Boss impressions from L31 fractal runner

Boss impressions from L31 fractal runner

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Posted by: Lopez.7369

Lopez.7369

I posted this on my blog, but I want to hear some thoughts and discussion on this:

A week and a half in, I’m at difficulty level 31 in Fractals of the Mists. Truth be told, I’m feeling a bit of burnout at this point, so this will probably be the highest I push for some time. But now that I have a solid amount of experience in my belt, I’m a bit more interested in looking at what the new feature in Guild Wars 2 did right and what it did wrong. Specifically, I’m interested in looking at boss mechanics.

Boss design in Guild Wars 2 has definitely not been the strong point of the game. Anyone who has done the other dungeons knows progression is bizarre and a lot of bosses are nothing more than dodge-and-kill fights akin to the simplest boss fights in other MMORPGs. So fractals were ArenaNet’s chance to show some improvement.

At level 31, I feel I have a good enough grasp of the content to gauge if ArenaNet succeeded or failed. To give the too-long-didn’t-read summary, my verdict is ArenaNet succeeded at improving, but failed at going far enough.

To give my verdict some context, I think good boss fights exemplify one or both of two key elements: variety in mechanics and phases. Both keep bosses fresh as they keep going, and both can provide twists in challenge. The two ingredients provide logical progression throughout a boss fight, which keeps players feeling like they’re accomplishing more and more as the fight goes on. If there’s a variety of mechanics, players typically feel like they’re conquering more and more odds as the boss gets lower and lower in health. With phases, clear mid-fight progression is added as players transition from one act of the boss to the next.

The problem is that, as the game stands, too many boss fights lack either of these elements. Take the Jellyfish Beast in the underwater fractal. What makes players say that the fight is too long, even with the electric cage mechanic? It’s not that the fight takes an extraordinary amount of time; it clocks in at three to four minutes, which is standard in fractal encounters. It’s that the boss has few mechanics — electric cells that can be used to shock it, an AOE pull that applies agony, and jellyfish adds — and the mechanics remain static throughout the fight. That makes players feel like they’re doing the same thing over and over for much too long.

Same thing applies to the final bosses in the dredge fractal. When I first started fractals, these two fights seemed fun. They assigned one player to a unique role — pour lava — and involved coordinated kiting from the group. The problem is the mechanic is repeated almost mindlessly for three to four minutes. It’s pretty much the only mechanic in the fight, barring some dodging and AOEing here and there. There’s no progression or twists.

In contrast, there’s the colossus fractal. Ignoring any exploits, the entire fractal is essentially a multi-phase boss fight centered around seals: Kill a legendary mob, which drops a hammer. Use the hammer to break two seals while handling adds. Destroy another seal while dealing with more mobs. Break two more seals while managing mobs that heal them. Finally, eliminate the last seal while fighting a legendary mob and adds.

Some might complain the colossus fractal takes too long relative to the other fractals, but I think it’s the perfect build-up. Mechanics get more and more complex, players change roles as the hammer is traded off, and it all culminates with a big fight at the end.

In between the colossus fractal and the dredge and underwater fractals, there is some middle ground. Among these, the Legendary Imbued Shaman in the grawl fractal gets to be one of the more interesting fights at higher levels as the transition between fighting the boss itself and dealing with its bubble shield and adds becomes harder to deal with. However, the fight ultimately remains static. The encounter makes players repeat the same task over and over, and there’s no notable mechanics except the high difficulty of dealing with transitions.

That’s the big problem with boss design in Guild Wars 2. Too often the boss fights feel like an unchanging dodge-and-kill. Too much of the time a boss is difficult because of numbers, not mechanics. In the end, too many of the bosses don’t feel like bosses; they feel like mobs with greater health pools and damage.

Moving forward, it’s definitely something ArenaNet can fix, especially with the promised dungeon revamp. For now, I appreciate Fractals of the Mists as a wonderful medium of content and progression, but some parts leave a bit to be desired.

http://vidyagame.wordpress.com/2012/11/26/designing-bosses/

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Posted by: replicant.3620

replicant.3620

Colossus is absolutely the only Fractal I enjoy doing because it is the most interesting.

