Guild Wars 2

It seems like some assume that time=reward, we input more into this game than just time (well assuming one is not faceroll grinding watching TV).

Why shouldn’t time = reward?

If a player puts in 10 hours all in one day, and another player puts in 1 hour across ten days, why is the second player getting ten times the reward?[/quote]

Because there is more to gaming than pure time investment – skill and guild management for instance, that and you find games that reward casual play while concurrently opening doors for the elite/hardcore/whatever succeed.

I could also suggest it is promoting healthier gameplay by rewarding moderation over binging…

And yes – I was dismissive of a lot of the noise that is being dragged in, do (specifically) note anything you feel was of import in that noise.

thisolderhead.5127:

Because there is more to gaming than pure time investment – skill and guild management for instance, that and you find games that reward casual play while concurrently opening doors for the elite/hardcore/whatever succeed.

I could also suggest it is promoting healthier gameplay by rewarding moderation over binging…

To many people, “binging” is the only option, as they have jobs that prevent them from obtaining regular access to the computer.

I don’t feel that it’s particularly fair to say that they don’t “deserve” the same rewards as someone else who puts in the same amount of time but spreads it out across more days.

It’s certainly not creating a “casual-friendly” game.

Jornophelanthas.1475:

I’m going to quote Isaiah Cartwright on the cost of ascended accessories:

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

These items are mainly earned through guild content, we included them on the laurels vendor to give players the opportunity to earn them if they are not in a guild but they are priced high to encourage players to try and accomplish them via the guild content.

source: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Holy-kitten-Cleric-Ascended-Accessory/page/3#post1516124

(Note: I personally disagree with his reasoning, because some players simply have no access to guild missions and its rewards because smaller guilds (10 people or less) have difficulty earning enough influence to unlock the guild content, let alone completing any guild missions.)

That would be great, if you didn’t get one reward a week….and it didn’t cost the earth in influence to do guild missions…

That is a horrible statement. Basically Anet is saying, “play the game the way we want you to play and we don’t care what you like”.

They are telling us, if we don’t play the way Anet wants, we will be punished.

I have bad news for you Anet. “Encouraging” me to do things I don’t want to do won’t make me do them. It will only make me quit and go find a game that I can play and have fun doing so, not being forced into content I don’t want to do.

Between telling people how to use their product and keeping the developement roadmap of their product secret it is hard to understand why anyone would keep paying… (Sarcasm with a kicker).

It is people who go out of their way to play against the developer’s plan or spirit (and blame the manifesto often, why not) that make the game as intended less fun for the rest of us.

Though I hope there is a game for you out there somewhere (else).

Pretty sure i paid the same amount to play this game as you.. so it shouldn’t matter how i play the game i should get the same rewards as the next guy..

Actually as an Aussie i paid more for my game than you so with your logic i should get more stuff than you right…

You’re lost mate..

critickitten.1498:

thisolderhead.5127:

Because there is more to gaming than pure time investment – skill and guild management for instance, that and you find games that reward casual play while concurrently opening doors for the elite/hardcore/whatever succeed.

I could also suggest it is promoting healthier gameplay by rewarding moderation over binging…

To many people, “binging” is the only option, as they have jobs that prevent them from obtaining regular access to the computer.

I don’t feel that it’s particularly fair to say that they don’t “deserve” the same rewards as someone else who puts in the same amount of time but spreads it out across more days.

It’s certainly not creating a “casual-friendly” game in my opinion.

Let me dig out some surveys of working gamers from one of my previous lives, most well balanced working people would see binge gaming all weekend as less attactive than a few hours a few times a week. Some very big games you may not play used the results to create (wait for it) structured daily reward programs.

The few hours a night player cannot engage in activities that require as much sustained involvement as the binger, therefore binger has potential to gain rewards from sustained activities which often also reward better.

Also fixed something for you…

If someone doesnt want to join a guild or dont give a cat about guilds…then yes 40 laurels is a joke.

35 for ring i still considered a joke… for amulet 30 i considered it another joke because made no sense, its the trinket which add more stats and cost less than the ring, and then you add amulets for 40 laurels i was like, lol.

thisolderhead.5127:

Let me dig out some surveys of working gamers from one of my previous lives, most well balanced working people would see binge gaming all weekend as less attactive than a few hours a few times a week. Some very big games you may not play used the results to create (wait for it) structured daily reward programs.

Not everyone works a 9-to-5 job. Some people have restricted internet access hours by virtue of the jobs they work.

And while it’s easy enough to say “well, tough for them”, I’d prefer if there were a way to ensure that they’re still being given a fair shake.

The few hours a night player cannot engage in activities that require as much sustained involvement as the binger, therefore binger has potential to gain rewards from sustained activities which often also reward better.

Not any more, since much of the game’s best rewarded content is time-gated to once per day.

If not for February’s patch, I might agree with you there to some degree. But now? Nope.

Also fixed something for you…

The original statement was correct. A casual player cannot always play every single day. A game which punishes them for that is not casual-friendly.

I’d be happy to agree with you about the subjectivity of other things I’ve said, but this isn’t one of them.

critickitten.1498:

thisolderhead.5127:

Let me dig out some surveys of working gamers from one of my previous lives, most well balanced working people would see binge gaming all weekend as less attactive than a few hours a few times a week. Some very big games you may not play used the results to create (wait for it) structured daily reward programs.

Not everyone works a 9-to-5 job. Some people have restricted internet access hours by virtue of the jobs they work.

And while it’s easy enough to say “well, tough for them”, I’d prefer if there were a way to ensure that they’re still being given a fair shake.

That is right, some people have duty weekends, some people fly in and out – but you have to tailor your passtimes to suit your lifestyle mate – can’t expect Anet to help out there, so they reward those who can only spare an hour or two here and there to play. Those who can only binge play (as you seem to be stuck with) are lower on the representation – so get screwed for the sake of the vast majority.

The few hours a night player cannot engage in activities that require as much sustained involvement as the binger, therefore binger has potential to gain rewards from sustained activities which often also reward better.

Not any more, since much of the game’s best rewarded content is time-gated to once per day.

If not for February’s patch, I might agree with you there to some degree. But now? Nope.
[/quote]
Yeah I’m a little dissapointed too but believe it is being addressed.

I’d be happy to agree with you about the subjectivity of other things I’ve said, but this isn’t one of them.

No really it is a casual friendly game (at least RIGHT NOW) based on the fact there is no gear gating and its pretty easy for the most part, you state those elsewhere, so that makes it VERY appealing to casual players…

Probably broke all the quotes there.

thisolderhead.5127:

That is right, some people have duty weekends, some people fly in and out – but you have to tailor your passtimes to suit your lifestyle mate – can’t expect Anet to help out there, so they reward those who can only spare an hour or two here and there to play. Those who can only binge play (as you seem to be stuck with) are lower on the representation – so get screwed for the sake of the vast majority.

