Guild Wars 2

It’s been HEAVILY hinted burning and poison will become stackable conditions, and since burning and bleeding will become almost the same condition with different names, I think they should add an additional effect to burning.

Before burning was stackable, it was unique due to the fact that it had a pretty high damage coefficient on single stack, while bleeding was more efficient in damaging by stacking.

Now, burning will stack, and bleed already stacks, so they’ll become 2 very similar conditions, effects-wise.

My suggestion is to add an additional effect to burning;
Double Damage to standing targets – If you stay still, burning will grant double damage, and if you move, ‘normal’ damage. Of course the ‘double’ damage could actually be the current damage and if the target is moving it’ll become the new base damage, which would be current/2

I understand they mentioned the smart thing to do to poison and burn (since they’ll stack) would be to lower the damage value a bit, but by adding this effect would make burning unique over bleeding.

Almost all damaging conditions will have an effect:
Poison reduces healing efficiency
Torment deals double damage to moving targets
Confusion deals double damage to foes using skills (newest POI episode hinted at a base damage per tick and bonus damage on skill use, I love this addition)
Burning deals double damage to targets standing still
Bleeding remains as it is, since the sources of bleed are numerous

Would running around not provide more oxygen for the flames, making it do more damage?

Would running around not make your blood flow faster, and cause more of it to leak out when you’re bleeding?

Would running around not make your blood flow faster, spreading the poison in your veins more rapidly, allowing it to do its damage sooner (although probably not more in total?)

Yes, yes and yes

But it would add a new dynamic to combat if, for more survivability when burning, you’d be ‘forced’ to move (rooted channeled skills)

Just something to make Burning unique and not a condition too similar to Bleeding

It’d be neat to see an additional effect put on Burning. More damage when your opponent has boons? When they’re stunned or otherwise CC’d?

Burning could also just be distinguished from bleed by having a high base damage with (relatively) poor scaling. As it is, burn has a base damage equivalent to nearly 8 bleeds, but scales with condition damage like 5 bleeds. They may just turn that effect up.

Or really low base damage with really high scaling! But that would probably contradict how Burning is currently positioned in skills and require a lot of adjusting.

Oh I love the concept around boons too! Or maybe reduce boon duration on foes by 10%?

I was also thinking about some kind of funny twist; Burning foes move 20% faster ( speed not stackable of course)

Warning: Speculation ahead.

Burning and poision will not stack like bleeding. they will stack once per player. The stacking is just to allow multiple players to have conditions on a target in dungeons and whatnot without losing DPS after the first guy uses them.

The point of burning was, and always will be, to have decent condition damage on a target without having to spec into condition damage.

Hannelore.8153:

Warning: Speculation ahead.

Burning and poision will not stack like bleeding. they will stack once per player. The stacking is just to allow multiple players to have conditions on a target in dungeons and whatnot without losing DPS after the first guy uses them.

The point of burning was, and always will be, to have decent condition damage on a target without having to spec into condition damage.

I hope so, since conditons are maybe not good against mobs in PvE, but they are
totally bad against players and even one stack burning melts you life often faster
then everything else.
I really don’t want to see condition mobs get even worse, and they are relly much
worse than any mobs that do just direct damage.

Beldin.5498:

Hannelore.8153:

Warning: Speculation ahead.

Burning and poision will not stack like bleeding. they will stack once per player. The stacking is just to allow multiple players to have conditions on a target in dungeons and whatnot without losing DPS after the first guy uses them.

The point of burning was, and always will be, to have decent condition damage on a target without having to spec into condition damage.

I hope so, since conditons are maybe not good against mobs in PvE, but they are
totally bad against players and even one stack burning melts you life often faster
then everything else.
I really don’t want to see condition mobs get even worse, and they are relly much
worse than any mobs that do just direct damage.

Yes, stacking conditions in intensity would be extremely bad for PvP as well.

My suggestion: don’t decrease burning damage at all, instead limit it stacks to 3.

Hannelore.8153:

Warning: Speculation ahead.

Burning and poision will not stack like bleeding. they will stack once per player. The stacking is just to allow multiple players to have conditions on a target in dungeons and whatnot without losing DPS after the first guy uses them.

The point of burning was, and always will be, to have decent condition damage on a target without having to spec into condition damage.

Something like that is what i would expect too, as they would not need to do much to the current application of burning, where if they make it stackable by the same player they would need to rework EVERY SINGLE application method (and as pointed out by others, would make it bleeding v2)

Hannelore.8153:

Warning: Speculation ahead.

Burning and poision will not stack like bleeding. they will stack once per player. The stacking is just to allow multiple players to have conditions on a target in dungeons and whatnot without losing DPS after the first guy uses them.

The point of burning was, and always will be, to have decent condition damage on a target without having to spec into condition damage.

But they said they will tone down the power of these conditions when they stack.

So it would leave a lot of stuff nerfed, only in case there are people ganging up on someone or something.
Wouldn’t count on stacking to only apply to different players. It sounds like a bleed kind of effect.

