If I get the time tommorrow I will kill something like 250 of creature ‘X’ and see what the drops look like.

Please dont just read some doom and gloom threads and worry too much guys. Most people who post them tend to over react a fair bit

What happened to me really happened! I didn’t dream it! I got double digits karma and xp and 6 copper…..

This was after doing events while exploring Blazeridge Steppes. That shouldnt be happening! I wasnt repeating the same DE’s either, in all cases only doing each DE once! How is this fair?!? I’m being penalised for playing normally :/

Thank you for this.

This is the sort of thing people should be doing more often. Feedback with proper data given is always a welcome thing to see.

I myself have never noticed any changes, and after reading the various threads I was just a little worried. However, as I like to constantly move around, I didn’t think it would be a big thing for me as well.

Nice findings Xericor. Hope to see more posts like this.

Morgoth.4573:

What happened to me really happened! I didn’t dream it! I got double digits karma and xp and 6 copper…..

This was after doing events while exploring Blazeridge Steppes. That shouldnt be happening! I wasnt repeating the same DE’s either, in all cases only doing each DE once! How is this fair?!? I’m being penalised for playing normally :/

Whatever happened, that is clearly not the intended design.

http://i47.tinypic.com/2ic331u.jpg
http://i49.tinypic.com/wl5h.jpg

I wasn’t even trying to farm, just going about normally doing events as I stumble into them. Am I doing something wrong?

I’m going to go out on a limb and suggest it’s because you’re doing DE’s that are well below your actual level. Might be something common for people having problems, idk.

Tradewind.6913:

I’m going to go out on a limb and suggest it’s because you’re doing DE’s that are well below your actual level. Might be something common for people having problems, idk.

That’s not it; I finished the norn starting area yesterday as an 80 and got about 250 karma per event.

4 karma? That seriously sounds like the bug at work.

Tradewind.6913:

I’m going to go out on a limb and suggest it’s because you’re doing DE’s that are well below your actual level. Might be something common for people having problems, idk.

Anet: The whole game is the endgame!
Except that going back to revisit older areas or to complete unique DEs that you’ve never seen before will not scale at all!

Morgoth.4573:

What happened to me really happened! I didn’t dream it! I got double digits karma and xp and 6 copper…..

This was after doing events while exploring Blazeridge Steppes. That shouldnt be happening! I wasnt repeating the same DE’s either, in all cases only doing each DE once! How is this fair?!? I’m being penalised for playing normally :/

Similar thing happened to me yesterday on Orr of all places too. I was playing a good while on my mesmer (several hours, no issues). Jumped on my thief and pretty quickly my karma, coin and xp went into double digit range. I didn’t know anything about these diminishing returns either till I asked what was up in map.

I think it’s just a new system and a tad glitchy is all.

“Tad” glitchy? :S

I just wish a dev would come and post something about it in the Dynamic Events subforum. Not hearing a peep about this issue is making people worried.

Morgoth.4573:

“Tad” glitchy? :S

I just wish a dev would come and post something about it in the Dynamic Events subforum. Not hearing a peep about this issue is making people worried.

I’m not sure what it is about human psychology that causes them to reach conclusions faster given an absence of information, but there you have it.

SpectacularYak.6518:

Morgoth.4573:

“Tad” glitchy? :S

I just wish a dev would come and post something about it in the Dynamic Events subforum. Not hearing a peep about this issue is making people worried.

I’m not sure what it is about human psychology that causes them to reach conclusions faster given an absence of information, but there you have it.

Because human beings need to plan on how to invest their time properly, regardless of wether there is information or not. Time is valuable to us.

Nobody wants to play for 3 hours then realize that the effort was for nothing when the game throws you 4 karma. If you want to bury your head in the sand and continue losing karma that you would have otherwise been legitimately given, be my guest.

As for me, I’ll put the game down for now (or do other non-gathering tasks) and wait for Anet to give info on the anti-farming system before I invest more time into the game.