And therein lies the problem.

They’re punishing those who “binge” by trying to cater to those who play a little bit every day. Okay, fair enough, but why punish anyone? Why have time-gating if you want to try and reward everyone’s play time?

The answer, of course, is that they’re adding time gates to prevent farming. And that is a discouraging thought: that they find it more important to punish people who find grinding fun (I don’t, but I don’t feel it’s fair to punish those who do) than to reward their playerbase.

If there’s one thing I’ve learned from teaching, it’s that negative reinforcement doesn’t provide nearly the same level of encouragement and overall drive as positive reinforcement. Instead of time gating and thus punishing people who can’t meet daily schedules, just focus on making a large variety of your content equally rewarding, and people will naturally start to gravitate towards the content they have the most fun playing.

No really it is a casual friendly game (at least RIGHT NOW) based on the fact there is no gear gating and its pretty easy for the most part, you state those elsewhere, so that makes it VERY appealing to casual players…

Which is true. However, that alone doesn’t make it casual-friendly.

A game that is casual-friendly allows players of very diverse schedules to all feel adequately rewarded for their time investment. Time gating prevents that from happening.

They are not punishing Binge players by catering towards anyone, that is just a victimised way of saying that some people get left out – well you cannot cater towards everyone, and of course you (as one of the vast minority who’s life doesn’t mesh with the game mechanics) are upset mate.

Teaching and training are different (just sayin’), but in either regard you would have experience with diminishing returns – you can spend a lifetime of resources on one lost cause student and gain basically nothing… put that into context.

I can’t see how you can remain straight-faced (so to speak) while saying Anet failed to create a casual friendly game, Anet failed to make a grindable game, Anet failed to make a game without excessive grind, and that Anet has failed to reward adequately for grinding all in parallel.

If you can reconcile that for us it would be great,

Jornophelanthas.1475:

DeathPanel.8362:

Jornophelanthas.1475:

You intentionally misinterpret silvermember.
What he/she is arguing is that the cost of attaining ascended earrings is unfair, because it is far lower for people who happen to be in large guilds than it is for people who don’t like to join large guilds.

Show me where I misrepresented him?

You have no evidence to support your statements that the cost is “far lower” since you haven’t quantified what the exact costs are and compared them.

In answer to your question, let me quote myself quoting ArenaNet. (If the post seems familiar to you, it was on page 1 of this thread.) I have added the bolded line for your convenience.

Jornophelanthas.1475:

I’m going to quote Isaiah Cartwright on the cost of ascended accessories:

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

These items are mainly earned through guild content, we included them on the laurels vendor to give players the opportunity to earn them if they are not in a guild but they are priced high to encourage players to try and accomplish them via the guild content.

source: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Holy-kitten-Cleric-Ascended-Accessory/page/3#post1516124

Further quantification:
Laurel vendor cost for 2 ascended accessories:
2x (40 laurels + 50 ectoplasm) = 80 laurels + 100 ectoplasm
80 laurels are earned through performing 2 monthly achievements + 60 daily achievements.
100 ectoplasm are earned through spending approximately 100 * 35 silver = 35 gold on the trading post, slightly lessened by what you may salvage from yellow items or may still have in stock. Daily rewards do not include ectoplasm or yellow items.

Commendation vendor cost for 2 ascended accessories:
2x (12 guild commendations + 5 gold) = 24 guild commendations + 10 gold
24 guild commendations are earned through performing 12 guild missions in 12 different weeks (each of which awards 2 guild commendations). This time period of 12 weeks can be halved or more if you have access to more than only Guild Bounties.
10 gold is earned partly through those same 12 guild missions (50s per guild mission x 12 guild missions = 6 gold). The remaining 4 gold must be earned in other ways.

There, quantified enough?

To be fair, since Ecto is becoming kind of easier to come by, a player who would do his/her daily and monthly will get his/her Ascended Earrings faster than the one who would get them through Guild missions, by your own numbers above (whether that’s fair or not, or which is more expensive, etc., is another issue.) Sure, it will cost more, but then again by the end of the two months he/she will probably have more than enough to get these Earrings (I am no power gold farmer, BTW-just talking casual in-game gold-making.)

At least we who won’t join a large Guild for its own sake have some way to get the Earrings, even “ahead of schedule”, as it were (though yes, they are pricey, and yes, I don’t really agree with the way Guild Missions were implemented)

thisolderhead.5127:

They are not punishing Binge players by catering towards anyone, that is just a victimised way of saying that some people get left out – well you cannot cater towards everyone, and of course you (as one of the vast minority who’s life doesn’t mesh with the game mechanics) are upset mate.

Actually I have time to play every day. So this doesn’t affect me. Doesn’t mean I’m not sensitive to the issue, however.

Teaching and training are different (just sayin’), but in either regard you would have experience with diminishing returns – you can spend a lifetime of resources on one lost cause student and gain basically nothing… put that into context.

Yes, but I’m not limited to only getting one chance per day to teach content to my students.

I can’t see how you can remain straight-faced (so to speak) while saying Anet failed to create a casual friendly game, Anet failed to make a grindable game, Anet failed to make a game without excessive grind, and that Anet has failed to reward adequately for grinding all in parallel.

If you can reconcile that for us it would be great,

I’m curious as to where I claimed all of those things, because it wasn’t here.

They did create a game that isn’t casual-friendly and has an excessive amount of grind, that much I have said many times in the past. They have indeed failed to adequately reward players for their efforts, choosing instead to time-gate so as to artificially lock the content for hardcore players and make it more difficult to access for casuals. But I don’t recall when I claimed that they failed to make a grindable game.

critickitten.1498:

thisolderhead.5127:

They are not punishing Binge players by catering towards anyone, that is just a victimised way of saying that some people get left out – well you cannot cater towards everyone, and of course you (as one of the vast minority who’s life doesn’t mesh with the game mechanics) are upset mate.

Actually I have time to play every day. So this doesn’t affect me. Doesn’t mean I’m not sensitive to the issue, however.

So just a Noble White Knight – out to fend off the developers and stick one to the makers of this product you love for the little guy who doesn’t even understand how he’s screwed, gotcha.

Teaching and training are different (just sayin’), but in either regard you would have experience with diminishing returns – you can spend a lifetime of resources on one lost cause student and gain basically nothing… put that into context.

Yes, but I’m not limited to only getting one chance per day to teach content to my students.
[/quote]
No the other context.

One noisy kid without much clue can take up such a large chunk of your time and energy (should you let them) proportionate to how much that one person actually matters, it could affect better souls – I mean really its just one unemployed mouth to feed (in the future of course).