Peralta | 80 Human Necromancer | Pain Train Choo [Choo] | Sanctum of Rall

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Posted by: Eugenics.6953

Eugenics.6953

level 31 :O kitten I got bored and stopped just as I got level 3.

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Posted by: Malefactor.2971

Malefactor.2971

Do you feel that maybe the developers are limited in what they can do with boss type encounters due to their removal of the “holy trinity”? Did they perhaps design themselves into a corner by trying to be different?

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Posted by: Servanin.5021

Servanin.5021

Do you feel that maybe the developers are limited in what they can do with boss type encounters due to their removal of the “holy trinity”? Did they perhaps design themselves into a corner by trying to be different?

In WoW, tanks have no mechanics in raids but to pick up adds that spawn and swap aggro to prevent stacking mechanics. For healers, there is usually an unavoidable amount of raid damage going out, with everything else being possible to avoid.

These are mechanics that are there specifically to give tanks and healers something to do, and boss encounters even in WoW could probably be created without them by just removing those, but they can’t because its too deeply ingrained into the design.

So no, there doesn’t need to be a trinity to have more boss fight diversity, GW2 just doesn’t have it.

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Posted by: arjeidi.2690

arjeidi.2690

Reading your post had me thinking “Well, they kept that in from GW1 then.” In GW1, bosses were really just “harder” mobs (“harder” being defined as ‘having more health and armor and damage while ultimately behaving exactly like a regular mob’) which a profession-specific glow that you could (eventually) cap skills from. They always seemed ‘meh’ in GW1 and I’m a bit… not surprised while reading your assessment that they have much of the same feel. There’s nothing really unique or interesting to them.

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Posted by: Ditton.3149

Ditton.3149

See I absolutely dont care at all about boss phase progression..I think it adds nothing and even if every single boss had it..you would complain because you have done this dungeon a minimum of 108 times already. Colossus last boss doesnt change at all, only the mobs around him and the added agony affect does. I think they took a tremendous step forward with these dungeons.

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Posted by: JSmooth.7654

JSmooth.7654

Just wanted to say that I loved your post (OP) and agree with most of it. I think that Anet has taken a step in the right direction with the fractal bosses. I hope they continue on that path to better, more interesting battles.

I am a tank at heart.
Sometimes I wonder what I’m doing here…

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Posted by: Bruno Sardine.2907

Bruno Sardine.2907

Yes, a step in the right direction in terms of encounter design… but really need to fix other issues before adding more. If your mechanics are rock solid, it’s easier to design encounters.

And just a side-comment… hate that condition damage doesn’t do extra damage against the ice elemental or dredge suit boss when they’re super heated…. once again, condition dmg <<< direct damage

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Posted by: Nonlinear.9823

Nonlinear.9823

almost all dungeon bosses have this problem, too many hp coupled with one long boring phase of just repeating the gimmick over and over.

I can think of a number of pre-fractals bosses this applies to off the top of my hear, last boss of SE path 2, last bosses of all exp paths of HotW. 1 phase hp sponges.

If you can do the mechanic for two minutes you can do it for 4.

Another problem I am seeing is people kitten their dps to go support and make fights up to 40% longer.

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Posted by: stof.9341

stof.9341

I’d add that far too many bosses got a much shorter “time from cue to impact” for melee range compared to ranged. Some attacks even only have the projectile travel time as time to dodge so when the boss suddenly changes aggro to you and throws this attack, it’s incredibly hard to dodge.

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Posted by: Bruno Sardine.2907

Bruno Sardine.2907

Another problem I am seeing is people kitten their dps to go support and make fights up to 40% longer.

Well agony and enemies getting buffed doesn’t really help…. you can’t really glass cannon unless you’re confident in taking no damage. It’d be something if this dungeon also scaled the damage off combo fields (or they had weaknesses) so that even as enemies are getting buffed, more cooperative dps is greater than everyone just whomping on a target.

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Posted by: Lopez.7369

Lopez.7369

I don’t think the Holy Trinity has much to do with it. There are plenty of interesting bosses in single-player games and other multiplayer games that don’t require a tank or healer. There are plenty of untapped ideas out there.

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Posted by: derLoko.2185

derLoko.2185

Do fractals at high lvl need any advanced team builds & combat tactics – or is it just same old with better boss mechanics as a “twist”?