Levelord.5746:

Nobody wants to play for 3 hours then realize that the effort was for nothing when the game throws you 4 karma. If you want to bury your head in the sand and continue losing karma that you would have otherwise been legitimately given, be my guest.

As for me, I’ll put the game down for now (or do other non-gathering tasks) and wait for Anet to give info on the anti-farming system before I invest time into the game.

Being a tad excitable/hostile, are we? I wasn’t exactly tearing into you. Don’t get your jimmies rustled.

I will say, though, that I’ve never really considered the time I’ve spent playing video games “effort” in any meaningful sense.

This clearly seems to be a bug, and hopefully they straighten it out sooner rather than later. We can add it to the list of all the other bugs we’re hoping that about.

Keep in mind guys, this doesn’t really prove anything. We’ve had people report diminished returns on events, and other people doing the same stuff and not seeing the issue.

It currently appears that it is BUGGED and does not behave the same way for everyone.

SpectacularYak.6518:

Levelord.5746:

Nobody wants to play for 3 hours then realize that the effort was for nothing when the game throws you 4 karma. If you want to bury your head in the sand and continue losing karma that you would have otherwise been legitimately given, be my guest.

As for me, I’ll put the game down for now (or do other non-gathering tasks) and wait for Anet to give info on the anti-farming system before I invest time into the game.

Being a tad excitable/hostile, are we? I wasn’t exactly tearing into you. Don’t get your jimmies rustled.

I will say, though, that I’ve never really considered the time I’ve spent playing video games “effort” in any meaningful sense.

This clearly seems to be a bug, and hopefully they straighten it out sooner rather than later. We can add it to the list of all the other bugs we’re hoping that about.

Sorry about that.

Can’t help getting rustled when you experience an obvious bug in game, then have the forum fanboys tell you that the problem doesn’t exist. Gets frustrating after a while…

Levelord.5746:

Sorry about that.

Can’t help getting rustled when you experience an obvious bug in game, then have the forum fanboys tell you that the problem doesn’t exist. Gets frustrating after a while…

Who said it didn’t exist? But this thread stands as a shining example that it’s not a completely widespread an issue (bug in actuality) as people make it out to be.

Tradewind.6913:

Levelord.5746:

Sorry about that.

Can’t help getting rustled when you experience an obvious bug in game, then have the forum fanboys tell you that the problem doesn’t exist. Gets frustrating after a while…

Who said it didn’t exist? But this thread stands as a shining example that it’s not a completely widespread an issue (bug in actuality) as people make it out to be.

One person on one account did a test. I doubt it stands as a model for determining if something is ‘widespread’ or not.

My point still stands though. For people like me, it’s best to put the game aside or do something else until we hear an update on this problem.

Levelord.5746:

Tradewind.6913:

Levelord.5746:

Sorry about that.

Can’t help getting rustled when you experience an obvious bug in game, then have the forum fanboys tell you that the problem doesn’t exist. Gets frustrating after a while…

Who said it didn’t exist? But this thread stands as a shining example that it’s not a completely widespread an issue (bug in actuality) as people make it out to be.

One person on one account did a test. I doubt it stands as a model for determining if something is ‘widespread’ or not.

My point still stands though. For people like me, it’s best to put the game aside or do something else until we hear an update on this problem.

Except you have people confirming the same behavior, it’s not just one person. Do they all have to go and write it down for you people to understand that the problem is not universal and stop kittening on others or saying that they’re all “fanboys” which really just makes you look petulant, which I assume isn’t what you’re shooting for.

If you had a point before that closely resembled what you said there, then yeah I agree. But it’s the first time I’ve seen it presented…but it’s a good one. Wait and see, I like it.

I have had my drops stop completely after just 15 mins of straight killing large groups of mobs so IMO its there and it is the worst system ever.

Tradewind.6913:

Levelord.5746:

Tradewind.6913:

Levelord.5746:

Sorry about that.

Can’t help getting rustled when you experience an obvious bug in game, then have the forum fanboys tell you that the problem doesn’t exist. Gets frustrating after a while…

Who said it didn’t exist? But this thread stands as a shining example that it’s not a completely widespread an issue (bug in actuality) as people make it out to be.