I can’t see how you can remain straight-faced (so to speak) while saying Anet failed to create a casual friendly game, Anet failed to make a grindable game, Anet failed to make a game without excessive grind, and that Anet has failed to reward adequately for grinding all in parallel.

If you can reconcile that for us it would be great,

I’m curious as to where I claimed all of those things, because it wasn’t here.

They did create a game that isn’t casual-friendly and has an excessive amount of grind, that much I have said many times in the past. They have indeed failed to adequately reward players for their efforts, choosing instead to time-gate so as to artificially lock the content for hardcore players and make it more difficult to access for casuals. But I don’t recall when I claimed that they failed to make a grindable game.[/quote]

Post don’t exist in a vacuum from one thread to the next and within them your points are quite mutable and there is little that hasn’t been said, but will concede that I should have said “effectively grindable” game.

thisolderhead.5127:

So just a Noble White Knight – out to fend off the developers and stick one to the makers of this product you love for the little guy who doesn’t even understand how he’s screwed, gotcha.

Not at all. Don’t twist what I said, I don’t find it amusing.

I’m simply speaking out about an issue that I feel negatively affects other players who have expressed these very same complaints in this forum before. The problem didn’t even occur to me until someone else complained about it. But once they explained their point of view, I couldn’t help but agree that what they were saying was, in fact, a pretty legitimate issue.

“White knighting” has nothing to do with it. If someone makes a convincing case for why something is a problem, one that I can’t honestly refute, then yeah, I’m probably gonna end up agreeing and back them up on that stance. Because that’s what a sensible, rational human being does.

No the other context.

One noisy kid without much clue can take up such a large chunk of your time and energy (should you let them) proportionate to how much that one person actually matters, it could affect better souls – I mean really its just one unemployed mouth to feed (in the future of course).

Except that in this particular case, the noisy kid is only being noisy because he honestly feels slighted and that he’s not being treated fairly, not because he’s a genuinely bad person who wants to hurt the rest of the class.

Post don’t exist in a vacuum from one thread to the next and within them your points are quite mutable and there is little that hasn’t been said, but will concede that I should have said “effectively grindable” game.

Still not seeing a quote of where I said that….so….got one available?

I can’t respond if you’re simply going to say that I said “X” and I can’t even view the quote so I can recall the context in which I was speaking.

critickitten.1498:

thisolderhead.5127:

So just a Noble White Knight – out to fend off the developers and stick one to the makers of this product you love for the little guy who doesn’t even understand how he’s screwed, gotcha.

Not at all. Don’t twist what I said, I don’t find it amusing.

I’m simply speaking out about an issue that I feel negatively affects other players who have expressed these very same complaints in this forum before. The problem didn’t even occur to me until someone else complained about it. But once they explained their point of view, I couldn’t help but agree that what they were saying was, in fact, a pretty legitimate issue.

But it doesn not impact on you so…

“White knighting” has nothing to do with it. If someone makes a convincing case for why something is a problem, one that I can’t honestly refute, then yeah, I’m probably gonna end up agreeing and back them up on that stance. Because that’s what a sensible, rational human being does.

You are carrying the cause of others – being the White Knight bro.

No the other context.

One noisy kid without much clue can take up such a large chunk of your time and energy (should you let them) proportionate to how much that one person actually matters, it could affect better souls – I mean really its just one unemployed mouth to feed (in the future of course).

Except that in this particular case, the noisy kid is only being noisy because he honestly feels slighted and that he’s not being treated fairly, not because he’s a genuinely bad person who wants to hurt the rest of the class.

Still comes a point in every venture where the return for the investment (of time or other) just isn’t worth it, and attempting to push beyond that point impacts on the rest of the venture, in this case it is you minority of binge-only-casual-end-gamers.

Post don’t exist in a vacuum from one thread to the next and within them your points are quite mutable and there is little that hasn’t been said, but will concede that I should have said “effectively grindable” game.

Still not seeing a quote of where I said that….so….got one available?

I can’t respond if you’re simply going to say that I said “X” and I can’t even view the quote so I can recall the context in which I was speaking.

You’ve discussed “grinding” and DR greatly, always negatively – so you’re saying this is NOT able to be summarised as “not effective”?

thisolderhead.5127:

But it doesn not impact on you so…

So what?

I don’t understand why anyone would think that you’re not allowed to have a stance on something that doesn’t affect you. Especially on the internet of all places.

You are carrying the cause of others – being the White Knight bro.

No, it’s not. That implies a connotation that isn’t present here.

You need to look that term up before you use it again.

Still comes a point in every venture where the return for the investment (of time or other) just isn’t worth it, and attempting to push beyond that point impacts on the rest of the venture, in this case it is you minority of binge-only-casual-end-gamers.

How does removing time gating negatively impact the rest of the playerbase?

I’ve yet to see anyone explain that, so let’s hear it.

You’ve discussed “grinding” and DR greatly, always negatively – so you’re saying this is NOT able to be summarised as “not effective”?

I’ll ask one final time before I dismiss this as merely an attempt at twisting my words into a context that I clearly didn’t use them in: Where did I make the claim that ANet had created a game where the grinding was “not effective”? Give me a quote.

I have said that the grinding is too great, certainly. And it is, considering that the developers continue to insist that the game has zero grind.

I’ve said that the grinding is rather poorly designed in some places and could be supplemented or complemented with genuine story content and skill-based challenges.

But I don’t believe I’ve ever made the claim that the game is ineffective at creating a grinding environment. I’ve said only the opposite, if anything.

Excellent – we’re getting somewhere.

So you aren’t here to save the game, not to save a player, you are really just “sensitive” to the fact there is a niche imbalance in the game mechanics that could potentially screw someone over, that doesn’t affect you and that you’ve failed to evidence actually affects anyone.

Time gating is your reversed wording for what is actually rewarding regularity, but since that doesn’t affect you really and you have all the time in the world to play, I can only assume you’re angling towards an abusable grindable system….

Which onto the final part – you have touted that effective grinding is possible but hindered by DR, time gating and concurrently noted you want more loot for your time in game.

Looks like a duck and quacks mate – 9/10.

thisolderhead.5127:

So you aren’t here to save the game, not to save a player, you are really just “sensitive” to the fact there is a niche imbalance in the game mechanics that could potentially screw someone over, that doesn’t affect you and that you’ve failed to evidence actually affects anyone.

I established how it could screw someone over in this thread at least a page ago. You’re not paying very good attention.

And there was another thread posted in this same forum no less than two days ago discussing this same topic. If you’re so desperate to find someone who is affected by this, go digging. I’m not obligated to go locate individual people for you. >_>

Time gating is your reversed wording for what is actually rewarding regularity, but since that doesn’t affect you really and you have all the time in the world to play, I can only assume you’re angling towards an abusable grindable system….