IMO, if you were to give burning an additional effect to differentiate it, then it should be a ‘different’ effect. Adding damage to a stationary target is just a rework of the torment effect.

Burning : Transfers to nearby characters. Adds 1 stack of 1s burning to other characters (PCs, NPCs, Mobs, allies, or enemies) on touch.

Moving already has advantages. Most of the time you see greatly unskilled players succeed more than they should by merely using their lower latency as an advantage over players with higher latency by merely moving behind them all the time.

Unless you add very good reasons to stand still other than putting torment on someone, there’s no reason for this effect.

For example, while moving:

• Projectiles will tend to stray a bit more.
• Areas will take a bit longer to activate.
• Cleave and direct hit skills (e.g. Flamestrike, Spatial Surge) will do a bit less damage.

This is the same pronciple as how you lose accuracy on the move in games like Counter-Strike, to give good reasons to stop to shoot, creating openings to let others aim, and increasing the need for skilled gameplay in which you can’t just shoot on the move all the time.

Once give good reasons not to move around too much, fire can have that ‘more damage while not moving’ effect.

Until then, there’s no point really, even if you add more sources of torment, moving all the time is still way better and with negligible downsides.

I see where you are coming from, OP, but I don’t agree with that effect. When I think of burning people, I think of them running around like headless chickens and spreading the fire. I kind of like ProtoMarcus’s idea about the speed boost. But what I would love is something like the GW1 Disease but it can spread among members of all races, not just the one who had cast on them. Keep the other mechanics though. For more info on Disease, check out this link: http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Disease

Burning is practically different though. The videos we have seen indicate a higher base damage than bleeding. Also, burning is generally a lot harder to stack up than bleeding (fewer sources and generally shorter durations). Also, bleeding does damage more frequently than burning, I don’t think that is changing.

Palindrome.8904:

Also, bleeding does damage more frequently than burning, I don’t think that is changing.

They both trigger once per second, so what are you talking about?

I think it does need something, but burning while not moving is first, completely worthless in PvP, nobody stops moving unless they are immobilized or down. And second, it is really not thematically fitting. I can throw out a couple ideas that are a little more copacetic with the fire theme.

• Burning deals more damage the higher the targets armor (Most severe burns are actually due to the burning of clothing, hair, and nearby objects. Any living body is composed of so much water it doesn’t burn well at all without a lot of help)
• Burning deals more damage for each nearby target which also has burning (Once again, burning really only affects living creatures with a lot of help, in this case nearby buddies who are also serving as kindling)
• Burning makes boons tick faster, decreasing their durations (Burning removes excess and extremities, the elementalist already uses this theme for fire skills that remove conditions, you could use it on your enemy to remove boons)

Uden Reavstone.3426:

Palindrome.8904:

Also, bleeding does damage more frequently than burning, I don’t think that is changing.

They both trigger once per second, so what are you talking about?

If you lump bleed numbers together, they show once per second, but otherwise you see a large number of smaller values. Unless those are just cosmetic?

Kaz.5430:

IMO, if you were to give burning an additional effect to differentiate it, then it should be a ‘different’ effect. Adding damage to a stationary target is just a rework of the torment effect.

Burning : Transfers to nearby characters. Adds 1 stack of 1s burning to other characters (PCs, NPCs, Mobs, allies, or enemies) on touch.

Some of the most interesting idea I’ve seen so far. I wouldn’t make it touch but it would be a pretty small radius.

Yeah i like the spreading idea, would make stacking a bit more risky, and fits very well with burning thematically

@Conncept, while your ideas are intresting, the first 2 while technically correct i guess, most ppl wont think it is, so in most peoples eyes it wont fit thematically. for the 3rd idea, well boons dont really “tick” currently from what i understand so think it would need quite some reworking of boons in general to make it work. thus i by far prefer the spreading idea

I like the spreading idea because you could potentially burn an entire zerg if they stay too close together.

I really like that mechanic in the volcanic fractal, where there’s this specific debuff that burns foes around you,

Maybe they could play with the affected range based on the stacks;

1 stack of Burning : No effect
2 stacks of Burning : Anyone that collides with you directly get 1 stack of burning for a small duration
3 stacks of Burning : Anyone in a very small radius get 1 stack of burning for a small duration

GummiBear.2756:

Yeah i like the spreading idea, would make stacking a bit more risky, and fits very well with burning thematically

@Conncept, while your ideas are intresting, the first 2 while technically correct i guess, most ppl wont think it is, so in most peoples eyes it wont fit thematically. for the 3rd idea, well boons dont really “tick” currently from what i understand so think it would need quite some reworking of boons in general to make it work. thus i by far prefer the spreading idea

Huh? Boons ‘tick’ in time, as in, they countdown, the condition would cause boons to countdown towards their end faster.

I think the two suggestions would fit well, I especially like the second, notice that it says targets, not enemies. Meaning that a fight with a lot of burning thrown around would basically have a bonfire like effect, each persons burning feeding the others. I think it would be especially fun with the guardians ability to burn itself and enemies in melee range, and the Ele’s long range AoE burning mechanics.