One person on one account did a test. I doubt it stands as a model for determining if something is ‘widespread’ or not.

My point still stands though. For people like me, it’s best to put the game aside or do something else until we hear an update on this problem.

Except you have people confirming the same behavior, it’s not just one person. Do they all have to go and write it down for you people to understand that the problem is not universal and stop kittening on others or saying that they’re all “fanboys” which really just makes you look petulant, which I assume isn’t what you’re shooting for.

If you had a point before that closely resembled what you said there, then yeah I agree. But it’s the first time I’ve seen it presented…but it’s a good one. Wait and see, I like it.

Well having the previous posters say that the people who worry are “delusional” and “ragequitting over a rumor” then you’ll see my response is understandable.
Maybe you should also rag them equally for labeling people like me as ‘delusional’, then I’ll stop labeling them as ‘fanboys’. Because right now you don’t seem very impartial.

If any level 80 wants to try a similar experiment and post their results then please do. Either way I intend to do this experiment again once I am level 80 and post my own results.

I’ve hit the cap every day for the past four days. Let me explain in a bit more detail. The cap is not as gradual as you seem to assume it is. How it works is that if you do somewhere around 8 events/half hour or 16 events/hour (in my experience), your next event will give fewer rewards. The specific event itself is totally irrelevant, only the speed at which you complete events. Once this cap starts, each subsequent event will give fewer and fewer rewards until finally you’re gaining 0.5% of what you would normally get. For example, I usually get 378 karma, but with the penalty in full effect I get 19.

So in other words, you should expect to keep getting full rewards continuously up until the moment you hit the cap, at which point rewards plummet over the next four or five events. Don’t expect slow gradual reduction from the start.

I don’t know about events, but mob drops definitely get affected the more you kill.

I was killing skale in queensdale because I needed weak blood, for instance. At first I was getting the blood pretty common, but after about 5-10 minutes. No more blood, ever. I even tried moving onto drakes or bats or harpies, they didn’t even drop anything.

Seems if you hit the anti-farm code, it screws you out of getting drops from absolutely anything… at least in that same zone.

I really don’t like this anti-farming code business, because it’s basically telling me how I can play the game or what I can do with my time. With the trading post not always being up, I have to get my fine materials from SOMEWHERE.

Also, given the nature of the game, you’re supposed to.. by design.. run around, help out with all the events you see, and play the game as fluidly as you desire. If they put a limit on the # of events you can do like that, then what’s the point? What do you do then?

Levelord.5746:

Well having the previous posters say that the people who worry are “delusional” and “ragequitting over a rumor” then you’ll see my response is understandable.
Maybe you should also rag them equally for labeling people like me as ‘delusional’, then I’ll stop labeling them as ‘fanboys’. Because right now you don’t seem very impartial.

There’s definitely been a disproportionate level of exaggeration on behalf of those who are angry. Some perhaps warranted, but very few have actually gone out and tested the theory and provided results. That’s been my observation so far.

There’s definitely been a disproportionate level of exaggeration on behalf of those who are angry. Some perhaps warranted, but very few have actually gone out and tested the theory and provided results. That’s been my observation so far.

I’ve done plenty of testing. If you’d like me to report on anything specific, just ask.

Strill.2591:

There’s definitely been a disproportionate level of exaggeration on behalf of those who are angry. Some perhaps warranted, but very few have actually gone out and tested the theory and provided results. That’s been my observation so far.

I’ve done plenty of testing. If you’d like me to report on anything specific, just ask.

Thinking from a perspective of bug testing it’d be beneficial to know your character level, zone it was in etc. You know, details like the OP did.

One person not seeing the issue in no way invalidates the experiences of the dozens of others that have (and are not “exaggerating” anything at all). The system is clearly bugged and giving different results to different players (thus bugged) so simply digging your head into the sand and going “ALALALALALA I CAN’T HEAR YOU” is not in any way useful to the discussion here.