No, time gating refers to the notion that a player is only rewarded X times per day for their decision to repeat an activity they enjoy.

I see no point in punishing a farmer if they enjoy farming. I find it boring, but more power to ’em if they can find enjoyment in something so menial.

Which onto the final part – you have touted that effective grinding is possible but hindered by DR, time gating and concurrently noted you want more loot for your time in game.

No, I have stated that the game produces an environment which restricts grinding through use of time gating while also forcing players to grind in order to obtain certain types of gear.

In other words, the devs can’t seem to decide if they want us to grind or not. Because they have introduced gear that has a grind to it, and then severely restricted people’s ability to grind for it.

Looks like a duck and quacks mate – 9/10.

Looks like you need to work on your English to me. If you think I’m complaining about time gating because I have this innate urge to create an abusable farming system, then you’ve completely and utterly failed at every single attempt you’ve made to interpret any of my statements.

I’ll give you one last chance before I just ignore you, because I’ve been hoping that you might produce some form of reasonable discussion. But it seems that you, too, are only here to troll. I’m genuinely disappointed. But this is why I don’t bother having “mature discussions” any more and just complain loudly. Folks like yourself demand civility and constructive dialogue, but you don’t actually want it, you just want the complaints to go away.

You provided a hypothetical set of conditions, you’ve not evidence that they’ve been met (and have stated you don’t meet them).

OK this one:
“No, time gating refers to the notion that a player is only rewarded X times per day for their decision to repeat an activity they enjoy.

I see no point in punishing a farmer if they enjoy farming. I find it boring, but more power to ’em if they can find enjoyment in something so menial.”

See the way you twist reward there is beautiful, like twisting laurels from earnable currency to an entitlement that you miss out on if you can’t log in and play – completely back to front logic and BRILLIANTLY presented. You’ve managed to take a short list of crap you’d do anyway (more or less) and turn it into the biggest chore list the internet has ever seen, shown the petulance to complain about having to do the chores to get desert, and then moved that it should be repeatable ad naseum.

The scary thing is how common this whole “I don’t have to earn, its a game” attitude is folks – its an MMO and you’ve entered into a social contract of sorts, do y’all know what that means?

Degeneration of your “mature converstations” may indicate communications issues with a common variable, dismissing me as a troll would be a nice completion to this one with a nice touch of faux symmetry…

The cost is absurd. I need ecto for sooo many other things.

Please make these and amulets available with fractal relics as well as with laurels.

thisolderhead.5127:

That is right, some people have duty weekends, some people fly in and out – but you have to tailor your passtimes to suit your lifestyle mate – can’t expect Anet to help out there, so they reward those who can only spare an hour or two here and there to play. Those who can only binge play (as you seem to be stuck with) are lower on the representation – so get screwed for the sake of the vast majority.

“Vast majority” does not play every day, so no, it’s exactly the other way around – it’s the majority that gets to suffer for the sake of a minority. Not to mention, the laurel cost for ascended set is too big even for those that do play every day. It’s already 180 laurels for only 5 slots. with whole set we will be looking at over a year of laurel farming.

Star Ace.5207:

To be fair, since Ecto is becoming kind of easier to come by, a player who would do his/her daily and monthly will get his/her Ascended Earrings faster than the one who would get them through Guild missions, by your own numbers above (whether that’s fair or not, or which is more expensive, etc., is another issue.) Sure, it will cost more, but then again by the end of the two months he/she will probably have more than enough to get these Earrings (I am no power gold farmer, BTW-just talking casual in-game gold-making.)

At least we who won’t join a large Guild for its own sake have some way to get the Earrings, even “ahead of schedule”, as it were (though yes, they are pricey, and yes, I don’t really agree with the way Guild Missions were implemented)

Ectoplasm is readily available in the Trade Post, but at a cost of 30-35 silver each. It may also be salvaged from rare or better equipment pieces, but there is no guarantee of success.

Also, the post below makes a valid point.

Paradox Xion.1038:

The cost is absurd. I need ecto for sooo many other things.

Please make these and amulets available with fractal relics as well as with laurels.

And this also goes for laurels. A player saving laurels for ascended earrings cannot spend those laurels on ascended amulets. (Well, if he/she does, he/she won’t have the earrings.) This is not true of guild commendations, since the commendation vendor does not offer other ascended items.
And finally, a player who regularly participates in guild missions is free to also earn laurels. A player who is not in a large guild does not have the option to do guild missions in addition to his/her dailies.

Regarding the time required to acquire enough laurels/guild commendations:

1. The duration of 2 months of daily/monthly achievements is the absolute minimum. Laurels cannot be earned faster.

2. The duration of 12 weeks (3 months) of guild missions is NOT the absolute minimum. If your guild has access to Bounties, Treks, Rushes, Challenges and Puzzles, you can earn more than 2 bounties per week. Alternatively, you can run with Bounties for multiple guilds in the same week. Therefore, Guild Commendations can be earned significantly faster. Halving the duration by gaining double the amount of commendations can even be achieved by performing only one additional (type of) guild mission per week.
(And half the duration of 12 weeks is already shorter than the 2 months of laurel hunting.)

Esodiki.6723:

It annoys me when you think items that you can’t get should be easier to get because you are such a noob. If these items were cheaper, everyone would have them which would mean no one would care about them, also it is nice to have something to work for once 80…not play for a couple of weeks and you have everything already.

I’d rather play for fun. Grinding for stats is not fun.

Ars Valde.8693:

Am I the only one that thinks it’s -absurd- that Ascended Earrings cost 45 Laurels and 50 Ectos each? They have lower stats than the rings, and even a single better stat item like the Ammy is only 35.

If anything they should cost 25 Laurels. What the blazes Anet? I understand you’re also introducing them with the Guild Missions system, but as that system really only caters to large guilds at the moment unless tweaked, this seems to be the only viable method for players in smaller guilds.

Am I off base here, or does anyone else agree?

I think the point is they don’t want you to use your laurels to buy them…
They want you to get them via guild missions.

The same way you can buy the rings with laurels… or get them from fractals.
To some, its a no-brainer…. to others, it seems like a good idea.

Bottom line is…. if it seems like a ripoff to go with one way instead of the other…. then go with the way you think is worth it.

Astralporing.1957:

Esodiki.6723:

It annoys me when you think items that you can’t get should be easier to get because you are such a noob. If these items were cheaper, everyone would have them which would mean no one would care about them, also it is nice to have something to work for once 80…not play for a couple of weeks and you have everything already.

I’d rather play for fun. Grinding for stats is not fun.