The passing from one person to another also fits well because fire spreads, but that is also already a mechanic of the necromancer and soon to be the Revenant, and unlikely to be made a wasted mechanic on one of the games only three damaging conditions.

Palindrome.8904:

Uden Reavstone.3426:

Palindrome.8904:

Also, bleeding does damage more frequently than burning, I don’t think that is changing.

They both trigger once per second, so what are you talking about?

If you lump bleed numbers together, they show once per second, but otherwise you see a large number of smaller values. Unless those are just cosmetic?

Most likely it has to do with stacks. If you go to this wiki page; http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Condition_Damage ; it says that bleeding does 42.5 per stack per second. Note that “per stack” are the key words in that sentence. If one stack is applied half a second after the first, then by definition there would be a half of a second between the damage stacks. Also are you sure that the numbers you see is not from your non-condition based attacks?

Uden Reavstone.3426:

Palindrome.8904:

Uden Reavstone.3426:

Palindrome.8904:

Also, bleeding does damage more frequently than burning, I don’t think that is changing.

They both trigger once per second, so what are you talking about?

If you lump bleed numbers together, they show once per second, but otherwise you see a large number of smaller values. Unless those are just cosmetic?

Most likely it has to do with stacks. If you go to this wiki page; http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Condition_Damage ; it says that bleeding does 42.5 per stack per second. Note that “per stack” are the key words in that sentence. If one stack is applied half a second after the first, then by definition there would be a half of a second between the damage stacks. Also are you sure that the numbers you see is not from your non-condition based attacks?

A while back they added an option to lump bleed numbers together, which I think defaulted on. Prior to that, it actually looked like enemies were bleeding numbers (lots of smaller ones). I’m thinking your answer that they display based on when they were applied relative to one another is right.

And yes, quite sure that I’m not confusing bleed damage with other damage, since it has a nice little blood icon on the number :P

ProtoMarcus.7649:

It’s been HEAVILY hinted burning and poison will become stackable conditions, and since burning and bleeding will become almost the same condition with different names, I think they should add an additional effect to burning.

Before burning was stackable, it was unique due to the fact that it had a pretty high damage coefficient on single stack, while bleeding was more efficient in damaging by stacking.

Now, burning will stack, and bleed already stacks, so they’ll become 2 very similar conditions, effects-wise.

My suggestion is to add an additional effect to burning;
Double Damage to standing targets – If you stay still, burning will grant double damage, and if you move, ‘normal’ damage. Of course the ‘double’ damage could actually be the current damage and if the target is moving it’ll become the new base damage, which would be current/2

I understand they mentioned the smart thing to do to poison and burn (since they’ll stack) would be to lower the damage value a bit, but by adding this effect would make burning unique over bleeding.

Almost all damaging conditions will have an effect:
Poison reduces healing efficiency
Torment deals double damage to moving targets
Confusion deals double damage to foes using skills (newest POI episode hinted at a base damage per tick and bonus damage on skill use, I love this addition)
Burning deals double damage to targets standing still
Bleeding remains as it is, since the sources of bleed are numerous

sure, cool story…..add about 500 new anti condi cleansing options first ok….condi spec is alrdy the most easy to play and vastly overpowered….ps. confusion does not need buff in anyway

guildabd.6529:

My suggestion: don’t decrease burning damage at all, instead limit it stacks to 3.

my guess is you only play condi builds….burning alrdy does crazy OP dmge as it is….and you want it to be tripled….right

Palindrome.8904:

Uden Reavstone.3426:

Palindrome.8904:

Uden Reavstone.3426:

Palindrome.8904:

Also, bleeding does damage more frequently than burning, I don’t think that is changing.

They both trigger once per second, so what are you talking about?

If you lump bleed numbers together, they show once per second, but otherwise you see a large number of smaller values. Unless those are just cosmetic?

Most likely it has to do with stacks. If you go to this wiki page; http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Condition_Damage ; it says that bleeding does 42.5 per stack per second. Note that “per stack” are the key words in that sentence. If one stack is applied half a second after the first, then by definition there would be a half of a second between the damage stacks. Also are you sure that the numbers you see is not from your non-condition based attacks?

A while back they added an option to lump bleed numbers together, which I think defaulted on. Prior to that, it actually looked like enemies were bleeding numbers (lots of smaller ones). I’m thinking your answer that they display based on when they were applied relative to one another is right.

And yes, quite sure that I’m not confusing bleed damage with other damage, since it has a nice little blood icon on the number :P

Conditions tick once a second. If you see numbers for each condition more than once a second, you’re seeing the ticks for each stack going off.

Also, conditions applied at a fractional second (or have a fractional duration) will have either an immediate tick of damage or the fractional duration tick at the very end on the next full second. IE if you apply 5.5 seconds of burning, it’ll be full tick, full tick, full tick, full tick, full tick, half tick. Previously, any conditions that lasted .1 to .9 seconds longer than a full second would “lose” that damage.