Tradewind.6913:

Strill.2591:

There’s definitely been a disproportionate level of exaggeration on behalf of those who are angry. Some perhaps warranted, but very few have actually gone out and tested the theory and provided results. That’s been my observation so far.

I’ve done plenty of testing. If you’d like me to report on anything specific, just ask.

Thinking from a perspective of bug testing it’d be beneficial to know your character level, zone it was in etc. You know, details like the OP did.

Level 80, cursed shore.

I’ve tried two main paths. One was:

3x Chain: Maggot Chain (located in the south)
Defend Penitent Camp
Defend Shelter’s Gate Camp
Defend Jofast Camp

These event chains repeat about once per 15 – 30 mins, so that’s maybe 15 events per hour because I was sometimes only able to complete one or two of the camp defense events while waiting between the maggot chain.

After exploring the map more thoroughly, I found a better, far more varied path.

Northwest Cursed Shore:

Escort Rattan
4x Chain: Escort Explorer Plix
Escort Packheart
2x Chain: Arena of Balthazar
Killl Champion Drake Broodmother
Kill Champion Abomination
Defend R&D Camp from Tar Elementals
Total: 11 events

Eastern Cursed Shore:

Defend Penitent Camp
Defend Shelter’s Gate Camp
Defend Jofast Camp
2x Defend Explorer So & So from Gorillas

Total: 5 events

I started out doing the first path with the maggot chain. I repeated it for several hours per day for four days and NEVER ONCE hit the event cap. Once I started doing the second path, however, was the first time I hit the cap. The second path has far more events concentrated into a very small space. The events in the northwest are so dense in fact, that it’s possible to do two or three of them at the same time. Furthermore, it gives you updates to the town defense events so you can always get to them in time.

The first time I hit the cap was 45 minutes into a karma booster, and I had not been doing any events before popping the booster. After trying again the next morning, I hit the cap within 25 minutes.

When I hit the cap, I’ve attempted to go to other zones, such as Malchor’s Leap and Straits of Devastation, however, my rewards were reduced there just as in cursed shore. I’ve found that I must wait about an hour for my rewards to be returned to normal.

Since the latest patch, I’ve attempted to return to my original path, but I’ve still been hitting the event cap anyway, and have mostly given up on karma farming until this is changed.

Eochaidh.4106:

Seriously? So all of those people are ragequitting over a rumor? That would be hilarious.

Not a rumour in fact it now appears the mechanism is bugged given players differing experiences. I for one acknowledge that my initial concerns were probably unfounded.

My main concern now is the lack of transparency on this issue from anet. Players should know how the anti farming mechanisms work.

Strill.2591:

The first time I hit the cap was 45 minutes into a karma booster, and I had not been doing any events before popping the booster. After trying again the next morning, I hit the cap within 25 minutes.

How many events did it take to hit the cap?

morrolan.9608:

Eochaidh.4106:

Seriously? So all of those people are ragequitting over a rumor? That would be hilarious.

Not a rumour in fact it now appears the mechanism is bugged given players differing experiences. I for one acknowledge that my initial concerns were probably unfounded.

My main concern now is the lack of transparency on this issue from anet. Players should know how the anti farming mechanisms work.

I agree about the transparency, but I think that even if the reduced rewards after 30 minutes/a certain number events is how it’s intended to work, it’s still messed up.

For players that have a couple of hours to play, they will be hitting the cap in 30-40 minutes, then have to sit around and do nothing for an hour or more before they can even start playing again (and before someone chimes in with “Well go do other stuff then” keep in mind a lot of people have almost everything completed, and Dynamic Events are the vast majority of the content in the game…. Locking people out of doing the main content after half an hour is absurd). I don’t think that’s how it should be and I think it’s unreasonable to even argue that that’s how it should work.

Regardless, it’s screwed up and needs to be fixed, or people will start abandoning the game. One thing that very few players will put up with is a game actively not respecting their time, and that’s precisely what this system does.

How many events did it take to hit the cap?

This was the second time I hit the cap so unfortunately in this case I wasn’t keeping exact track. I’d guess somewhere around 8 events.