How is playing the game grinding?
In your version, everything in this game is a grind.
Killing x amount of enemies for achievements is a grind. Doing dailies is a grind. Killing anything is a grind, logging in is a grind, having to right click on items to deposit them in the bank is a grind.
Seriously, I fear the day ANet releases content that is actually difficult and time consuming to complete. People will lose their minds.
Some of the current generation of gamers are beyond hope.

thisolderhead.5127:

You provided a hypothetical set of conditions, you’ve not evidence that they’ve been met (and have stated you don’t meet them).

And I already told you, there is someone who expressed this same complaint about two days ago.

You want individual cases so badly, you go digging for them. I’m not going to humor this line of thought that, because you haven’t actually SEEN someone complain about this, that obviously no such person exists.

See the way you twist reward there is beautiful, like twisting laurels from earnable currency to an entitlement that you miss out on if you can’t log in and play – completely back to front logic and BRILLIANTLY presented. You’ve managed to take a short list of crap you’d do anyway (more or less) and turn it into the biggest chore list the internet has ever seen, shown the petulance to complain about having to do the chores to get desert, and then moved that it should be repeatable ad naseum.

No, you’re twisting my words. Again. I never said a single thing about “entitlements”. No one is entitled to free laurels.

But players who dedicate the same amount of time to a game and perform essentially the same activities deserve the same opportunity for rewards. And time gating prevents that.

You’re trying very hard to distract from this core issue and question my moral fibre without actually addressing the problem (as my prior question remains unanswered). If that’s not trolling, then I question why you’re even bothering to post here, because you certainly aren’t trying to have a genuine discussion.

The scary thing is how common this whole “I don’t have to earn, its a game” attitude is folks – its an MMO and you’ve entered into a social contract of sorts, do y’all know what that means?

Already dismissed this ridiculous twisted logic earlier, so I won’t do it again.

Degeneration of your “mature converstations” may indicate communications issues with a common variable, dismissing me as a troll would be a nice completion to this one with a nice touch of faux symmetry…

You are a troll. You’re not actually answering any of the questions I’ve asked you directly (most likely because you have no interest in actually having the discussion to begin with), you’re twisting my words to say things I never said, and you’re questioning my integrity instead of providing any discussion of merit.

The only “common variable” here is that every single person left in this forums who defends the dev team is incapable of actually answering direct criticisms of the game’s mechanics without heavy use of straw-man and ad hominem. The game can’t possibly be at fault for any mistakes, you claim, it’s all of these nasty entitled haters who dare to expect adequate rewards in accordance with their time investments who are detracting from this perfect game. And all I can say to that is….fine, you can stay in your bubble. I’m not going to invest further time in trying to explain something in detail when you’re simply shrugging it off without actually replying to it.

I see no value in this ‘discussion’ any longer. I’ve attempted to engage you in an intelligent debate, and you’ve dodged every question I’ve asked and taken every opportunity to insult my person. You’re a waste of my time.

One thing I think no one has mentioned – there are two ring slots. A member of a large guild could do BOTH dailies AND guild missions simultaneously, essentially halving the time taken to obtain both. So the time based gating doesn’t work so well in this case, because if you aren’t in a big guild you aren’t gated equally.

The only guild wars happening in this game is that of the recruiters of guilds fighting for active members….

All guilds are not created equal nor will they ever seem to be….

With that said I think most people that are not in a big guild or don’t care for them will always be left out of the guild content unless its changed. I don’t even call this new content because I will never be able to actually do it because of the expectations and requirements needed to do them. I guess I was left out of the cool kids club… lulz

Excursion.9752:

The only guild wars happening in this game is that of the recruiters of guilds fighting for active members….

All guilds are not created equal nor will they ever seem to be….

With that said I think most people that are not in a big guild or don’t care for them will always be left out of the guild content unless its changed. I don’t even call this new content because I will never be able to actually do it because of the expectations and requirements needed to do them. I guess I was left out of the cool kids club… lulz

Yes that part of the idea of guilds are organization fighting over the best new members. Its true in real life why should it not be true in games? If any thing there more of a true guild wars in GW2 then there ever was in GW1.

The thing is guilds are made by ppl not by Anet so there is going to be unequal. I am sry that ppl put more work into there guild then you do or others.

The “cool kid club” would be the small guilds not willing to try new things because these small guild are more exclusives then big guilds. Also you seem to think small guilds cant get any thing done they can and they are its INACTIVE guilds that are taking the most hit here and they should. If your guild is just a name and is doing nothing for there members then that guild should be worst off then guilds who is doing things with there members.

Jski.6180:

The thing is guilds are made by ppl not by Anet so there is going to be unequal. I am sry that ppl put more work into there guild then you do or others.

On average, people in small guilds put more effort into their guilds than those in big ones. After all, in big ones you don’t have to do anything besides keeping represent on and showing up for missions. there are always enough active members to carry the guild anyway. Quantity over quality.

First of all, I want to say that I do not agree with the way ascended items are priced right now. Having put that out, it seems people think the problem would be solved by having ascended items drop in more ways. Given that ascended items are supposed to be rarer than exotics, and that I’ve had 1 exotic drop ever in all my time in Tyria, I don’t see how this issue would be solved. I would get the laurels and ectos sooner than I would have the chance of seeing an ascended drop.
The bigger problem here is how Anet defined the process to get an ascended currently, and that guild missions are an easier way to get them compared to laurels, and smaller guilds will find it impossible to get the influence points needed to do guild missions . If they both took around the same time, and if all ascended items were comparable in cost to each other, I don’t think anyone would have a problem.

You don’t see anyone complain about how long it should take to get a legendary (except for the RNG precursor part, and that is not the point here), doesn’t matter whether its twilight or bolt, your chances are the same.
So if all ascended items took about the same time to earn (30 laurels or 40 laurels or whatever Anet decided was a good time gate), people would still crib, but eventually accept it for what it was.
It almost seems like Anet didn’t plan out well in advance how they wanted to make ascended items available, so it ends up that you get rings in one way, amulets are cheaper than accessories, all of them cost different, and only amulets have utility slots etc etc. There is just too much variation in there, unlike exotics, where if you wanted berserkers or clerics, you could get exactly what you wanted for about the same price/stat value for each gear.

The amount of grind just reached a new all-time-high. Anet really wants to lock everybody into one char with only one build.
I’m from europe and play on a US-server. I could only play Guild missions if i would stay up really late at night.

This game gets more tedious every patch. Time to uninstall the game and delete the password. FO Anet you will not waste any more of my time.

Pixelninja.6971:

The amount of grind just reached a new all-time-high. Anet really wants to lock everybody into one char with only one build.
I’m from europe and play on a US-server. I could only play Guild missions if i would stay up really late at night.

This game gets more tedious every patch. Time to uninstall the game and delete the password. FO Anet you will not waste any more of my time.

The thing is this game GW2 is the lowest grind mmorpg to date maybe you do not like mmorpgs?

Easy solution would be to make all ascened gear available through all play styles, such as dungeons, fractals, Karma etc, etc. This way a person could really truely play the way they would want to.
Some might say then people would earn it too fast. That is true and I do not care how fast some one gets their gear. If someone wanted to get everything in one day by marathoning it, fine good for them, but I would like to have that choice. Currenlty it is just a time gate which I do not think is very good for the game’s future.

Just bring it out for all forms of playstyle and let us grind out for cosmetics.

Just my two cents

Jski.6180:

Pixelninja.6971:

The amount of grind just reached a new all-time-high. Anet really wants to lock everybody into one char with only one build.
I’m from europe and play on a US-server. I could only play Guild missions if i would stay up really late at night.

This game gets more tedious every patch. Time to uninstall the game and delete the password. FO Anet you will not waste any more of my time.

The thing is this game GW2 is the lowest grind mmorpg to date maybe you do not like mmorpgs?

This is absolutely not true. I’m guessing you haven’t played many MMO’s including Guild Wars 1. I bet you’re one of those EQ, Eve Online, and WoW players.

The Laurel portion and/or Guild Commendations needed to get these earrings are ridiculous. Spending 1,000 hours on a single character just to be able to perform at highest efficiency possible in WvWvW is absurd. Time Played should never trump skill, ever. Winning a 1v1 in WvWvW just because of a gear gap is not okay. It’s not the worlds fault that some people fail at real life, have infinite time, and try to fill the emptyness inside with virtual junk.

“Ooohhhh all I really want is a guy who plays videos games all day and night” ~ said no attractive girl ever.

Sardonia.8196:

Easy solution would be to make all ascened gear available through all play styles, such as dungeons, fractals, Karma etc, etc. This way a person could really truely play the way they would want to.
Some might say then people would earn it too fast. That is true and I do not care how fast some one gets their gear. If someone wanted to get everything in one day by marathoning it, fine good for them, but I would like to have that choice. Currenlty it is just a time gate which I do not think is very good for the game’s future.

Just bring it out for all forms of playstyle and let us grind out for cosmetics.

Just my two cents

Ascended was put into the game to provide a goal that would not be gotten quickly. ANet’s wording was something along the lines of “bridge the gap between getting exotics and legendaries.” The developers did this because the game was hemorrhaging players whose complaint was nothing to work towards. ANet decided that it was better for the game’s future to slow the process of getting gear down. Now you want to speed the process up.

Now, maybe ANet was wrong. At the time, a lot of people threatened to leave the game over Ascended. For all I know they did leave. Maybe the game lost more players with the addition of Ascended than they retained. Having already theoretically lost these players, what is ANet’s motive for speeding up acquisition? So people can get the items quickly, then turn around and kitten about nothing to do?

Jski.6180:

The thing is this game GW2 is the lowest grind mmorpg to date maybe you do not like mmorpgs?

RPG does not stand for “Really Powerful Grind”, you know. It stands for “Role Playing Game”.

Contrary to popular belief, some people buy RPGs for the atmosphere, the experience (no, not the stat), and the escapism. Not everyone who plays an RPG does it because they want gear to chase after.

And it’s worth noting that MMOs don’t actually have to include grinding. They do it because it’s the cheapest method of long-term player retention available. But it’s hardly a mandate. If an MMO were to come out that had very little grinding in it, it wouldn’t get shunned by its peers and be cast out of the MMORPG “club”.

Grinding is not a required facet of MMOs. It’s just a cheap and easy way to keep people busy, which is why they do it.

Theplayboy.6417:

Jski.6180:

Pixelninja.6971:

The amount of grind just reached a new all-time-high. Anet really wants to lock everybody into one char with only one build.
I’m from europe and play on a US-server. I could only play Guild missions if i would stay up really late at night.

This game gets more tedious every patch. Time to uninstall the game and delete the password. FO Anet you will not waste any more of my time.

The thing is this game GW2 is the lowest grind mmorpg to date maybe you do not like mmorpgs?

This is absolutely not true. I’m guessing you haven’t played many MMO’s including Guild Wars 1. I bet you’re one of those EQ, Eve Online, and WoW players.

The Laurel portion and/or Guild Commendations needed to get these earrings are ridiculous. Spending 1,000 hours on a single character just to be able to perform at highest efficiency possible in WvWvW is absurd. Time Played should never trump skill, ever. Winning a 1v1 in WvWvW just because of a gear gap is not okay. It’s not the worlds fault that some people fail at real life, have infinite time, and try to fill the emptyness inside with virtual junk.

“Ooohhhh all I really want is a guy who plays videos games all day and night” ~ said no attractive girl ever.

So there was no grind in GW1 i though you had to at least work for skins and the runes for both your own gear and your npcs gear. At the same time you had to unlock your npc and new zones though quest. If your going to call what GW2 has a grind then you MUST call what GW1 had was a grind too.

Side note if that your best argument to go more after a person attk your not going to last long on these forms.

critickitten.1498:

Jski.6180:

The thing is this game GW2 is the lowest grind mmorpg to date maybe you do not like mmorpgs?

RPG does not stand for “Really Powerful Grind”, you know. It stands for “Role Playing Game”.

Contrary to popular belief, some people buy RPGs for the atmosphere, the experience (no, not the stat), and the escapism. Not everyone who plays an RPG does it because they want gear to chase after.

And it’s worth noting that MMOs don’t actually have to include grinding. They do it because it’s the cheapest method of long-term player retention available. But it’s hardly a mandate. If an MMO were to come out that had very little grinding in it, it wouldn’t get shunned by its peers and be cast out of the MMORPG “club”.

Grinding is not a required facet of MMOs. It’s just a cheap and easy way to keep people busy, which is why they do it.

And your the one who said that you could not have an mmorpgs with out a grind. so i am not sure why your flipping your views. We had a long argument about this. Any way RPG do have a grind in them all of them do if just simply leveling up that is a type of grind.

Jski.6180:

And your the one who said that you could not have an mmorpgs with out a grind. so i am not sure why your flipping your views. We had a long argument about this. Any way RPG do have a grind in them all of them do if just simply leveling up that is a type of grind.

No, I said they couldn’t avoid all grind.

Not that they can’t possibly minimize it.

If you read my post, you’d note that I said this:

If an MMO were to come out that had very little grinding in it, it wouldn’t get shunned by its peers and be cast out of the MMORPG “club”.

Note the choice words: “very little”, not “none”.

I don’t think you’re even trying to read my posts correctly at this point, because I know I’ve said this at least three times now.

critickitten.1498:

Jski.6180:

And your the one who said that you could not have an mmorpgs with out a grind. so i am not sure why your flipping your views. We had a long argument about this. Any way RPG do have a grind in them all of them do if just simply leveling up that is a type of grind.

No, I said they couldn’t avoid all grind.

Not that they can’t possibly minimize it.

If you read my post, you’d note that I said this:

If an MMO were to come out that had very little grinding in it, it wouldn’t get shunned by its peers and be cast out of the MMORPG “club”.

Note the choice words: “very little”, not “none”.

I don’t think you’re even trying to read my posts correctly at this point, because I know I’ve said this at least three times now.

Ya if you cant avoid something then its going to always be there.

When you say “And it’s worth noting that MMOs don’t actually have to include grinding.” other being a very confusing statement (no not never soo many negative) makes it seem like your saying mmorpgs do not need grinds of any type. When you say" They do it because it’s the cheapest method of long-term player retention available." show that there are other method that is not so cheap i would love to know these.

Jski.6180:

Ya if you cant avoid something then its going to always be there.

When you say “And it’s worth noting that MMOs don’t actually have to include grinding.” other being a very confusing statement (no not never soo many negative) makes it seem like your saying mmorpgs do not need grinds of any type.

I did state that avoiding all grinding is impossible. It can always be mitigated, not removed.

But developers want to pad their content length, too, so they tend to leave some grind in there. MMOs have a high tendency to

When you say" They do it because it’s the cheapest method of long-term player retention available." show that there are other method that is not so cheap i would love to know these.

One option would be to dedicate several members of your development team to providing full-time content releases on a very frequent and regular basis. Some smaller companies utilize this sort of model, pushing out weekly releases (instead of monthly ones) in an effort to maintain higher retention levels. Bigger groups like ANet would have trouble doing this, though, because it’s not cost-efficient.

And there are others, too, but I’m not going to go in-depth any further since I’ve already had multiple posts deleted for being “off-topic” when I was merely responding to other users’ posts.

Suffice it to say that grind is not the only way to keep people playing your game.

Jski.6180:

Theplayboy.6417:

Jski.6180:

Pixelninja.6971:

The amount of grind just reached a new all-time-high. Anet really wants to lock everybody into one char with only one build.
I’m from europe and play on a US-server. I could only play Guild missions if i would stay up really late at night.

This game gets more tedious every patch. Time to uninstall the game and delete the password. FO Anet you will not waste any more of my time.

The thing is this game GW2 is the lowest grind mmorpg to date maybe you do not like mmorpgs?

This is absolutely not true. I’m guessing you haven’t played many MMO’s including Guild Wars 1. I bet you’re one of those EQ, Eve Online, and WoW players.

The Laurel portion and/or Guild Commendations needed to get these earrings are ridiculous. Spending 1,000 hours on a single character just to be able to perform at highest efficiency possible in WvWvW is absurd. Time Played should never trump skill, ever. Winning a 1v1 in WvWvW just because of a gear gap is not okay. It’s not the worlds fault that some people fail at real life, have infinite time, and try to fill the emptyness inside with virtual junk.

“Ooohhhh all I really want is a guy who plays videos games all day and night” ~ said no attractive girl ever.

So there was no grind in GW1 i though you had to at least work for skins and the runes for both your own gear and your npcs gear. At the same time you had to unlock your npc and new zones though quest. If your going to call what GW2 has a grind then you MUST call what GW1 had was a grind too.

Side note if that your best argument to go more after a person attk your not going to last long on these forms.

As I suspected you never played Guild Wars 1. Let me educate you a bit, I had two PvE Characters that were completely maxed out within the first month an less than 200 hours of game play. I can log onto to those character right now almost 8 years later and they are still at max possible stats. They may not have not have tormented weapons or head to toe in Obsidian Armor but they are the statistically equal to every other player in RA, CA, AB, JQ, FA, GvG, and HA. Not only that but I can change these characters weapons, traits, skills, and armor in a second to many completely different builds. I can’t do that in Guild Wars 2. If I stop playing the game for as little as 1 month I will NEVER be able to catch back up to my peers. If I take a break from GW2 I will never come back.

I think you need reevaluate what it is your trying to accomplish by playing online video games. It seems to me that you’re playing only to progress your character and for virtual trash and not because you actually enjoy playing the game. If you aren’t rewarded with a virtual items or a stat increase then you’re not happy. I suggest looking deeper into your life to figure out why this is. No amount of progession or virtual loot will fill the hole in your life. WoW has taught you that all MMO’s must have grind. This simply isn’t true. All this new tier of gear really does is lock every player into a specific set of stats.

If it wasn’t for all of the grind hypnotized freaks amd their endless crying on the forums GW2 would never have even introduced Ascended level items. Guild Wars 2 is bleeding players left and right.

Theplayboy.6417:

Jski.6180:

Theplayboy.6417:

Jski.6180:

Pixelninja.6971:

The amount of grind just reached a new all-time-high. Anet really wants to lock everybody into one char with only one build.
I’m from europe and play on a US-server. I could only play Guild missions if i would stay up really late at night.

This game gets more tedious every patch. Time to uninstall the game and delete the password. FO Anet you will not waste any more of my time.

The thing is this game GW2 is the lowest grind mmorpg to date maybe you do not like mmorpgs?

This is absolutely not true. I’m guessing you haven’t played many MMO’s including Guild Wars 1. I bet you’re one of those EQ, Eve Online, and WoW players.

The Laurel portion and/or Guild Commendations needed to get these earrings are ridiculous. Spending 1,000 hours on a single character just to be able to perform at highest efficiency possible in WvWvW is absurd. Time Played should never trump skill, ever. Winning a 1v1 in WvWvW just because of a gear gap is not okay. It’s not the worlds fault that some people fail at real life, have infinite time, and try to fill the emptyness inside with virtual junk.

“Ooohhhh all I really want is a guy who plays videos games all day and night” ~ said no attractive girl ever.

So there was no grind in GW1 i though you had to at least work for skins and the runes for both your own gear and your npcs gear. At the same time you had to unlock your npc and new zones though quest. If your going to call what GW2 has a grind then you MUST call what GW1 had was a grind too.

Side note if that your best argument to go more after a person attk your not going to last long on these forms.

As I suspected you never played Guild Wars 1. Let me educate you a bit, I had two PvE Characters that were completely maxed out within the first month an less than 200 hours of game play. I can log onto to those character right now almost 8 years later and they are still at max possible stats. They may not have not have tormented weapons or head to toe in Obsidian Armor but they are the statistically equal to every other player in RA, CA, AB, JQ, FA, GvG, and HA. Not only that but I can change these characters weapons, traits, skills, and armor in a second to many completely different builds.

You don’t need to gear out any NPC’s for PvP. Hero’s are mainly PvE and I don’t care if someone has an advantage over me in Guild Wars 1 PvE because all of the PvE content was specifically instances just for me and/or my party.

I think you need reevaluate what it is your trying to accomplish by playing online video games. It seems to me that you’re playing only to progress your character and for virtual trash and not because you actually enjoy playing the game. If you aren’t rewarded with a virtual items or a stat increase then you’re not happy. I suggest looking deeper into your life to figure out why this is. No amount of progession or virtual loot will fill the hole in your life. WoW has taught you that all MMO’s must have grind. This simply isn’t true. All this new tier of gear really does is lock every player into a specific set of stats.

If it wasn’t for all of the grind hypnotized freaks amd their endless crying on the forums GW2 would never have even introduced Ascended level trash.

True i did not play it for that long but there was a type of grind and i think that ppl complains about it just as much as they do here. When GW1 first came out ppl where writing it off as worst then WoW it too a year for the game to get good why not the same for GW2?

@ critickitten.1498
“Suffice it to say that grind is not the only way to keep people playing your game.”

But how? I am not asking how Anet can rework there team i am asking what beyond just simply adding in a new events ever week or do we need something every day? I think something new a month is pushing it as is for both the Anet team and ppl ability to keep up (there would be a greater feeling of being left behind if you cant do all the content to the point of being overwhelmed (gear not the only thing that ppl will miss out on when they leave for a week).

I don’t mind a grind. I do think one should be rewarded for playing the game more, if they devoted the time to it.

However, I want to pick my path, not what Arenanet dictates. Giving 2 choices, of one which is incredibly unreasonable and the other choice gets shut off due to the guilds I join just leads to a slow boring grind that isn’t fun. That’s just an illusion of choice. It would be like presenting me with 2 roads to get to the same place but one of them is broken down and requires necessarily long roundabout ways to get there.

Sure, I could bandwagon on a large guild just to get it. Except that kinda defeats the purpose of being in a guild.

Arenanet would do well to present new content. However, please don’t shove your new gimmicks down our throats while making it exclusive to your new blasted item tier. Sure there’s the illusion of “optional” but as more and more ascended pieces get introduced, it’s just going to finish the gate that will lock people out. Ascended gear is truly a plague atm.

Jski.6180:

True i did not play it for that long but there was a type of grind and i think that ppl complains about it just as much as they do here. When GW1 first came out ppl where writing it off as worst then WoW it too a year for the game to get good why not the same for GW2?

It’s the direction. GW2, instead of improving, is now actually worse than it was the moment it shipped out.

Jski.6180:

But how? I am not asking how Anet can rework there team i am asking what beyond just simply adding in a new events ever week or do we need something every day? I think something new a month is pushing it as is for both the Anet team and ppl ability to keep up (there would be a greater feeling of being left behind if you cant do all the content to the point of being overwhelmed (gear not the only thing that ppl will miss out on when they leave for a week).

So? If all the content is equal, providing horizontal alternatives, then coming after a year to see a new continent does not mean you are somehow behind. It only means that you haven’t been there yet. And there would be no barrier preventing you from going there and doing whatever you want. Nobody would say “you need to prepare for a month before visiting that region”. You could just play and have fun.

Astralporing.1957:

Jski.6180:

True i did not play it for that long but there was a type of grind and i think that ppl complains about it just as much as they do here. When GW1 first came out ppl where writing it off as worst then WoW it too a year for the game to get good why not the same for GW2?

It’s the direction. GW2, instead of improving, is now actually worse than it was the moment it shipped out.

Jski.6180:

But how? I am not asking how Anet can rework there team i am asking what beyond just simply adding in a new events ever week or do we need something every day? I think something new a month is pushing it as is for both the Anet team and ppl ability to keep up (there would be a greater feeling of being left behind if you cant do all the content to the point of being overwhelmed (gear not the only thing that ppl will miss out on when they leave for a week).

So? If all the content is equal, providing horizontal alternatives, then coming after a year to see a new continent does not mean you are somehow behind. It only means that you haven’t been there yet. And there would be no barrier preventing you from going there and doing whatever you want. Nobody would say “you need to prepare for a month before visiting that region”. You could just play and have fun.

No only a few ppl think its worst then when it shipped you seem to be one of them you do understand most ppl who play GW2 avoid the forms because this places is one of the worst ways to find out info from your fellow players.

Ppl are like that. A game like FF11 has no treadmill for the most part (well before they added in level 76+) but there was a lot to the game to the point that new players where overwhelmed to do events and most often ppl who where playing the entire time where not going to help the new ppl. That is the feeling that ppl get when they do not play a few weeks when they add in new things every week or every day.

Jski.6180:

No only a few ppl think its worst then when it shipped you seem to be one of them you do understand most ppl who play GW2 avoid the forms because this places is one of the worst ways to find out info from your fellow players.

Most of people do not “avoid” the forums – they either do not want to put an effort to post or read, don’t know the language (there is a lot of those), or don’t even know there are forums. This cuts across all the groups represented here – you are as likely to find supporters or opposition to any idea we argue here as you would on this forum.
All the claims about a “vocal minority” that is supposedly present only on forums, are just that – claims without any support in hard facts.

Unless you can supply those facts, of course.

Astralporing.1957:

Jski.6180:

No only a few ppl think its worst then when it shipped you seem to be one of them you do understand most ppl who play GW2 avoid the forms because this places is one of the worst ways to find out info from your fellow players.

Most of people do not “avoid” the forums – they either do not want to put an effort to post or read, don’t know the language (there is a lot of those), or don’t even know there are forums. This cuts across all the groups represented here – you are as likely to find supporters or opposition to any idea we argue here as you would on this forum.
All the claims about a “vocal minority” that is supposedly present only on forums, are just that – claims without any support in hard facts.

Unless you can supply those facts, of course.

Most ppl who post or say any thing feel very strong about there views i am not an exception to this nor are you.

Jski.6180:

Most ppl who post or say any thing feel very strong about there views i am not an exception to this nor are you.

True. This however does not mean that the counterpart (the people that feel strongly about something post here) is also true. In fact, it is not.

Astralporing.1957:

Jski.6180:

Most ppl who post or say any thing feel very strong about there views i am not an exception to this nor are you.

True. This however does not mean that the counterpart (the people that feel strongly about something post here) is also true. In fact, it is not.

I guess its just odd to me if ppl dislike the game why are they still on the forms in the first places? If you given up on it what they point of posting on it? I find ppl still like this game even with there complains and that why they stay arone here posting.

Jski.6180:

I guess its just odd to me if ppl dislike the game why are they still on the forms in the first places? If you given up on it what they point of posting on it? I find ppl still like this game even with there complains and that why they stay arone here posting.

I do like this game. What i don’t like is the direction it is currently going, because i know, that if it continues on this path, i will eventually give up on it.

So, i continue posting on the off chance that there’s still possibility of changing that direction into one more appealing to me. Especially since i saw that other people were succesful trying that (which, by the way, was one of the things that started the whole mess).